On Finding A Match For A Brahmin Widower

[krish44]

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I was recently trying to find a match for a young widower a relative left with a girl child aged 4 years. He had lost his wife to cancer two years back

When I tried thru a popular matrimonial site , I was stunned to find literally hundreds of tamil brahmin girls in 28-37 age group mostly divorced and some widowed.

most of them were well educated and in excellent jobs earning 7-20 lakhs per year.

quite a few of them were in US or canada.

this set me thinking.

the reasons of separation given by these girls are false information about education,job ,medical status of boys, physical and mental abuse,inlaws ,dowry related.

What is interesting is,they were bold enough to walk out of marriages , get separation and try for a match again.

but they were extra careful about their fresh choice and were clear about what they did not want in a mate.

also many were not bothered any further about horoscope matches and were liberal about sub castes while wanting only a brahmin match.

not many were ready to give up their jobs or place of work for marriage.

some stated openly that their parents are their only anchor and would prefer to stay near them after remarriage.

most pathetic cases are those who were separated and whose divorces were getting blocked by their husbands refusing to give divorce and delaying the

process of law.

If these girls have children , it becomes extremely difficult for them to get a match. Men are not large hearted to accept a girl with a child.

Interestingly there only a few widows trying for a match. as compared to divorced girls.

I strongly believe that the numbers of these girls must be very large. only a few are trying to get married again.

Tamil brahmin society is undergoing a big change due to education and economic independance of girls

Perhaps it is good .

 

[krish44]

Some of interesting observation about the tamil brahmin divorced/widowed girls in US/canada.

They prefer tamil brahmins already there, preferably born and brought up there

They fear Tamil brahmins boys from india using them to get an entry to US/canada

Some make it amply clear what kind of TBs are acceptable.

They also specify the visa status acceptable to them if the girls are US citizen or permanent residents.

Hardly anyone is interested to return to india.

most say they can only at best talk tamil.

many are prepared to accept any brahmin or other castes .

Only one was prepared to return on the condition she will not take up any job in india and would expect the prospective husband to economically fully support her.

She would like to pursue her passion in india -carnatic music and become a concert singer.lol

Another in india met me and told me about the abusive relationship at her inlaws place.-comments about her skin colour,misbehaviour of inlaws making her go hungry and

husband not caring for what she was going thru. Her parents wanted her to adjust and put up with abuse.now the husband is refusing to give her divorce.

Another said she will accept only a divorced /widowed man with no kids.Equally interesting was another wanting an assurance she could have kids of her own after

marriage.

Indian types were clear -under no circumstances they will give up their jobs and they would say near their support system -namely her parents.

Widowed girls were far more accomodating. only they were careless in posting their profile including photos and willing for compromises on job and accepting someone

who will take care of them.Some of these were in low paid jobs and had low expectations from another marriage. Only their parents were keen on resettling them

most were extra cautious and rejected any proposal outright if it involved any inconvenience or hardship.It is difficult to change status quo ist mindset if you have

suffered in a marital relationship leading to breakdown of marriage

 

[krish44]

This being the status of divorced/widowed ladies what is a reasonable option for a widower with a child

Simplest -Do not get married again and bring up his child utilising the services of a house maid.

Next option collect a poor widow with minimal education with no expectations and marry and dump the child and his parents on her .

finally marry high flying educated career type and satisfy all her needs including change of place , job and move in near her parents . This perhaps might mean playing

a less significant role in marriage and he can pray she will take care of his child and his parents.

any other options?

 

[renuka]

dear Krish ji,

Why dont you advice this person to start dating?

Its just been two years since his wife died and he has a daughter too..so why get into marriage so soon..cos marriage can be stressful..is he completely recovered from the death of his wife?

Tell him to just have a few causal relationships and then decide.

Right now he needs love or lust and not marriage.

 

[krish44]

dear renukaji
If this person had enterprise, he would know how to get into relationships.

One or two relationships terminated after telephonic talk with the girls.

tamil boys unlike the local punjabi boys are not capable of dating anyone. they are mostly dumb

He is ready to move on and marry again.

Only I am wondering which is the best option.?

The girl from US is a CA and wants to become a carnatic music singer and wants him in chennai/bangalore.

One girl from chennai well educated is awaiting divorce -which may take six months to a year.

Third is a widow and prepared to simply marry . Though educated She wants to be housewife and prepared to look after his kid and inlaws.

The fellow is dreaming of the US girl and might end up with an indian option.

Dating is a great option-if these girls are in delhi.

Are divorced girls/widows after what they have undergone in their life are capable of getting into casual relationships? I doubt

They only become mental cases and cynical about love.

I am only wondering how to finalise a marriage in shortest possible time -say 4 to 5 weeks.

It is a challenge to my match making capabilities.lol

 

[sangom]

Excuse me for poking my nose in this thread.

It will depend on the age of the widower. If he can keep his daughter with his parents or his in-laws (first wife's parents) for about two or three years, it may be a good course. Better to get married again soon and lead a husband & wife life for 2 or 3 years and then bring the daughter into the household; no new child in the meanwhile.

The other option is not to marry again and bring up the daughter as best as circumstances allow.

 

[krish44]

sangomji
I value your wise advice.

This boy is around 37 years.

He has some support system.

His parents with whom he stays are looking after the child. However they have their own medical problems in addition to old age issues.

It sounds selfish to hand over child to inlaws and get married again. How many inlaws can accept this proposition ?

When one has long years of life left to live and choices are limited it can be exasperating.

In our parents generation, men coolly got married multiple times due to easy availability of women for marriage.

with education and women becoming economic entities with high paid jobs and skewed sex ratio, girls are setting harsh terms for cohabitation.

it is becoming difficult to find girls for normal marriages . A widower with a child may not have many takers ,irrespective of his economic status.

This is the crass reality.

Most educated , well earning divorced /widowed ladies would prefer to stay single than accepting a man with a child.

 

[renuka]

Excuse me for poking my nose in this thread.

It will depend on the age of the widower. If he can keep his daughter with his parents or his in-laws (first wife's parents) for about two or three years, it may be a good course. Better to get married again soon and lead a husband & wife life for 2 or 3 years and then bring the daughter into the household; no new child in the meanwhile.

The other option is not to marry again and bring up the daughter as best as circumstances allow.

Dear Sangom ji,

I feel keeping the daughter away from him would affect the child seriously cos the girl would feel as if she has been abandoned and as it is she does not have a mother..it would be to much for a young child to handle.

May be he should try to marry a divorcee or a widow with a child so that they can bring up each others children too and live happily and have kids on their own too.

 

[krish44]

Dear Sangom ji,

I feel keeping the daughter away from him would affect the child seriously cos the girl would feel as if she has been abandoned and as it is she does not have a mother..it would be to much for a young child to handle.

May be he should try to marry a divorcee or a widow with a child so that they can bring up each others children too and live happily and have kids on their own too.

Very interesting thought -marrying divorcee/widow with a child and also have further kids after marriage.

You know males have a mindset . they would expect the girl to accept his kid thru ex wife but he would be reluctant to accept widows/divorcee with her kid.

Also ,they would not mind having more kids after marrying again.

they come out with perverse logic that boy and girls kids thru previous marriage may not bond and one might get ill treated .

of course ,it is not wise as you say to keep daughter away from father. This man is unlikely to agree to such an arrangement.

My feeling is his aspirations for a high flying career woman for spouse does not match with his need for for a housewife who will look after his kid and his parents. he requires a wife who can play

nanny and a nurse He would like to dump his commitments on his wife if feasible.

It is strange when it comes to marriage most want a dream girl who do not match their real life needs. Same is the case with many girls. Thats why one sees many

mismatched couple.

 

[mkrishna100]

It is strange when it comes to marriage most want a dream girl who do not match their real life needs. Same is the case with many girls. Thats why one sees many

mismatched couple.

That is why one sees more unmarried boys and girls also . I know of one girl who kept very high standards with regard to her marriage and for the last 10 years or so still remaining unmarried and and now that she has got old she is finding it tough to find the right guy ( as she was also getting older year by year and have now only to choose between bald headed guys , divorced ,widowers etc ) and is now frustrated and has gone in to a sort of depression .
Also I know of one guy who thought he was like Cine Actor Madhavan and was expecting a heroine as his wife and for 5 years nothing much happened and he got frustrated and finally hed to select with great reluctance an awful looking girl ( sorry to say this but that is the first opinion anyone will get when seeing that girl .She may be a good girl at heart but he had to drstically cut down his standrads with regard to beauty for settling down finally as his parents warned that if he is not realistic then he will soon turn into a Mama and finally a Tatha and they have to only find a Maami or Paati for him ) .

 

[krish44]

That is why one sees more unmarried boys and girls also . I know of one girl who kept very high standards with regard to her marriage and for the last 10 years or so still remaining unmarried and and now that she has got old she is finding it tough to find the right guy ( as she was also getting older year by year and have now only to choose between bald headed guys , divorced ,widowers etc ) and is now frustrated and has gone in to a sort of depression .

The issue of girls marriage is a little more complicated.

Since girls have got better educated and hold decent jobs . There is no economic compulsion to marry early.The average age for educated and working girls has shot up

to 28 years. We have literally hundreds of unmarried girls in thirtees.Many have set sight on US?canada for a career and marriage.

These feel they can afford to wait and pick and choose what they want

Parents are not too much bothered as the girls are economic entities . many of these parents are retired entities and mostly unable to force compromises on daughters

as they become physically dependant on them for health reasons. besides ,the high paying MNCs where many girls are employed give handsome salaries to these girls

They just unable to marry anyone earning far less in other professions.So one has ended up with a large number of these girls in mid thirtees. the plight of men is still

worse. There are men in thirtees and forties also unable to find a match as girls are calling the shots and slightly mediocre are rejected by all girls.in addition ,there is

a skewed sex ratio.

If one sees facebook ,one comes across lots of these boys and girls of tamil brahmin background looking for matches.

Such a phenomenon can be found only in our brahmin classes.lol

 

[mkrishna100]

The average age for educated and working girls has shot up

to 28 years.

I am talking of Girls who are 35+ and still seeking Mr.Right and are getting highly frustrated and finally come to the conclusion that they have to bring down their gold standrad to aluminium standard in case they have to marry finally .

 

[krish44]

I am talking of Girls who are 35+ and still seeking Mr.Right and are getting highly frustrated and finally come to the conclusion that they have to bring down their gold standrad to aluminium standard in case they have to marry finally .

Per se ,there is nothing wrong in setting standards and getting selective in choice of spouse as one has to spend a lifetime with them.

Most do not know how to specify their minimum requirements and what to compromise on.

Many hang on to narrow subsect matches or horoscope requirements and do not compromise on them

If it is only academic proficiency or well earning person in right age band they should find many.

also most girls do not like to change their city of working if they are career oriented. They also would like to be near their support system -namely her parents'

also if at all are prepared to move from their cities in india , they would prefer it to be some place in US or canada or even Europe.

this is the real issue

 

[renuka]

You know males have a mindset . they would expect the girl to accept his kid thru ex wife but he would be reluctant to accept widows/divorcee with her kid.

.

This I have noted only among those males who carry the Indian DNA and these rules are imposed on Indian brides only.

But these very same Indian males would not mind marrying a Non Indian divorcee/widow with a brood of kids.

Its very unfair that Indians impose all weird rules only on their own kind

 

[sangom]

Dear Sangom ji,

I feel keeping the daughter away from him would affect the child seriously cos the girl would feel as if she has been abandoned and as it is she does not have a mother..it would be to much for a young child to handle.

May be he should try to marry a divorcee or a widow with a child so that they can bring up each others children too and live happily and have kids on their own too.

Smt. Renuka ji,

I will value your advice as coming from an experienced person. But from some instances which I have seen, the widower marrying a new bride and that new bride seeing this girl child from day 1 as a competitor to her in sharing that man's love, affection, money, time, etc., will be a great harm to that child because the second wife will start the very ancient "war" against that child, popularly called சித்தம்மை கொடுமை (cittammai koṭumai = cruelty by father's second wife).

In any case, the best option for the man (37 years already) is to forego his own pleasures and bring up the child but he should also be aware that his daughter need not realize the great sacrifice he has made for her and may leave him to the mercy of some old age home towards the end of his life (I have seen such a case.). A really tragic situation (catch 22?) either which way you think of it

 

[Vaagmi]

The issue of girls marriage is a little more complicated.

Since girls have got better educated and hold decent jobs . There is no economic compulsion to marry early.The average age for educated and working girls has shot up
to 28 years. We have literally hundreds of unmarried girls in thirtees.Many have set sight on US?canada for a career and marriage.These feel they can afford to wait and pick and choose what they wantParents are not too much bothered as the girls are economic entities . many of these parents are retired entities and mostly unable to force compromises on daughters as they become physically dependant on them for health reasons. besides ,the high paying MNCs where many girls are employed give handsome salaries to these girls
They just unable to marry anyone earning far less in other professions.So one has ended up with a large number of these girls in mid thirtees. the plight of men is still worse. There are men in thirtees and forties also unable to find a match as girls are calling the shots and slightly mediocre are rejected by all girls.in addition ,there is
a skewed sex ratio.
If one sees facebook ,one comes across lots of these boys and girls of tamil brahmin background looking for matches.
Such a phenomenon can be found only in our brahmin classes.lol

The problem is now well understood. What can be the solution?

First let us see the origin of the problem. Have we followed the wrong path by opting for only sAtvic food and a culture which puts stress on underplaying emotions?

Girls need a boy not only for buying cars, house etc., together and go to party to enjoy. If these are the only needs the girl can wait indefinitely looking for suitable like minded, ideal hero with similar interests and level of education etc.,

Perhaps that is what the brahmin girls are doing today.

Is there not a basic natural human urge? Does a girl not need a boy to satisfy that need? Who but a boy can satisfy that need?

The problem is that our girls do not have that fire in them perhaps to fall head over heels in love with a boy. The sAtvic food habits, the underplaying of emotions, the culture etc., have robbed them of that most wonderful feeling of madly falling in love at the right age (18 to 22) - do you know what it is like to be suddenly swept off your feet?-, the surprises, the disappointments and coming to terms with them, and the several pleasant discoveries etc., of going through a stormy courtship, and finally settling down with the hero who may not be having a matching salary, a matching degree or even a matching height. And then facing the challenges of life together and make it work.

We men folk have again converted all our girls into mice. The mice which all will live as programmed by us. What a diabolic plot is being played out in the arena today!! And when the mice perform perfectly the assigned plot to the dot we again blame them. Poor things.

Women, thy name is suffering, thy name is pathetically suffering, thy name is pathetically suffering as dictated by heartless, mindless, stupid men. Men think you are giving it back to them in the same coin. But you know pretty well that you are just monkeys at the end of the tether playing as commanded.

Go and eat non sAtvic food regularly and drink too a peg or two regularly so that you get back your fire. LOL.

 

[krish44]

This I have noted only among those males who carry the Indian DNA and these rules are imposed on Indian brides only.

But these very same Indian males would not mind marrying a Non Indian divorcee/widow with a brood of kids.

Its very unfair that Indians impose all weird rules only on their own kind

Renuka
Do you think skin colour of female foreigners something to do with acceptance of their kids.?

I met recently tamil brahmin who has a divorced daughter in chennai

He has excellent professional credentials. His wife is swiss who was on holiday in europe

After committing to me that he will enable his daughter to talk to my relative , made me introduce the boy for remarriage to him which I promptly did on phone.

After making an appointment for talk with the boy later in the evening , he developed cold feet

He talked with the boy , grilled him on his credentials and then informed him he will take his wifes[!] concurrence after she returns from holiday after 10 days before

proceeding ahead

this fellow is nearing 70 years. yet he was scared of antogonising his swiss wife. yet his daughter is not a child -32years plus divorced. He would not go forward

without wife holding his hands. he same consideration would not have shown to indian wives. It was weird . He had made an appointment for breakfast and spent my

two hours. Nothing prevented him from consulting wife and daughter before meeting and also talking with boy 2000 km away. what do we do with this kind ?

He had posted the profile of his daughter as a tamil brahmin in a matrimoial site and keeping quiet about his swiss wife.Only at the fag end of breakfast , he let it slip that his wife is

swiss.very dicey.

My only consolation was he paid for the breakfast.mangalore bonda and coffee ,my favourites in woodlands.lol

 

[renuka]

Smt. Renuka ji,

I will value your advice as coming from an experienced person. But from some instances which I have seen, the widower marrying a new bride and that new bride seeing this girl child from day 1 as a competitor to her in sharing that man's love, affection, money, time, etc., will be a great harm to that child because the second wife will start the very ancient "war" against that child, popularly called சித்தம்மை கொடுமை (cittammai koṭumai = cruelty by father's second wife).

In any case, the best option for the man (37 years already) is to forego his own pleasures and bring up the child but he should also be aware that his daughter need not realize the great sacrifice he has made for her and may leave him to the mercy of some old age home towards the end of his life (I have seen such a case.). A really tragic situation (catch 22?) either which way you think of it

dear Sangom ji,

But the man also has to think of his future..cos we can never really trust children too.

A child can not take the place of a spouse and eventually he is going to feel lonely.

In fact I wonder how many widowed women are able to stay without husbands..dont they get lonely that they lack the love of a spouse?

So as you said..its a difficult situation that is why I recommended the widower to get into the dating scene..bring his daughter along for some occasions like an outing...try to make his potential wife and daughter friends first.
The potential wife need not play "mother' so soon.

I have a friend here who is a divorcee ..he brings his kids along for holidays along with his girlfriends kids and making everyone get along before considering marriage.

My friend seems fine with his girlfriend kids but she does not seem too fond of his kids..so he has not brought up marriage yet.

So its always better to test the waters before jumping into marriage.

For a second time around person..he should be knowing how to control the reigns by now.

 

[krish44]

dear Sangom ji,

But the man also has to think of his future..cos we can never really trust children too.

A child can not take the place of a spouse and eventually he is going to feel lonely.

In fact I wonder how many widowed women are able to stay without husbands..dont they get lonely that they lack the love of a spouse?

So as you said..its a difficult situation that is why I recommended the widower to get into the dating scene..bring his daughter along for some occasions like an outing...try to make his potential wife and daughter friends first.
The potential wife need not play "mother' so soon.

I have a friend here who is a divorcee ..he brings his kids along for holidays along with his girlfriends kids and making everyone get along before considering marriage.

My friend seems fine with his girlfriend kids but she does not seem too fond of his kids..so he has not brought up marriage yet.

So its always better to test the waters before jumping into marriage.

For a second time around person..he should be knowing how to control the reigns by now.

You know something interesting.

One of the girls who was interested in getting into relationship with the boy made him give the phone to his daughter and she merrily chatted with the child.

she was prepared to accept the child fully and take up a job in delhi.

I spent an evening with her . Gem of a girl. Only she is stuck in her divorce case for next few months.

why does life has to be so complicated ?

Happily she took a selfie with me . Strange things can happen in life

 

[renuka]

You know something interesting.

One of the girls who was interested in getting into relationship with the boy made him give the phone to his daughter and she merrily chatted with the child.

she was prepared to accept the child fully and take up a job in delhi.

I spent an evening with her . Gem of a girl. Only she is stuck in her divorce case for next few months.

why does life has to be so complicated ?

Happily she took a selfie with me . Strange things can happen in life

This seems great..she wants to bond with the child first..

may be you should try to help her speed up her divorce process.

 

[krish44]

This seems great..she wants to bond with the child first..

may be you should try to help her speed up her divorce process.

She is scared.She feels if her husband comes to know of her alternate plans, he might use it to damage her divorce case.

So she is wary of involving third parties.

She told me she requires 4 months to complete the mandatory period of separation.

she wants mutual consent with no alimony. so let us see

 

[renuka]

She told me she requires 4 months to complete the mandatory period of separation.

Meanwhile she can just chat with the widower online..just be friends first and see if they are compatible..once her 4 months mandatory separation is over..she is a free bird once again.

 

[krish44]

Meanwhile she can just chat with the widower online..just be friends first and see if they are compatible..once her 4 months mandatory separation is over..she is a free bird once again.

I do not want her to throw herself at him.

I would like her to develop some self worth.

She is the victim of abuse.

I want my relation to take the initiative and not her.

She has already made the first move and indicated that she will accept the boys child and family. She is prepared to move to delhi.

She is good looking ,educated and capable of getting good matches

She is working for her Phd in addition to working in a decent job.

After she comes out of her personal muddle, I will find her somebody or other from my family circle [ I have a large army of young relatives] if not this boy

 

[renuka]

I do not want her to throw herself at him.

I would like her to develop some self worth.

She is the victim of abuse.

I want my relation to take the initiative and not her.

She is educated,talented and capable of lot .

She is working for her Phd in addition to working in a decent job.

After she comes out of her personal muddle, I will find her somebody or other from my family circle [ I have a large army of young relatives.lol

I like her determination to move on in life and remarry and not withdraw from the idea of marriage.

Yes..it should be your relative making the move but since they had already spoken on the phone before..so things might just work out.

Alternately you give your relative some tips on how to woo a woman and start the ball rolling with this girl.

 

[krish44]

I like her determination to move on in life and remarry and not withdraw from the idea of marriage.

Yes..it should be your relative making the move but since they had already spoken on the phone before..so things might just work out.

Alternately you give your relative some tips on how to woo a woman and start the ball rolling with this girl.

My relative has a hang up about a dream girl from US wanting to make a career in music in india.

when he gets kicked by her [very likely as dreams always have a way of turning into nightmares.lol] he will see reason.

so keeping cool until it happens.