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Are Godmen aThreat in Our Society

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Godmen have over the years have a huge presence in our society, In recent times they seem to prosper living an extravagent lifestyle

It appears some fradulent Godmen are as much a threat As Godlessness in our society.

The main issue is how to separate the fraudulent from the genuine.There is no easy way

Many times only after some complaints such as coercion or sexual deviancy comes out, only then people take notice

In recent times a religeous-political complex emerging around Godmen.Politicians need them and protect them

In india anyone can become spiritual and become a Guru . Spirituality is the most accessible space . Belief is fully democratic.

It is a temptation to learn some spiritual mumbo jumbo become a Guru for good living . Why not?

Courtesy Shiv Visvanathan ,The mint of nov 23 , 2014
 
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[h=2]Are Godmen aThreat in Our Society [/h]

As long as people are in distress or in greed , Godmen and Politcians who promise a cure for their distress or promise of Heaven will continue to have good business .
 
It happens when people live insulated lives. If you notice - most clients of such charlatans belong to the upper or middle classes of society. These are the people who get restless if they dont get the daily paper on time or if they dont get to see the latest sports news on tv. Their reality is whats on TV or whats happening in their immediate circle. As for the lower classes they may be superstitious but they still live their day to day life interacting with all kinds of people - good and bad. So they keep a grip on common sense without which eking out a living is difficult. So they can easily see through a charlatan when they see one.
 
It happens when people live insulated lives. If you notice - most clients of such charlatans belong to the upper or middle classes of society. These are the people who get restless if they dont get the daily paper on time or if they dont get to see the latest sports news on tv. Their reality is whats on TV or whats happening in their immediate circle. As for the lower classes they may be superstitious but they still live their day to day life interacting with all kinds of people - good and bad. So they keep a grip on common sense without which eking out a living is difficult. So they can easily see through a charlatan when they see one.
What you say is not strictly correct

The 15 to 20 thousand people following the Godman in haryana were the dalits and others belonging to poorest section of society.

those believing in miracles and superstitions belong to all calsses

english speaking middle class follow Sri sri Ravishanker andjaggi vasudev

they are holier types like sankaracharyas , jeers and swamis of vaisnavite sects.

actions of some of them have been unsavoury .

we have swami nityananda and Asarambapu being accused of heinous crimes.

of course TV has its own influence and some tend to have faith in what TV shows them and do not directly experience anything
 
There are good godmen and bad godmen in other religions too. The church has the worst child abuse record, and now only the media and victims have woken up. There are numerous private settlements by the church to avoid publicity. Only in india, the media screams and makes wild allegations and reports for trp ratings and to exhibit their secular credentials (means only hindu related are attacked) and keep silent and express blissful ignorance when when accused are exonerated.

There is no disagreement that those violating laws and indulge in cheating are punished; existing laws are adequate to charge sheet the offenders. But the cases must be heard and judgement delivered as quickly as possible.

Asaram bapu is still in jail without bail, but tehalka chief got bail and will participate in literary festival sponsored by the times group.
 
Godmen have over the years have a huge presence in our society, In recent times they seem to prosper living an extravagent lifestyle

It appears some fradulent Godmen are as much a threat As Godlessness in our society.

The main issue is how to separate the fraudulent from the genuine.There is no easy way

Many times only after some complaints such as coercion or sexual deviancy comes out, only then people take notice

In recent times a religeous-political complex emerging around Godmen.Politicians need them and protect them

In india anyone can become spiritual and become a Guru . Spirituality is the most accessible space . Belief is fully democratic.

It is a temptation to learn some spiritual mumbo jumbo become a Guru for good living . Why not?

Courtesy Shiv Visvanathan ,The mint of nov 23 , 2014

Sir,
I can say only ‘Yes’ to this question because women folk in India would become a cheap prey to these fraudulent cheating men with a fervent hope that the G.men would solve their problems quickly. A lot more will be contributed on this subject by the experts of our forum.
 
There is no such word as "God-man". Oxford Dictionary says " God-man:Indian , often derogatory A holy man; a guru:"
This word is coined by Indian media people to ridicule (mostly of) Hindu Gurus. Society is always a mix of good and bad elements. This applies to every part of the Society in which we live.
Interestingly two types of people run after search of spiritual solace, one is the people who face unsolved problems in life and other is the people who amass wealth by all means and seek the divine protection to keep it safe.
Some religious teachers use the faith of these people to gain monetary benefits resulting in indulgence of fraudulent activities.
Mushrooming of these people in recent times have given bad name to real Acharyas.

Brahmanyan,
Bangalore.
 
All the godmen are humans too. A few of them are very knowledgeable and are potentially capable of guiding people in the right direction. But unfortunately even these few after tasting success succumb to the temptations that huge success brings in. Unless one is truly divine it is very difficult to rise above intense pressures and temptations.
 
Well said, sir. And the media coined term -self styled or self anointed - is used indiscriminately by many to brush good people too.

Many a time the opportunist coterie takes advantage of its proximity for personal gains and power.

There is no such word as "God-man". Oxford Dictionary says " God-man:Indian , often derogatory A holy man; a guru:"
This word is coined by Indian media people to ridicule (mostly of) Hindu Gurus. Society is always a mix of good and bad elements. This applies to every part of the Society in which we live.
Interestingly two types of people run after search of spiritual solace, one is the people who face unsolved problems in life and other is the people who amass wealth by all means and seek the divine protection to keep it safe.
Some religious teachers use the faith of these people to gain monetary benefits resulting in indulgence of fraudulent activities.
Mushrooming of these people in recent times have given bad name to real Acharyas.

Brahmanyan,
Bangalore.
 
sravnaji
Since chances of finding these wise men are remote, it is tempting to do away with them as the havoc they are causing to society far outweighs the good.

There needs to be a code of conduct harshly imposed on these entities to protect people from them

now only our courts are left with the job of cleaning up the mess these godmen have created

more than them , political leaders should be penalised for banking on them and encouraging and protecting them
 
Typical commie solution. Your implication is - destroy all. Let all religious orders and ngos follow a common law as applicable to any institution - accounting, taxation, transparency, quick investigation and resolution of complaints registered.

Many run schools, colleges, old age homes and animal shelters.

Today a report says that there is some financial irregularity by delhi court judges in laptop scheme. Same solution!

sravnaji
Since chances of finding these wise men are remote, it is tempting to do away with them as the havoc they are causing to society far outweighs the good.
 
sravnaji
Since chances of finding these wise men are remote, it is tempting to do away with them as the havoc they are causing to society far outweighs the good.
There needs to be a code of conduct harshly imposed on these entities to protect people from them now only our courts are left with the job of cleaning up the mess these godmen have created more than them , political leaders should be penalised for banking on them and encouraging and protecting them

Sri "Krish"

We have enough Laws to protect us from every form of injustice caused to the individuals and Society. But enforcing the same is the difficulty, due to our system of litigation. Here is a news item on 10.11.2014, I read will prove my point."A Delhi court on Monday fixed December 8 for delivering its verdict in the 39-year-old case of murder of the then railway minister Lalit Narayan Mishra".
It was C.Northcoat Parkinson who said "delay is the deadliest form of denial".

Brahmanyan,
Bangalore.
 
And the sad part is the judiciary is not coming out with a solution for fast closure of cases. Apart from procedural reforms, even suggestions like operating in shifts, curtailing court holidays, insisting on all documents to be submitted in one go, no vayda - are not even considered. Undertrials languishing in jails without any hope of court appearance is criminal travesty of justice.

Sri "Krish"

We have enough Laws to protect us from every form of injustice caused to the individuals and Society. But enforcing the same is the difficulty, due to our system of litigation. Here is a news item on 10.11.2014, I read will prove my point."A Delhi court on Monday fixed December 8 for delivering its verdict in the 39-year-old case of murder of the then railway minister Lalit Narayan Mishra".
It was C.Northcoat Parkinson who said "delay is the deadliest form of denial".

Brahmanyan,
Bangalore.
 
Brahmnayanji
What you say is true regarding delays by court

for want of a better mechanism , it appears to be the best course

when institutions , religeous order get compromised by unsavoury elements, state cannot keep quiet . they need to ensure the well being of citizen.

when one sees thousands of poor including many ladies are held as human shields by a conman to avoid due process of law, what happens to the state.

can this happen in any other country?

there needs to be introspection by all supporting such elements . if it is irreligeosity , so be it.
 
Yes; with hundreds of forced suicides. Anyway it is still differnt from suicide bombing, attack on schools and stripping and shooting. Why ashrams, even simple encroached buildings are protected by arms wielding and gun trotting men and women. Keep religion out and punish the guilty as seculars conveniently say.

can this happen in any other country?
 
All this does not justify actions of Godmen taking the gullible for a ride using religion.

Luckily there is an activist court in punjab ,haryana high court fixing these elements.

next action is expected against another Godman of Sacha sauda

ultimately our courts with their limitations are capable of intervening and setting things right though with delays.



There should be some fear of the law .

Today on TV there was news of few women in parked car in MG road in bangalore were being teased by 3-5 men and no one came to their rescue inspite of their

screaming for help. Police even refused to register a case until they called the top cop in bangalore.

Such things can hardly go on in india.
 
All god men are a threat to Society. They are like unregistered people on oath of which nobody knows anything. Yes many of them run institutions for the benefit of the public. But these are facades. If they want to give discourses to public, they can use tv media and disappear. The good god men will not attempt to weed out the bad god men (professional ethics) and soon you find them all in the same light. It ultimately melts down to "he is also a human" (not a god men?!). Even before pre-vedic period there had been good men and bad men. The religions have made no impact on men. Only men have made impacts on religions.
 
I agree with Krishji, but I also agree with Iyyaji post.
It is very difficult to save a fool. A conman will find the gullible and no law can protect them.
 
In a family of godmen, a clean baba stands out like a white sheep. That, however, does not stop people from stooping to charlatans in robes and matted hair. And the reason is simple: these godmen happily stomp on grounds where scientists fear to tread.


What facts can help figure out the beginning of the beginning, or how something came out of nothing? Alternatively, which experiment can explain the end of the end, or what it is to be dead? It’s a mug’s game to press scientists to find solutions to these questions, because they are actually riddles. In one case, the answer lies before a fact was born and, in the other, after a fact has gone.


Riddles, however, are the staple of godmen, mystics and saints. It is not enough to know why wood floats, stones sink or how planes fly. Science can tell us about these and much more, but that does not stop us from speculating on the wonder of life or the darkness of death. When all is said and done, no matter the quantum leaps in knowledge, those niggling, nettlesome issues will still remain.
It is not just the illiterate and the uncouth who ask questions which have no real answers. Some of the best scientists too have been assailed by similar doubts, especially after their lab hours are over. In short, this line of inquisitiveness is a universal failing — a quest that has no real solution. It is in this empty space that the godman strikes, with nothing more than a prayer and a song.


As these eternal questions have, and will, torment us forever, there is no getting out of the fear and the awe of the supernatural. Consequently, whenever there is despair, or when the future is uncertain, or when terror stalks the soul, the godman gets a near open invitation, all expenses paid. Scientific advance concedes empty knowledge spaces, but as faith abhors a vacuum it readily serves up answers to the unanswerables. At this level there is just no contest — science has to concede.


No doubt, there were great ascetics and kind and generous faith leaders who, at tremendous personal cost, often gave succour to the masses in times of great distress. From Jesus, to Muhammad, to Vivekananda and even Dayananda Saraswati, we have had such heroes who shored up our spirits and gave us strength. The truth, however, is that when these great souls depart, they leave behind followers who are human — all too human. As they lack the charisma of their gurus, they reduce the substance of their teachings to miracles and magic.


To blame Indians, or Hindus, alone for being prone to mystics and godmen would be unfair and unjust. What remains true is that godmen do extraordinarily well in our country than in most others we know of, and that is where the puzzle lies. Is our society more vulnerable? Or, is Hinduism particularly susceptible? Or, does this show up so blatantly among us because of the way we practise democracy and secularism?


Or, is it a combination of the above?
.........................................
Hindus may or may not be overly religious, but that should not excuse politicians when they include babas in their power calculations. Most societies are religious and yet, if they are democracies, it is important that they keep faith in its place. The French did this job remarkably well when in 1905 they banned the wearing of religious symbols, notably the cross, by government functionaries. This angered the Pope and he railed against this “ungodly” policy from St. Peter’s Square. The French President of the day stood firm and eventually the Catholic Church retreated. Today, there are vibrant churches in France, but there is vibrant democracy too. As Hegel famously said, by separating church from state we are actually doing both a favour. A time comes in every democracy’s life to call a spade a spade and not draw and redraw lines in the sand.


Secularism truly means keeping religion out of politics. Likewise, democracy truly means keeping politics out of religion. Distort either one and you muck up the other.
India?s godman syndrome - The Hindu
 
prasadji
Thank you . Good post

I liked the last line.

secularism truly means keeping religion out of politics, likewise democracy truly means keeping politics out of religion . Distort either one and you muck up the other .

How true
 
With many national governments - united kingdom, france, russia, germany, australia openly asserting their christian affiliation and values, and without saying a word about nations of religion of peace, this oxymoron statement has no relevance or value in the comity of nations. Religions which openly convert others by force ought to be controlled by the state.

Secularism followed by the hypocritical and opportunist politicians and communists are detrimental to our culture and way of life.

prasadji
Thank you . Good post

I liked the last line.

secularism truly means keeping religion out of politics, likewise democracy truly means keeping politics out of religion . Distort either one and you muck up the other .

How true
 
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