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Tired of playing games of us vs them

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prasad1

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Some members in this site are insisting on clocking themselves in Tiranga Jhanda. What gives them exclusive right to speak for India, Indian, Hinduism etc. If any one dare object to happenings in India, these good samaritan and their jalara group attacks them as if these PIO are anti-India.

You may not have the opportunity of travelling abroad or your myopic view does not permit you to see others POV, but it exists.

People of Indian origin, still have a lot of attachment towards India, you should have seen the Indian flag more in ICC champions trophy than the British Flag. Even the English team commented about that. It was was not the Indian Nationals who were waving the flag.
 
People of Indian origin, still have a lot of attachment towards India,

Dear Prasad ji,

I dont know how far this is true..but I feel these days with Globalization most people are trying to see beyond borders.

I go to India ever year cos its near and I like to buy books and do some shopping.

Its fun for me if you ask me...but if you ask me if I have attachment to India....I would rather say I am thankful to India for giving me the chance of knowing Sathya Sai Baba..giving me my MBBS degree... the opportunity to study Sanskrit and also "giving" me Shah Rukh Khan!

In terms of attachment I might want to say NO..cos I feel we have been born in different countries in previous lives too so each country is as important to us as the other..so no specific attachment to any country and I call Malaysia my home since I was born and brought up here.
 
All are not alike. Some have emotional attachment, some critical, some criticising, some have hate attachments.

When hate predominates, it does not lead to detachment and moving away, but falling into the trap of considering oneself as a messiah to correct perceived wrongs of present and past good souls and save them from eternal damnation.

Dear Prasad ji,

I dont know how far this is true..but I feel these days with Globalization most people are trying to see beyond borders.

I go to India ever year cos its near and I like to buy books and do some shopping.

Its fun for me if you ask me...but if you ask me if I have attachment to India....I would rather say I am thankful to India for giving me the chance of knowing Sathya Sai Baba..giving me my MBBS degree... the opportunity to study Sanskrit and also "giving" me Shah Rukh Khan!

In terms of attachment I might want to say NO..cos I feel we have been born in different countries in previous lives too so each country is as important to us as the other..so no specific attachment to any country and I call Malaysia my home since I was born and brought up here.
 
Hate is strong word to use in conflict resolution.

Just as you assign motives to all the people different than you or your jalara group. Let me assign the possible reason to the conflict.
The people who are against PIO and their views are Ignorant about the true origin of our Hindu culture or Indian people.

For instance some think that India was great in 14th century or 6th century or what ever time frame they fancy. They do not understand that India as a country did not exist till British cobbled together Princely states. India as Republic was born on 26th January 1950. So generally any perceived greatness of India in ancient time is purely Mythe. It is more regional, or princely states greatness.

In the late Vedic period, around the 5th century BCE, the small chiefdoms of the Ganges Plain and the north-western regions had consolidated into 16 major oligarchies and monarchies that were known as the mahajanapadas. The emerging urbanisation and the orthodoxies of this age also created the religious reform movements of Buddhism and Jainism.

During the period 230 BCE to 220 CE, Satavahana dynasty covered much of India. The Satavahanas are credited for establishing peace in the country, resisting the onslaught of foreigners after the decline of Mauryan Empire. Satavahanas are also credited with furthering Budhism in India including Ajanta caves.

The Sangam literature of the Tamil language reveals that, between 200 BCE and 200 CE, the southern peninsula was being ruled by the Cheras, the Cholas, and the Pandyas, dynasties that traded extensively with the Roman Empire and with West and South-East Asia. In North India, Hinduism asserted patriarchal control within the family, leading to increased subordination of women. By the 4th and 5th centuries, the Gupta Empire had created in the greater Ganges Plain a complex system of administration and taxation that became a model for later Indian kingdoms. Under the Guptas, a renewed Hinduism based on devotion rather than the management of ritual began to assert itself.

A small reading of history tells you that there was no One INdia. I am proud of Modern India, that was created after Independence. I do not want to steal the neighbors achievements, just because I feel empty. A stolen greatness is worse than not having any greatness at all. I have no problem is accepting greatness of Mankind from any part of the world.

And this TRUTH hurts these so called INDIAN PATRIOTS and they lash out at any one pointing this out.

Or may be they are Jealous of the success of others who are prosperous, (Surely not or ...).
They failed socially or economically when they tried to leave India. Or they regret not leaving India because of circumstances.
Some are upset that their children left them and settled in other countries.

I do not know the causes, but most of these folks who proclaim themselves to be the only True Indian are
1. Do not like the free India we got from the British, they even hate the independence movement.
2. One even goes to the extent of predicting (using Astrology) the demise of Independent India.
3. One hates democracy is waiting for Ram Rajya, by the way Ram did not rule India.


Asoka did not rule India, he extended the Magadha kingdom to cover most of present day India.
 
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considering oneself as a messiah to correct perceived wrongs of present and past good souls and save them from eternal damnation.

Dear Sir,

India is lucky that Avatars are born there..so that way they do not need any Non Avatar messiah to save them.
 
Messiah is not the appropriate word; missionary is more representative.

Avatars are for the establishment of dharma and protection of vedas. Preserving and protection of vedas is prime dharma.

Dear Sir,

India is lucky that Avatars are born there..so that way they do not need any Non Avatar messiah to save them.
 
I dont know how far this is true..but I feel these days with Globalization most people are trying to see beyond borders.

Yes, this is a general trend, and good in a philosophical or spiritual sense, but reality could be different.

and also "giving" me Shah Rukh Khan!
Please take him with you to Malaysia... no kidding.
 
India today is, even today, not much different from what it probably was under Ashoka or the Gupta dynasty's time, except that the geographical area covered is rather different. The present geographical area is definitely much smaller than what the British cobbled together. The concept of a "Mother India", representing the British India as it was just before 14-08-1947, also does not seem to be an ancient idea, though it has been the practice to call one's native land or even earth itself as a whole, as mother or "jananī" in sanskrit. That perhaps was what induced patriots like Bankim Chandra Chatterjee to coin vande mātaram and Mother India etc.

While the princely states have disappeared in terms of their geography, their rulers, ruling systems, diverse administrative set-ups in those many "native" states etc., we now have many "states" of large and small sizes; proving the 'reorganization of states' as a very faulty and perhaps foolish decision made by inexperienced leaders at the nascent stage of the federal union that is the Indian republic, we see the unmistakable trend for sub-division of the existing states into smaller and smaller units. This is, in one sense, orderly disintegration - what else? This tendency for subdivision on various grounds, also reveals another facet of what the OP calls "Modern India" created after Independence, of which he is reportedly, " very proud of" — that is, the people here are still divided by many parameters like their ancestral history and their tribal glory (e.g., Jharkhand), economic disparities (e.g., demand for a separate Telengana) when, even the existing states are based on linguistic considerations.
Thus language, history of communities, economic conditions and even caste (I think Uttarakhand is based on caste consideration - 20% of its population is Brahmins!!) have been acting as centrifugal forces in the artificially 'cobbled together' Mother India by the great British with their colonial rule and this is open for every one to see.

It was just the same way that the scriptural bhāratavarṣa in the bharataḥkhaṇḍa existed. And, as Gandhiji observed in his wisdom "India lives in her villages" - not in the metros or cities.

We do have a number of members in this forum who have emigrated from this country, have adopted their new homeland as 'their country' and have become lawful citizens of those countries. But it can be said that, without exception, all of them have followed this "gatānugatikā nyāya" only if it was conducive to their material well being and not otherwise; there are no tabras who have migrated, accepted foreign citizenship but are sleeping in shop pavements covered by packing cases and asking for a few cents to fill their belly, etc.

Such members very often have a fallacious notion that if post-1947 India, their motherland, of which they are proud, is given some minimal "make-up", then this country can also "look" very much like their newly adopted country (of which they may or may not be as much proud, as they are of India). I am reminded of a TV advertisement which came some time ago. One mother not so good-looking, takes her child to the nursery but the child refuses to go and tells, "mummy, you are not beautiful like xyz's mom; why don't you also become beautiful like her? We are shown a specimen of an Indian woman dressed in western style, with all the make-up and other devices which go with it, leading the xyz to school, triumphantly!!
In the very same manner, our PIO benefactors desire that we adopt whatever "make up" they suggest, alter ourselves superficially and parade before them so that they can feel "at home".

Since some of us (it has become a necessity to make this "us vs them", mainly because of the condescending tone of our PIO gurus) are not convinced, and since 'they' are unable to convince us so far, that their 'upadesams', solutions to "our" problems etc., are workable in India, or will produce any solution to "our" problems, it becomes necessary to differ and to record such differences.

But, the above OP brings to light a new facet of some of our PIO benefactors, viz., that they can also be "touch-me-nots" who will not brook any dissent to whatever they say, on any topic. I am only thankful that as yet they cannot initiate a WMD allegation on us and do an Iraq on us ;) in their over-eagerness to bring their post-1947 Mother India, to the level they want, much the same way that the child in that TV ad wanted its mother to do.

PS:
I would like to humbly remind the thread starter about one old story possibly from the Panchatantra; a fisherwoman does not get sleep when lying down in the bed room of a flower-seller surrounded by the smell of flowers. At last she brings a basket of dried fish, which she had been carrying, into the bedroom. Once she gets the usual surroundings she was able to sleep.

Such is human nature. Some people will prefer their very native dirt, grime and poverty to the heavenly comforts elsewhere. It need not be that such people failed socially or economically when they tried to leave India, or they regret not leaving India because of circumstances, or that some are upset that their children left them and settled in other countries. One will have to repent conclusions drawn in haste and hate.
 
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Sri Sangom,

My responses are in blue.



India today is, even today, not much different from what it probably was under Ashoka or the Gupta dynasty's time, except that the geographical area covered is rather different. The present geographical area is definitely much smaller than what the British cobbled together. The concept of a "Mother India", representing the British India as it was just before 14-08-1947, also does not seem to be an ancient idea, though it has been the practice to call one's native land or even earth itself as a whole, as mother or "jananī" in sanskrit. That perhaps was what induced patriots like Bankim Chandra Chatterjee to coin vande mātaram and Mother India etc.

While the princely states have disappeared in terms of their geography, their rulers, ruling systems, diverse administrative set-ups in those many "native" states etc., we now have many "states" of large and small sizes; proving the 'reorganization of states' as a very faulty and perhaps foolish decision made by inexperienced leaders at the nascent stage of the federal union that is the Indian republic, we see the unmistakable trend for sub-division of the existing states into smaller and smaller units. This is, in one sense, orderly disintegration - what else? This tendency for subdivision on various grounds, also reveals another facet of what the OP calls "Modern India" created after Independence, of which he is reportedly, " very proud of" — that is, the people here are still divided by many parameters like their ancestral history and their tribal glory (e.g., Jharkhand), economic disparities (e.g., demand for a separate Telengana) when, even the existing states are based on linguistic considerations.
Thus language, history of communities, economic conditions and even caste (I think Uttarakhand is based on caste consideration - 20% of its population is Brahmins!!) have been acting as centrifugal forces in the artificially 'cobbled together' Mother India by the great British with their colonial rule and this is open for every one to see.

It was just the same way that the scriptural bhāratavarṣa in the bharataḥkhaṇḍa existed. And, as Gandhiji observed in his wisdom "India lives in her villages" - not in the metros or cities.

Nothing to say so far.

We do have a number of members in this forum who have emigrated from this country, have adopted their new homeland as 'their country' and have become lawful citizens of those countries. But it can be said that, without exception, all of them have followed this "gatānugatikā nyāya" only if it was conducive to their material well being and not otherwise; there are no tabras who have migrated, accepted foreign citizenship but are sleeping in shop pavements covered by packing cases and asking for a few cents to fill their belly, etc.

How do you know :)

Such members very often have a fallacious notion that if post-1947 India, their motherland, of which they are proud, is given some minimal "make-up", then this country can also "look" very much like their newly adopted country (of which they may or may not be as much proud, as they are of India). I am reminded of a TV advertisement which came some time ago. One mother not so good-looking, takes her child to the nursery but the child refuses to go and tells, "mummy, you are not beautiful like xyz's mom; why don't you also become beautiful like her? We are shown a specimen of an Indian woman dressed in western style, with all the make-up and other devices which go with it, leading the xyz to school, triumphantly!!
In the very same manner, our PIO benefactors desire that we adopt whatever "make up" they suggest, alter ourselves superficially and parade before them so that they can feel "at home".

This is where the division begins. Failure to recognize the genuine concern and desire of PIOs to make things better because of personal bias. Belittling of PIOs suggestions using sarcasm and irrelevant examples and completely rejecting any suggestions without even considering the merits.

Since some of us (it has become a necessity to make this "us vs them", mainly because of the condescending tone of our PIO gurus) are not convinced, and since 'they' are unable to convince us so far, that their 'upadesams', solutions to "our" problems etc., are workable in India, or will produce any solution to "our" problems, it becomes necessary to differ and to record such differences.

Aren't you doing the same thing to the PIOs that you are accusing them of. You could simply say their suggestions as being unviable, and state the reasons. Why the innuendo and sarcasm?


But, the above OP brings to light a new facet of some of our PIO benefactors, viz., that they can also be "touch-me-nots" who will not brook any dissent to whatever they say, on any topic. I am only thankful that as yet they cannot initiate a WMD allegation on us and do an Iraq on us ;) in their over-eagerness to bring their post-1947 Mother India, to the level they want, much the same way that the child in that TV ad wanted its mother to do.

This is because they have experienced life in both places by part of the society unlike you, who has visited or gets information from other people. They become "touch me nots" because the criticism/innuendo/accusation comes from an armchair critic who has no first hand knowledge of establishing a home and living in a westen society.

PS:
I would like to humbly remind the thread starter about one old story possibly from the Panchatantra; a fisherwoman does not get sleep when lying down in the bed room of a flower-seller surrounded by the smell of flowers. At last she brings a basket of dried fish, which she had been carrying, into the bedroom. Once she gets the usual surroundings she was able to sleep.

Such is human nature. Some people will prefer their very native dirt, grime and poverty to the heavenly comforts elsewhere. It need not be that such people failed socially or economically when they tried to leave India, or they regret not leaving India because of circumstances, or that some are upset that their children left them and settled in other countries. One will have to repent conclusions drawn in haste and hate.

Here again you make a generalization that people left India for heavenly comfort and leave native dirt, grime and poverty or that they consider the people who decided to stay behind as failures.

People genuinely interested in improving the conditions in India will welcome all suggestions with an open mind and evaluate them. The fact remains that a Chinese or an Arab is not going to offer suggestions to improve India. It is only people who have some affinity and interest in India will offer suggestions, NRIs/PIOs.

Initially when I emigrated out of India around 35years ago, when I used to visit India I would offer suggestions to my father what Indians should do to improve the general conditions and his reactions used to be the same as that you are displaying here. I realized that to him, who had never gone out of India, I looked like an upstart, who assumed that he knows everything just because he has spent a few years in the west. As I matured and mellowed I started understanding his point of view and stopped offering any suggestions to improve India. I understood that since I do not live there, what I see is only superficial and what I think might be the solution may not be suitable at all because I do not know all the facts. Probably I would react the same way if someone visiting from India offered me suggestions on how I should interact with my grandchildren or how I should run my home.

That is why I do not offer any suggestions/opinions regarding Indian infrastructure, society or politics. It is not my place.

However I would request you Mr. Sangom, not to paint every NRI and PIO with the negative image that you have created for them. Lot of the PIOs/NRIs make suggestions because they are genuinely interested in improving the conditions in their country of birth and or not trying to belittle people who are living there. It is their wish to see that country prosper because they see the immense potential and resources India has that is being wasted. Most of these NRIs/PIOs do this at their work and they desire the same thing for their country of birth.

If this is understood then there will be no us or them. Everyone is interested in India being a great country and if these personal egos are set aside we would have more harmonious discussions and we may even come out with some idea that is actually original and might do some good.

K. Kumar
 
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Sri Sangom,

My responses are in blue.





People genuinely interested in improving the conditions in India will welcome all suggestions with an open mind and evaluate them. The fact remains that a Chinese or an Arab is not going to offer suggestions to improve India. It is only people who have some affinity and interest in India will offer suggestions, NRIs/PIOs.

Initially when I emigrated out of India around 35years ago, when I used to visit India I would offer suggestions to my father what Indians should do to improve the general conditions and his reactions used to be the same as that you are displaying here. I realized that to him, who had never gone out of India, I looked like an upstart, who assumed that he knows everything just because he has spent a few years in the west. As I matured and mellowed I started understanding his point of view and stopped offering any suggestions to improve India. I understood that since I do not live there, what I see is only superficial and what I think might be the solution may not be suitable at all because I do not know all the facts. Probably I would react the same way if someone visiting from India offered me suggestions on how I should interact with my grandchildren or how I should run my home.

That is why I do not offer any suggestions/opinions regarding Indian infrastructure, society or politics. It is not my place.

However I would request you Mr. Sangom, not to paint every NRI and PIO with the negative image that you have created for them. Lot of the PIOs/NRIs make suggestions because they are genuinely interested in improving the conditions in their country of birth and or not trying to belittle people who are living there. It is their wish to see that country prosper because they see the immense potential and resources India has that is being wasted. Most of these NRIs/PIOs do this at their work and they desire the same thing for their country of birth.

If this is understood then there will be no us or them. Everyone is interested in India being a great country and if these personal egos are set aside we would have more harmonious discussions and we may even come out with some idea that is actually original and might do some good.

K. Kumar

I am not here to change your views or opinions, nor am I here to justify every word I write. I post my opinions here just as you do, and I don't expect any justification from you for your opinions.

K. Kumar


http://www.tamilbrahmins.com/general-discussions/12258-indesent-dressing-girls-29.html#post191108
 
Post #10.

Height of irrelevancy. I did not ask you to comment, Mr. Sangom, I was making a request to you. You have just proved my point about being close minded.

Thanks,
K. Kumar
 
People genuinely interested in improving the conditions in India will welcome all suggestions with an open mind and evaluate them. The fact remains that a Chinese or an Arab is not going to offer suggestions to improve India. It is only people who have some affinity and interest in India will offer suggestions, NRIs/PIOs.

Making grand statement of intent and objectives and following it up with useful articles is one thing and providing cut paste job of newspaaper articles in Times of India or The Hindu or The Hindustan Times is a completely different thing, as if people in India have no access to these news papers and have to rely on the well meaning and good intentions of these PIOs to know about this and have to be grateful to them for these small mercies.

No person would consider serialising the rape reports and forming a thread about these rapes exclusively and iterating and re-iterating their own opinions as contribution of welfare measure by these good Samaritans.

All these PIOs were strangely silent when there were hate crimes against Indians in Canada, USA and UK snd no thread was dedicated to those unfortunate persons. Instead they found time to search Canadian Daily Mail editorial to send us a write up on Dalit burning in UP!!!!!!

For that matter I didnt see any post from you on the hate crimes against Indian students in Australia in the recent past though there were a number of them, although by your posts you seem to have or have had some association with that country.

This is the double standard that is being reflected in the Us Vs. Them thread. It is very easy to preach. One has just to stand in the pulpit.
 
For that matter I didnt see any post from you on the hate crimes against Indian students in Australia in the recent past though there were a number of them, although by your posts you seem to have or have had some association with that country.

Zebra16,

Yes I lived in Australia for close to twenty years. The reason I did not make any comment was because I wasn't there when these attacks happened. When I checked with my friends both Indians and Australians, I found out that the picture being painted in Indian media was totally hyped up and the actual reasons were something very different. I do not read Indian newspapers so I had no idea what they were saying. The gist of the matter was, as I was told, they were in the wrong place at the wrong time. The criminals thought they were soft targets and easy pickings. I trust my friends' version more than the media versions.

I do not know what double standard you are talking about. On an individual basis, I post when I have some first hand information to contribute or to correct some misinformation. For example, I do not comment on events happening in Sholapur, because I don't know what happened there nor do I live there to understand the background.

My point was to bring home the point that NRIs/PIOs have some interest in India. That is why they make suggestions. If you don't like the suggestion, discard them. If you think there is some merit use them. My request was just because they are not in India don't ridicule them, or attribute motives to their suggestions. It is a very simple request.

Well sometimes one needs to get on the pulpit to be heard and I know it irks some when the error in their logic is pointed out.

I thought this forum is supposed to be a platform for exchanging ideas, but may be I am mistaken. If my posts are so offensive, I will withdraw myself and let all those who are supposed to be defending the virtues of their motherland do so.

Have a good day, good bye.

K. Kumar
 
Zebra16,

Yes I lived in Australia for close to twenty years. The reason I did not make any comment was because I wasn't there when these attacks happened. When I checked with my friends both Indians and Australians, I found out that the picture being painted in Indian media was totally hyped up and the actual reasons were something very different. I do not read Indian newspapers so I had no idea what they were saying. The gist of the matter was, as I was told, they were in the wrong place at the wrong time. The criminals thought they were soft targets and easy pickings. I trust my friends' version more than the media versions.


The high-lighted portion is one of the double standards I am talking about. The media becomes dubious when atrocities against Indians are telecast by these channels or published in newspapers and the same media becomes TRUTH PERSONIFIED when it reports rapes, is it?

I do not think any of the vociferous PIO friends made any personal enquiries to ascertain the veracity of the newspaper reports before consuming reams and reams of cyber sheet about rape.

Be that as it may, nothing was stopping them from reporting or giving HTML links to Canadian Daily Mail or Sydney Herald or London Times or Washington Post which covered the hate crimes against Indians. Were the victims not Indians? Why did the affinity towards fellow Indians go away then?

I have seen a very few posts made by you and my post is not directed against your post.

It is high time that these PIOs start to demonstrate their sensitivity which they keep dinning into our ears always. After all charity begins at home.
 
The high-lighted portion is one of the double standards I am talking about. The media becomes dubious when atrocities against Indians are telecast by these channels or published in newspapers and the same media becomes TRUTH PERSONIFIED when it reports rapes, is it?

I do not think any of the vociferous PIO friends made any personal enquiries to ascertain the veracity of the newspaper reports before consuming reams and reams of cyber sheet about rape.

Be that as it may, nothing was stopping them from reporting or giving HTML links to Canadian Daily Mail or Sydney Herald or London Times or Washington Post which covered the hate crimes against Indians. Were the victims not Indians? Why did the affinity towards fellow Indians go away then?

I have seen a very few posts made by you and my post is not directed against your post.

It is high time that these PIOs start to demonstrate their sensitivity which they keep dinning into our ears always. After all charity begins at home.

Mr. Zebra,
You have been railing against these PIO's who have POV opposed to your POV.
You have been India and are more patriotic than any PIO, what have done for India and Indian. How much money and effort have you spent on the downtrodden. You need to look in mirror and answer to the man in the mirror.

The pio in addition to money spend their efforts in India and Indian causes. WE support schools, old-age homes, etc. So before belittling the contributions of PIO, Like you said Charity begins at home.
By shutting down the pio voice you will drain Praveen of contributors and possibly funds.
 
Zebra16,

Yes I lived in Australia for close to twenty years. The reason I did not make any comment was because I wasn't there when these attacks happened. When I checked with my friends both Indians and Australians, I found out that the picture being painted in Indian media was totally hyped up and the actual reasons were something very different. I do not read Indian newspapers so I had no idea what they were saying. The gist of the matter was, as I was told, they were in the wrong place at the wrong time. The criminals thought they were soft targets and easy pickings. I trust my friends' version more than the media versions.

I do not know what double standard you are talking about. On an individual basis, I post when I have some first hand information to contribute or to correct some misinformation. For example, I do not comment on events happening in Sholapur, because I don't know what happened there nor do I live there to understand the background.

My point was to bring home the point that NRIs/PIOs have some interest in India. That is why they make suggestions. If you don't like the suggestion, discard them. If you think there is some merit use them. My request was just because they are not in India don't ridicule them, or attribute motives to their suggestions. It is a very simple request.

Well sometimes one needs to get on the pulpit to be heard and I know it irks some when the error in their logic is pointed out.

I thought this forum is supposed to be a platform for exchanging ideas, but may be I am mistaken. If my posts are so offensive, I will withdraw myself and let all those who are supposed to be defending the virtues of their motherland do so.

Have a good day, good bye.

K. Kumar
Sir,
Every time someone objects to your POV you can not run away. Please defend your pov as best as you can.
 
Mr. Zebra,
You have been railing against these PIO's who have POV opposed to your POV.
You have been India and are more patriotic than any PIO, what have done for India and Indian. How much money and effort have you spent on the downtrodden. You need to look in mirror and answer to the man in the mirror.

The pio in addition to money spend their efforts in India and Indian causes. WE support schools, old-age homes, etc. So before belittling the contributions of PIO, Like you said Charity begins at home.
By shutting down the pio voice you will drain Praveen of contributors and possibly funds.


Get real and try to understand the other person's point of view. I need not have to show case my contribution to Inida here, nor have I asked you to tabulate your contribution. Neither of our contribution entitle us to think our POV is superior to other. The POvs have to stand on their own merits instead of mere jimgoism.

Before showing mirror to me look at the mirror yourselves.

Nobody is asking or attempting to shut down your voice or anyone's voice. Please cut out the rhetoric and raise sibstantiative points. Let us bring down the volume of preaching.
 
Sir,
Every time someone objects to your POV you can not run away. Please defend your pov as best as you can.

Mr Prasad,

It is not a question of running away because someone objects to my POV. You can sustain a conversation and argue if something is going to be achieved in the end. After reading innumerable number of posts it is clear that there are people who have closed minds and spending time arguing with them is a waste of time. I have better things to do than wasting by breadth on useless, fruitless discussions. As you had mentioned in one of your posts, it is better to do constructive things than spend time on idle talk.

K. Kumar
 
Get real and try to understand the other person's point of view. I need not have to show case my contribution to Inida here, nor have I asked you to tabulate your contribution. Neither of our contribution entitle us to think our POV is superior to other. The POvs have to stand on their own merits instead of mere jimgoism.

Before showing mirror to me look at the mirror yourselves.

Nobody is asking or attempting to shut down your voice or anyone's voice. Please cut out the rhetoric and raise sibstantiative points. Let us bring down the volume of preaching.

empty vessel makes lot of noise.

There is no superior POV, it is your inferiority complex, jealousy of others success is your motivation.
 
It is high time the indian government institute pravasi bharata ratna for their philanthropy, dedication to indian causes and generous contribution. He who pays calls the tunes is displayed here, fortunately those apaswarams are ignored by the natives. So be it.

Mr. Zebra,
You have been railing against these PIO's who have POV opposed to your POV.
You have been India and are more patriotic than any PIO, what have done for India and Indian. How much money and effort have you spent on the downtrodden. You need to look in mirror and answer to the man in the mirror.

The pio in addition to money spend their efforts in India and Indian causes. WE support schools, old-age homes, etc. So before belittling the contributions of PIO, Like you said Charity begins at home.
By shutting down the pio voice you will drain Praveen of contributors and possibly funds.
 
The high-lighted portion is one of the double standards I am talking about. The media becomes dubious when atrocities against Indians are telecast by these channels or published in newspapers and the same media becomes TRUTH PERSONIFIED when it reports rapes, is it?

I do not think any of the vociferous PIO friends made any personal enquiries to ascertain the veracity of the newspaper reports before consuming reams and reams of cyber sheet about rape.

Be that as it may, nothing was stopping them from reporting or giving HTML links to Canadian Daily Mail or Sydney Herald or London Times or Washington Post which covered the hate crimes against Indians. Were the victims not Indians? Why did the affinity towards fellow Indians go away then?

I have seen a very few posts made by you and my post is not directed against your post.

It is high time that these PIOs start to demonstrate their sensitivity which they keep dinning into our ears always. After all charity begins at home.

The final point is - where are/were the so-called suggestions? In one case, of indecent dressing by girls may lead to rapes, this idea itself was made by a quasi PIO who shuttles between India, UK & USA, but this suggestion itself was very vehemently opposed - tooth, nail and stomach, may I say - by our very same PIO group although we completely agreed with the OP.

In the second case it was a C&P job giving an admonition/warning that "India’s Rape Crisis Undermines the Country". To the best of my understanding there was no suggestion.

I had suggested that these over-sincere PIOs collect some funds, institute a rolling trophy to be awarded each year to the Indian state which has no rape during that year, etc. Strangely, all these PIOs have been deafeningly silent on that, my, suggestion. It would seem that they would like to grab fish from the pond/river without getting their hands wet (கை நனையாமல்‍ மீன் பிடிப்பது).

What these self-appointed PIO benefactors obviously want is that the native membership here should immediately and invariably sing Halleluja to whatever they say and there should be no differing opinions expressed.
 
empty vessel makes lot of noise.

There is no superior POV, it is your inferiority complex, jealousy of others success is your motivation.

Continue to live in your ivory tower isolated from reality in India.

To the best of my knowledge none of the members have showed even casual interest in what you do for living, leave alone becoming jealous of your or others success.
 
Continue to live in your ivory tower isolated from reality in India.

To the best of my knowledge none of the members have showed even casual interest in what you do for living, leave alone becoming jealous of your or others success.

You hit the nail at the center of the head!!
 
The final point is - where are/were the so-called suggestions? In one case, of indecent dressing by girls may lead to rapes, this idea itself was made by a quasi PIO who shuttles between India, UK & USA, but this suggestion itself was very vehemently opposed - tooth, nail and stomach, may I say - by our very same PIO group although we completely agreed with the OP.

In the second case it was a C&P job giving an admonition/warning that "India’s Rape Crisis Undermines the Country". To the best of my understanding there was no suggestion.

I had suggested that these over-sincere PIOs collect some funds, institute a rolling trophy to be awarded each year to the Indian state which has no rape during that year, etc. Strangely, all these PIOs have been deafeningly silent on that, my, suggestion. It would seem that they would like to grab fish from the pond/river without getting their hands wet (கை நனையாமல்‍ மீன் பிடிப்பது).

What these self-appointed PIO benefactors obviously want is that the native membership here should immediately and invariably sing Halleluja to whatever they say and there should be no differing opinions expressed.


Exactly!!
 
Making grand statement of intent and objectives and following it up with useful articles is one thing and providing cut paste job of newspaaper articles in Times of India or The Hindu or The Hindustan Times is a completely different thing, as if people in India have no access to these news papers and have to rely on the well meaning and good intentions of these PIOs to know about this and have to be grateful to them for these small mercies.

No person would consider serialising the rape reports and forming a thread about these rapes exclusively and iterating and re-iterating their own opinions as contribution of welfare measure by these good Samaritans.

All these PIOs were strangely silent when there were hate crimes against Indians in Canada, USA and UK snd no thread was dedicated to those unfortunate persons. Instead they found time to search Canadian Daily Mail editorial to send us a write up on Dalit burning in UP!!!!!!

For that matter I didnt see any post from you on the hate crimes against Indian students in Australia in the recent past though there were a number of them, although by your posts you seem to have or have had some association with that country.

This is the double standard that is being reflected in the Us Vs. Them thread. It is very easy to preach. One has just to stand in the pulpit.

Absolutely!! These PIO's totally have double standard. They are in fact Gurus of our Indian Politicians. If all our politicians are trained by these PIO's, these politicians can do more wonders!!
 
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