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பழநி மலைக்கோயிலில் ஸ்டாலின் மனைவி துர்க&

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kk4646

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பழநி மலைக்கோயிலில் ஸ்டாலின் மனைவி துர்க&

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: "கடவுள் நம்பிக்கை இல்லை' என கூறும், தி.மு.க., தலைவர் கருணாநிதியின் மருமகள், பொருளாளர் ஸ்டாலின் மனைவி துர்கா, பழநி மலைக்கோயிலில், சுவாமி தரிசனம் செய்தார்.....[DINAMALAR..]


தன்னோட குடும்பத்துல உள்ளவங்களே இப்டி இருக்குறப்போ அடுத்தவங்க பண்ற பூஜை, சடங்குகள எப்டி வெக்கமில்லாம கிண்டல், கேலி பண்ண முடியுது????...[Comment...]



TVK
 
Irrespective of his public stand, atleast he has not prevented his wife from doing the Pooja.

Venkat K
 
Irrespective of his public stand, atleast he has not prevented his wife from doing the Pooja.

Venkat K


Stalin is not Anti-God..He is a devote of Saibaba too.. But to he has not shown it in Public.. One of the pet subject for this Karunanidhi & Veramani is to condem hindu marriage rituals.. For them tying Thirumagalyam is an anti dravidan principle..But what happened in 60th birth day of Stalin.? He tyed the thirumangalyam in front of this Karunanidhi..!!


TVK
 
Stalin is not Anti-God..He is a devote of Saibaba too.. But to he has not shown it in Public.. One of the pet subject for this Karunanidhi & Veramani is to condem hindu marriage rituals.. For them tying Thirumagalyam is an anti dravidan principle..But what happened in 60th birth day of Stalin.? He tyed the thirumangalyam in front of this Karunanidhi..!!


TVK


That's why I don't like those people who present themselves as a rationally thinking smart atheists while personally indulging in doing many spiritual activities and traditional practices that are spiritually valued.

As well, I could not digest those who take a stand on being an agnostic. Because, what they do spiritually as an agnostic, keeping a sense of doubt and validity in the existing of God/Spirituality, I fail to understand why they are then into spirituality? Are they fooling themselves? Are they ridiculing Spirituality?

Existence of True Atheists in fact is a different phenomena of Spiritual existence (as long as they are not foul mouthing God/Spirituality/Theists) than that of Agnostics, IMHO.

 
That's why I don't like those people who present themselves as a rationally thinking smart atheists while personally indulging in doing many spiritual activities and traditional practices that are spiritually valued.

As well, I could not digest those who take a stand on being an agnostic. Because, what they do spiritually as an agnostic, keeping a sense of doubt and validity in the existing of God/Spirituality, I fail to understand why they are then into spirituality? Are they fooling themselves? Are they ridiculing Spirituality?

Existence of True Atheists in fact is a different phenomena of Spiritual existence (as long as they are not foul mouthing God/Spirituality/Theists) than that of Agnostics, IMHO.



The Atheism followed by likes Karunanidhi, Veeramani & Ramasamy Naicker was only to achieve their political ambitions.. If we analyse carefully.. we will know the anti-hindu stance preached by Ramasamy Naicker was mainly against brahmins.. to cut down Rajaji's influence..and indirectly supported by Congress..

TVK
 
I think there is a Tamil proverb which reads "ஊருக்குத்தாண்டி உபதேசம் உனக்கில்லடி கண்ணே".
 
Leave her alone. She is a good lady, and does not interfere in politics or public life. If it gives her peace to pilgrimage and pray, we should respect it. Dinamalar, should not have published this, because, they did not ask her, and get her permission.

Had it been Stalin, at the temple, then it another issue. He is a public figure, and is game to papparazzi wile.
 
Leave her alone. She is a good lady, and does not interfere in politics or public life. If it gives her peace to pilgrimage and pray, we should respect it. Dinamalar, should not have published this, because, they did not ask her, and get her permission.

Had it been Stalin, at the temple, then it another issue. He is a public figure, and is game to papparazzi wile.


I beg to differ with you Sir.. This news would not have been important if the so called Dravidan ideology of Karunanithi is like any other tamiliyan brethren.. Nearly for 40 years he has criticised , ridiculed every hindu customs..and he has gone to the extent of even changing the TamilNew year's day by an act.. [which is now reversed]...For him the Hinduism & its time tested customs are nothing but crude jokes.. But he do not have the guts to talk about either Muslim/ christian because of his vote-bank politics.. Now time has come for the public to know about this cheap politician who all along spit venum ..

If you read the caption in Dinamalar...there is nothing to critcise the lady but an attack over Karunanidhi only.. and Dinamar trying to expose this Karunanidhi & Veeramani in every possible opportunity...

TVK
 
Poverty does not threaten anybody; but wealth threatens in all ways. The family must be facing wealth threat. Fear is the most common factor in all living beings. It is the extremity of fear that drives to unknown.
 
Poverty does not threaten anybody; but wealth threatens in all ways. The family must be facing wealth threat. Fear is the most common factor in all living beings. It is the extremity of fear that drives to unknown.


Yes.Sir...you are absolutely correct...


TVK
 
I beg to differ with you Sir.. This news would not have been important if the so called Dravidan ideology of Karunanithi is like any other tamiliyan brethren.. Nearly for 40 years he has criticised , ridiculed every hindu customs..and he has gone to the extent of even changing the TamilNew year's day by an act.. [which is now reversed]...For him the Hinduism & its time tested customs are nothing but crude jokes.. But he do not have the guts to talk about either Muslim/ christian because of his vote-bank politics.. Now time has come for the public to know about this cheap politician who all along spit venum ..

If you read the caption in Dinamalar...there is nothing to critcise the lady but an attack over Karunanidhi only.. and Dinamar trying to expose this Karunanidhi & Veeramani in every possible opportunity...

TVK

hi tvk,

i agree with you 100% MK. the target of his jibes are not the religious folks within his party, which is just about everyone except the top coterie. even periyar did not raise a word against murugan, who is perceived as tamil kadavul, whereas rama was fair game, the perception being he is north india originated. barring the brahmins, none of the other castes appear to have considered their religion violated or insulted. so much for the unity of hindus !!

moving on to family references..

still, i think, even at the height of the anti brahmin period in early MK reign, dont know if rajaji's family was ever commented on by either dk or dmk. that is all i am trying to say. it has been my experience, that the hysterical level of intolerance is usually a monopoly of the right wing of all religious flavours, and i have uncomfortable seeing such. it is in that context, i felt that dinamalar was wrong. hope atleast it explains my pov.

moving further on..

overwhelmingly, tamil society voted dmk (the political arm of dk ideology) because they figured that they would have a better future in the hands of periyarist philosophy than with congress. the grudging (as far as we tambrams are concerned) truth is that take any NB, especially from the lower middle and poorer classes, those in the slums and those in indentured labour in agriculture, and he would say, thanks to government generosity, either he or his children have a chance to live in a maadi veedu (as opposed to the kudisai veedu of the prev generation).

they (NB) are now maybe 98 or 99% of the population. democracy is all about vote banks, and the elected act on behalf of the electorate..supposedly for all electorate, but in most cases, for those who voted for them (in addition to themselves in india :))

i lived in mandaveli, and used to attend regularly dmk and congress meetings. the former had a dynamism, and the crowd went away filled with hope for the future, whereas for the congress, it was all about freedom and how congress had won it for india, and now it was payback time. after a while this was not enough to warm the audience, and ultimately the congress lost TN, never to regain it.

MK: re your comment, 'Now time has come for the public to know about this cheap politician who all along spit venum'.. most of the people have known that all along. he only moved up where he was, because what MK said in words and writing, sounded melody to the ears of a vast tamil populace. nowadays, even though much has changed, and you can really see him being spit upon with words so harsh, that even i cringe once in a while. politics of arms muzzling is violent and ruthless, and the winner takes all.

but did you know that even among DMK cadres JJ invokes fear. MK apparently is forgiving, but not the madam. you cross her and you are done for immediately. her memory is long, which is probably one reason, she will never exchange even birthday pleasantaries with MK. same goes the kanchi mutt head who probably was in for a harsh time in the jails, had it not been for the benign neglect of MK and active support through senior tambram bureaucracy in new delhi. this from an insider who claims he knows it all, and throws out morcels of choice gossip once in a while :)

nowadays, i keenly follow the NB politics of TN, and am fascinated by the hatred towards dalits by the ruling castes. it is based on fear, i think. the overwhelming one, appears to be the weakness of their girls for dalit boys, believe it or not. the numbers may not amount to much in reality, but the very fact this happens, is a breach of long held hierarchy.

the good news, is that the dalits, supported by the constitution are hitting back and hitting hard. in one meeting in kovai, the dalit speaker was exhorting the labourers, whom he called the real farmers, to quit working on the land, and move to the cities. chennai and bangalore will provide them with jobs and dignity. the indignities faced by dalits apparently still in practice over much of TN.

what is funny though, is that while the dalits invoke periyar, and term the ruling castes as hindutva, the gounders/vanniars/reddiars/thevars themselves consider themselves true inheritors of periyar too. so there goes the periyarist philosphies of anti brahminism out for grabs among his children.

something more to fear is the resurgent tamil nationalism which is anti periyar. because it is not dravidian but tamil and ancient tamil at that. in their philosophy there is acknowledgement and room for brahmins, for andhanars are a fact in the sangham age. whereas naidus naickers reddiars are NOT. interesting isn't it, the turn of history and politics.

we have not heard the last of tamil nationalism. tamilaruvi manian when confronted with tamil nationalism, reasserted his gandhian belief (of unified india). an independent tamil nadu, he said, will in months break up further - vanniar nadu in the north, kongu nadu in the middle and nadar nadu in the south...where does that leave the rest of us? i wonder :) but one thing for sure - the dalits would be driven once more to the status of serfs.

sorry for the ramble. this is what happens when you trigger off some trains of thought with your nice reply. thank you and haveaniceday :)
 
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You can look at it in another way. It is family democracy. Karunanidhi's and Stalin's personal views are not imposed on their family members. They are pretty much free to do what they like when it comes to religion. Even Karunanidhi's wives are also ardent devotees.
 
You can look at it in another way. It is family democracy. Karunanidhi's and Stalin's personal views are not imposed on their family members. They are pretty much free to do what they like when it comes to religion. Even Karunanidhi's wives are also ardent devotees.



I fully agree with your views about freedom of his family.. But..Pl.. tell me Sir.. what right he had all these years to ridicule religious practice followed by other families.. Has he not talked about Thirumangalyatharanam..Has he not criticised the rituals followed by other families.. Does it mean ..his view about religious freedom pertaining ONLY to his family..? What right he had to change the TamilNew years day which is being celebrated by Hindu Families for decades..?.. Is not an interference in religious freedom..?..Is it not an impose of his views over Tamil Families..?
It is Karunanithi who termed Hindus as 'Thieves'..

TVK
 
......... even periyar did not raise a word against murugan, who is perceived as tamil kadavul, whereas rama was fair game, the perception being he is north india originated. ........
Dear Kunjuppu Sir,

PeriyAr said: "கடவுள் இல்லை, இல்லவே இல்லை; கடவுளைப் படைத்தவன் முட்டாள்; கடவுளை வணங்குபவன் காட்டுமிராண்டி"!

(kadavuL illai, illavE illai; kadavuLaip padiaththavan muttAL; kadavuLai vaNangubavan kAttumirANdi !)

Do you mean to say that Murugan is NOT added in the list of Gods?
 

Dear T V K Sir,

A theist might think of God only when he prays but an atheist will ALWAYS be thinking of God

to find different ways to attack HIM! For example Kamsa was always thinking of Krishna!! :decision:
 
EVR is an opportunist; he balmed only brahmins and 'some gods'. He was against dalits. Only brahmins are easy to offend and never retaliate. There is a running series in Thuglak how evr took everyone for a ride, and how inconsistent he was.

JJ was forced to act against Jayendra saraswati, because MK had planned ooradaipu and strike all over tamilnadu. After the initial action to preempt MK, she and her government and the MK group too have lost interest;the government is not at all keen to fight the case. Most of the witnesses have turned hostile, the inspector who framed charges and manipulated witnesses died a tragic and ignominious death.

Dear Kunjuppu Sir,

PeriyAr said: "கடவுள் இல்லை, இல்லவே இல்லை; கடவுளைப் படைத்தவன் முட்டாள்; கடவுளை வணங்குபவன் காட்டுமிராண்டி"!

(kadavuL illai, illavE illai; kadavuLaip padiaththavan muttAL; kadavuLai vaNangubavan kAttumirANdi !)

Do you mean to say that Murugan is NOT added in the list of Gods?
 

Dear T V K Sir,

A theist might think of God only when he prays but an atheist will ALWAYS be thinking of God

to find different ways to attack HIM! For example Kamsa was always thinking of Krishna!! :decision:



But Kamsa never attacked Krishna just for popularity, to earn money , to get power to rule..or to be opportunist... Kamsa was Krishna's genuine enemy ..


TVK
 
Dear Kunjuppu Sir,

PeriyAr said: "கடவுள் இல்லை, இல்லவே இல்லை; கடவுளைப் படைத்தவன் முட்டாள்; கடவுளை வணங்குபவன் காட்டுமிராண்டி"!

(kadavuL illai, illavE illai; kadavuLaip padiaththavan muttAL; kadavuLai vaNangubavan kAttumirANdi !)

Do you mean to say that Murugan is NOT added in the list of Gods?

i consider periyar's language vulgar and full of garbage. his ideas has to be filtered to make sense and logic. also he was full of inconsistencies.

through all his anti god tirade, his family continued to maintain their family deity and temple in their neighbourhood - so i hear.

he claimed that rajaji was his best friend. in an ode to rajaji on his death, periyar said that there was no one like rajaji for honesty and integrity and hard work. he only wished, that rajaji, instead of focussing good only for the brahmins, treated all tamilians as his own. the prime example given, was rajaji's opposition to quotas in jobs and education.

the success of periyar, is his mass appeal to the tamil. he stuck a chord, appealing to their needs, aspirations and dreams. and overwhelming NB tamilians will agree, that life for them, has been better these past 50 years......but let us not digress :)
 
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EVR was well ahead of his time; he demanded huge fees for his appearance on stage and for abusive speeches. Now all american past presidents and senators charge hefty fees for addresses.

Rajaji must have regretted all his life for supporting EVR and helping annadurai to come to power.

Dear Kunjuppu Sir,

PeriyAr said: "கடவுள் இல்லை, இல்லவே இல்லை; கடவுளைப் படைத்தவன் முட்டாள்; கடவுளை வணங்குபவன் காட்டுமிராண்டி"!

(kadavuL illai, illavE illai; kadavuLaip padiaththavan muttAL; kadavuLai vaNangubavan kAttumirANdi !)

Do you mean to say that Murugan is NOT added in the list of Gods?
 
A theist might think of God only when he prays but an atheist will ALWAYS be thinking of God
A slightly different take on this, those who admire EVR for the fight he led against an array of social evils think of him only intermittently or occasionally. But those who hate him can't spend a minute without thinking of him. It almost seems like they have a huge crush on hating him. Oh well ...
 
A slightly different take on this, those who admire EVR for the fight he led against an array of social evils think of him only intermittently or occasionally. But those who hate him can't spend a minute without thinking of him. It almost seems like they have a huge crush on hating him. Oh well ...

dear nara,

periyar's words stung. very hard indeed to the tambrams. to an extent, that even close to 100 years after some utterances, they sting like hard, to bring forth froth and bubbles in many a mouth.

ambedkar had equally harsh words for the brahmins. but tambrams by and large, ignored it. and even in my household, ambedkar was respected as the father of the constitution.

narayana guru was equally vehemantly anti brahmin. but he clothed it in religiosity, so that he was acceptable even to that basion of brahmin orthodoxy - RSS

all in all, i think, it is all in the delivery. eh!
 
i consider periyar's language vulgar and full of garbage. his ideas has to be filtered to make sense and logic. also he was full of inconsistencies.

through all his anti god tirade, his family continued to maintain their family deity and temple in their neighbourhood - so i hear.

he claimed that rajaji was his best friend. in an ode to rajaji on his death, periyar said that there was no one like rajaji for honesty and integrity and hard work. he only wished, that rajaji, instead of focussing good only for the brahmins, treated all tamilians as his own. the prime example given, was rajaji's opposition to quotas in jobs and education.

the success of periyar, is his mass appeal to the tamil. he stuck a chord, appealing to their needs, aspirations and dreams. and overwhelming NB tamilians will agree, that life for them, has been better these past 50 years......but let us not digress :)


I would like to mention an interesting thing here...

When Rajaji passed away..his body was kept in the Rajaji hall for public to pay homage.. Since I was in Triplicane by that time..I too waited in the queue and entered Rajaji Hall.. To my surprise EVR was sitting near his head of the body and I happened to know that he was there right from morn'g and didn't move out.. The procession started in the afternoon/evening to Kannammapet burial ground via Triplicane High Road and I was near Ratna Cafe to watch the procession...and to my utter surprise EVR was WALKING along with body in front and using his walking-stick.. He must be 70+ or 60+ by that time..He walked all the way to burial.. ground around 2 to three kms..and stayed till all the last rites were perfomed.. Some of my friends who were in the procession told me later that EVR was in tears all along...

My opinion about EVR was changed from that time onwards..I was an ardent communist by that time ..never had a good opinion about EVR but after this incident I started respecting EVR and started admiring his human approach and his respect to friendship.. eventhough I hated his way of public utterances..
I had chance meeting with him once.. along with my Communist comreds and I was floored by his hospitality eventhough I am a Brahmin whom he criticise in each & every place.. When we started leaving he came upto the front door and gave send off..
Pity IndiraGandhi who was the PM didn't bother to send any one her Ministers but Rajaji cermated with state honours..

TVK
 
I would like to mention an interesting thing here...

When Rajaji passed away..his body was kept in the Rajaji hall for public to pay homage.. Since I was in Triplicane by that time..I too waited in the queue and entered Rajaji Hall.. To my surprise EVR was sitting near his head of the body and I happened to know that he was there right from morn'g and didn't move out.. The procession started in the afternoon/evening to Kannammapet burial ground via Triplicane High Road and I was near Ratna Cafe to watch the procession...and to my utter surprise EVR was WALKING along with body in front and using his walking-stick.. He must be 70+ or 60+ by that time..He walked all the way to burial.. ground around 2 to three kms..and stayed till all the last rites were perfomed.. Some of my friends who were in the procession told me later that EVR was in tears all along...

My opinion about EVR was changed from that time onwards..I was an ardent communist by that time ..never had a good opinion about EVR but after this incident I started respecting EVR and started admiring his human approach and his respect to friendship.. eventhough I hated his way of public utterances..
I had chance meeting with him once.. along with my Communist comreds and I was floored by his hospitality eventhough I am a Brahmin whom he criticise in each & every place.. When we started leaving he came upto the front door and gave send off..
Pity IndiraGandhi who was the PM didn't bother to send any one her Ministers but Rajaji cermated with state honours..

TVK

dear TVK,

periyar (1879- 1973) was close to rajaji (1878 - 1972) in age, ie close to 90 when the former died. so the effort must have been high to stay with rajaji's funeral. also periyar was incontinent and needed help in just about every bodily function, i heard.

always wondered why the tambram leaders of that age (early 1900s) did nothing to counter periyar's arguements. rajaji's one response to antibrahminism, was that it always existed, and nothing could be done about it.which appeared to me a pretty lame excuse and cop out way of responding to what is a threat to his community.

how did the complacency come about? or was it arrogance? i really dont know. was it all a matter of winner take it all. did they not realize that the rules could be changed? always wondered about those things.

the net result of rajaji and his kula kalvi and the attitudes of the tambrams of those times, is the marginalization of the community now. i will not give periyar the credit for our diasporic existence..this moving out started early 1920s, with increased opportunities and money in jobs for the british govt and companies all over the india of those times (burma, ceylon etc).

1950s, when maximum migration occurred, delhi was the mecca of tambrams..the newly formed central government bureaucracy offered plum jobs and status. i have read a few of those experiences, and it was not only exhilarating but satisfying to participate in country building exercise of the nehru era - still by and large honest and uncorrupt.

the tambrams who have reinvented themselves have done well. just look at ananda vikatan now, and compare it with a 50s or 60s or even 70s edition. during those times, it was brahmin centred whereas now, there is hardly a drop of brahminism in it, in the various vikatan editions. same goes for tvs - 99% of their market is NB or non tamils - and they have a healthy level of NB management now, unheard of even 20 years ago.

us kerala pattars have a gripe against ems nambudripad. when the first communist govt came in 1959, ems passed these land reform acts, and overnight all the landlords lost their lands, with a token compensation. the hurt still lingers with many of the older generation, but what it did, was to drive the sons to education, and out of towns like palakkad or trichur, to bombay or mid east - where they did well.

a similar arguement could be said for periyar - thanks to loss of govt jobs, we have moved on to private sector and abroad and did exceedingly well. my girl cousin, 25 years ago, got 98% in PUC, denied medical admission in the then madras. she took biology, and moved on to immunology, to usa, and today she is a VP of a world renowned cutting edge biotech firm. a while ago, she mused, that mbbs denied, was probably the best thing that happened to her. .. :)
 
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