The Quandary of Tamil Brahmin Bride Shortages!

[prasad1]

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Prasad

That's the beauty of Krishna's character. He can be different things to different people. To be a protector you need to be the best of all the worlds. Krishna's pranks came out of a pure heart. The same Krishna giving Gita upadesh shows the master of pragmatics at work.

He is complete and hence un circumscribed capabilities. So you may look at him in any way. There is always something to learn if you are open and perceptive.

You live in mythology, others live in reality.
The op is pointing out that 70 years olds with 150 years old ideas are failing the community.

 

[sravna]

You live in mythology, others live in reality.
The op is pointing out that 70 years olds with 150 years old ideas are failing the community.

We make our reality. If mythology can help us shape the right ideals why not employ them. Ideas get better with the test of time. Modern ideas have to pass that test. If time tested ideas apparently fail we are just not being true to its spirit.

 

[sravna]

It is important not to get carried away by the idea of modernity. It makes sense with respect to technology and fashion. They don't survive time. But society's ideals on the contrary need to weather time and come out successfully. The longer it is practiced the better is the testimony for its value.

So it is necessary to have the right perspective in this modernity versus tradition debate.

 

[prasad1]

We make our reality. If mythology can help us shape the right ideals why not employ them. Ideas get better with the test of time. Modern ideas have to pass that test. If time tested ideas apparently fail we are just not being true to its spirit.

Your own example if a person marries 1008 wives (whatever the reason), will you advise your daughter to marry him?
It sounds great in mythology but in reality, it is unworkable. That is the reason our ancient culture is disappearing among young people. Then again you have shown in your post that you do not understand reality nor do you care about the younger generation's aspirations.
You live in your world, and rest be dammed.
I am sorry we do not agree at all.

 

[sravna]

Your own example if a person marries 1008 wives (whatever the reason), will you advise your daughter to marry him?
It sounds great in mythology but in reality, it is unworkable. That is the reason our ancient culture is disappearing among young people. Then again you have shown in your post that you do not understand reality nor do you care about the younger generation's aspirations.
You live in your world, and rest be dammed.
I am sorry we do not agree at all.

I would without hesitation ask my daughter to marry a person of Krishna's caliber irrespective of his 1008 wives I am sure she will be happy. That's what matters.

But personally I have Rama's attitude towards marriage. I don't want to pass judgement here as both Rama and Krishna are truly impeccable.

I understand reality and am really saddened that we are more into illusion of happiness than experiencing real happiness.

Younger generation needs guidance. But I am not advocating forcing of ideas either. As always balance works best.

 

[Vaagmi]

I quote “ you live in mythology and others live in reality”.
We loosely use words here. Krishna marrying a 1008 or more Gopis is mythology. Every mythological story has two aspects. One is just what is said and the other is what is implied. People who read the mythology just miss a lot of hidden underlying treasure. When Krishna married a thousand Gopis it was marriage of one male with a thousand females and also granting of Sayujya Samrajya to a thousand jeevatmas which have crossed the sAlokya,sArupya,sAmeepya stages and were yearning for sAyujyam.To understand the meaning of all these please read just not religion but also a little bit of philosophy too.
It is like calling the worship of Shivling as phallous worship. Indeed the Shivling looks like the phallous. It does not make the worship of Shivling phallous worship if you go a little deep and understand why Shivling is worshipped.
Sravana,
There is no use arguing with people who think with a borrowed language. If language conveys ideas then Shivling is just phallous.
I go. Bye.

 

[sravna]

I quote “ you live in mythology and others live in reality”.
We loosely use words here. Krishna marrying a 1008 or more Gopis is mythology. Every mythological story has two aspects. One is just what is said and the other is what is implied. People who read the mythology just miss a lot of hidden underlying treasure. When Krishna married a thousand Gopis it was marriage of one male with a thousand females and also granting of Sayujya Samrajya to a thousand jeevatmas which have crossed the sAlokya,sArupya,sAmeepya stages and were yearning for sAyujyam.To understand the meaning of all these please read just not religion but also a little bit of philosophy too.
It is like calling the worship of Shivling as phallous worship. Indeed the Shivling looks like the phallous. It does not make the worship of Shivling phallous worship if you go a little deep and understand why Shivling is worshipped.
Sravana,
There is no use arguing with people who think with a borrowed language. If language conveys ideas then Shivling is just phallous.
I go. Bye.

Well explained Sir

 

[Lotusinsanskrit]

Your own example if a person marries 1008 wives (whatever the reason), will you advise your daughter to marry him?
It sounds great in mythology but in reality, it is unworkable. That is the reason our ancient culture is disappearing among young people. Then again you have shown in your post that you do not understand reality nor do you care about the younger generation's aspirations.
You live in your world, and rest be dammed.
I am sorry we do not agree at all.

Lol
the op is difficult in getting single bride but talking about a person marries 1008 wives.

 

[renuka]

I quote “ you live in mythology and others live in reality”.
We loosely use words here. Krishna marrying a 1008 or more Gopis is mythology. Every mythological story has two aspects. One is just what is said and the other is what is implied. People who read the mythology just miss a lot of hidden underlying treasure. When Krishna married a thousand Gopis it was marriage of one male with a thousand females and also granting of Sayujya Samrajya to a thousand jeevatmas which have crossed the sAlokya,sArupya,sAmeepya stages and were yearning for sAyujyam.To understand the meaning of all these please read just not religion but also a little bit of philosophy too.
It is like calling the worship of Shivling as phallous worship. Indeed the Shivling looks like the phallous. It does not make the worship of Shivling phallous worship if you go a little deep and understand why Shivling is worshipped.
Sravana,
There is no use arguing with people who think with a borrowed language. If language conveys ideas then Shivling is just phallous.
I go. Bye.

Long long ago in a galaxy far far away I read that the 16008 wives are symbolic.

8 is the 8 petals of the Hridaya chakra.

1000 is the petals of the Sahasrara Chakra and each chakra has 16 kalas hence 16000.

So 16000 + 8 = 16008.

Krishna represents the Lord of the Chakras as He is also known as Yogeshvara.

So its the state of Sayujyam when Krishna " marries" the 16008.

Btw the Shiva linga doesnt really look lke any organ.
Its a formless form, representing both the Manifest and Unmanifest.

Lingam meaning Leeyate Gamyate Iti Lingam( That into which everything undergoes dissolution)

So finally whether its 16008 " wives" or the Shivalingam..both denote the state of Dissolution either in a technical sense or in the state of Divine Love where the Bhakta merges with her Lord.

I am using the word her Lord here because all of us are created from Prakirti which is feminine..all fetuses are feminine first including male fetuses..the male fetus only becomes male when testosterone is secreted a bit later in utero.

Only God is the Masculine principle and we are the Feminine principle hence the term wives of Krishna is used.



note** Hridaya chakra is different from the 12 petalled Anahata chakra..in most text Anahata is wrongly translated as the heart chakra..Anahata is the unstruck sound chakra.

 

[prasad1]

I would without hesitation ask my daughter to marry a person of Krishna's caliber irrespective of his 1008 wives I am sure she will be happy. That's what matters.

But personally I have Rama's attitude towards marriage. I don't want to pass judgement here as both Rama and Krishna are truly impeccable.

I understand reality and am really saddened that we are more into illusion of happiness than experiencing real happiness.

Younger generation needs guidance. But I am not advocating forcing of ideas either. As always balance works best.

My point was that ideal changes. What was ideal at some point in times changes over a period, then some iXXXt comes along to DEFEND their ideal without understanding the context (occasional visitor).
Vishvamitra abandon Menaka and Child Shakuntala, which would not be an ideal parent material. No modern girl will want a person like that.

There is no need to jump through hoops. My statement is supporting the OP to stay that TB Boys need to change, so that the modern educated, carrier oriented, ambitious girls will find them marriage material.

 

[Vaagmi]

My point was that ideal changes. What was ideal at some point in times changes over a period, then some iXXXt comes along to DEFEND their ideal without understanding the context (occasional visitor).
Vishvamitra abandon Menaka and Child Shakuntala, which would not be an ideal parent material. No modern girl will want a person like that.

There is no need to jump through hoops. My statement is supporting the OP to stay that TB Boys need to change, so that the modern educated, carrier oriented, ambitious girls will find them marriage material.

I believe one of the qualities that would go to make a marriage material is say boldly whatever one wants to say. But indeed there are people with the name of a man but with guts at zero level. They make easily disownable abuses hiding it in junk like ixxxt. I wish they try to get some courage at least by borrowing it from their women folk. Poor chaps. God bless.

 

[sravna]

My point was that ideal changes. What was ideal at some point in times changes over a period, then some iXXXt comes along to DEFEND their ideal without understanding the context (occasional visitor).
Vishvamitra abandon Menaka and Child Shakuntala, which would not be an ideal parent material. No modern girl will want a person like that.

There is no need to jump through hoops. My statement is supporting the OP to stay that TB Boys need to change, so that the modern educated, carrier oriented, ambitious girls will find them marriage material.

Prasad,

The ideals that are espoused in our scriptures are universal and timeless. You can practice them at any time or place. Controlling ones emotions, respecting others and good self esteem etc are what are taught. They will stand you in good stead any time, any where. I would proudly defend them.

 

[sravna]

I have been very scathing in my words too. But I think they are appropriate reactions for gross misdeeds. If your defences are good it will protect self. But when the adharmic acts are pervasive and constant it goes beyond protection of self and the battle has to be fought.

 

[Mani_Chennai]

I believe one of the qualities that would go to make a marriage material is say boldly whatever one wants to say. But indeed there are people with the name of a man but with guts at zero level. They make easily disownable abuses hiding it in junk like ixxxt. I wish they try to get some courage at least by borrowing it from their women folk. Poor chaps. God bless.

It is claimed that about 4.5% people in the world are Narcissists. Thus, "with name of man" know how to hide their identity and no parents with daughters (includes them) with narcissist tendency are identified before marriage by visiting with a Psychiatrist( I am not their agent or am a Psychiatrist). Unhappy marriages are the result of incompatible narcissist with a simple minded partner. Indians (for that matter any nationality) will not change until we first identify the personality using sleuths and then proceed. But who has time? Bad mother-in-law/daughter-in-law syndrome should be first resolved, otherwise being unmarried is bliss. About 45% (in the West) do not want to marry or have children because without detailed analysis ( almost impossible ) you spent rest of the life like a caged tiger. This is true of not only so called Brahmans but also others in India. With economic freedom and some real education, women are now understanding that finding a compatible partner takes a long time, patience and some luck.

 

[sravna]

I think the problem is both the bride and the groom are expecting perfection from the other which invariably leads to disappointments. The Americans especially have found a way out by understanding humans as one who invariably have a number of weaknesses and have set to live accordingly.

I do not want that solution either. People in theory are indeed perfect and we need to bring out atleast some of it. I believe that's a better way out and can lead to helping to preserve the institution of marriage and other relationships in general.

 

[Vansan]

A very interesting subject for discussions. Good analysis by Praveen and others .
My two cents on this subject : The boys and girls are more knowledgeable and intelligent now than before and they are very clear as to what they want in their life. At the same time, the parents think that they are still the same kids and try to advice / influence them in all their action... Their actions are from their experience and expectations and they strongly believe that it is in the best interest of their children. But times have changed and the boys and girls want to live independently and make their own decisions. They have the financial means and see the world evolving and be a part of the future and make their own destiny.

At the same time, the way they have been brought up in a close knit family with its own set of values and do's and don'ts , pull them back from going all out in search of their own future. So we see both Ambi and Remo ( to use Praveen's analogy ) in every boy and girl. Ambi at home to their parents and Remo outside to their friends. Nothing wrong, because they are caught in a dilemma and still have love and respect for their parents and do not want to hurt their feelings...

As far as marriage is concerned, the parents' expectations are different than the boys & girls. Parents want a person with Ambi's character , well educated and settled and with a good family background . The boys and girls want a person with Remo's character ( attractive, outgoing, jovial, loving, enjoying life ) and well educated, employed with good salary and with good habits.
In both cases, it seems the preference is for someone from abroad (preferably USA).., as there is a belief that life will be better abroad than in India . ( sometimes yes and sometimes no...I may be wrong ) . But the notable difference is that boys & girls who prefer a Remo character within India will look for a Ambi character abroad...( ?? )
By the by, there are two types of TBs (boys & girls) in US / Canada. TBs who went there recently as students or for employment and settled there and the other category is TBs who are born and brought up there ... There is a huge difference between these categories - in the way they think, behave and act... The boys and girls who are born and brought up there, know exactly what they want and make their own decision. They are respectful to their parents but at the same time, say NO if they don't agree with them. These boys and girls ( and sometimes their parents too ) look for a boy and girl with a similar background - born and brought up in US / Canada, as they feel that their wavelengths ( communication, interests, life style ) will match each other...

Going back to the original topic, finding a suitable match for TB is a huge exercise. It is very difficult to have a 100 % match as per one's check list, and adjustments have to be made as needed. The ultimate goal is for the boy and girl to understand each other well and live happily .

 

[asadu]

My only comment on the above subject is, we the Tamil Brahmins will never ever correct ourselves and destined to perish. I only pray god that this happens as early as possible.

 

[prasad1]

My only comment on the above subject is, we the Tamil Brahmins will never ever correct ourselves and destined to perish. I only pray god that this happens as early as possible.

You must have some reason for this despondency and dire prediction, can you elaborate?

 

[Taurus]

Ha ha ha this may be true. But what to do, the society is making them to be like that right from their collegehood by adjusting with so many hardships of not getting seats of their choice/interest and continue in the ride of searching jobs and getting stress in the corporate world.

So for girls the remo type will be only from other caste/religion as they get everything of their choice/interest while TB will look like Ambi only.

nice analysis, bro

 

[Lotusinsanskrit]

nice analysis, bro

Thank you

 

[tbs]

You must have some reason for this despondency and dire prediction, can you elaborate?

A very interesting subject for discussions. Good analysis by Praveen and others .
My two cents on this subject : The boys and girls are more knowledgeable and intelligent now than before and they are very clear as to what they want in their life. At the same time, the parents think that they are still the same kids and try to advice / influence them in all their action... Their actions are from their experience and expectations and they strongly believe that it is in the best interest of their children. But times have changed and the boys and girls want to live independently and make their own decisions. They have the financial means and see the world evolving and be a part of the future and make their own destiny.

At the same time, the way they have been brought up in a close knit family with its own set of values and do's and don'ts , pull them back from going all out in search of their own future. So we see both Ambi and Remo ( to use Praveen's analogy ) in every boy and girl. Ambi at home to their parents and Remo outside to their friends. Nothing wrong, because they are caught in a dilemma and still have love and respect for their parents and do not want to hurt their feelings...

As far as marriage is concerned, the parents' expectations are different than the boys & girls. Parents want a person with Ambi's character , well educated and settled and with a good family background . The boys and girls want a person with Remo's character ( attractive, outgoing, jovial, loving, enjoying life ) and well educated, employed with good salary and with good habits.
In both cases, it seems the preference is for someone from abroad (preferably USA).., as there is a belief that life will be better abroad than in India . ( sometimes yes and sometimes no...I may be wrong ) . But the notable difference is that boys & girls who prefer a Remo character within India will look for a Ambi character abroad...( ?? )
By the by, there are two types of TBs (boys & girls) in US / Canada. TBs who went there recently as students or for employment and settled there and the other category is TBs who are born and brought up there ... There is a huge difference between these categories - in the way they think, behave and act... The boys and girls who are born and brought up there, know exactly what they want and make their own decision. They are respectful to their parents but at the same time, say NO if they don't agree with them. These boys and girls ( and sometimes their parents too ) look for a boy and girl with a similar background - born and brought up in US / Canada, as they feel that their wavelengths ( communication, interests, life style ) will match each other...

Going back to the original topic, finding a suitable match for TB is a huge exercise. It is very difficult to have a 100 % match as per one's check list, and adjustments have to be made as needed. The ultimate goal is for the boy and girl to understand each other well and live happily .

Hi

just info.....im born in vedic TB family in india.....i moved to USA/CANDA some 25 yrs back...my both children

married to white americans.....my son in law is white boy and my daughter in law is white gal.....so now a

days...marriage more individual choice than a parental choice....we have to accept the reality...other wise

we will be in dream world.. my grand daughter is looklike american girl...

 

[renuka]

Hi

just info.....im born in vedic TB family in india.....i moved to USA/CANDA some 25 yrs back...my both children

married to white americans.....my son in law is white boy and my daughter in law is white gal.....so now a

days...marriage more individual choice than a parental choice....we have to accept the reality...other wise

we will be in dream world.. my grand daughter is looklike american girl...

These days as long as children marry the opposite gender, i would be happy.

Lots of same sex marriages these days.

 

[sravna]

These days as long as children marry the opposite gender, i would be happy.

Lots of same sex marriages these days.

These are modern ideas which traditionalists are not able to keep pace with. God help them.

 

[XLR8R]

By the by, there are two types of TBs (boys & girls) in US / Canada. TBs who went there recently as students or for employment and settled there and the other category is TBs who are born and brought up there ... There is a huge difference between these categories - in the way they think, behave and act... The boys and girls who are born and brought up there, know exactly what they want and make their own decision. They are respectful to their parents but at the same time, say NO if they don't agree with them. These boys and girls ( and sometimes their parents too ) look for a boy and girl with a similar background - born and brought up in US / Canada, as they feel that their wavelengths ( communication, interests, life style ) will match each other...

There is a third category, the ones who are permanently settled, born and brought up in North/East/North East India (like me) without any familial links to South India. These are the people who are stuck, because their older generations still remember when they were migrating and had a proper south Indian cultural upbringing, but the newer generations are somewhere in between a proper North Indian and a proper South Indian.

This generation neither looks like, nor behaves like, nor talks like Ambi or Remo, they are more likely to be Gangadhar or Shaktimaan. There is a huge crisis, because most of their friends, influences and priests are in fact North Indian and their connect to South India is limited to their parents/families' views and stories. Most of them can still speak Tamil/Malayalam/Telugu and are "pucca" Brahmins, but their culture is an extreme mishmash of North Indian with South Indian.

The entire TB community faces a problem due to this third category because all matrimony services still place them in the same bucket as the traditional TBs of Maharashtra and South India. This means that the frequencies often do not match and creates a bad taste in the young minds about marriage in general due to a negative experience communicating with individuals.

The differences are, as of today, so vast, that I strongly feel bifurcating the TB community is required in 2023 so that young people can find and converse with like-minded potential matches/peers/friends etc.

 

[Lotusinsanskrit]

There is a third category, the ones who are permanently settled, born and brought up in North/East/North East India (like me) without any familial links to South India. These are the people who are stuck, because their older generations still remember when they were migrating and had a proper south Indian cultural upbringing, but the newer generations are somewhere in between a proper North Indian and a proper South Indian.

This generation neither looks like, nor behaves like, nor talks like Ambi or Remo, they are more likely to be Gangadhar or Shaktimaan. There is a huge crisis, because most of their friends, influences and priests are in fact North Indian and their connect to South India is limited to their parents/families' views and stories. Most of them can still speak Tamil/Malayalam/Telugu and are "pucca" Brahmins, but their culture is an extreme mishmash of North Indian with South Indian.

The entire TB community faces a problem due to this third category because all matrimony services still place them in the same bucket as the traditional TBs of Maharashtra and South India. This means that the frequencies often do not match and creates a bad taste in the young minds about marriage in general due to a negative experience communicating with individuals.

The differences are, as of today, so vast, that I strongly feel bifurcating the TB community is required in 2023 so that young people can find and converse with like-minded potential matches/peers/friends etc.

True. TB girls prefer BG of boys moved abroad and these TB boys are more struggled to get brides.