Discrimination - can it be stopped?

[Nara]

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I asked how the wife felt about it, and also the attitudes of Toronto tambrams?

K, why leave the answer to suspense, or did you delete it for fear of a knock on the door by RAW in the dead of night? Come on man, don't keep me hanging, my head was already about to explode from not knowing what you deleted of Kashmir in that other thread about Goa, and now this and the pressure is increasing ....

 

[kunjuppu]

nara,

i was wondering if anyone reads my posts at all

the wife had her doubts, anger at one time. seeing that she has pattar heritage, but not marriable to pattars - the lady looks classy like CLASSY.

she has a handsome husband and apparently now, she has gotten over her misgivings. of the two, he is the more gregarious, and she was always the quiet charming one.

incidentally, i am the only one to know this.

incidentally i have now 3 nair relatives through marriage, two girls and one boy. the grisl married iyer style, the boy married nair style. in all 3 cases, the families both sides, overwhelming supported the love unions and makes me glad, that atleast the pattars are slowly coming around to accept the byproducts (albeit unacknowledged in many cases) of their ancestor's groins

i know also film star pattar jayaram is married to a nair girl. maybe sangom can shed some light as to the attitudes of trivandrum brahmins into entering matrimonial relationships with nairs/menons?

 

[sangom]

nara,

i was wondering if anyone reads my posts at all

the wife had her doubts, anger at one time. seeing that she has pattar heritage, but not marriable to pattars - the lady looks classy like CLASSY.

she has a handsome husband and apparently now, she has gotten over her misgivings. of the two, he is the more gregarious, and she was always the quiet charming one.

incidentally, i am the only one to know this.

incidentally i have now 3 nair relatives through marriage, two girls and one boy. the grisl married iyer style, the boy married nair style. in all 3 cases, the families both sides, overwhelming supported the love unions and makes me glad, that atleast the pattars are slowly coming around to accept the byproducts (albeit unacknowledged in many cases) of their ancestor's groins

i know also film star pattar jayaram is married to a nair girl. maybe sangom can shed some light as to the attitudes of trivandrum brahmins into entering matrimonial relationships with nairs/menons?

K, nara,

Some of the nair girls are bewitchingly beautiful, if that is what K means by 'classy'. Once during my bank inspection days, one very young manager insisted on my visiting his house; at last on the last but one day we, the team of inspectors went to his house. He was newly married and I really envied him, looking at his wife. This man later rose to a very high position in his bank.

Tabras of TVM had made known their attitude towards ic with nairs/menons in the naveena swayamvaram held last year or so. As a community there seems to be no change. In fact, even day before yesterday one tabra was holding on to brahmin superiority and among other things he said பிராமணப்பொண்-ன்னா லக்ஷ்மி அல்லவா, இங்கிருந்து மற்றஜாதிக்காரன் வீட்டுக்குப்போனா அங்கெ லக்ஷ்மி செழிக்கறது and so on. So, I feel the general exclusivist-supremacist feeling is still there very much. But individual cases in which the tabra girls are pragmatic and bold enough to be adamant on ic, get the family support.

I had written about one instance of the Brahmin Association Office holder saying "over my dead body" to his son's wedding with a (very rich and highly placed) good looking nair girl. It now transpires that after much drama, chasing the son out of the house and a good lot of public bravado about his principled stand, this fool of a fellow has taken a U-turn and is now all praise for his nair sambandhi, the dil and their entire clan. With such fools among tabras I think our young men and women need not be very apprehensive of selecting their partners outside caste, if they have independent income and can live as a married couple happily.

 

[kunjuppu]

..With such fools among tabras I think our young men and women need not be very apprehensive of selecting their partners outside caste, if they have independent income and can live as a married couple happily.

sangom, you say 'fools', i say 'idiots'.. and we mean the same thing

 

[kunjuppu]

Dear sangom,

The tambrams in Toronto have been tamed by a generation of young ones marrying outside of the community. Consistently.

The norm (ie 50%) is punjabi, mainly because most of brown people here are Punjabis. Next come gujjus. And whites. So I think, it would be with great delight a tambram would welcome a nair sil or dil.

So far, we know only two, both tambram guys marrying nair girls..but then there are not that many malayali hindus here.

 

[amala]

Classy is not necessarily attractiveness per se. The dictionary defines it as elegant and fashionable. I think it just means refined. Very few truly classy people around these days if you ask me!

Generally the "noveau riche" are not as classy as the "old money gentries". Even if they are not wealthy anymore there is still that classiness in their demeanor. I do wonder how?!

Sorry to sound a tad snooty and to interrupt!I was just wondering aloud.Do carry on people

 

[kunjuppu]

Classy is not necessarily attractiveness per se. The dictionary defines it as elegant and fashionable. I think it just means refined. Very few truly classy people around these days if you ask me!

Generally the "noveau riche" are not as classy as the "old money gentries". Even if they are not wealthy anymore there is still that classiness in their demeanor. I do wonder how?!

Sorry to sound a tad snooty and to interrupt!I was just wondering aloud.Do carry on people

i will go with 'refined and fasionable' re my lady friend; in addition to beauty

 

[kunjuppu]

Understanding the greatness of Balasaraswati

this is in today's hindu e-paper.

without much ado, i present it to you, and introspect.

balasaraswati

 

[tenalleyraman]

According to UN:Understanding Discrimination - print
Can we eliminate or should we even try to eliminate discrimination? I do not think it is possible.
1. the Buddha actually eliminated discrimination in his teaching and sangha.
this permeated societies like tibet and china.
it accords with advaitic ideals which do not endorse society but transcend them.

The discrimination outlawed by the country and some other birth based discrimination should be stopped.
2. discrimination by birth again sits uneasily with advaita.
social norms relevant during ancient times where cultures were coalescing may be irrelevant after homogeneous hinduism was overwhelmed by foreign conquerers who negated its cultural and societal validity.

The society should change through education and economics.
3. education in values and social and ethical teaching was introduced by the Buddha to change entrenched discrimination then.
it worked for a time till it was destroyed by foreign invasions.
this is consistent with advaita which does not discriminate or interfere with worldly norms.

In US social discrimination goes on, forced integration is very difficult.
4. it is worse in the west where discrimination is practised on many subtle levels which exclude new migrants. the innate tolerance of india is missing in those countries where ethical and moral norms are overcome by capitalism and power at all cost.

The middle class runs from poor neighborhood.
5. this is natural as otherwise you would be forced to degrage your quality of life by living with inimical subcultures. having tried assimilation and multiculturalism in the west, I find it dangerous to surrender your values as the mainstream culture itself lacks depth in its values.
I feel that Indian overseas could profit from community based living [agrahaarams?] as they need to counter the wholesale destruction of values likely in later generations.

Even in Football teams the black players and white players do not integrate.
6. the west has lofty principles not practised.
the east practices its principles openly.
we need to take the best of world thought and apply it so that we can evolve a humane Dharma which reflects best practice, however obtained.

 

[kunjuppu]

The middle class runs from poor neighborhood.
5. this is natural as otherwise you would be forced to degrage your quality of life by living with inimical subcultures. having tried assimilation and multiculturalism in the west, I find it dangerous to surrender your values as the mainstream culture itself lacks depth in its values.
I feel that Indian overseas could profit from community based living [agrahaarams?] as they need to counter the wholesale destruction of values likely in later generations.

.

raman,

i think, nobody forced to give up our values. instead i think we willingly surrendered whatever we found not valueable or useful to our current life.

agraharams all over tamil nadu and kerala, have been abandoned to such an extent, that they are but skeletons of what they were even 30 years ago.

i think it will be good for us to think forwards into the future, and come up with ideas, as to how we can deal with the basic lack ofinterest of the younger generation, on many of our values, which are brahmin centric, and essentially in conflict with a flat equal world of equals.

do you think, even for community living, there would be many takers here even to share a retirement community with NBs? just look at our ads in our matrimonial sites. or the pleas here for household help. we are insular and, unless due to non availability of brahmins, we will not venture out to take on the services of anyone other than our own community.

wishful thinking, yours. though.

 

[kunjuppu]

chinmayee sripada - a recent profile - from an ardent fan

chinmayee