Scrutinising the subject, 'Science'

[Raghy]

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Respectable members,

Greetings. Sri.Saidevo said (in a different thread) :-

As regards Raghy's argument that we should discuss the negative aspects too when we discuss the positives, the same logic should apply to:

• discussions of science: when we showcase the achievements of science, do we talk about the ills it has wrought on the human society, animal and mineral kingdom, and Nature as a whole?

Actually we have not discussed the 'poitive aspects' of 'science' as such. But that is beside the point. A wide spectrum of topics can be viewed under 'science'. Before we start scrutinising Science, kindly allow me to make few posts high lighting the achievements of science... then we can happily take them apart as we add more achievements of science.

Let us open with this please. Let us watch 'Science and Humanity'.....

VS Ramachandran: The neurons that shaped civilization | Video on TED.com

Cheers!

 

[Nara]

..... Actually we have not discussed the 'poitive aspects' of 'science' as such.

Dear Raghy and others,

There are probably several motivations to diss science.

One is the knee-jerk reaction among those who feel an urge to defend religion, in this instance caste, to criticize science as if that somehow absolves religion/caste of its original criticism. If they see any criticism of religion they start off criticizing science.

Another motivation is the mistaken idea that there is a competition between science and religion, a kind of of a zero-sum duel, where disparaging science is seen as a triumph for religion.

In reality, science and religion are not in the same league at all, not even in the same planet.

At the root of religion is doctrine, at the root of science is reason.
At the root of religion is certainty, at the root of science is inquiry.
At the root of religion is enforced conformity, at the root of science is freedom of thought.
At the root of religion is handed down wisdom that must be accepted without question, at the root of science is questioning anything that is handed down.
At the root of religion is untested testimony, at the root of science is independent testing and verification.
At the root of religion is moralizing, at the root of science is impartial dispassion.

There is no equivalency between science and religion. Science is a self-correcting process of discovery, verification, and validation. Nobody is required to believe in it, nobody is required to use it, people are free to do whatever with it.

Science makes no demand on anyone. If somebody does not trust science he can leave it. Atheists have done just that with religion. They are not clinging on to religion and yet criticize it. So, why can't those who try to say science is just as bad do likewise and abandon science. Why do they use electricity, why do they use gas, why do they use IC engine based transportation, why do they use the phones, why do they use any kind of western medicine? It is not as if this is impossible, the Amish are doing it even today. Those who want to enjoy the benefits of science on the one hand and then level bogus criticisms against it are whatchamacallit, freeloaders.

Cheers!

 

[Raghy]

Sri.Nara said amoung other thought provoking inputs:-

at the root of science is questioning anything that is handed down......at the root of science is independent testing and verification.

Thank you Sri.Nara. Any research conducted by any scientist gets peer reviewed; data gets cross examined; samples scrutinised......But that is the basis of science..infact, that is science. As Sri.Nara stated, not to accept anything handed down with out questioning..

Does science support human values? Kindly watch this please...

Sam Harris: Science can answer moral questions | Video on TED.com

Cheers!

 

[Iyest]

Dear Raghy and others,

There are probably several motivations to diss science.

One is the knee-jerk reaction among those who feel an urge to defend religion, in this instance caste, !

Caste is not the same as religion. That again is a knee jerk reaction.

to criticize science as if that somehow absolves religion/caste of its original criticism. If they see any criticism of religion they start off criticizing science. !

These dudes are lacking in gray matter. That is all.

In reality, science and religion are not in the same league at all, not even in the same planet.

Actually, religion is the root of science. Today they are in conflict due to the abuse of both.

At the root of religion is doctrine, at the root of science is reason.
At the root of religion is certainty, at the root of science is inquiry.!

Inquiry is the root of religion. One only has only to read the works of Buddha through Nagarjuna down to Ramana Maharshi and Krishnamurti in the last century. It is also impersonal inquiry as opposed to the inquiry for personal gain in todays science.

At the root of religion is enforced conformity, at the root o science is freedom of thought. !

Well it depends. Oppenheimer felt he had freedom of thought when unleashing his work on the bomb. Later he realized he should have thought about the consequences of yielding the nuclear button to the political leader in the White house. He tried to undo the damage but found he did not have the freedom anymore.

 

[Raghy]

Sri.Iyest said:-

These dudes are lacking in gray matter. That is all.

I start with something you said that is agreeable to me. Although I can't speak for Sri.Nara, I dare say, he may agree too.

Actually, religion is the root of science.

Can you back up your claim? Religion is a belief syatem based on faith. Belief is accepting something without evidence. On the other hand, seeking evidence by conducting tests and research is known as 'science'. I look forward to see the basis for your claim.

Inquiry is the root of religion.

With respect to religion, inquiry...of what? Without addressing the topic of inquiry, how can one see an inquiry taking place? I request you to elobarate on that, please. Thank you.

Oppenheimer felt he had freedom of thought when unleashing his work on the bomb. Later he realized he should have thought about the consequences of yielding the nuclear button to the political leader in the White house. He tried to undo the damage but found he did not have the freedom anymore.

It is very interesting. I am sure you have evidences to prove the quoted claim. As far as I know, Oppenheimer was committed to the 'bomb project'. (Although it is irrelevant to this discussion, you may be aware that Oppenheimer was very interested Hindu Religion).

Cheers!

 

[Nara]

I start with something you said that is agreeable to me. Although I can't speak for Sri.Nara, I dare say, he may agree too.

I don't agree Raghy, I have a lot of gray matter -- outside my skull though, or, are you guys talking about something else? You see I am supposed to be lacking in some matter or other, I am trying to figure it all out, but I am not getting it, I will work on it some more and see whether I can understand.

Cheers

 

[nachi naga]

I don't agree Raghy, I have a lot of gray matter -- outside my skull though, or, are you guys talking about something else? You see I am supposed to be lacking in some matter or other, I am trying to figure it all out, but I am not getting it, I will work on it some more and see whether I can understand.

Cheers

:lalala::scared::happy:

 

[sapthajihva]

... I have a lot of gray matter -- outside my skull though, ...

Pardon me for butting in... but I just hope that it was not in one of our 'rounds' that the gray matter came outside the skull? Maybe due to 'punches'?:madgrin: My punches...??! But those were soft ones....!!! Coming to think of it, I never did punch at all...

Anyways, I dont punch senior citizens....!:becky:

Or has it always been outside....? :suspicious:

 

[nachi naga]

sapthajihva,

please don't maayir pudungify,all he has now is,gray mayirru !! with a kudumi bobbing and a sporty komanam (it's a j/k)

 

[sapthajihva]

..... (it's a j/k)

I guess that statement saved the day...

 

[Nara]

Pardon me for butting in... but I just hope that it was not in one of our 'rounds' that the gray matter came outside the skull?

Big mistake, as they say சட்டியிலே இருந்தாதானே ஆப்பையில வர. I have very good external growth, so what is inside is perhaps very suitable only for that

...Anyways, I dont punch senior citizens....!:becky:

Look here young man, at my age I have of lots of female admirers right here from this site itself

Or has it always been outside....?

Now you are talking ....

 

[Iyest]

Sri.Iyest said:-


Can you back up your claim?

It is not a claim. Read the works of the people mentioned.

Religion is a belief syatem based on faith. !

Not according to the above.

With respect to religion, inquiry...of what? Without addressing the topic of inquiry, how can one see an inquiry taking place? I request you to elobarate on that, please. Thank you.!

Inquiry of the inquirer. You are welcome.

It is very interesting. I am sure you have evidences to prove the quoted claim. As far as I know, Oppenheimer was committed to the 'bomb project'. (Although it is irrelevant to this discussion, you may be aware that Oppenheimer was very interested Hindu Religion).

Evidence is available in many historical records and you can find it. Yes, we also know he quoted from the Gita.

 

[nachi naga]

robert oppenheimer was feeling guilty,so he took umbrage,under hinduism,that too lord vishnu.the crap about nuclear technology used by indians in mahabharatha war,was the icing on the cake.ro could not stop usa president to bomb hiroshima and nagasaki,the only country in the world today,to unleash the nuclear bombs,maybe pakistanis,will use the nuclear bombs to bomb usa,in the future.

 

[Raghy]

Sri.Iyest,

From the single liner responses in the post #12, I can see the depth of your knowledge in the subject in discussion. When you develop the capacity to elobarate your thoughts, I will be more than happy to discuss with you.

Cheers!

 

[Raghy]

I don't agree Raghy, I have a lot of gray matter -- outside my skull though, or, are you guys talking about something else? You see I am supposed to be lacking in some matter or other, I am trying to figure it all out, but I am not getting it, I will work on it some more and see whether I can understand.

Cheers

Sri.Nara,

Greetings. என் தலை உள்ளேயும் காலி; வெளியேயும் காலி.So, I could readily agree. I forgot about your lovely சிகை. Sorry. உம்ம தலைக்குள்ளே நல்ல வண்டல் இருக்கும் போல இருக்கு! அதான் சிகை நன்னா வளர்ந்து இருக்கு!

 

[Iyest]

Sri.Iyest,

From the single liner responses in the post #12, I can see the depth of your knowledge in the subject in discussion.

Yes, sir. Too bad you could not use your 'drishti' to understand the works mentioned.

When you develop the capacity to elobarate your thoughts, I will be more than happy to discuss with you.

When you develop some civility in your correspondence, I might also be willing.

 

[Nara]

..... When you develop some civility in your correspondence, I might also be willing.

Folks,

It is less than 2 months since he joined this forum and here are some "civil" pronouncements he has made:

• These dudes are lacking in gray matter. That is all.
• What is really telling is your depth of ignorance and lack of comprehension.
• First let us shake off our stupidity
• Great speech.

I am sure he is completely oblivious to the mocking tone of his posts that are oozing with condescension. Yet he is so super sensitive to incivility in others that he sees it even when it is not there.

We go about our business deeply concerned with matters that affect us, and nothing wrong with that. We have no time for others, there is nothing wrong with that as well. We see suffering, misery and sadness all around us, and we are apathetic. This behavior can also be excused, after all we all have our own grief and suffering to endure. But what is truly amazing is we are oblivious to our own transgressions, but quick to take offense against real or imagined transgressions of others. A little bit of empathy will make us all better people.

Cheers!

 

[sapthajihva]

...

Look here young man, at my age I have of lots of female admirers right here from this site itself

They have a medical terminology for this kind of self proclaimed mental visions... :biggrin1:

 

[Nara]

They have a medical terminology for this kind of self proclaimed mental visions...

Humble clairvoyance? :heh:

 

[sapthajihva]

Humble clairvoyance?

Think it is more like schizo... something...phrenia... something...:evil:...

 

[Nara]

... something...:evil:...

I see a lot of green in the above, green with envy??? :boom:

 

[sapthajihva]

I see a lot of green in the above, green with envy??? :boom:

No, I am only 'V', no 'NV'... :madgrin:... hence the green...

 

[renuka]

Big mistake, as they say சட்டியிலே இருந்தாதானே ஆப்பையில வர. I have very good external growth, so what is inside is perhaps very suitable only for that

Look here young man, at my age I have of lots of female admirers right here from this site itself

Now you are talking ....

Dear all...

Nara anna is telling the truth..there are many in this forum who think he is Manohara..
Mano(Mind)
Hara(Take away)

One who takes one's mind away...
So dont mess with my anna Ok..

renu

 

[Raghy]

Unfortunately I don't see 'science' being scrutinised here. I am still waiting for the science sceptics to show me the ills of science. I posted two subjects to get the ball rolling ( from Ramachandran and Sam Harris). :focus:

Cheers!

 

[nachi naga]

Unfortunately I don't see 'science' being scrutinised here. I am still waiting for the science sceptics to show me the ills of science. I posted two subjects to get the ball rolling ( from Ramachandran and Sam Harris). :focus:

Cheers!

raghy

it all depeds upons ones views ultimately,if you think science is progressive then it is so,if you think science is regressive then it is so.happiness is a state of mind,which vastly differs from one individual to another.every society has its own plus and minus,we endeavor to attain optimum satisfaction.