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Is corporate culture good for brahmins?

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shri kunjuppu,

thank you for the above, for you have outlined where our outlook lies in... i was talking here about the nithyakarmas and here you are talking about 'savaram' and 'jetty'... and there i was, referring to gayathri, pujas and vedas...

with due respects, my statement was meant to interpret your hastiness in looking at everything with the same thought... ie., of materialistic growth...

as for your spirited thoughts on how we carry on ...

=> i do not eat bread or cakes or any other such product...
=> i sport a beard (no savaram business... :nod:)
=> i avoid leather products...
=> i take neemsticks/guava leaves or indian traditional ayurvedic toothpowder... failing which i use vicco.. (only that)
=> i dont drink coffee or soda or liquor or any carbonated beverages
=> fyi, i do sport the komanam... what is wrong with it? you must remember that there was a lengthy thread about komanam in this very forum...
=> i am unaware of the pubic hair savaram part... so will refrain from commenting on it... perhaps that is your domain...
=> i wonder why you didn't hit on the language - english!!!

the world is overrun by mlecchas and their habits (if any?).. it is said that one should not live where a brahmin is not honoured... going by that standards, people like me who insist on tradition cannot live anywhere... but suicide is also a papam.. that is why there is some adjustment allowed... but that is only so much so as to live... it should not become the aim of living (as in your case)...

i have neither your age, nor your feelings, just my experiences; i do not have a family yet, but that is a different story...

your sarcasm notwithstanding, i will not take back my word on your remarks, but sir, there is no personal contempt towards you...

the bottom line is, sir, i think, we are deluded if we think we belong to the same club... but of course, you are free to your rights... :)

regards,

Shri. Sapthajhiva,

Amazed reading your post. In a planet populated by people who think times are changing, mores are changing, so change along with that, people like you confirming to time honored customs and practices are a rarity, so I salute you, Sir. For people like me, as long as the mind is seeking it though unable to practice in full, we will get there eventually, I think.

Thanks
 
India Cements Srinivasan

Better we lost our advantage in IPL. This IPL culture is stinking and people here tolerated it only for Cricket. Now the Can of Worms got opened and the transparency expected should not lead to the poor Brahman researcher who started it.

But India Cements Srinivasan seems to be in thick of it!
 
My son is in the corporate world He has the drive to be a leader and to achieve,the killer instinct of corporate culture. He has booked a flat in OMR road and his monthly EMI will not be less than Rs. 60000 PM. He is worried about this commitment. In spite of talking about planned wealth creation & investments etc he wants divine guidance and has found a temple where the God gives you confidence in situation like this. This temple is in திரூச்சேறை between Kumbakonam & Tiruvarur . This is Rina Vimochana Ligeswarar(கடன் தொல்லை போக்கும் கடவுள்) ::decision:Corporate culture need not be contradictory to your Basic culture We all went to this temple and though temple from outside looks dull and aging inside the is really grand and vibrant I am impressed
Jambu
 
Because we need to be accepted in the social circle, we tend to give in to such accepted norms of behaviour , food habits. In the strict sense as a brahmin one should be proud of his rituals and practices, but me working in the corporate work culture, i see many of them who are born as brahmins lowering themselves and going away from their practises.

Maybe material conscious supersedes spiritual conscious- and when this happens, whether one follows his caste,creed does not matter. Earning and gianing wealth in forms of money is more accepted norms and having sufficent bank balance is more secure than spiritual knowledge and inner strength.
 
Where is a Brahmin Corporate Leader?

I am sorry to say this sir but, your posting only say that your son is lacking in the Corporate Culture. Actually no corporate leader has evolved in the recent past from Tamilnadu. The big corporates that has risen, the sort of Sun TV Group, are all from non Brahmin leadership. The truth is therefore that Brahmins find it difficult to cope up with Corporate Culture.
My son is in the corporate world He has the drive to be a leader and to achieve,the killer instinct of corporate culture. He has booked a flat in OMR road and his monthly EMI will not be less than Rs. 60000 PM.

It is only the gullible amongst us get carried away by big package as big corporate position. Possibility is that others are enjoying more from your son's package than his family. The Corporate Culture is about making people believe and your son has been made to believe for the requirement of Rs.60000 PM EMI for housing when he may not require it. If he has not opted for it, he will loose his job or he would not have been given the job contract. Many who are forced to take loan as part of their package seldom enjoy their property for their propensity to jump jobs. They will also not be reimbursed what has been deducted from their package as settlement!

He is worried about this commitment. In spite of talking about planned wealth creation & investments etc he wants divine guidance and has found a temple where the God gives you confidence in situation like this. This temple is in திரூச்சேறை between Kumbakonam & Tiruvarur . This is Rina Vimochana Ligeswarar(கடன் தொல்லை போக்கும் கடவுள்) :

Any God will bless your son only with another job with another big package and .... hidden clauses! God is more close to Corporate Lords than to poor Brahmins.

:decision:Corporate culture need not be contradictory to your Basic culture We all went to this temple and though temple from outside looks dull and aging inside the is really grand and vibrant I am impressed
Jambu
 
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Today the higher education is about ensuring the employability of the students. Employability comes only if the student is adept is switching to the demands of 'Corporate Culture'. This is not only for MNCs but also for our own private and public sector opportunities. Therefore the Corporate culture has come to stay.

Though we appreciate India as crucible of diverse culture, we are still perturbed about corporate culture. This is because the corporate culture does not gel with our traditional culture to form a more strong an alloy of culture in the crucible. Our traditional cultures get thrown out as stag with corporate culture in the crucible. Unfortunately we are helpless and just cannot do anything than watching the rot happen.
 
Let the others know

I am sorry to say this sir but, your posting only say that your son is lacking in the Corporate Culture. Actually no corporate leader has evolved in the recent past from Tamilnadu. The big corporates that has risen, the sort of Sun TV Group, are all from non Brahmin leadership. The truth is therefore that Brahmins find it difficult to cope up with Corporate Culture.
Jumbu ji. I was waiting for your response to this for long. It is the sub-prime fraud of real estate sector that pulled the economy down to recession in West. Against this only well orchestrated corporate frauds in real estate sector is holding the corporate sector in India. Do you agree to what is said about big packages?
 
Corporate game of convenience

True. The Corporate Culture does not gel in any way with our Brahmin way of life and thus all those who are forced in to balancing these two will definitely forgo one of it. That is the reason that we could not accept any Corporate Leaders from our community as Brahmin Leaders. These leaders also do not claim chastity as Brahmins but still use their Brahmin tags only when it means advantage to them. A true Brahmin leader can evolve only from humble background as Adi Sankara or Ramanuja. Where is that Brahmin Leader? I think that we have to wait for one more generation to get our leader for now none seems to be there in the mold.
Today the higher education is about ensuring the employability of the students. Employability comes only if the student is adept is switching to the demands of 'Corporate Culture'. This is not only for MNCs but also for our own private and public sector opportunities. Therefore the Corporate culture has come to stay.

Though we appreciate India as crucible of diverse culture, we are still perturbed about corporate culture. This is because the corporate culture does not gel with our traditional culture to form a more strong an alloy of culture in the crucible. Our traditional cultures get thrown out as stag with corporate culture in the crucible. Unfortunately we are helpless and just cannot do anything than watching the rot happen.
 
True. The Corporate Culture does not gel in any way with our Brahmin way of life and thus all those who are forced in to balancing these two will definitely forgo one of it. That is the reason that we could not accept any Corporate Leaders from our community as Brahmin Leaders. These leaders also do not claim chastity as Brahmins but still use their Brahmin tags only when it means advantage to them. A true Brahmin leader can evolve only from humble background as Adi Sankara or Ramanuja. Where is that Brahmin Leader? I think that we have to wait for one more generation to get our leader for now none seems to be there in the mold.

ganamukundhapriya

Classically there were four main roles in society: the thinker (brahmin), the leader (kshatriya), the producer (vaishya), and the hand-on doer (shudra).All of them exist in all society,in modern life.
 
Dual Role

The Question is about duality in role. Can a Brahmin also be a Kshatriya or Vysiya or Sudra simultaneously? I only know of a Brahmin clan that switch its role only for afternoon for Sudhra. Corporate culture is akin to other clans in some manner but not in any way suitable for Brahmins.
ganamukundhapriya

Classically there were four main roles in society: the thinker (brahmin), the leader (kshatriya), the producer (vaishya), and the hand-on doer (shudra).All of them exist in all society,in modern life.
 
I wish to refine the roles assigned to 4 classes of the society.

1. Brahmin - Custodian of Dharma
2. Kshatriya - Ruler
3. Vaisya - Trader
4. Sudra - One who does physical labour

But, this old definition is no longer valid today. Every person assumes more than 1 role today. Thus, a brahmin can be an administrator or an accountant too, a kshatriya can be a trader or businessman too, vaisya a teacher too and sudra a judge, politician or trader too.

"Vannangal vetrumai pattaal - Adhil
Maanudar vetrumail illai" - Bharathi
 
The Brahmins have now adapted and adopted well the Corporate Culture and that is the reason that they could sail against all adversities. They fit in perfectly well at all levels in MNCs proving their global portability. But on the flip side of it the Brahmins are loosing their cultural values to corporate culture! Is it an healthy trend?

I found the undernoted definitions of Corporate Culture relevant to this discussion:-

1. Corporate culture is the total sum of the values, customs, traditions, and meanings that make a company unique. Corporate culture is often called "the character of an organization", since it embodies the vision of the company’s founders. The values of a corporate culture influence the ethical standards within a corporation, as well as managerial behavior.

2. Corporate Culture - the particular strategies, style, systems, environment and shared values within an organization which contribute to its individuality.

Corporate Culture (CC) therefore boils down to working within the rules and regulations laid down by a company or organization. Most of the Corporations today are engaged in manufacturing, sales, and financial & other services including health. IT basically is manufacture and sales, in my view, particularly in the Indian context because we have not been able to do anything of note either in the development of "chips" or in producing brand new software which can be patented. (If I am wrong, please correct me.)

Adjusting to CC is nothing different from the way brahmins adjusted to the "kumbini" rule initially and subsequently to the British Government Service. The very fact that there were so many luminaries from among brahmins who were highly respected as brahmins per se by the community, and were decorated with titles like Rao Bahadur, OBE, and so on by the British administration, speaks eloquently about the ability of brahmins to morph themselves to fit into the two distinct shapes - orthodox brahmin, and trusted servant of the British - at the same time without even an iota of difficulty. The same ease we find coming down the social ladder to the ordinary brahmin clerk; panchakachham with shirt, coat and turban, and leather chappals also sometimes (a forbidden item for pure brahmins; I am told that in the olden days some musicians did not eat along with the mridangam player since the latter was touching leather! and hence impure.) Incidentally Bharatiar also donned the same dress despite all his dislike for the British! The snuff was another paraphernalia in many cases and was accepted as sanctioned by the Sastras. During all these periods we don't feel that brahmins lost any of their cultural values.

Brahmins, in my view, will not, therefore, have any difficulty in adjusting to any CC without losing their cultural values.
 
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I have come to understand the euphemism ‘corporate culture’ as mentioned in this thread as such: this happens with people working together, maybe men women or men alone, a lot of drinking, meateating, wenching and such wild stuff, sex at odd hours, high earning but equally high spending, and above all, an absence of ‘morality’ as defined by middle class norms.

There is also a wide held belief that this is universally and widely prevalent ie almost all folks of a certain age, certain professions, certain careerist indulge in all or some of the above.

I do not wish to dispel such hard held beliefs, but I wish to recount my own experiences as seen here in Canada.

It is true that folks who work in long shifts together, tend to develop camaraderie. These are usually IT operators who, here perhaps work 12 hour shifs for 6 days and get 8 days off or something like that. these people’s body cycle is out of rhythm with the general 9to5 crowd, and hence a natural tendency to cling together pervades. But this exists only till they get married, at which point, the odd hours shifts is great for adjusting babysitting schedules, and hence avoiding expensive daycare.

Most of the careerist put in close to 80 hours or more per week. I do not see any of them have the time for gallivanting or frolicking. Once in a while, an occasional drink after work in a pub may be the norm. those that have families, find it hard, to keep track of their children’s life and growth and lose out on this. this type of long work hours causes tensions within the family, as the wife, usually not only has to do her own day job, but carry on the responsibilities of a household by herself. I have seen a lot of couples break up just due to intense ambition and commitment to their careers.

There are always folks who ‘play’ around. But these are very few, atleast to my knowledge. So, when I read about the widespread prevalency of immoral corporate ‘culture’ in india, I am bound to be sceptical, as to me, this sounds like yet another of those tunes about ‘lost’ culture and values.
 
I have come to understand the euphemism ‘corporate culture’ as mentioned in this thread as such: this happens with people working together, maybe men women or men alone, a lot of drinking, meateating, wenching and such wild stuff, sex at odd hours, high earning but equally high spending, and above all, an absence of ‘morality’ as defined by middle class norms.

There is also a wide held belief that this is universally and widely prevalent ie almost all folks of a certain age, certain professions, certain careerist indulge in all or some of the above.

I do not wish to dispel such hard held beliefs, but I wish to recount my own experiences as seen here in Canada.

It is true that folks who work in long shifts together, tend to develop camaraderie. These are usually IT operators who, here perhaps work 12 hour shifs for 6 days and get 8 days off or something like that. these people’s body cycle is out of rhythm with the general 9to5 crowd, and hence a natural tendency to cling together pervades. But this exists only till they get married, at which point, the odd hours shifts is great for adjusting babysitting schedules, and hence avoiding expensive daycare.

Most of the careerist put in close to 80 hours or more per week. I do not see any of them have the time for gallivanting or frolicking. Once in a while, an occasional drink after work in a pub may be the norm. those that have families, find it hard, to keep track of their children’s life and growth and lose out on this. this type of long work hours causes tensions within the family, as the wife, usually not only has to do her own day job, but carry on the responsibilities of a household by herself. I have seen a lot of couples break up just due to intense ambition and commitment to their careers.

There are always folks who ‘play’ around. But these are very few, atleast to my knowledge. So, when I read about the widespread prevalency of immoral corporate ‘culture’ in india, I am bound to be sceptical, as to me, this sounds like yet another of those tunes about ‘lost’ culture and values.


100 % well defined ground realty Sri Kunjuppu ji....:yo:
 
I have come to understand the euphemism ‘corporate culture’ as mentioned in this thread as such: this happens with people working together, maybe men women or men alone, a lot of drinking, meateating, wenching and such wild stuff, sex at odd hours, high earning but equally high spending, and above all, an absence of ‘morality’ as defined by middle class norms.

There is also a wide held belief that this is universally and widely prevalent ie almost all folks of a certain age, certain professions, certain careerist indulge in all or some of the above.

I do not wish to dispel such hard held beliefs, but I wish to recount my own experiences as seen here in Canada.

It is true that folks who work in long shifts together, tend to develop camaraderie. These are usually IT operators who, here perhaps work 12 hour shifs for 6 days and get 8 days off or something like that. these people’s body cycle is out of rhythm with the general 9to5 crowd, and hence a natural tendency to cling together pervades. But this exists only till they get married, at which point, the odd hours shifts is great for adjusting babysitting schedules, and hence avoiding expensive daycare.

Most of the careerist put in close to 80 hours or more per week. I do not see any of them have the time for gallivanting or frolicking. Once in a while, an occasional drink after work in a pub may be the norm. those that have families, find it hard, to keep track of their children’s life and growth and lose out on this. this type of long work hours causes tensions within the family, as the wife, usually not only has to do her own day job, but carry on the responsibilities of a household by herself. I have seen a lot of couples break up just due to intense ambition and commitment to their careers.

There are always folks who ‘play’ around. But these are very few, atleast to my knowledge. So, when I read about the widespread prevalency of immoral corporate ‘culture’ in india, I am bound to be sceptical, as to me, this sounds like yet another of those tunes about ‘lost’ culture and values.


Dear Kunjuppu,

When the IT sector boom started in India and reached its acme in a short time, many youngsters found themselves in oodles of money perhaps never before seen by the family itself. Since most of the jobs were concentrated in one or two metros, the youngsters had to live away from their families as well. This new-found freedom plus the sudden affluence did affect their lifestyles. In BGL I have heard from my nephew (born and brought up there) that drinking, living-together, homosexuality, etc., had become fads to indulge in for the nouveau riche IT younsters.

But the boom has almost gone and people must have come down to the earth by now. It is reported to be more of a slave-driving thing in the IT companies now. Still since most jobs here are of the BPO-type and hardly any new software (patentable by India) is developed, the connection of these people with their foreign "clients" is more and perforce the staff is required to know the customs, manners, mores etc., of the foreign countries. This knowledge rubs on them also. Perhaps that is why all this talk about "Corporate Culture" being bad.
 
CORPORATE CULTURE



PREFACE

What does one mean by corporate culture? First, it is most unique to an organization. Secondly, the organization must be well-structured, and in existence for relatively a longer period. A true corporate house is one which is spread over a vast geographical area, employing people with different backgrounds in terms of their language, education, skills and experience.

By culture we mean the characteristics and style of functioning. These are determined by the shared values, beliefs, customs and practices – mostly transmitted through oral communication and reinforced over time. It may be surprising to note in many organizations, this culture is contrary to what has been conveyed through written booklets, training materials and circulars. Therefore, it is obvious that informal communication plays a major role here. And this paradox is a well recognized and a well accepted one.


MAJOR INGREDIENTS OF AN ORGANIZATIONAL CULTURE

Leadership styles that are well established over a period, channels of communication and their contents, reporting relationships which include hierarchical pattern, corporate ethos and values (both professed and practiced), reward and punishment mechanisms, investments made in human resources development, brand positioning and finally, interaction with the external world – directly through its personnel, through the media and indirectly through its chartered accountants, advocates/attorneys and company secretaries and top management personnel who formulate the key policies and take critical decisions in managing the organizations.


WHAT IS A CORPORATE CULTURE vis-à-vis ORGANIZATIONAL CULTURE?

A corporate entity inculcates and retains all the ingredients of an organizational culture. But what distinguishes it from an ordinary organization is, there is an undercurrent of business motive in every move of a corporate culture. It is expected that its business goals are reflected in every transaction of a corporate entity, unlike an ordinary organization. This has resulted in developing a materialistic outlook in the personnel working in such companies. People are judged by the business mobilized and the profits generated. The most important fall out of this is redefining the morals and ethics, in the long run. (Here, morals and ethics are collectively called ‘dharma’ that evolved over thousands of years in various societies, across the world).


GOOD ELEMENTS OF A CORPORATE CULTURE

1. Adoption of uniform standards, codes and practices within an organization, mostly.
2. Consistency in style of functioning, reinforced by suitable reward and punishment mechanisms.
3. Stability of an organization is assured.
4. ‘Succession planning’ becomes easier.
5. Loyalty of its personnel is greater.
6. Positioning itself in the society becomes simple and easy.


BAD ELEMENTS OF A CORPORATE CULTURE

1. Informal needs and wants of human beings – inside or outside – are seldom cared for.
2. Interpersonal relationships, except in very few corporate houses, are rigid and marked by the
position and authority one holds.
3. External variables in a dynamic business environment are not properly accounted for. As a result,
performance to the targeted level is demanded at any cost.
4. Especially in private sector, stability of tenure is not guaranteed.
5. Trade Unions and Collective bargaining are unknown.
6. Subjectivity of the superior determines the career growth of a sub-ordinate always.
7. Greater weightage is assigned to the version of the senior and top level managers. Thus, we can
say true democracy is conspicuous by its absence.


CORPORATE CULTURE AND INDIVIDUAL LIFESTYLE

Corporate culture has an influence on the lifestyles of the individuals impacted by it. For instance, its own personnel and their families and those who have regular dealings with such entity are visibly influenced. But, there is invisible influence on the other sections of the society – people who rent their building to the office or its personnel, schools, colleges, hospitals, vegetable vendors, washermen, servants/maids, barbers, shops that supply monthly provisions to the employees’ families are all indirectly benefited/influenced by the corporate entities in their midst. Because of such influence, these sections of the society affect the lifestyle of people practicing other trades and profession in their region. This is the reason why certain goods and services are more expensive in certain areas and less expensive in certain other areas, even though the standards are comparable.


CORPORATE CULTURE AND SOCIAL VALUES

We must always remember that corporate entities do not exist in isolation. They exist within our society. Therefore, the culture of a corporate entity affects the culture of people working in it and others who interact with such people.

Certain old beliefs are replaced by a new set of beliefs and in the name of cultural fusion, cultural confusion also happens. Money plays a dominant role and it keeps aside all other considerations. People who earn more and possess more have better say and are respected, regardless of their personal character.

Modern education system gives a lot of importance to privacy and individuality. In the name of freedom of expression, anything can be said or written, without any accountability. People are made to believe all that is old is trash and all that is new is fine and acceptable. Sophistication means freedom to do anything in private and condemning it in public, if it has no social acceptance. This “Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde” personality is common and widespread.

When money is believed to compensate for all ill-doings, when money is believed to atone for all one’s sins, when money can undo the damages caused by one’s action or inaction, money becomes the ‘GOD’ – omnipresent and omnipotent.


CONCLUSION

In a nutshell, corporate culture is business oriented and it cannot function without money. Everything is reduced to monetary terms. The most direct casualty of this is personal relationships. Another important point is, culture – of the society or a corporate entity – does not evolve within a short period. It takes longer time to evolve, to take proper shape and then finally to settle. Once it is done, it is very difficult to change it. Therefore, it is in everybody’s interest that a good, time-tested culture shall not be tampered with. Therefore, it is everyone’s duty to preserve our cultural heritage, that has been free from materialistic outlook but influenced by our social and spiritual outlook, strengthened by wisdom gained during the last 3000 years.

Needless to say, the aim of this article is not to condemn the corporate culture as such. But to safeguard our own culture, from its evil effects. That’s all.
 
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Exactly. Also the Brahmins everywhere should understand dichotomy in Corporate life and should stop eulogizing the Corporate career as boon for Brahmins who have been deprived of other opportunities in India, particularly in Tamilnadu.
 
Varnasrama envisaged Cultural identity. Corporates profess dichotomy and cultural duality. It is good if Brahmins refrained from identifying themselves with the Corporate culture.
 
Varnasrama envisaged Cultural identity. Corporates profess dichotomy and cultural duality. It is good if Brahmins refrained from identifying themselves with the Corporate culture.
Harini,

I am not able to understand both statements: 1. Varnasrama envisaged Cultural identity, and, 2. Corporates profess dichotomy and cultural duality. (emphasis mine). Will you please explain.
 
Greetings to all!.. Anybody irrespective of castes can be suitable for corporate culture. Adimai Thozhilnu aayachu. Corporata irundha enna, corporationa irundha enna. Kaasiyila Brahmins riksha 'pull'alaya? (izukkalaiya?). Sory, semmozhilyana thamil mozhi yoda ring tone effect.
 
Genetics

1. Varnasrama envisaged Cultural identity, and, 2. Corporates profess dichotomy and cultural duality. (emphasis mine). please explain.

Varnasramam is a classification based on the genes that identifies one's culture. Corporate culture is an effort to genetically modify genes for a purpose without minding the side effects.
 
Varnasramam is a classification based on the genes that identifies one's culture. Corporate culture is an effort to genetically modify genes for a purpose without minding the side effects.

harini, i am not sure i follow.

i have heard that the genes of all indian castes are very much alike. if one does a dna analysis of indian castes including dalits, there has been little or no difference. the tamil brahmin is close to other tamil tribes and less close to the north indian brahmin, though many would like to believe otherwise.

there is really no logical basis for varna except for that guy manu.

re corporate culture, whatever that may be, it is a mode or method of behaviour in one's work. nothing to do with our genetic set up. atleast this is the way i understand it.
 
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