Avadhuta Gita

[renuka]

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Stanza 63

You have neither mother nor father nor relative nor wife nor child nor friend.Neither have you any partiality or impartiality.Why then is there so much suffering in your mind?

Stanza 64

O mind,there is no day or night for you,nor rise nor fall.How can the wise imagine a bodiless being to have a body?

 

[RVR]

Stanza 63

You have neither mother nor father nor relative nor wife nor child nor friend.Neither have you any partiality or impartiality.Why then is there so much suffering in your mind?

Stanza 64

O mind,there is no day or night for you,nor rise nor fall.How can the wise imagine a bodiless being to have a body?

Sister Renuka,

You are provoking me to take up Sanyasa.

The stanzas are wonderful.

Please keep it up

All the best

 

[renuka]

Sister Renuka,

You are provoking me to take up Sanyasa.

The stanzas are wonderful.

Please keep it up

All the best

Dear RVR anna,

If you feel this stanza makes you feel like taking up Sanyasa..read this stanza from Bhavani Ashtakam:


Na thato, na mata, na bandur na data,
Na putro, na putri , na bruthyo , na bartha,
Na jayaa na Vidhya, na Vruthir mamaiva,
Gathistvam, Gathistvam Tvam eka Bhavani.

Neither the mother nor the father,
Neither the relation nor the friend,
Neither the son nor the daughter,
Neither the servant nor the husband,
Neither the wife nor the knowledge,
And neither my sole occupation,
Are my refuges that I can depend, Oh, Bhavani,
So you are my refuge and my only refuge, Bhavani


renu

 

[renuka]

Stanza 65

Realize the immutable Atman,which is neither the whole nor the part,neither undivided nor divided.It is beyond happiness and misery.

Stanza 66

I am neither the doer nor the enjoyer.There is no past or present action in me.
Since I have no idea of body or of bodilessness,how can I say that it is mine or not mine?

 

[renuka]

Stanza 67

I am free from such weaknesses as passion,anger and so on.I am free from misery pertaining to the body,the mind and so on.Know that I am that Atman which is one and vast as space.

Stanza 68

My friend mind,what is the use of so much idle talk?My friend mind,all this is a matter of conjecture.I have told you what is the quintessence.You are indeed the Reality---boundless as space

 

[anandb]

Dearest Nara anna,

You know when I was typing the stanza I thought of the same thing also...But i guess Dattatreya was speaking about Nirguna Brahman in Stanza 59 and Saguna Brahman in Stanza 60...

Dear anna, How can I ever get mad with you?
Have I ever got mad with you ever before...

I am going to qoute and modify stanza 60 now...

"I do not see any diversity....How can I even get mad with anyone? for You and I are verily One and the same....."


your loving sister:kiss:
renu

Renuji,

There is a contradiction here as well. If you and Shri. Nara are one and the same, how can he be a anna and you the thangai. Think about it.:laugh:

 

[renuka]

Renuji,

There is a contradiction here as well. If you and Shri. Nara are one and the same, how can he be a anna and you the thangai. Think about it.:laugh:

Dear AnandJi,

Nara is Saguna
Renu is Saguna
Hence we are anna and thangai..

When we are Nirguna we are One and the same....

renu:music:

 

[SuryaKasyapa]

Sister Renuka,

You are provoking me to take up Sanyasa.

All the best

Sri RVR ji, I have to say " Ma RVR"... (similar to Ma nishaada.. stop .......,don,t do so..).


There are much unfinished in Karma Yoga to think of Sanyasa.

(Shall we consult Shri Sharamaji if such a yoga is there in the horoscope ?).

Jokes part, I am copying a piece of note in one blog which I felt was relevant in this context..

QUOTE:

I remember reading once Ramakrishna paramahmasa who stated the
essence of bagahvad Gita. He said keep on saying Geetha .. Geetha you
will end up saying thagi, Thagi,Thyagi.

perhaps the real meaning of Thyagi has to be searched from Baghavat
Geeta
in chapter 18 when Arjuna asks krishna difference betwen Thyaga and
Sanyasa(18,1)

samnnyasaya(of renunciaton) mahabaho(mighty armed) tatvam(the truth)
ichchami(wish) veditum(to know)|
tyagasya(of thyaga) ca(and) hrishikesa(oh hrishi kesa) prthak
(severally) kesinsudana(slayer of kesi)||

I desire to know severally oh mighty armed,the truth of sanyasa, oh
hrishikesa and also of thyaga,oh slayer of kesi

(sri bhgavan uvacha)Baghavan said

kamayanam( desireful) karmanam(of actions) nyasam(renunciation)
samyasam(renunciation) kavayah(sages) viduh(undertand)|
sarva karma pala thyagam(the abandonment fruits of all works)Prahaus
(declare)
thyagam(abandonement) vickasanah||(the wise)

The renunciation of kamay karma, the sages understand as sanyasa
The wise declares the abandonment of the fruits of all works as
thyaga.

In the vaious bashyams there are various interpretations of this
(going hrough chinmayananda,chidbavananda,purushotamananda,
shantnanada.)
I have come to the folowing distinction.
kamya karma are actions which are prformed with an intent to
accumulate personal wealth, life,status etc.renunciation of
all "works" or "actions" leading to this is called sanyasa.(this to
me is a role metaphor or a clear work metaphor).Thyaga talks only
about abandonment of the fruits of the action (this is an
existantial metaphor where the actions can mean any thing but there
is no atachement to the fruits of the action).

After this 18-3 also talks of meaning of sanyas but there is a total
blurring of the two. some where many sages have been using theses two
words as synonyms.
To me sanyas is a way of not creating desires. if you dont do any
karma the desire themselves do not rise. it is role bound mechanism
for reaching a state wher renunciation occurs.

A Thyagi in true sense can be deeply involved in actions( like the
lady who was serving her husband when konkanamui expected her to
serve him first,she tells Him (kokkennru ninaitheero konkana
munivarae!!).konkana muni earlier had looked at a stork in anger
since it had shat on him as he was meditating and the stork had got
burnt with his yogic(ayogyic!!)looks..When he got upset with the
lady , she tells him i am not the stork for you to get burnt. she
then directs him to a butcher who is a great sage.... so the story
goes(Mahabaratha)I think.So the karma yoga is acually extolled here.
There is a strong move in Baghavat geeta to give predominace to karma
yoga as perhaps the intention of krishna was to energise Arjuna in
performing his role actions.
Some classical sages who believed in the brahminic value of sanyas as
a way of life probably were trying to equate thyaga with sanyasa.

in chapter (4-20)
Thyathva kma pala sangamnitytpro iasaya
Karmany abhipravrtto p nai va kimcit karoti sah

Here the poet is using th word'Thyaktva'

Having abandoned atachment to the fruits of action
,ever content,depending upo nothing,though engeged in karma,verily he
does not do any thing.here why should he use th esentence "thyaktwa
karmaphalam" this person is the thyagi.

5-10.5-11,5-11,5-12 also talks of abandonment of fruit of actions and
abandonment of actions.
To me thyagi is a yogi who is able to do all worldly actions and yet
is not owning up the fruits of action for his accumlation of karma.he
is only a part of the cause. he releases himself from the cause
effect cycle.Every efect does not create another seed of action in
him. UNQUOTE


(link: Sanyas and thyagi what is thedifference : DSampath blogs on sulekha, Religion blogs, DSampath blog from india

 

[renuka]

Stanza 69

In whatever way and in whatever place the yogis die,they merge into Brahman,as the jar space is united with the limitless space when the jar is broken.

Stanza 70

A yogi may die in a holy place or even in the house of a one born at the end of the varna or he may even die in a coma;but no sooner does he give up the body than he becomes one with the Absolute.



Stanza 71

The yogis consider everything -duty,wealth,objects of enjoyment,liberation and all movable and immovable things,such as men,trees and so on--as water in a mirage

 

[renuka]

Stanza 72

I did not perform actions in the past nor do I preform actions in the present,nor shall I perform actions in the future.Neither did I nor do I nor shall I enjoy their respective fruits.This is my firm conviction.

Stanza 73

The Avadhuta lives happily alone in a secluded place,purified by the uninterrupted bliss of Brahman.Renouncing the ego,the mendicant Avadhuta moves about and finds everything within his own Self.

 

[renuka]

Stanza 74

When there is no threefold state,nor even the Fourth(Transcendental),there one attains the Absolute Atman.
Where there is neither virtue nor vice,how can there be bondage or liberation.

Stanza 75

One cannot attain Brahman through the repetition of mantras or the recitation of the Vedas or the practice of tantric rites.The great Avadhuta after purifying himself through meditation and becoming absorbed in the uninterrupted bliss of Brahman has sung this Gita spontaneously.

Stanza 76

Everything is void and at the same time full.There is neither truth nor falsehood in Brahman.This is narrated by the Avadhuta from his own experience and also according to his knowledge of the scriptures.

End of Chapter 1
tommorow will start on chapter 2

 

[RVR]

Stanza 74

When there is no threefold state,nor even the Fourth(Transcendental),there one attains the Absolute Atman.
Where there is neither virtue nor vice,how can there be bondage or liberation.

Stanza 75

One cannot attain Brahman through the repetition of mantras or the recitation of the Vedas or the practice of tantric rites.The great Avadhuta after purifying himself through meditation and becoming absorbed in the uninterrupted bliss of Brahman has sung this Gita spontaneously.

Stanza 76

Everything is void and at the same time full.There is neither truth nor falsehood in Brahman.This is narrated by the Avadhuta from his own experience and also according to his knowledge of the scriptures.

End of Chapter 1
tommorow will start on chapter 2

Stanza 75

It says repetition of mantras and reciting vedhas will not help in attaining brahman.

It goes against common belief. Mostly people are comfortable with reciting vedhas or repetition of mantras.

Personally I also feel that mantras or vedhas are just paths in the spiritual journey but not solutions to realize brahman.

This stanza clearly spells out that realizing brahman requires different mindset.

Could you explain further on this

All the best

 

[renuka]

Stanza 75

It says repetition of mantras and reciting vedhas will not help in attaining brahman.

It goes against common belief. Mostly people are comfortable with reciting vedhas or repetition of mantras.

Personally I also feel that mantras or vedhas are just paths in the spiritual journey but not solutions to realize brahman.

This stanza clearly spells out that realizing brahman requires different mindset.

Could you explain further on this

All the best

Dear RVRJi,

I am going to answer you from the knowledge I have acquired from reading various books...this is just my personal belief...

Mantras and Vedas are needed for the spiritual aspirant to get on the right track and to elevate to a higher spiritual state.
Also from Tamo Guna--to Raja Guna---to Sattva Guna---and finally Nirguna.

Recitation of mantras merely help to dispel darkness and lead us from Untruth to Truth...Realization of Brahman is our own journey which no mantra,no Vedas or no Guru can teach us.

We have to rely on our intrinsic ability finally and not on extrinsic influence in the form of mantras,rituals etc.

Doesnt Lord Krishna say in the Bhagavad Gita;

Uddharet aatmanaatmaanam
naatmaanam avasaadayet
aatmaiva hy aatmano bandhur
aatmaiva ripur aatmanah

Let man uplift self by the self;
let the self not be degraded.
Indeed,the self is its own friend
and the self is its own enemy.


Many of us recite mantras,vedas etc...but how many truly see all as one?
We still have the feeling of "Mamaiva"..the feeling of mine and thine.
To realize Brahman,Sattva guna is not enough..A guna still binds.
A person with Sattva Guna will have good qualities but he will also despise any bad and also be judgemental when it comes to others.
He might have the "Holier than Thou" attitude...
He cannot still realize Brahman...because he still has not gone beyond the pairs of opposite.
There is still two here...The good and the bad..

Doesnt stanza 74-76 say there is neither vice nor virtue,there is neither truth nor falsehood in Brahman.

I will give you a simple example....now this whole Nithyananda scandal episode...many will be saying bad about him now...
Many might forget all the good lectures he had given before.
The fact is he has a flaw in his character....(if its actually him in the video)
He has still some amount of desire in him...

Now many Sattva guna people will despise his act but a person who does not see good or bad will hope that Nithyananda realises his flaw and works on it to ovecome it and with all the knowledge he has he will rise up again from the ashes like a Phoenix

renu

 

[RVR]

Sister Renuka

I am reminded of Ramana Maharishi.

His method of realising brahman is by questioning `Who Am I' and not by repeating any mantra or reciting vedha.

The stanza 75 perfectly matches with Ramana Maharishi's method.

I always felt that Ramana's method is highly rational as compared to repeating a particular mantra or reciting vedha.

This stanza of avadhuta gita and Ramana's philosophy seems to be beyond all religon and God

It is really a wonderful stanza.

All the best

 

[renuka]

Chapter 2

Avadhuta said:

Stanza 1

A guru may be young or engaged in wordly pursuits,he may be iliiterate or a servant or a householder;but none of these should be taken into consideration.Does one give up a gem dropped in the dirt ?



Stanza 2

The teachings of a guru should not be judged from the stanpoint of literacy merit.Indeed intelligent people accept the quintessense.Is not a boat,though unpainted and ugly capable of carrying passegers across the ocean ?

 

[RVR]

Chapter 2

Avadhuta said:

Stanza 1

A guru may be young or engaged in wordly pursuits,he may be iliiterate or a servant or a householder;but none of these should be taken into consideration.Does one give up a gem dropped in the dirt ?



Stanza 2

The teachings of a guru should not be judged from the stanpoint of literacy merit.Indeed intelligent people accept the quintessense.Is not a boat,though unpainted and ugly capable of carrying passegers across the ocean ?

Chapter 2 Stanza 1 reminds the episode of Nithyananda Paramahamsa which is the hot topic now.

I cannot accept such people as my Guru

All the best

 

[renuka]

Chapter 2 Stanza 1 reminds the episode of Nithyananda Paramahamsa which is the hot topic now.

I cannot accept such people as my Guru

All the best

Dear RVR anna,

I knew you were going to say this...

I will type the explanation given in the book.

An illumined soul is not contaminated by anything.Apparently he may be engaged in wordly pursuits due to prarabdha or the momentum of his past actions,but this does not affect his knowledge.


Anna,let me add a few words here.
Wordly pursuits are..education,job,marriage,spouse,family,property etc(by legitimate means)

Sex scandals are not wordly pursuits..its an act of unrighteousness.

renu

 

[RVR]

Dear RVR anna,

I knew you were going to say this...

I will type the explanation given in the book.

An illumined soul is not contaminated by anything.Apparently he may be engaged in wordly pursuits due to prarabdha or the momentum of his past actions,but this does not affect his knowledge.


Anna,let me add a few words here.
Wordly pursuits are..education,job,marriage,spouse,family,property etc(by legitimate means)

Sex scandals are not wordly pursuits..its an act of unrighteousness.

renu

Thanks for the clarifications. Now I am clear.

All the best

 

[renuka]

Stanza 3

The motionless Brahman possesses all that is movable and immovable without any effort.It is by nature calm,conscious and all pervading like space.

Stanza 4

Truly that omnipresent Brahman alone guides efforlessly all that is mobile and immobile.Then how can that nondual Brahman be different from me ?

 

[renuka]

Stanza 5

Since I am that Supreme Beautitude, I am beyond the essential and nonessential.I am free from birth and death,doubt and confusion.


Stanza 6

I am without constituents part,so I am worshippped by the gods.Since I am that intergral Being, I do not acknowledge differences between gods(such as Brahma,Vishnu and Shiva)

 

[renuka]

Stanza 7

Ignorance cannot create any doubt in me.Why should I care about the waves of the mind?
They appear and disappear like bubbles in water.

Stanza 8

As softness,hardness,sweetness and bitterness are ever connected with their respectives objects,so cosmic intelligence and other elements are always pervaded by Brahman.

 

[N.R.Ranganathan]

Dear Renuji,
The example of Lord Dakshinamurthy being young and the four
disciples older than the Master comes to my mind while reading
stanza 1.

The qualifications of a Guru are explained in Mundakopanishad
1-2-12 as ' shrothriam brahmanishtam'. This is further expanded
by sri Adi Sankara in Viveka choodamani in the verse beginning
with ' saantha mahantho nivasanthi ..........'. Gurus are those
who have crossed the ocean of samsar and help the disciples
also to cross it. They are erudite in sastras and are themselves
brahmanishtas. They are selfless in their endeavour to lift their
disciples and realize the supreme Bliss.

I am sorry to interrupt in the middle of an ongoing good work.

Regards,

 

[renuka]

Dear Renuji,
The example of Lord Dakshinamurthy being young and the four
disciples older than the Master comes to my mind while reading
stanza 1.

The qualifications of a Guru are explained in Mundakopanishad
1-2-12 as ' shrothriam brahmanishtam'. This is further expanded
by sri Adi Sankara in Viveka choodamani in the verse beginning
with ' saantha mahantho nivasanthi ..........'. Gurus are those
who have crossed the ocean of samsar and help the disciples
also to cross it. They are erudite in sastras and are themselves
brahmanishtas. They are selfless in their endeavour to lift their
disciples and realize the supreme Bliss.

I am sorry to interrupt in the middle of an ongoing good work.

Regards,

Dear Sir,

Thanks for giving info to all of us....
We all are learning from each other in this forum...

regards,
renu

 

[renuka]

Stanza 9

As water can be hot or cold or warm and still be the same water,so also Prakriti(matter) and Purusha(spirit),it seems to me are identical.


Stanza 10

Since Brahman is subtler than the subtlest,It is devoid of appelation.It is betond the senses,the mind and the intellect.It is the ever-shining Lord of the Universe.

 

[N.R.Ranganathan]

Dear Renuji,

Chapter 1 ,stanza 76 - void but at the same time full, that is sunya
and at the sametime poorna.

An explanation of this concept of soonya and poorna is found in
yoga vasishta.

We can also cite the examples of a tamil proverb ' kallaik kandaal
naayaik kaanom......'. Saint Tirumoolar also says ' maraththai
maraiththathu mamada yaanai .....'.

An elephant is made out of wood. If you look at it as wood only,
then elephant is not there -elephant is soonyam and wood is
poornam. If you look at it as an elephant , then elephant is there
and wood is not there. Elephant is poornam but wood is soonyam.
Thus an article can be both poornam and soonyam. Similarly the
example of the image of dog carved out of stone.

Till I read this piece I was wondering as to how a thing can be
both soonyam and poornam.

However, soonya or poorna does not make any difference to anyone
who has realized Brahman. All are same !

Just thought I can share this with all.