After the Mahapralaya..where do we begin again?

[renuka]

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I was just wondering that after each Mahapralaya when the cosmos goes into Dissolution mode then when the next cycle of creation starts..where do we begin?

What I mean is..do we start back from square one as in evolving from single cell unit and evolution cycles start all over again or we just start off where we left off.

Just say Mahapralaya is tomorrow and when next cycle of creation kick starts do we still have our current state of advancement of society or we have to be cave man all over again?

Are we having re runs in our very existence or its a new movie each time with a new sequel?

So is existence a Mega Serial or it is just Re Runs??

 

[zebra16]

I was just wondering that after each Mahapralaya when the cosmos goes into Dissolution mode then when the next cycle of creation starts..where do we begin?

What I mean is..do we start back from square one as in evolving from single cell unit and evolution cycles start all over again or we just start off where we left off.

Just say Mahapralaya is tomorrow and when next cycle of creation kick starts do we still have our current state of advancement of society or we have to be cave man all over again?

Are we having re runs in our very existence or its a new movie each time just with a new sequel.

So is existence a Mega Serial or it is just Re Runs??

Ok... here is an input from an ignoramus:

The whole purpose of evolution is for the jeevas is to realise the Brhman and become one with It/Him/Her by realisation/sayyujja/serving Him/Her/It etc. When after 4 yugas it is found that all the yugas and the relative experiences have failed in the objective, there cannot be any benefit from taking off from the latest stage of evolution. If it was possible to take off from the current evolution, probably there may be no need for mahA-pralaya.

So my guess is that new creation will start from the begining all over again (like the single cell unit you have indicated) and may be there may be a subtle or slight change in the tanmatras or primordial elements which will help the new jeevas to have a crack at the mokshA once again.

 

[renuka]

Ok... here is an input from an ignoramus:

The whole purpose of evolution is for the jeevas is to realise the Brhman and become one with It/Him/Her by realisation/sayyujja/serving Him/Her/It etc. When after 4 yugas it is found that all the yugas and the relative experiences have failed in the objective, there cannot be any benefit from taking off from the latest stage of evolution. If it was possible to take off from the current evolution, probably there may be no need for mahA-pralaya.

So my guess is that new creation will start from the begining all over again (like the single cell unit you have indicated) and may be there may be a subtle or slight change in the tanmatras or primordial elements which will help the new jeevas to have a crack at the mokshA once again.

Dear sir,

So there is a possibility that in previous creation cycles mankind could have been even more advanced in Science and Technology than what we are now.Dont you think so?

 

[zebra16]

Dear sir,

So there is a possibility that in previous creation cycles mankind could have been even more advanced in Science and Technology than what we are now.Dont you think so?

There are so many ways to look into this aspect. A few possibilities are:

a) The man-kind could have been more advanced in Science & Technology, but their knowledge lost due to flood and inundation (mahApralaya)

b) They might have been on a different planet and we are on a different planet and at present we do not have a means of communication to that planet to really pick up and start off from their development stage.

c) Science & Technology may not have been a fad then (as it now). Even in the present yuga you find that S & T is at the forefront only during the last 500 years or so.

d) People could have been primitive and may have taken the hardships in their stride with the intuitive knowledge that the hardships help in working out the karma.

There could be so many probabilities and any speculation would be countered with as may objections.

 

[S.Ramanathan]

If re birth is true then we will born again as per our pap and punyam we do in this generation. Hence we have to be very carefull before doing any thing. We should not thing bad to others even in our mind. Hence I feel the gereation will start from scrap.

 

[vgane]

We are in Kaliyuga...As per this at the end of it Lord Krsihna will come as an infant in a leaf...The end of Kaliyuga will begin the new yuga which is Satya Yuga and everything will start from the beginning

 

[Iyyarooraan]

Nobody knows the Alpha and Omega? Why tax our brain? Naarayaana knows and nobody knows Naaraayana. We are darts far away from the bow and no where near the target. Let me add (in a lighter vein) that we should learn swimming. And the only way to swim is to swim!

 

[renuka]

Nobody knows the Alpha and Omega? Why tax our brain? Naarayaana knows and nobody knows Naaraayana. We are darts far away from the bow and no where near the target. Let me add (in a lighter vein) that we should learn swimming. And the only way to swim is to swim!

Dear sir,

What a co incidence you are mentioning Narayana cos that doubt came to me today when I was reading Narayaneeyam where Creation was described so beautifully and also about starting off after a Mahapralaya.

 

[BostonSankara]

What I mean is..do we start back from square one as in evolving from single cell unit and evolution cycles start all over again or we just start off where we left off.

Only LIFE starts over again dear Renu... but as you know we are far far more than simple life. The mahapralaya is the greatest gift. At that point we all merge into Brahman. Karmas or none the details matter not. Saguna is no more at that point and they only return just after.

 

[prasad1]

Yoga Nidra of Lord Vishnu – the cosmic sleep in Hindu Scriptures
In Hinduism, the cosmic dissolution (Mahapralaya) takes place when the cosmos goes beyond redemption due to destruction of Dharma. This is not an end but a positive change or death before rebirth. This cycle is repeated endless times.


After the cosmic dissolution, there is a period of stillness. Vishnu reclines over the still cosmic waters on the endless coils of the serpent Ananta Sesha, which represents Time.


Everything that existed before the Mahapralaya lies around Him in the still primeval waters. This cosmic sleep is known as Yoga Nidra. Here He is focused on the Infinite Reality of His own identity


Yoga Nidra ends with beginning of the next cycle of creation.



The next cycle of creation is symbolically represented by a lotus with Brahma seated on it that rises out of His navel.
Yoga Nidra of Lord Vishnu – the cosmic sleep in Hindu Scriptures ~ Hindu Blog

Mahapralaya: The great dissolution. This is the time when the entire creation (the physical universe as well as the spiritual universe) is reabsorbed back into God. After mahapralaya only God exists until He issues forth creation again. According to traditional Hindu calculations of the yugas, there is yet billions of years before the next mahapralaya.

So am I going to loose any sleep over it!!!! LOL

 

[biswa]

Perhaps we could widen the discussion a bit in terms of science and cosmology. We know that shrishti happened. In science it is known as the big bang. However scientists are in two minds whether pralay will happen or not. It is quite possible that it will and science will call it the big crunch. Maybe this will eventually lead to the next big bang.

However it is not clear to me why the next creation will follow exactly the same path involving creation of something called Planet Earth inhabited by some sundry life-forms one species of which calls itself human and thinks it is intelligent enough to understand creation.

 

[renuka]

Perhaps we could widen the discussion a bit in terms of science and cosmology. We know that shrishti happened. In science it is known as the big bang. However scientists are in two minds whether pralay will happen or not. It is quite possible that it will and science will call it the big crunch. Maybe this will eventually lead to the next big bang.

However it is not clear to me why the next creation will follow exactly the same path involving creation of something called Planet Earth inhabited by some sundry life-forms one species of which calls itself human and thinks it is intelligent enough to understand creation.

Well said Biswa..Actually I was also hoping this thread will take a twist in the right direction of cosmology,science and spiced with info from religious text cos I feel its all inter related.

I also have often wondered if in the next Mahapralaya is it the same Earth we will be in or some other universe and some other planet which will play the role of Earth again.

I was reading about Varaha Avatar yesterday and I was wondering where could Earth have been submerged for Lord Vishnu to pick it up again.
What was the waters they were referring too in the Puranas?
Its every interesting to try to wonder what could have been like before(even though I know I might not actually really know but no harm trying to decipher)

 

[zebra16]

Well said Biswa..Actually I was also hoping this thread will take a twist in the right direction of cosmology,science and spiced with info from religious text cos I feel its all inter related.

I also have often wondered if in the next Mahapralaya is it the same Earth we will be in or some other universe and some other planet which will play the role of Earth again.

I was reading about Varaha Avatar yesterday and I was wondering where could Earth have been submerged for Lord Vishnu to pick it up again.
What was the waters they were referring too in the Puranas?
Its every interesting to try to wonder what could have been like before(even though I know I might not actually really know but no harm trying to decipher)

I think you are on a slippery slope when you want to flirt with science, cosmology and religious text et all in one and the same thread. Let me try to elaborate:

First let us take the case of science or big bang theory. Let us assume the theory is fully explained and accepted by all. Once this is achieved, the question will arise as to what caused the big bang and was it possible for such a cause to exist before, whether such big bangs did occur in the past and whether such past big bangs resulted in life or not. If it did, where are/were such life forms? If such big bangs did not result in life, why not? .

Now let us take the varaha avatar episode. Who is that person who is narrating the episode? Where was he stationed when Maha Vishnu took out the earth from deep under waters (when there was no land mass)? Why was the narrator not consumed by the preceding maha pralaya? Was the narrator reporting the current developments or was he reporting the past incidences? Were the past incidences actually seen by him or were they narrated to him?

If the original episode was narrated based on direct testimony of Maha Vishnu, the narrator should have been extremely fortunate to converse directly with Vishnu. What good deeds or karma did the narrator do to merit such such a face to face conversation with Vishnu.

 

[renuka]

If the original episode was narrated based on direct testimony of Maha Vishnu, the narrator should have been extremely fortunate to converse directly with Vishnu. What good deeds or karma did the narrator do to merit such such a face to face conversation with Vishnu.

Dear Zebra Ji,

Weren't most of the sages in the past themselves partial incarnations of Lord Vishnu ?
So I guess its first hand information from them.

I will get back soon about this topic.Have to take my son for a movie now.

Just to add..the slippery slope of science,cosmology,religion is not all that slippery at present cos right now there is still no one (who feels that Science and Religion are like parallel lines) to pull me down!
Some might be back soon so I better discuss things when I still can.LOL!!

 

[prasad1]

I think you are on a slippery slope when you want to flirt with science, cosmology and religious text et all in one and the same thread. Let me try to elaborate:

First let us take the case of science or big bang theory. Let us assume the theory is fully explained and accepted by all. Once this is achieved, the question will arise as to what caused the big bang and was it possible for such a cause to exist before, whether such big bangs did occur in the past and whether such past big bangs resulted in life or not. If it did, where are/were such life forms? If such big bangs did not result in life, why not? .

Now let us take the varaha avatar episode. Who is that person who is narrating the episode? Where was he stationed when Maha Vishnu took out the earth from deep under waters (when there was no land mass)? Why was the narrator not consumed by the preceding maha pralaya? Was the narrator reporting the current developments or was he reporting the past incidences? Were the past incidences actually seen by him or were they narrated to him?

If the original episode was narrated based on direct testimony of Maha Vishnu, the narrator should have been extremely fortunate to converse directly with Vishnu. What good deeds or karma did the narrator do to merit such such a face to face conversation with Vishnu.

Mr. Zebra,
I like this post very much.
Our mythologies are great stories, and generally have a deeper meaning. They are trying to explain metaphysical concept in real world similes. Do we take it to be Historical documents? I think we will have problem with that.

In the similar mode, 'big bang theory' in science is a concept. It is not a proven fact, at present from our knowledge that is the best guess. So even science is not exact in this theory. We may have better explanation in the future.

 

[Govinda]

This is my favorite topic. I would like to share my reading/understanding of Vishnu Purana. I will join in soon. Meanwhile, the first few chapters of Vishnu Purana explains the creation and dissolution wonderfully. The time scales are incomprehensible.

You may enjoy reading the first few chapters from Vishnu Purana.
The Vishnu Purana: Book I: Chapter I

 

[Visalakshi Ramani]

Why should varaha moorthy stand ON earth while lifting earth from water???

The universe we see is only a small part (1/4) of the Brahman.

The earth itself is just a spec in our Universe.

Our universe is just a spec among all the universes.

Come out of the limitations of the earth and the sea which is part of the earth

when you want to imagine bigger, better, higher and greater things!!!

 

[Visalakshi Ramani]

The rushis, the seers and the sages are given the power to visualize

the happenings of the distant past minutely -

as if they just happened in front of their eyes.

They CAN hear the conversations AND see the happenings as if real.

May be they can tune in their receiver to the correct frequncy and filter out what they

want to see, hear and say!

THERE ARE MORE THINGS IN NATURE THAN WE CAN EVER FATHOM

OR EVEN GUESS WILDLY!

 

[Visalakshi Ramani]

When two persons are connected by mental waves, they can communicate

even in huge crowds without the use of words.

Not just friends... even strangers and enemies.

How do you turn back automatically at a stranger staring at you in a crowded place???

Do we have hidden eyes at the back of our heads??

How do we sense the impending danger even from the backside???

messages get across even without verbal or even eye contact.

So there is NO NEED to actually talk with Maha Vishnu to tell us things about Him.

 

[Visalakshi Ramani]

PSI Phenomena.


PSI phenomena are a collective name given to the various unusual mental phenomena including Telepathy, Precognition, Clairvoyance and Psycho-Kinesis. Ordinary people can perform extraordinary feats, which defy all known physical laws, by entering into their Para normal states of Conscience.

Hidden powers of human mind have been known for a long time. The Society for Psychical Research was formed in England, in 1882. Here all the “PSI” phenomena are subjected to severe scrutiny. High standard of research is maintained. The experiments conducted over a century have yielded remarkable results.

Telepathy is the most widely known PSI phenomenon. In this, the thoughts of one person are transferred to another– no matter by how far they were separated.

Clairvoyance is closely related to telepathy. It is not acquired by any traditional methods or means. Here the knowledge is not passed from one person to another. If a pack of cards is shuffled and a person is able to guess correctly the top card, then it is Clairvoyance.

In Psycho-kinesis, physical objects are moved by the mental force, without actually handling or touching them. Uri Geller had such a strong mental force that he could actually bend spoons, just by looking at them!

Precognition is to know what is going to happen, before it does happen. Many people have reported about their dreams–which later came true.

Extra Sensory Perception known ESP was tested by a simple and easy experiment using Zener cards. These are 25 in number. Each one of these five simple patterns square, circle, plus, star and wavy lines is printed on 5 cards, totaling to 25 cards.

Two persons were put in two separate rooms. One of the persons drew out the cards in random order and the other person guessed it. In one such experiment, a subject was able to guess all the 25 cards correctly, establishing the existence of the power of ESP.

Despite the numerous experiments conducted over a century, much is yet to be discovered with regard to PSI phenomena. The best thing we can do now is to keep our minds open for further discoveries.

Visalakshi Ramani

 

[Kirankumar]

each Manu created by Brahma has a span of 71 Mahayugas meaning (71 times all the 4 yugas). And if we go by Geethacharya - sambhavami yuge yuge... it means the cycle is repeated endlessly.... and there are 14 manus in the lifespan of Bramha...so it is a never ending cycle....

 

[biswa]

I agree with some of the statements that it is hard to draw a direct parallel between the science and the puranas. We can only interpolate and be happy with that. A few points I would like to make:

1. The big bang is not just a "concept", just like the electron is not just a concept. Of course it is a concept, but there is also evidence behind the theory. Likewise, there is evidence for the big bang: it is the cosmic background radiation. Please see What evidence supports the big bang theory

The big bang was an unproven theory before this radiation was discovered.

2. Regarding varaha avatar, the nearest thing I can think of is how the earth was formed from a cosmic soup of gas and dust. Maybe the solidified Earth was languishing in the bottom of this ocean until Lord Vishnu pulled it out!

 

[Govinda]

1. The big bang is not just a "concept", just like the electron is not just a concept. Of course it is a concept, but there is also evidence behind the theory. Likewise, there is evidence for the big bang: it is the cosmic background radiation. Please see What evidence supports the big bang theory

Acc. to VP, "Purusha (spirit) is the first form, of the supreme; next proceeded two other forms, the discrete and indiscrete; and Kála (time) was the last." Pradhana is the indiscrete ocean, I guess, may be the equivalent of the Milky-Ocean or the Primordial Soup. Then, Vishnu disturbed the equilibrium (primal-Soup) into the 24 principles and qualities for the discrete/elemental-forms. VP explains it to be an expanded egg or bubble (before big-bang). After the bang, we have the discrete form of universe with forms (prakriti).

I was just wondering that after each Mahapralaya when the cosmos goes into Dissolution mode then when the next cycle of creation starts..where do we begin?

Vedas are Apaurusheya/eternal, hence the process of creation, the duration/order of creation, the means of spiritual progress , the details of materials [herbs, foods, animals, varna] etc. should be valid forever. After every kalpa or 14 manvantras [ a day of Brahma], seems lie the lower 3 lokas, go through accidental dissolution and recreated in next kalpa. After 100 years of Brahma, the whole creation will dissolve subtly into the primal ocean/crude matter. Acc. to VP, many such lives of Brahma are passed. The positions of devas ruling the lokas, planets, natures must be titles, they advance as the time passes, and so all of us. But, the aggregate of dharna-bhuta jnanam (consciousness) will be considered for promotion, than just advancement of one part of material knowledge/science.

 

[biswa]

I would also like to address two pertinent issues raised by questioners of the big bang:

1. If the big bang marked the beginning of everything, what was there before that?
2. If what we see/perceive is the universe, what is there outside the universe?

The answers are of course not definitive, but the current arguments hinge on non-linearity.

We will only think of beginning and end if we view time as linear. However it time is really curved like a circle, the end is really the beginning and the beginning the end.

Similarly we may think of all space as a cosmic bubble which is expanding (this is actually experimentally observed). There need not be anything outside as new space is being created inside in a continuous fashion without taking anything from outside.

Now question for the members: is God part of this universe or outside?

 

[Anand Manohar]

Dear Dr Renuka

Clawed my way back on board this austere forum. For over a decade now, I have been into researching into what I
term "The History of the Future" - The Bhavishya Puranam - many fake and corrupted versions, even translated into
English are available. I cannot say with authenticity that we have found the real thing. Finding the palm leaves and getting them transcribed is a real task. Symbolism and seemingly deliberate encoding makes the jigsaw puzzle all the more complicated. Everything is written in 'past tense' - even some of the major, well-known events such as the advent of Gauthama the Budha, Jesus the Christ and Mohammed the Prophet have been written about, long long before these actually occurred and noted in recorded history.

Since someone mentioned Kali Yugam, Maha Pralayam etc - here's the Bhavishya Puranam's take on TIME:

A small extract - I am sure you know these already - just a recap:


Time: as defined in "The History of the Future" - if you have the time / care to read it :


The smallest unit of time is nimesha. This is the amount of time it takes to blink. Fifteen nimeshas makes
one kastha and thirty kasthas are one kala. Thirty kalas make one muhurtha and thirty muhurthas make
one day. Thirty days make one month and each month of divided into two lunar fortnights - shuklapaksha
and krishnapaksha .Six months make one ayana and two ayanas make one year. Three hundred and sixty
human years are equivalent to one year for the gods.


The lengths of the four yugas [eras] are defined in terms of years of the gods and not in terms of human years.
Satya yuga lasts for 4000 years, Treta yuga lasts for 3000 years, Dwapara yuga lasts for 2000 years and Kali
yuga lasts for 1000 years - this adds up to 10,000 divine years. The sandhyas and sandhyamshas are the
intervening periods between the yugas and these add up to 2000 divine years. Thus the four yugas taken
together last for twelve thousand divine years.


A kalpa has fourteen manvantaras. In each manvantara the cycle of four yugas occurs seventy one times.
Each manvantara is ruled by a Manu. There have been six manvantaras so far .
This is the seventh - ruled by Vaivashvatha Manu presently. One kalpa corresponds to one day for Brahma.


The six manus, whose manvantaras have passed are 1 . Swayambhuva, 2 . Svarochasha, 3 . Outtami,
4 . Tamasa, 5 . Raivatha and 6 . Chakshusha.


The seven manus, whose manvantaras are to follow the current Vaivashvatha Manvantara:
1 . Savarni Manu, 2 . Dakshasavarni Manu, 3 . Brahmasavarni Manu, 4 . Dharmasavarni Manu
5 . Savarna Manu, 6 . Rouchya Manu and 7 . Bhoutya Manu .


The Bhavishya Puranam is written in past tense - what is zapping is that the advent and lives of great and world-famous
personalities over the centuries such as Gouthama the Budha, Jesus Christ and Prophet Mohammed [ to name few ] are all
written in past tense - not as a prediction or or calculation or a foresight into the future, long long [ yugas why, maybe kalpas ]
before such events actually occurred [ in recorded history ] !

I think this is sufficient boredom, I've fed you for the day.


I shall mail you the verses [ with transcripts ] pertaining to Mohammed the Prophet, Jesus the Christ, birth and spread of new
religions etc if you are interested and can view and imbibe things from a neutral, unbiased, unprejudiced mind without any
pre-conceived notions or even a judgemental frame of mind.


Guruvethunai
Yay Yem