Does God Feel Pain?

[prasad1]

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How Hinduism views suffering Mental or physical suffering…
• part of the unfolding of karma and is the consequence of past inappropriate action
• an expected part of living until reaching moksha
• physical suffering is “real” - we do experience physical pain as we are bound by the laws of our world How to cope?
• accept it as a just consequence
• experience it to satisfy the debt for past behavior
• understand that the soul isn’t harmed; suffering is temporary.

Arjuna, a seeker of wisdom in The Bhagavad-Gita, is told: “The self embodied in the body of every being is indestructible.” “Weapons do not cut it, fire does not burn it, waters do not wet it, wind does not wither it. It cannot be cut or burned; it cannot be wet or withered; it is enduring, all-pervasive, fixed, immovable, and timeless.”


How Hinduism views suffering How to cope? (continued)
• suffering, like all things, is a manifestation of God/The Ultimate
• suffering is not solely bad…
• can lead to progress on a spiritual path
• can even be embraced as an opportunity
• detach from desire for things to be different than they are Acceptance Hindu traditions view acceptance in 2 ways…
1. a logical attitude towards pain and suffering, because all is seen as the just working of karma
2. the practice of acceptance is also a means to a greater end, detachment. Accepting your life lessens your desire for things to be different than they are. As desires fall away, detachment is achieved.

http://www.uphs.upenn.edu/pastoral/events/Whitman_Oct08.pdf


This may not be related to the original thread, but I thought it would be relevant to what RRji said in her post.

 

[a-TB]

In such topics no one seem to have any clue. One can say some scriptural stuff without understanding or just share own pet beliefs.

Here is the crux of the issue posed :
1. If God feels pain (and extreme pain) why did he/she create the world like this (and must be suffering all the time)
2 If God does not feel pain, how can he be called "ocean of compassion" that you are supposed to love back

Only conclusion is we don't know what this God as taught by any religion is.

 

[sravna]

From my firsthand experience I can remove pain and have removed on umpteen number of occasions for others too. So physical pain can be removed by even a mortal like me. Again based on first hand experience, mental pain need not be felt as I minimally feel it because of my control over emotions. So the conclusion is God does not feel mental pain too.

Since pain can be removed by spiritual energy, we can conclude with some knowledge of scriptures that pain is caused beacause our true self is veiled by maya. God is not affected by maya and so does not feel pain.

 

[Shankar Venkataraman]

Advaita followers will say a BIG YES.... I too....

 

[rishikesan]

Dr. Renukaji, I too use to think on these lines,just to analyze in our mind about all- pervading God.I would like to briefly mention the essence of Vaishnavism. It also that, if you totally Surrender to Lord Narayana, & leave everything to HIM. He is bound to look aft
er you at all remove impediments,&show you the righteous path/which you would know , whenever you stand before Him for 2/3 mts daily.Chant, if you like Ram/Ram before sleep.
please do not waste time , in such thoughts , as it will lead to confusin & definitely no solutio
n

sincerely,
p
A Srinivasan
,

 

[renuka]

Dr. Renukaji, I too use to think on these lines,just to analyze in our mind about all- pervading God.I would like to briefly mention the essence of Vaishnavism. It also that, if you totally Surrender to Lord Narayana, & leave everything to HIM. He is bound to look aft
er you at all remove impediments,&show you the righteous path/which you would know , whenever you stand before Him for 2/3 mts daily.Chant, if you like Ram/Ram before sleep.
please do not waste time , in such thoughts , as it will lead to confusin & definitely no solutio
n

sincerely,
p
A Srinivasan
,

Dear Sir,

The reason I started this thread is becos last week 21 teenagers and 2 teachers died in a fire at a madrasah here becos of arson revenge attack.

The victims were trapped and screams of them being burnt alive were heard by witnesses.

I felt too much pain just to read about this and it was a national tragedy here.

The pain these children went tru would have been unbearable.

So I thought..they felt pain...i felt pain by their suffering..so I asked " God..did You feel pain too?"

Its not a waste for me to question this..even if I chant Rama Rama a 1008 times it can not erase the pain these boys suferred so I just hope God too feels pain so at least He knows what suffering is.

It would be only fair to those boys.
What can I say?
All I can hope is their souls are in peace now.

It has been raining heavily after they were buried..may be God decided to cry.
BTW..I can never surrender if I dont have any answers to my feelings.

I am not too concerned to pray to God for my well being but I cant stand grand scale suffering of others that involves severe pain.

 

[Vaagmi]

At a very fundamental level what exactly is pain and pleasure?

 

[prasad1]

At a very fundamental level what exactly is pain and pleasure?

You should have read post#25

 

[rishikesan]

Dear Renukaji, I have read the horror in news, my reaction is same like you & even more because I always question God, a few things viz :-1) when children born retarded, that too no cure, the parents life is made to crumble, (they suffer every minute of their life) I almost daily question God such acts of God make people loose total faith, not only that, they get totally dejected& Hate to look at HIM.
!y brother,s Son , most active, most helpful to al humans, though Emngieer can drive nonchalantly even heavy vehicles in Cement Factory., i when he was on way to factory in Scooter, as he was raising his hand to return salute, he h
fell & got Head injury & lost his life,If he had lived, all relatives would have been helped & made us All cheerful. My brother is Mute for last 25 years.
itis perplexing & make you Q God It is but Natural .One more important aspect.?
One gets old & some live longer, but is it at all fair to make Men/Womencontinue live & suffer all types of ailments , though he/She is a waste in this earth is made to Suffer , for no faught of his ? Is it Godliness? I feel Not, at All Why torture & make him to loose hard earned Punyam.?

A.Srinivasan
.

 

[sowmyasubbaraman]

A very good explanation that is undu enral undu illai enral illai. Why should not we feel god's bliss instead of the pain which we suffer.

 

[rishikesan]

Dear Dr Renukaji,
,,,, My sister,s. Son, Mr.Arvind is serving in Malaysia is working in Malaysia as a Compuer engineer for last 7/8 yrs. Heidi married recently & left for
!alaysia a month back.
If I write his ph/ Address, would you like to talk to them ?
Srinivasan

 

[renuka]

Dear Renukaji, I have read the horror in news, my reaction is same like you & even more because I always question God, a few things viz :-1) when children born retarded, that too no cure, the parents life is made to crumble, (they suffer every minute of their life) I almost daily question God such acts of God make people loose total faith, not only that, they get totally dejected& Hate to look at HIM.
!y brother,s Son , most active, most helpful to al humans, though Emngieer can drive nonchalantly even heavy vehicles in Cement Factory., i when he was on way to factory in Scooter, as he was raising his hand to return salute, he h
fell & got Head injury & lost his life,If he had lived, all relatives would have been helped & made us All cheerful. My brother is Mute for last 25 years.
itis perplexing & make you Q God It is but Natural .One more important aspect.?
One gets old & some live longer, but is it at all fair to make Men/Womencontinue live & suffer all types of ailments , though he/She is a waste in this earth is made to Suffer , for no faught of his ? Is it Godliness? I feel Not, at All Why torture & make him to loose hard earned Punyam.?

A.Srinivasan
.

Dear Sir...I am not blaming God for any loss or praising God for any gain...I have never blamed God for anything ever.

I dont blame God for even a tragic death but all I want to know is Does He feel pain?

Cos if Geeta says God incarnates from Age to Age to uphold Dharma to some extent that shows He has some response and reaction ..so could pain be one of them?

After all to even Parithranaaya Sadhunam that shows some emotion is there.

I just want a God who feels..He doesnt have to change any outcome cos we believe in Karma too..but just like us who believe in Karma when we see suffering of anyone we feel for them..
I only wish God too has feelings to emote.

An above all inert God would not be a good Lord.
Even a King feels for his subjects..so does God feel?

 

[renuka]

Dear Dr Renukaji,
,,,, My sister,s. Son, Mr.Arvind is serving in Malaysia is working in Malaysia as a Compuer engineer for last 7/8 yrs. Heidi married recently & left for
!alaysia a month back.
If I write his ph/ Address, would you like to talk to them ?
Srinivasan

Dear Sir,

Nice to note your relatives are in Msia.
Thank you for your kind words but the truth is I hardly socialize..have no idea even what I would want to talk.

But since you are kind enough to consider me to call them..you can give me the phone number.

 

[rishikesan]

Is it because, you may have 24 hour availability as an Indian Doctor, or by nature you are of that nature?I am always pleased to interact as a give/and take,
i will talk to you niece & if he talks, well& good.

A.Srinivasann

 

[prasad1]

Going back to opening POV.
Please define GOD.

Even in Gita, there is a conradictory explanation. Sometimes they talk of Nirguna Brahman and sometimes they talk of god being born. It can not be both.
If it is nirguna Brahman then attributes cannot be attached.

Gita 2.5

5. Some indescribable supreme principle which is imperishable, unborn, undecaying, fearless, motionless, one without a second, ancient and infinite, that thing alone exists.
The Supreme Brahman is indescribable because description always catches parts and can never include the whole in its judgments. When Brahman is said to be like "this", there is an automatic exclusion of the "not-this" aspect or the "that" aspect of Brahman. Words are too limited and the mind is too incapable to adequately picture the eternal nature of Brahman. Even "Sat-Chid-Ananda" is only a provisional description and is only an intellectual prop. The exact nature of the Reality can only be experienced as such and can never be given expression to.

Chapter 2.6

6. What is neither short nor long, neither that much nor this much, neither black nor white, neither stout nor thin, neither good nor bad, that should be understood as Brahman.
Shortness and length, quality and colour, quantity and size are not attributable to Brahman which is Indivisible and Absolute. Such attributes are the conceptual limitations superimposed on the Reality by the imaginative individual consciousness. The conception of any sort of quality is possible when there is a cogniser and the cognised. Being itself cannot cognise qualities and relations, for such relations are connected with individualised centres which exist as independent entities. The Immortal Being which is relationless and is inclusive of the fullness of existence is itself the bosom of all possibilities and so cannot itself be involved in such self-limiting adjuncts.

suddenly reverts to the saguna Brahman and says:

yadaa yadaa hi dharmasya
glaanirbhavati bhaarata.
Abhyutthaanam.h adharmasya
tadaatmaanM sRRijaamyaham.h..

Bhagavad Gita, Chapter IV, Verse 7.

Hey Bhaarata (Arjuna). It is Faith which teaches renunciation and is responsible for the elevation and well-being of human beings. Whenever in the passage of time, (yadaa yadaa) Faith (or dharma) is weakened or is under attack, (glaanirbhavati) - and whenever adharma spreads without control (abhyutthaanam.h) - it is then (tadaatmaanM) that I re-incarnate myself (sRRijaamyaham.h) with all my powers to restore Faith.Whenever there is a decline of righteousness, and the rise of unrighteousness, then I re-incarnate myself to teach dharma.


http://eaglespace.com/spirit/gita_krishna0407.php

 

[GANESH65]

You seem to be spending a lot of time on surfing Prasad ji,. Good post..

 

[Raji Ram]

Dear Prasad Sir,

B G is man-made! So are the Gods and Goddesses. :thumb:

 

[prasad1]

You seem to be spending a lot of time on surfing Prasad ji,. Good post..

Knowing you, I think it is a compliment. But others throw at me as an insult. LOL.

I do not have self-knowledge! Nor am I all knower. So I take the help of others who are more knowledgeable. I also give the credit for it.

This also validates my points.

 

[GANESH65]

Knowing you, I think it is a compliment. But others throw at me as an insult. LOL.

I do not have self-knowledge! Nor am I all knower. So I take the help of others who are more knowledgeable. I also give the credit for it.

This also validates my points.

It surely is Prasad ji. I have no reason to insult you, so be rest assured. I said so because most of your posts showing credits to various web sites. It is quite obvious that one cannot access so many information without spending time on surfing.

 

[prasad1]

You seem to be spending a lot of time on surfing Prasad ji,. Good post..

Knowing you, I think it is a compliment. But others throw it at me as an insult. LOL.

I do not have self-knowledge! Nor am I all knower. So I take the help of others who are more knowledgeable. I also give the credit for it.

This also validates my points.

 

[agopal]

Yes. God realizes pain. He doesn't feel it as he doesn't have the appropriate mechanism to feel pain like the nervous system etc. All he sees is the light of all the souls flickering about moving in designated patterns. He doesn't see individual souls until he takes an avatar. All he sees is a collection of souls that too as a blob of light. That light doesn't move. There are such blobs of light for every life-embodied star systems( billions and billions of them). If he wants to see deeper then his soul (yes HE has a soul) has to enter the blob and go through and take up a life line. He can see the bigger picture - whether all the souls in the light blob are always kept in their life line or they go out of their life line and he can fix bigger problems like maximizing the souls that are kept in the life line. occasionally due to the inherent nature of such a structure fluctuations happen and souls shed their life lines. Sometimes the souls shed it on purpose. Sometimes the souls get disengaged with the life line. But, he knows that when the souls shed their life lines they flicker faster and energy gets released due to the strong bond that the life line and the soul makes. The more the energy , more the pain to the soul. But rest assured when it is out of the life line it feels no pain. He himself had gone through such a pain when he took up the primordial life line ( out of which all the life lines are created) . HE sacrificed and forcibly shed a life line to create many.
He felt pain then. He doesn't feel pain when a individual soul feels pain but he realizes what pain is.

 

[biswa]

But who is giving the pain? Is that God too?

So is God giving pain to himself?

 

[biswa]

Prasadji your Gita posts are right on the money.

I think God is neither good nor evil. Because then why does evil exist in God's creation? Or otherwise, we have to invent a Devil to justify the existence of evil.

 

[munsaamy]

( Preamble - You don't have to read it.......... I took part in this forum few years back that's when I learned ' my Chennai Tamizh' was not considered as Tamil. Even at that time I was learning English, but had no confidence in writing English. I said that to my English teacher. He said " போடா பயித்தாரா... இதுக்கு போய் கவலைப்படுவாளா? நாஞ்சொல்லித்தரேன்.. கத்துக்கடா".. I learned. Now I know three languages - Tamizh, Chennai Thamizh and English. By the way.... I stopped mixing water for the milk I supply to my Teacher... For the information of new comers, I am a milk vendor.

I lurk the forum once in 2 to 3 months. It was interesting to see the question would the God feel pain. I not only believe in God, I know God, my Teacher showed me. So I wanted to answer. I wanted to think. My சகலபாடி works in TASMAC. I asked him to put away a bottle of சரக்கு for me. He did. By the time I drank half the bottle I knew the answer... I got drunk as usual,but I knew the answer..).

God does not feel pain.

There are two theories to it.

Theory #1 - There is no God. So, God can not feel pain. Subject closed.

Theory #2 - There is God.

Going with theory #2, how do we define God? It is important because that defines does God feel pain or not.

What is God? Note, I did not say, " Who is God?". God is a 'What'. When Talking about Siva, they say Siva performs ' Cosmic Dance'...

Siva doesn't 'perform' cosmic dance.... but.. The Cosmic Dance is Siva. What is Cosmic Dance? It is the movement all the planets in this cosmos... It is the energy that makes the whole cosmos function... We call this in other words 'Nature'.

Nature makes it possible for the cosmos to exist and function. Nature creates, sustains and destroys..... We have a name for nature.... Brahman.....

Brahman is in equilibrium... in other words, this cosmos is in equilibrium.... sure, occasional meteorite showers does take place.... Hey, when you are considering slightly large volume as this cosmos, occasional meteorite showers are nothing....

Such Brahman.. or God... is everywhere... but doesn't have a form or figure .. pain pathway doesn't work here.

Since God does not have a confined figure we have, God can not feel pain. Matter of fact, God can't have any feeling at all..

P.S - My teacher is also a member of this forum. My writing may seem like his writing since he was training me for a very long time... But Munsaamy is Munsaamy. Munsaamy requests this forum to recognise Chennai Tamizh as a branch of Tamizh, so that Munsaamy may post in his mother tongue, that is Chennai Tamizh. Thank you.

 

[prasad1]

Prasadji your Gita posts are right on the money.

I think God is neither good nor evil. Because then why does evil exist in God's creation? Or otherwise, we have to invent a Devil to justify the existence of evil.

Thanks.