Distortions in Indian History

[happyhindu]

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You are likely to end up in gallows for indulging in 'jathi perai solli thittarathukku"

Tone down your anti brahmin bursts or else face the music when some brahmin takes you to court.

Your silly ridiculous threats cut no ice. Do what you want.

Mayawati, UP chief minister and the sole liberator of dalits has opined that brahmins and dalits are the most exploited communities and must work together for their collective betterment.

Cool. You can shift to UP to make a better life then. All the best.

 

[sarang]

India became from a surplus to a deficit and poor country during the british regime because of the land policies - ryotwari and jamindari systems. Even the famines were the result of food diverted to UK instead of local distribution.

Impoverishment of the farmers by the ryotwari system:

The ryotwari system, instituted in some parts of British India, was one of the two main systems used to collect revenues from the cultivators of agricultural land. These revenues included undifferentiated land taxes and rents, which were collected simultaneously. Under the Ryotwari system of land revenue settlement, every registered landowner were called proprietor. These proprietors were responsible for the direct payment of the land revenue to the state. The Proprietor had the right to sub let his land holdings, or to transfer, mortgage or to sell it. A proprietor holds the land till the government wanted him to be the Proprietor. In case if the Proprietor failed to pay the state demand of the land revenue, he was evicted from the office.

. . .yet it caused oppression and agricultural distress. The peasantry was shattered and subjected to utter poverty. Hence they became the subjects of the chetty or the moneylenders to pay off the land revenue to the state. Thus the Ryotwari system of land revenue gave rise to a group of moneylenders, who were no less the oppressors. The machinery of collection of the land revenue or the return s of the moneylenders was too oppressive.

Thus the Ryotwari system of land revenue proved extremely disastrous. The excessive state demand with the new judicial and administrative set up turned Indian rural economy upside down.

Ryotwari System

 

[happyhindu]

This is true if people can believe the cock and bull story that 3% of the population decided the fate of the rest 97%. May be 1 in a billion is so credulous to believe this kind of a story and come and tell that here.

People are not so dumb to be fooled with the 3% story. Go look up kshatropeta brahman armies and various historical dynasties.

That too in a country where there are enough stories about kings drowning brahmins tied to stone pillars in sea and kings gorging out the eyes of brahmins for refusing to obey them etc.

Saivite Brahmins (that is, Chola kings) did that to Vaishavites. Its a Saivite versus Vaishnavite fight. All between Brahmins themselves.

Why not respect character values and person for what he is? Why not put up such men as candidates in elections? Why do they have to be belonging to the majority caste (not brahmin any way) in that constituency?

Because nobody want brahmins in politics, plain and simple. They have politicized hindu religion enough.

Yes if the dwijas speak about castes they will be put behind bars whereas majority castes can say and do any thing (this includes raping tribal women as happened in Vachathi, roasting alive men women and children as happened in Keelvenmony)and the law will not do anything to them for long( in some cases untill the culprits die a natural death). It is majority-ism that is ruling the country. Dwijas beware of what you speak and post here! This particular threat has been held out by the poster many times earlier in this forum.

What canard is this, when did i threaten anyone posting in this forum. Anyone who commits a crime, should be punished. But the laws themselves are a joke, with all the loopholes.

Yes, because India is the exclusive father's property of only the majority castes all dwijas (and dalits too) go and jump either into the Bay of Bengal or the Arabian sea. It will be good riddance for the majority castes.

Your reasoning capabilities are very good.

We will never say(even for a statement's sake) 'get rid of casteism' because it bites and hurts us badly. We will only say 'get rid of brahminism' to deflect/shift the focus from the real oppressor castes. Better wording it, we would even say 'get rid of brahmins' because our 'great great leader', the 'Socrates of Tamilnadu' had once said that. But decorum and Praveen prevent us from going that far.

Cheers.

Varna dharma was "invented" by brahmins. Brahmanism is the mother of casteism. Ofcourse 'brahmins' can never think of that. Say what you want about EVR, i don't care for him.

 

[suraju06]

Reference post #203:

People are not so dumb to be fooled with the 3% story. Go look up kshatropeta brahman armies and various historical dynasties.

I asked my nephew and his friends whethr they have heard of this Kshatropeta brahmins because they are history students. They blinked. The poster should realise that the so called kshatropeta is included in the 3%. Without those brahmins(if they are that) it would be a precise 2% only. So the argument still holds even if you add few more vyshyopeta and Sudropeta brahmins to the brahmin caste to dilute it.

Saivite Brahmins (that is, Chola kings) did that to Vaishavites. Its a Saivite versus Vaishnavite fight. All between Brahmins themselves

This is a new unique spin to the Cock and bull and kshatropeta story. I hear for the first time that Karikalan and Rajaraja/Rajendra/kulothunga cholan were brahmins. May be the poster has a carbon dated palm leaf manuscript in which the family history of cholas is written and preserved. And by the way, Appar was not a vaishnavite. The poster has to refresh her memories.

Why not respect character values and person for what he is? Why not put up such men as candidates in elections? Why do they have to be belonging to the majority caste (not brahmin any way) in that constituency?

Because nobody want brahmins in politics, plain and simple. They have politicized hindu religion enough.

Brahmins have politicised every thing and majority middle castes are all angels. Brahmins are not wanted in politics because it will become clean if they come . In clean politics casteist pigs can not breed.

What canard is this, when did i threaten anyone posting in this forum. Anyone who commits a crime, should be punished. But the laws themselves are a joke, with all the loopholes

This is not a canard. This is a truth. If demanded I can give the exact post no. and thread here."Anyone who commits a crime, should be punished. But the laws themselves are a joke, with all the loopholes". It is a joke scripted by majority middle castes and the loop-holes are convenient escape latches created by the majority castes.

Your reasoning capabilities are very good.

I expected this. Thank you.

Varna dharma was "invented" by brahmins. Brahmanism is the mother of casteism. Ofcourse 'brahmins' can never think of that. Say what you want about EVR, i don't care for him.

Castes were invented by the Hindu Society of that time in the distant past. There is nothing called brahminism. It is just casteism. Brahminism is an invention by the middle castes as an opiate to feed and instigate the majority against the minority in the society. Of course people who are sold/hooked on 'brahminism opiate' can never kick it.

Cheers.

 

[happyhindu]

Reference post #203:



I asked my nephew and his friends whethr they have heard of this Kshatropeta brahmins because they are history students. They blinked. The poster should realise that the so called kshatropeta is included in the 3%. Without those brahmins(if they are that) it would be a precise 2% only. So the argument still holds even if you add few more vyshyopeta and Sudropeta brahmins to the brahmin caste to dilute it.

Nice reasoning, eh? Given a choice you wud create dalitopeta brahmins and claim present-day brahmins are as innocent as newborn babies.

Your history student nephew and his friends are obviously not reading ancient history. Tell them to look up works of Hemchandra Raychaudhri and Priyatosh Banerjee.

This is a new unique spin to the Cock and bull and kshatropeta story. I hear for the first time that Karikalan and Rajaraja/Rajendra/kulothunga cholan were brahmins. May be the poster has a carbon dated palm leaf manuscript in which the family history of cholas is written and preserved. And by the way, Appar was not a vaishnavite. The poster has to refresh her memories.

LOL, nice reasoning again. Go look up aarakshan thread, on the cholas. When did i ever say Appar was vaishnavite?

Brahmins have politicised every thing and majority middle castes are all angels. Brahmins are not wanted in politics because it will become clean if they come . In clean politics casteist pigs can not breed.

Brahmins in politics already tried hard to bring hindutva. Everyone knows what they try to do through a political platform. Everyone knows how "clean" brahmins in BJP and Congress are.

This is not a canard. This is a truth. If demanded I can give the exact post no. and thread here.

Yes, do that, then speak.

"Anyone who commits a crime, should be punished. But the laws themselves are a joke, with all the loopholes". It is a joke scripted by majority middle castes and the loop-holes are convenient escape latches created by the majority castes.

And i suppose laws scripted by brahmins in dharmashastras are sooo good.

Castes were invented by the Hindu Society of that time in the distant past. There is nothing called brahminism. It is just casteism. Brahminism is an invention by the middle castes as an opiate to feed and instigate the majority against the minority in the society. Of course people who are sold/hooked on 'brahminism opiate' can never kick it.

Cheers.

Repetition. Claim what you want. You cannot get on without evidence, if not from historical sources, atleast something even from puranas will do.

 

[suraju06]

Reference post #205:

Nice reasoning, eh? Given a choice you wud create dalitopeta brahmins and claim present-day brahmins are as innocent as newborn babies.
Your history student nephew and his friends are obviously not reading ancient history. Tell them to look up works of Hemchandra Raychaudhri and Priyatosh Banerjee.
LOL, nice reasoning again. Go look up aarakshan thread, on the cholas. When did i ever say Appar was vaishnavite?
Brahmins in politics already tried hard to bring hindutva. Everyone knows what they try to do through a political platform. Everyone knows how "clean" brahmins in BJP and Congress are.
And i suppose laws scripted by brahmins in dharmashastras are sooo good.
Claim what you want. You cannot get on without evidence, if not from historical sources, atleast something even from puranas will do.

All lies repeated for an nth time.

 

[happyhindu]

Reference post #205:



All lies repeated for an nth time.

I suppose you want people to beleive your lies, and hence you claim that others are lying. Anyways, this is what can be expected from you.

 

[Yamaka]

Yamaka's post #190:

What you have quoted from my post #186 was a reply to Nara's post 184 reproduced below:


Now about your post: You have said "You unleashed your anti-American venom for my statement"

If statement of facts of history become venom it only reflects the state of mind of the person who makes that charge. Yamaka, you have strong prejudices about America, your life there, your so called achievements and your pet theme of Atheism. So it is a strong wall which can not be penetrated and nothing on the other side will be visible to you either. On and off I also notice a strange thing happening to you-I am talking about your turning a psychiatrist analysing the state of mind of people in this forum. Your comments like "pure vengeance out of simple jealousy" etc show only that. What do you know about me, my life, and my successes or otherwise to come to the conclusion that I have envy. And what is there in you for me to envy? What do you have that I do not have? How did you come to the conclusion? I know you won't be able to answer these questions.Like a child playing with dolls tells its playmate " you dirtied my doll so I dirty your doll", with your bait you are trying to draw me into a spat of mutual recrimination which I am refusing to bite. Go and try it with some one else. I have seen enough of life, world and people to be beyond all that. Come on, become a grown up my dear friend. It will do a lot of good to you.

Cheers.

Dearest Raju:

1. You have been vomiting venom on the West and in particular the US in many of your posts many times. Your understanding of world history is terribly distorted.

Your jaundiced view of the US is horrendous. However, you love to "White Wash" or rewrite or run away from the known Indian History.

2. I have lived in India till 1979, and then in the US for the past 32 years. I have seen both places, unlike you! (I assume you have not lived in the US or any place in the West?/!!)

3. Atheism is not my pet Theory. That's the FACT, if you care for it. All humans are born Atheists. Some are force-fed the artificial Theism! A fact.

4. I don't need to know anything about you, except what you write here.

5. Your boyish ranting "you dirtied my doll, so I dirtied yours" is hilarious!

I stand by my observation that envy and jealousy ooze out in all your anti-West or anti-American rhetoric you show in your writings!

Take good care of your emotions!

Love

Y

note:- after reviewing this i believe this post does not resemble a personal attack/rant, rather it is more of a reply. hence i am leaving it as is. If someone does think this is a personal attack, plz report with a valid explanation.

 

[Nara]

... I hear for the first time that Karikalan and Rajaraja/Rajendra/kulothunga cholan were brahmins..

According to the ARaurappadi Guru Parampara Prabavam, the Chozan, aka kirimikanda chozan, was following the advise of Nalooraan, a brahmin Shaivite. In his final days, Koorathazhavan is supposed to have wished the same destiny for Nalooran as his own. This is taken to mean Koorathazvan wished the same Sri Vaikuntam for Nalooran as he was destined for. But, it is not clear why this could not mean he wished Nalooran to lose his eyes as well.

Anyway, I think Happy is correct with her observation.

Cheers!

 

[subbudu1]

I have been reading some of the posts especially a few of Happy Hindu. I would like to share some experience with you about brahmins of different parts of India, because I have indeed not only travelled across India, I have lived in all four co-ordinates north-east-west-south. This experience of brahmins will help us explain how they play a role in India. Do they really stand up for the cause of good governance and honesty and so on?


1, Iyengars of TamilNadu- By and large there are lot of extremes in the community.Some extremely good and honest, the likes of Raja Gopalachari. When we quote that name we look at some one dignified, calm, person, a well organized person, clean and neat, a true patriot, a religious person, yet broadminded, and not a fundamentalist. He stood for honesty and we must salute the likes of him. We have some kind of hindutva breeds as well the likes of Govindacharya. Then there are more cloistered and orthodox Iyengars. Some of them stand for honesty and some have been outight dishonest with their colleagues as well as with the management. bribing taking, I know specific examples. In other words scanning across, it is not predictable who is honest and who is dishonest until we move with them.So will they stand up for honesty if they are in power. No, as you will end up getting honest and dishonest leaders from both.

2. Iyers - Iyers by their own texts are supposed to be upholding the smritis. There is no ambiguity here. The most orthodox Iyer will even defend untouchability if he very much believes in smrithis. However the good part is today for last two generations, no Iyer fully believes anything. Not his Guru, not his smrithi, not his customs not his rituals and so on. The likes who fully believe it, may be holding a paramacharya photo, travelling with a kudumi and jholna pai, and like a person who does not know how to survive, is at receiving end everywhere. He may be attached to the Kanchi Muttam, and living in modest circumstances while the rest of coterie around him may be making money in the name of vaidikam and shastram. Do the Iyers stand for honesty. They like to believe so. But when it comes to trying situations there are seldom few who can come out like Gandalf the white. The average Iyer is your simple man, reasonably honest, but he is not your most orthodox Iyer. The most orthodox either do not know how to survive or be practical , or the other orthodox play games both against others and their own traditions and survive.So again it is difficult to predict who will be honest and who will not unless you move with them.

Telugu and Kannada brahmins- On a whole their social interaction is very good but there is no guarantee for their honesty either. Naramasimha Rao is a case. I do not think he was casteist but he was not honest even though a good administrator. So there is no guarantee that their rule will be honest.

Malayali Brahmins- People like Sangom have a deeper insight. But I think on the whole their Malayali identity is far more important to them than uniting with other brahmins. The most respected namboodiris will be considered the worst brahmins here, because they were revolutionary against tradition. Take the case of EMS. Are there corrupt and two-timing malayali brahmins. The people of Kerala and the namboodiris themselves will point out the two timers among them. The whole episode of smartha vicharam and the lunatic casteism and discrimination of kerala, recorded since colonial times is a positive indication of what happens when these folks are in power or controlling the power.

Orissa Brahmins - By and large they are much simpler than the brahmins of other states. That is largely because by and large people of Orissa are simple. However there are a lot of politics that come into play. Brahmins are clear about their identity inspite of only mild differences in their food habits with the rest of the state. I am surprised if just by wearing thread, somebody can feel so better. The pandas of Puri are a good example of rampant corruption in the brahminical ranks. In a recent cyclone in Orissa, there was a report in BBC, that brahmins were unwilling to lend a helping hand in cleaning up the mess and corpses destroyed during the unbearable cyclone. Would they make perfect adminstrators? The Shankaracharya of Puri made some statement that Dalits can have their own temples and manage that for which there would be training. He was in favor of sati, and women not chanting the Vedas. I would assume that the Puri acharya is not native to Orissa, but the most conservative of Orissa brahmins could very well echo these sentiments.

I am continuing this in a new post so it becomes easier.

 

[subbudu1]

Bengali Brahmins- History records the way Kulin System controlled the society with the brahmins at the top , getting the highest privilege. In later times the Kulin system degenerated into a mess. Casteism and exploitation was rampant. However because of Islamic and European conquests, there was always a pressure on the caste for the last 800 years. When we therefore speak of Bengali brahmins, there are only some who think they are different from the rest of the society. All this apart, the middle class in Bengal, the brahmins and others including are an intellectual class. Like any intellectual class, they have their vices, gambling, drinking, keeps , affairs and so on. There is a conservative section among them as well. But the traits and religiosity is uniformly distributed across the middle class. You cannot pinpoint someone's behavior and stereotype it based on caste today. True atleast for middle class. Neither do the Bengalis themselves accept such stereotypes. An attack on a Bengali Brahmin is considered an attack on a Bengali and Vice versa. Yes there is a more conservative bengali brahmin section who are into the Pujas. On one hand saligrama puja may be performed on the other hand, in the same house mutton may be cooked. If we look into this until the previous generation we could have said that the Bengali brahmins followed lot many more religious rules than the others, mostly out of interest. However these did not make them more honest than the rest of the society. Buddhadeb created a chaotic rule, and alienated his subjects was a brahmin of high prestige. He may have personally not been dishonest but he allowed dishonesty and massacre of people. While this may be spoken as representing the administrative acumen of an individual. There is no way we can look at a Bengali Brahmin and be assured of his honesty. This the Bengali brahmin himself will acknowledge.

The Brahmins of the centre- The madhya pradesh and UP- There is rampant casteism especially in UP. There are some brahmin UP Politicians who have atleast a 100 criminal charges against them, some including murder charges. The average UP brahmin is casteist, and pro-North. There have been a lot of good brahmins, people who have gone out of the way to uplift caste. The simple middle class brahmin out there enjoys a lot of respect among the middle castes and his interaction with low castes comes especially when he is involved with land. Otherwise like any other society there are good and bad to pick , both in plenty and the examples I cite make it clear that Brahmin raj does not mean prosperity. ND Tiwari, we all know, he was a UP Brahmin. Lal Bahadur Shastri, a person from that region , known and respected by us all, was not a Brahmin. So there you see.

Rajasthan- The brahmins out here are like your average middle castes and carry the same middle caste values that you see anywhere. Some of them are quite dull and some are very bright. They are not the leaders in the society, and so they may not have been exposed to the vices of that position. The Rajputs are the dominant group here and financially the vaishyas. Educationally or in Business they are no where in control. This is one of the reasons there is greater respect for them here than in Tamil Nadu or UP. Sounds funny but this is reality. May be Suraju should change his mind and prefer the second rate situation where the brahmins are not laying the rules for the society and not administrators. May be this is what is good to make them humble and also get respect?
However a deep level of frustration has now built among them, and they want more stake in the society and trying to even obtain quotas. But a good number are in middle class I would assume.

Brahmins of Kashmir- They have been decimated in Kashmir, but we may need to understand why Islam became so popular in medieval times in Kashmir especially when it was a society dominated by Brahmins in numbers ,in influence and position. Part of it is because of fundamentalist Islam but to understand this we need to know the social situation then. I am not sure if there are unbiased records of those times. Rajatarangini of Kalhana was written by a brahmin. Regarding Administrative acumen, Yes they did have a good administrative acumen, they produced highly efficient people, some of whom were reputed for their good services to the country and renowned for their honesty. There was the corrupt section also among them. The anti-brahmin Nehru was also a brahmin. Nehru was a womanizer and that we know. That apart he was no great Prime Minister that we see today. So a big question mark on whether we really have made it that big inspite of having atleast two pure brahmins as Prime Minister. The third brahmin was Indira , we all know about corruption at that time.

Maharastra brahmins- They are simple and more social than tamil brahmins. But at home they can be quite casteist and look upon even the marathas as low castes. A relation of mine married into a marathi brahmin family many decades earlier, so in a way I am privy to the kind of conversation at their home..There are corrupt maharastrian brahmins as well as very honest people. We are again in no position to place them on a pedestal. The history of anti-brahminism in Maharashtra is clear about the politics of brahmins. How the peshwas did not allow the maratha ruling class to rise. The orthodox brahmin used to quote the smritis to preserve the caste in the british times. Frankly speaking the maharashtrian brahmins do not like the rise of dark-skinned tamilians who in their eyes are low. They are yet to prove their mettle or ability to rule efficiently and prove that they are great administrators which can keep the people under them happy.

This is my view. I have tried to personify the brahmins of the different regions. But here I make a distinction between the average person and the extremes. I have tried my best not to over-stereotype somebody and I might be wrong. But I can share this from visits and experiences. The intention is not brahmin bashing but to show that today there is no guarantee that brahmins at the top could lead India to success. There may be someone who can save India but it could be anyone from any caste, for all we know, or a mixed caste too.

 

[suraju06]

Nara's post #209:

According to the ARaurappadi Guru Parampara Prabavam, the Chozan, aka kirimikanda chozan, was following the advise of Nalooraan, a brahmin Shaivite. In his final days, Koorathazhavan is supposed to have wished the same destiny for Nalooran as his own. This is taken to mean Koorathazvan wished the same Sri Vaikuntam for Nalooran as he was destined for. But, it is not clear why this could not mean he wished Nalooran to lose his eyes as well.

"Saivite brahmins(that is, chola kings).........." are the exact words of the post which I have reacted to. My knowledge of English is only such that I interpreted these words as meaning the "Chola Kings who were saivite brahmins......... ". I have no means to understand the mind of the poster to know that she meant "saivite brahmins on whose instigation the chola king..........". Perhaps you have such a facility.

The aaroirappadi narration is well known. Kirumikanda chozhan[aka kulothungan] was instigated by Nalooran and appar's ordial was due to a king belonging to the jain faith.

Happy is correct with her observation.

Is she? If you think she is, it is fine. Let it be.

Cheers.

 

[suraju06]

Yamaka's post #208:

1. You have been vomiting venom on the West and in particular the US in many of your posts many times. Your understanding of world history is terribly distorted.

I as well as all human beings suffer nausea only when we come across a nauseating circumstance-like when we see, hear or smell something nauseating. I hope, with your immense amount of empirical knowledge(about which too you have bragged), you would surely understand what I mean. Yes, lest there be any misunderstanding-what you write-the frequent bragging about inane rewards, the pretense of knowledge about every thing under the sun including economics (the MBA stuff) is nauseating. I have stopped reading your posts. This is the last time you will see my answer to your post.

Your jaundiced view of the US is horrendous. However, you love to "White Wash" or rewrite or run away from the known Indian History.

cool, man cool. If it is your view and if you are so much agitated about a counter view, you need not read my posts. For your convenience Praveen has provided a "ignore" button. Just click it and forget me.

2. I have lived in India till 1979, and then in the US for the past 32 years. I have seen both places, unlike you! (I assume you have not lived in the US or any place in the West?/!!)

Your having lived in India and your living in US does not mean anything to me. The Madurai Thirumalai Naicker Mahal (you must be familiar with this) has many solid pillars which are witness to hundreds of years of history. Go and ask them who financed the building of the structure or how many people toiled to build them. You will get only a stony silence as answer. So it is of no use. I see this "unlike you" as a bait. I am not going to give you the list of countries I have visited or my period of stay there. I don't have to prove any thing to you. Be happy with your pet assumptions. Happiness is important in life. Your health will also improve.

3. Atheism is not my pet Theory. That's the FACT, if you care for it. All humans are born Atheists. Some are force-fed the artificial Theism! A fact.

Again your pet theory and it is nauseating. You are going to again complain that I have vomited something.

4. I don't need to know anything about you, except what you write here.

The context man, context. You need to know more about me if you have to make all those statements about me-like I have not seen any where outside India, that I am envious of you for your "great" achievements etc etc., I am sorry for you friend.

5. Your boyish ranting "you dirtied my doll, so I dirtied yours" is hilarious!
I stand by my observation that envy and jealousy ooze out in all your anti-West or anti-American rhetoric you show in your writings!
Take good care of your emotions!

"envy and jealousy ooze out in all your anti-West or anti-American rhetoric you show in your writings!" is more hilarious than that. LORL.

I love you Yamaka for you are a good entertainer-I wont use the term joker because I know I may get a s*#@ storm as reply directed this side.

My only request to you is, please try to grow up.

Cheers my friend and bye.

 

[suraju06]

Reference Subbudu's post #211:

Dear Sri Subbudu,

You have written quite a lot about the brahmins of various regions in India. I have this to ask you. Have you lived in all these regions in India for sufficiently long and have obtained first hand info about the brahmins there? Could you please answer this question. I will then give my views about the people about whom you have written.

 

[sarang]

More from dharampal on how the british made the farmers poor: Stated aim of the british administration was to transfer maximum revenue and produce to england.

Reading of dharampal's writings will change our perception now derived from colonial, and now their descendent - pseudo secular-communist historians.

"Dharampal found that for long periods in the late 18th and the 19th centuries, the tax on land in many areas exceeded the total agricultural production of very fertile land. This was particularly so in the areas of the Madras Presidency (comprising current Tamilnadu, districts of coastal Andhra, some districts of Karnataka and Malabar). The consequences of the policy were easy to predict: in the Madras Presidency, one third of the most fertile land went out of cultivation between the period 1800-1850. In fact, as early as 1804, the Governor of the Madras Presidency wrote to his masters (the President of the Board of Commissioners) in London:

"We have paid a great deal of attention to the revenue management in this country...the general tenor of my opinion is, that we have rode the country too hard, and the consequence is, that it is in a state of the most lamentable poverty. Great oppression is I fear exercised too generally in the collection of the Revenues.