NO UBI, Only Amma canteen will work for India !!

[Jaykay767]

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Gosh, NO UBI, Only Amma canteen will work for India -

One of the bane of the Indian planning is that we tend to see what works abroad and try to leverage that. But in almost all cases it does not work for india.

In our villages, due to poor education and lack of secure jobs, and huge uncertainty, most of the men are addicted to beedis, cigarettes, liquor and gambling leading to the ruin of innumerable families. One of the main reason many political parties go for repeated prohibition with no success.

In this context, UBI ( Universal Basic Income) is useless as the men of the family will spend it all on such destructive habits while the kids go hungry and get into bad habits themselves repeating an endless cycle of poverty.

Here is where we have to salute Amma aka Jayalalitha who revolutionised the political thinking by spearheading freebies of cooker, TV, laptop, free or subsidised rice and finally the signature Amma canteen.

Our poor need "free" good and nutritious food so that they can get out of the endless poverty and violence. And these families cannot depend on the men in the families to provide this for them.

Hence the govt has to step in till mass education can uplift the morass of people from this mess.

Instead of spending on countless subsidies on roads, toilets and gas Ujwala etc.. and now on UBI, the centre should adopt just one scheme - the Amma canteen and its delivery mechanism and implement across the country. Free and nutritious food is the only thing the poor need, they will work out the rest themselves. For godsake don't waste time and effort on useless schemes.

This will ensure the women and kids of the poor are well fed irrespective of whether the men of the family provide for them or not. This will drastically reduce the family fights as people get fed by the Amma canteens across the country.

The sad tragedy of this country is NOT lack of money but lack of "right ideas". No point in taking wrong ideas and even if we implement them well, it is useless.

 

[Jaykay767]

Amma's schemes were all "rightly targeted towards the woman" of the house and this dramatically lifted the poor in our Tamil society and gave a strong voice for them !

 

[Jaykay767]

Media needs to debate these issues and critically analyse whether a UBI will work in india or not. Instead everyone nods their heads in unison and then when it does not work, they will spend endless discussions on the failures. And then search for another messiah to come with magic wand to deliver the goods.

 

[Jaykay767]

free good and nutritious food alone solves most of the problems - Malnutrition, Healthcare issues, domestic violence and killings, slavery, forced employment of children, theft, robberies, prostitution, woman trafficking, etc..

And we can coin this as - Universal Amma Canteen - UAC !!

 

[prasad1]

It is a good thread Topic.
I do not know if I meet the criteria of subject matter expertise.
UBI may have worked at other places, but like you said it may not be India.

Unfortunately, a welfare state by any other name is still a welfare state. There should be some standards for determining who qualifies for certain aid, a UBI would be given to everyone. This would dramatically increase the pool of citizens receiving benefits from the state and inflict massive expenses across the board.

At the same time, nothing is expected of these recipients.
Like the OP expressed it does not motivate the recipient to perform any useful service to the community.

Incentives are a powerful force. And there is no greater incentive than financial security and holding a job is essential to that end. When something comes easy, it is easily taken for granted. And while it would be nice to believe otherwise, giving cash handouts to every citizen incentivizes them to try that much less.

 

[Jaykay767]

It is a good thread Topic.
I do not know if I meet the criteria of subject matter expertise.
UBI may have worked at other places, but like you said it may not be India.

Unfortunately, a welfare state by any other name is still a welfare state. There should be some standards for determining who qualifies for certain aid, a UBI would be given to everyone. This would dramatically increase the pool of citizens receiving benefits from the state and inflict massive expenses across the board.

At the same time, nothing is expected of these recipients.
Like the OP expressed it does not motivate the recipient to perform any useful service to the community.

Incentives are a powerful force. And there is no greater incentive than financial security and holding a job is essential to that end. When something comes easy, it is easily taken for granted. And while it would be nice to believe otherwise, giving cash handouts to every citizen incentivizes them to try that much less.

Agree, welfare states are not sustainable economically in the long run. But then, most poor will not survive anyways in the meanwhile.

So it is a necessary evil that needs to be managed well. In this case, we can target specifically to the poor and hungry in the most downtrodden areas ! So that the needy get immediate relief.

That's why despite the widespread criticism of TN freebie politics, it is a game changer for the poor !

 

[Jaykay767]

On jobs, due to the disastrous failure of this govt, the poor have no choice but to live on handouts. Yes that will disincentive them from working.

But again necessary evil to tide over the immediate crisis.

Unless we build a massive blue print and execute like China, we cannot transform and provide jobs for most if not all.

Hence the need to continue the welfare state in the interim.

 

[vasuent]

Media needs to debate these issues and critically analyse whether a UBI will work in india or not. Instead everyone nods their heads in unison and then when it does not work, they will spend endless discussions on the failures. And then search for another messiah to come with magic wand to deliver the goods.

People are already lazy due to all freebies. Ask the agriculture sector,how much it was affected by "minimum guaranteed workdays scheme" There was shortage of workers. Free food appears very basic and effective but what about perfect implementation. There will be philforation and poor quality like what happens in "Mid-day meal scheme". Improve job opportunity especially in basic sectors,and minimum wages. Bring down prices.

 

[sanarthi]

Agree, welfare states are not sustainable economically in the long run. But then, most poor will not survive anyways in the meanwhile.

So it is a necessary evil that needs to be managed well. In this case, we can target specifically to the poor and hungry in the most downtrodden areas ! So that the needy get immediate relief.

That's why despite the widespread criticism of TN freebie politics, it is a game changer for the poor !

One of the reasons why annadanam has been conducted in all the temples by our ancestors. Unfortunately the temple lands have been usurped by unscrupulous elements and not only the society is suffering even the temples do not have money to spend on their day today activities.

 

[chandar]

Gosh, NO UBI, Only Amma canteen will work for India -

One of the bane of the Indian planning is that we tend to see what works abroad and try to leverage that. But in almost all cases it does not work for india.

In our villages, due to poor education and lack of secure jobs, and huge uncertainty, most of the men are addicted to beedis, cigarettes, liquor and gambling leading to the ruin of innumerable families. One of the main reason many political parties go for repeated prohibition with no success.

In this context, UBI ( Universal Basic Income) is useless as the men of the family will spend it all on such destructive habits while the kids go hungry and get into bad habits themselves repeating an endless cycle of poverty.

Here is where we have to salute Amma aka Jayalalitha who revolutionised the political thinking by spearheading freebies of cooker, TV, laptop, free or subsidised rice and finally the signature Amma canteen.

Our poor need "free" good and nutritious food so that they can get out of the endless poverty and violence. And these families cannot depend on the men in the families to provide this for them.

Hence the govt has to step in till mass education can uplift the morass of people from this mess.

Instead of spending on countless subsidies on roads, toilets and gas Ujwala etc.. and now on UBI, the centre should adopt just one scheme - the Amma canteen and its delivery mechanism and implement across the country. Free and nutritious food is the only thing the poor need, they will work out the rest themselves. For godsake don't waste time and effort on useless schemes.

This will ensure the women and kids of the poor are well fed irrespective of whether the men of the family provide for them or not. This will drastically reduce the family fights as people get fed by the Amma canteens across the country.

The sad tragedy of this country is NOT lack of money but lack of "right ideas". No point in taking wrong ideas and even if we implement them well, it is useless.

 

[chandar]

Sorry to say our country is so unique that in every 50 Km the dialect & customs changes.
For country like us we need UIB -which meant for farmers to be supported & welcomed
Every society in the world smokes etc etc & we Tamilan glorify the social evils instead of eradicating it.
Unfortunately our community do not have unity & we are bend upon showing others in poor instead of appreciating it.
Amma canteen is meant for masses in general & UIB is meant only for the farmers.
Amma canteen is only in few cities of TN & not in whole of India. Where as UIB is meant for whole of India.
Let us appreciate the good act &criticise the bad one but our community will find loopholes in all act.

 

[ashoktwinn]

UBI can be disastrous for India as more and more people would refuse work. Take the havoc happening in our farms. As the farm workers have assured income from Rozgar Yojana, no one wants grains for wages instead cash, which can increase to Rs500 per person per day. Hence giving incentives to work hard is better than UBI.

 

[naithru]

dear Sri JK,
Your contention about freebies ok, But Mr.M.K.'s corruption( colour TV ) is scientific. By spending the Govt's money and pocketing the commission, ultimate beneficent is his nephew, Mr, Maran who gets monthly subscription for Sumangali Cables. However smart JJ is , by distributing grinder, mixie et all, without electricity
they are no use, moreover if power goes off for his TV, Mr.MK will say ADMK has cut the electricity

 

[CHANDRU1849]

dear Sri JK,
Your contention about freebies ok, But Mr.M.K.'s corruption( colour TV ) is scientific. By spending the Govt's money and pocketing the commission, ultimate beneficent is his nephew, Mr, Maran who gets monthly subscription for Sumangali Cables. However smart JJ is , by distributing grinder, mixie et all, without electricity
they are no use, moreover if power goes off for his TV, Mr.MK will say ADMK has cut the electricity

Why did the Govt. not ask for any share from TV subscriptions, since the Govt paid for TV?

 

[naithru]

Why did the Govt. not ask for any share from TV subscriptions, since the Govt paid for TV?
mr. Chandru1849 do you mean to say that the govt will ask , it will not come to the pocket but will go to govt.
why should ?? and they will ask under the table as usual

 

[prasad1]

Sorry to say our country is so unique that in every 50 Km the dialect & customs changes.
For country like us we need UIB -which meant for farmers to be supported & welcomed
Every society in the world smokes etc etc & we Tamilan glorify the social evils instead of eradicating it.
Unfortunately our community do not have unity & we are bend upon showing others in poor instead of appreciating it.
Amma canteen is meant for masses in general & UIB is meant only for the farmers.
Amma canteen is only in few cities of TN & not in whole of India. Where as UIB is meant for whole of India.
Let us appreciate the good act &criticise the bad one but our community will find loopholes in all act.

Welcome to the forum.
UBI ( Universal Basic Income), I thought was for everyone.
If I am not wrong Jaykayji, wanted something on the lines of Amma's Kitchen to be duplicated everywhere.
But he can explain it much better.
To be fair "glorifying" does not feed hunger. Feed me first when I am hungry.

 

[Jaykay767]

One of the reasons why annadanam has been conducted in all the temples by our ancestors. Unfortunately the temple lands have been usurped by unscrupulous elements and not only the society is suffering even the temples do not have money to spend on their day today activities.

Absolutely !! Agree, this is very very unfortunate. And the govt take over of the temples is the reason for this mess. Temple and its administration should have been left to the heriditary priest !!

 

[Jaykay767]

Sorry to say our country is so unique that in every 50 Km the dialect & customs changes.
For country like us we need UIB -which meant for farmers to be supported & welcomed
Every society in the world smokes etc etc & we Tamilan glorify the social evils instead of eradicating it.
Unfortunately our community do not have unity & we are bend upon showing others in poor instead of appreciating it.
Amma canteen is meant for masses in general & UIB is meant only for the farmers.
Amma canteen is only in few cities of TN & not in whole of India. Where as UIB is meant for whole of India.
Let us appreciate the good act &criticise the bad one but our community will find loopholes in all act.

This is not about criticing for the sake of it. UBI scheme is for all the poor and not specific to farmers. The one for farmers is the Kisan Yojana.

If money is directly given to the poor, the men in the family will spend it on "Kudi" and the kids in the family will go hungry. This is the unfortunate reality. In the poor families, most of the salary earned today is spent on Kudi and very little on kids.

Hence the only solution is to provide free food for the poor via Amma canteen.

Remember Amma canteen is better than UBI, the poor still need to still work for housing, clothing, studies etc...

 

[Jaykay767]

People are already lazy due to all freebies. Ask the agriculture sector,how much it was affected by "minimum guaranteed workdays scheme" There was shortage of workers. Free food appears very basic and effective but what about perfect implementation. There will be philforation and poor quality like what happens in "Mid-day meal scheme". Improve job opportunity especially in basic sectors,and minimum wages. Bring down prices.

Agreed, in an ideal world, most of the people should be gainfully employed and working for a living.

But what do we do when this govt has totally messed up the informal economy due to disastrous policies like demomentisation and GST ??

 

[Jaykay767]

dear Sri JK,
Your contention about freebies ok, But Mr.M.K.'s corruption( colour TV ) is scientific. By spending the Govt's money and pocketing the commission, ultimate beneficent is his nephew, Mr, Maran who gets monthly subscription for Sumangali Cables. However smart JJ is , by distributing grinder, mixie et all, without electricity
they are no use, moreover if power goes off for his TV, Mr.MK will say ADMK has cut the electricity

Naithru, Not a perfect world, it is a percent world !!

In TN and in general south states, politicians take some amount as bribe and deliver the goods even if very shoddily. In north, politicians will take the full amount as bribe !! So we have to live with some of these issues.