Madisar/Panchakacham

[iyerponnu]

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I was going through the threads posted earlier on and found some posts relating to how the madisar and the panchakacham should be worn.. this gave rise to another question in my mind..I know that the madisar/panchakacham is considered to be the garment of the Tamil Brahmin. My patti(s) wear it everyday; my mother on certain auspicious days, me once on the day I got married and once during my sister's wedding and for the sumangali prarthanai. My question is as follows: When should the madisar/panchakacham be worn?
Given the fact that most of us dont wear it often, I feel that this beautiful garment is slowly dying.At least if we all made sure that we wore it on certain days, this lovely saree wont fade away completely..Are there any rules/restrictions as to when this has to be worn? Is this governed by the rules for 'athu pazhakam' and does this (wearing it on certain occasions and festive days) depend on which part of Tamilnadu/Kerala the family hails from.. Please clarify..

Mythili

 

[kunjuppu]

iyerponnu,

to the best of my understanding, the madisar was the day to day garment of a married TB woman.

i have a neice, who has turned traditional. she is a lecturer in one of the colleges, teaching philosophy. since her marriage, she goes to college to teach, everyday, wearing madisar. so i am told

 

[Sabesan Narayanaswami]

There are plenty of opportunities to wear this graceful dress.As Mr Kunjuppu has pointed out it was the traditional dress those days(my mother is 93 and she is wearing from her 13th year when she got married!)and I cant imagine her in any other dress.My sister in her 70s wears on all the festival days,Navarathri all 9 days.and other religious functions.The next generation of course wears on very few occasions.Generally I find elderly ladies wear in the morning times after bath till cooking,Puja activities and then change over to yada souharyam.There is no hard and fast rule about this, it depends on each person and the environment.If the present generation wears on all the above mentioned days I am sure this traditional dress will not become a thing of the past.

 

[sadasivam.sridharan]

People who follow acharam,people who follow traditional,conservative tamil brahminical culture wear madisar and panchakacham always.Generally elders insist that these things are worn when there are special occasions in the house like festivals,poojas etc.Whether to wear this or not depends on individual's custom and convenience.
S.Sridharan

 

[SuryaKasyapa]

It is just like-- when you attend a formal function dress formally, if it is a casual occasion dress casually-- So if the occasion is a traditional function, the dress also should match it.

Let us hope that the fashion designers of today may reinvent them as modern dress.

But everything is as per one's convenience and comfort. As my vaadhyaar says -- "Yathaa saukaryam".

Both these dresses were devised when there were no separate undergarments, one utility for all.And those were days when you ned not travel on footboards of buses, and nobody will trample on your dress.

So just...yathaa saukaryam..

 

[sreeindia111]

Dears

What all the compulsory days for wearing these traditional dress?
Actually many of us even do not know how to wear these two dress.
I think one must practice regularly to familirise.

Sreedhar

 

[pannvalan]

1. At the time of conducting homams, the Dharmapathni is to wear Madisar and the
Kartha or Yajaman has to wear Pancha Kachcham.

2. On festival days, at the time of conducting pujas, the same dress code applies.

3. At the time of performing 'samaradhanas', ditto.

4. When 'Brahmanaal are served food, on any other occasion, ditto.

5. On the days of Navarathri festival, ditto.

6. While going to a temple, for conducting any special prayers or pujas also, same.

7. Any other occasion, as per the advice of the elders in the house or the 'Aathu
Vaadyar', ditto.

 

[ramadasan]

Dears

What all the compulsory days for wearing these traditional dress?
Actually many of us even do not know how to wear these two dress.
I think one must practice regularly to familirise.

Sreedhar

Strictly speaking, once you are married everyone should follow this dress code at all times. This is also one of the identification of the marriage (like wearing metti / two yagnobhivatheems). If it is not possible to wear panchakacham always, gents should wear panchakatcham atleast when doing Sandhiyavandhanam and pujas.

- Regards, Balaji

 

[tbs]

hi folks,
madisaar/panchakachham for grihasthal (married couple)
uniform...daily dress for tamil/kerala brahmins....in olden
days many tamil brahmin lawyers wear panchakaccham
in high court/supreme court with traditional attire...
my grand father used go to police station as sub inspector
in british raj with panchakaccham/with keethu namam...
even britishers encouraged our traditional dress/attire...my
patti always wear madisaar.never wear anyother dress
after her marriage...........i saw only madisaar in my
patti's wardrobe....


regards
tbs

 

[Sriram Sivaraman]

Thanks to Mrs.Iyer Ponnu for starting this interesting topic. I have a friend who is an officer in an Insurance firm and attends with Panchakacham only. As other members have listed majority of the options, I will add the one most important day of the year for all of us. All gents should wear Panchakacham on Aavani Avittam day & it would be nice if ladies too wear madisar on that day.

Pranams,
Sriram Sivaraman

 

[Sabesan Narayanaswami]

Thanks to Mrs.Iyer Ponnu for starting this interesting topic. I have a friend who is an officer in an Insurance firm and attends with Panchakacham only. As other members have listed majority of the options, I will add the one most important day of the year for all of us. All gents should wear Panchakacham on Aavani Avittam day & it would be nice if ladies too wear madisar on that day.

Pranams,
Sriram Sivaraman

and vadhyars too...??

 

[ravidesikan]

Wearing Panchakaccham/madisar

The answer lies in the question itself.

Panchakaccham is the dress code for a Gruhastha and Madisar for a Sumanagali stree.


We can atleast try to wear it during our trikala Sandhyavandanam and morning puja.

-Ravi

I was going through the threads posted earlier on and found some posts relating to how the madisar and the panchakacham should be worn.. this gave rise to another question in my mind..I know that the madisar/panchakacham is considered to be the garment of the Tamil Brahmin. My patti(s) wear it everyday; my mother on certain auspicious days, me once on the day I got married and once during my sister's wedding and for the sumangali prarthanai. My question is as follows: When should the madisar/panchakacham be worn?
Given the fact that most of us dont wear it often, I feel that this beautiful garment is slowly dying.At least if we all made sure that we wore it on certain days, this lovely saree wont fade away completely..Are there any rules/restrictions as to when this has to be worn? Is this governed by the rules for 'athu pazhakam' and does this (wearing it on certain occasions and festive days) depend on which part of Tamilnadu/Kerala the family hails from.. Please clarify..

Mythili

 

[kunjuppu]

Whether girl or boy from IT sector knows wat is Madisaar or Panchakatcham....???
It will be a big question......hahahahahaha....
Lets teach them how to wear, if we not atleast....

swami,

i love that hahahahaha.. good going.

by the way, you have made so many observations about folks working in the IT sector, so that it appears to me, that they are aliens living in tamil nadu.

what is it that makes this group, cut across caste/religion and behave in an unique manner, so as to attract attention.

are all these attentions unwanted? are there anything admirable with those working in the IT sector? or is it just that they got plain lucky in life at an early age?

i have always thought that it takes certain smarts and work ethics to get into working in IT in india.

thank you.

 

[SuryaKasyapa]

I take sides with Swaminatha sharma(only) to defend him.

When somebody alludes in general to IT sector, it totally represents a new generation--well educated, high spirited, yearning for fast growth, working tirelessly without minding different time schedules, at the same time earning far more than their own elders ,who had spent years earning pittance.

The elders of yesterday generations look at the IT boys and girls with mixed emotions.
They look at the in awe in matters of the youngsters conviction, self decision,ability for selection, goal fixing etc. They pity them for sacrificing small small pleasures of life in their fast paced life.They are afraid of them fearing that the new earned wealth and power of independence may lead them to rashness and land them in problem.
They look at them with expectation of confidence that these youngsters will certainly " DO " many things positive for the world
.

Sri Swaminatha sarma probably was having a genuine doubt as to whether these youngsters will get time and patience to wear the cumbersome traditional dresses, when most days many of them have to rush with one hand tightening the shirt buttons and other hand carrying a half eaten pizza.(so fast life..short of time..)

That is all ; no offence meant.

( I have put Sarma in the compulsion to agree...hahahahaha..

Greetings

 

[sadasivam.sridharan]

Shri.suryakasyapa has really painted very well the life style of the younger generation employed in the IT sector.I know many youngsters in the software profession foregoing breakfast and rushing to the office in the morning and coming back home very late in the night and hit the bed.When such is the hurry in their daily routine where is the question of thinking about our traditional dresses and other stuff.
S.Sridharan

 

[Sabesan Narayanaswami]

Yesterday I attended a Harikatha Program of Visakha Hari on the life history of Saint Thyagaraja through his own Compositions,the commentary in a nice flowing English!.She was looking very graceful in her madisar saree.She is young,highly talented,educated and kept the audience spell bound for nearly three hours.
Madisar is certainly a very Graceful dress for women if they wear it properly.
This applies to Pancha Kaccham also..I have seen a mockery of Madisar in group song sequences of Tamil Movies!

 

[drsundaram]

You are right Sri Sabesan. Her husband who is a chartered Accountant is again into katha kaalakshepam and he will obviously also be in panchakacham not only during performing the art but at all times. As you rightly said in the TV Serials and in Cinema they are abusing the wearing by doing it very wrongly. Under the intention of imitating they go haywire. Very easily they can bring right person and dress them to wear properly. Who to do it....
Madisar is grace to itself....

 

[iyerponnu]

It looks like I have started a lively debate....
I would like point a few things about the 'younger IT generation'...seeing that I belong to that too.. yes, we are running around like headless chickens to start with, but personally I feel people from our community do want to uphold the traditions whenever possible. Do give us some credit..not that anyone here has discredited us. I live in London and the work culture here is different to the one we have in India..but we try and manage to do bits and pieces where ever possible...we have samooha poojais and discourses..The only disadvantage for us is, if it is on a weekday we are unable to attend..

And a small correction to what Dr.Sundaram has said abt Smt Vishaka's husband Sri Hariji.. he is not a Chartered Accountant..Smt Vishaka is the Chartered Accountant. But as you both rightly pointed out, you can always see them in this graceful attire..not just them, Sri Hariji's brother Sri Rangan and his wife Smt. Dhrushya are the same..

As to the other issue, can't anyone raise the issue of the misuse of our garment...sometimes it is horrifying to see the way the madisar is worn in movies/serials..I think the only person who wore it real well was Manorama...perfect like how our women wear it..the others (sad to note that even those who hail from brahmin families) make a mockery of it...

 

[drsundaram]

It looks like I have started a lively debate....
I would like point a few things about the 'younger IT generation'...seeing that I belong to that too.. yes, we are running around like headless chickens to start with, but personally I feel people from our community do want to uphold the traditions whenever possible. Do give us some credit..not that anyone here has discredited us. I live in London and the work culture here is different to the one we have in India..but we try and manage to do bits and pieces where ever possible...we have samooha poojais and discourses..The only disadvantage for us is, if it is on a weekday we are unable to attend..

And a small correction to what Dr.Sundaram has said abt Smt Vishaka's husband Sri Hariji.. he is not a Chartered Accountant..Smt Vishaka is the Chartered Accountant. But as you both rightly pointed out, you can always see them in this graceful attire..not just them, Sri Hariji's brother Sri Rangan and his wife Smt. Dhrushya are the same..

As to the other issue, can't anyone raise the issue of the misuse of our garment...sometimes it is horrifying to see the way the madisar is worn in movies/serials..I think the only person who wore it real well was Manorama...perfect like how our women wear it..the others (sad to note that even those who hail from brahmin families) make a mockery of it...

Correction noted on Sri Hari's profession. Thank you. About apolegetic way of wearing madisar I have with Sri Sabesan have pointed out in this forum. Raising it elsewhere, yes, that is how it should be where...How..... I am prepared if tips are given. I think sowcar Janaki in Baama vijayam wore it well. So also Padmini in Thillana Mohanambal. All rest were using it to imitate but is awefully bad . Anyway we are too submissive for anything , let it be in Vijay TV on Mangalasuthra or this......

 

[Paapu]

Nice topic ! I had real tough time during my marriage ( ever first time I wore madisar ). I am 4th generation born in Malaysia ( ancestors from Chidambaram ). It wasnt of practice back in Msia but my husband is from India ))) So I am back to be in touch madisar tradition. I used to wear madisar whenever I do pooja at my in laws place in India.

Just another question... is it okay for Iyers to wear madisar Iyengar style I feel its much more easier for me to wear that way...

I would really appreciate if someone suggest me good places in Chennai to get madisar sarees...especially nice pattu type , on my last visit to India ( abt 2 yrs ago ) I did visit Vadapalani area...most of the shops I went...did not have madisar sarees...! So disappointing !

 

[tbs]

Nice topic ! I had real tough time during my marriage ( ever first time I wore madisar ). I am 4th generation born in Malaysia ( ancestors from Chidambaram ). It wasnt of practice back in Msia but my husband is from India ))) So I am back to be in touch madisar tradition. I used to wear madisar whenever I do pooja at my in laws place in India.

Just another question... is it okay for Iyers to wear madisar Iyengar style I feel its much more easier for me to wear that way...

I would really appreciate if someone suggest me good places in Chennai to get madisar sarees...especially nice pattu type , on my last visit to India ( abt 2 yrs ago ) I did visit Vadapalani area...most of the shops I went...did not have madisar sarees...! So disappointing !

hi
vanakkam/welcome...nice madissaar sarees from radhas silk emporium
mylapore,chennai.....nalli silks in t nagar...u can try...ok lah?

regards
tbs

 

[SuryaKasyapa]

An year back when I went to Hrishikesh,I saw , readymade(Stitched) Pnchakachams.I took a fancy to it and bought pair. But on an occasion when I asked my vadhyar reluctuntly about this to wear, he did not agree for that. But I saw many people buying correctly inquiring for that ,whereas I bought by seeing another person buying.

Why not we use them?

 

[Paapu]

Thank u / " terima - kasih " TBS-ji ! Certainly will check at the place's you've mentioned.

 

[Sabesan Narayanaswami]

Nice topic ! I had real tough time during my marriage ( ever first time I wore madisar ). I am 4th generation born in Malaysia ( ancestors from Chidambaram ). It wasnt of practice back in Msia but my husband is from India ))) So I am back to be in touch madisar tradition. I used to wear madisar whenever I do pooja at my in laws place in India.

Just another question... is it okay for Iyers to wear madisar Iyengar style I feel its much more easier for me to wear that way...

I would really appreciate if someone suggest me good places in Chennai to get madisar sarees...especially nice pattu type , on my last visit to India ( abt 2 yrs ago ) I did visit Vadapalani area...most of the shops I went...did not have madisar sarees...! So disappointing !

Nalli's/Rangachari/Radha Silks/Kanchipuram are the best bets..

 

[Paapu]

Thank u for the suggestion, certainly will check out those places on my next visit.