Hinduism - Is not a religion, Way of Life. Whats it?

[happyhindu]

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Shri Nagesh Mahadevan Ji,

Not sure, but hope your intent is not proselytizing or converting.

Just mentioning: personally am not convinced about the gospel.

Regards.

 

[tvvaradan]

Hinduism

Sirs
Listen to this prayer from vedas
Asathoma sad gamaya Lead me from Non reality to Reality
Thamasorma jyothirgamaya Lead me from darkness to Light
Mruthyorma amrutham gamaya Lead me from Death to immortality

The beauty of vedas is it extends a helping and loving hand for all humanity and luckily I am in such a great Hindu religion .

Whatever be the arguments and discussions and debate the crux of the matter is HUMAN should strive to become HUMANE and then try to become DIVINE.

Actually the divinity is already in us , the upanishads proclaim. Only we are not aware of it.

All the spiritual practices shall be directed towards relizing our true nature that is divinity .
pl. listen to swami vivekananda

Each soul is potentially divine. The goal is to manifest this divine within by controlling nature external and internal. Do this either by work or worship or psychic control or philosophy. By one or more or all of these and be free. This is the whole of religion. Doctrines or dogmas or rituals or books are temples ar but secondary details.

Here again please note that the great swamy has not said that they are unnecessary aut said they are secondary.

We should go from known to less known and then to unknown

Satart with sandhya, go to Gayathri and then merge with OM.
Start with a rirual, go the manthra and then merge with the meaning of the manthra
OM shanthi shanthi hsanthihi

 

[nageshmahadevan]

Shri Nagesh Mahadevan Ji,

Not sure, but hope your intent is not proselytizing or converting.

Just mentioning: personally am not convinced about the gospel.

Regards.

Dear happyhindu,

Do I have to advise you as I did sapthajihva? Does quoting from scriptures which you think is not yours, be construed as proselytizing? Why do you always jump to conclusions? This is an inherent issue with members of the community.

What is 'Gospel'? It is a Greek word which means 'Good News'. Any good news is gospel. If Bagwadgita is good news to you, it is gospel to you.

I cannot explain more nor can I be more clear.

And please do not drag on this point in this thread any longer. Br PV Raman has started this thread with a noble motive. Let there be no digression.

If anyone desires to debate with me on the confusion called conversion, you may please do say in an entirely different forum but not in any of the threads in this forum. I wish to stick to the objectives of this forum.

Thanks.

Regards,
Nagesh

 

[happyhindu]

Dear NAgesh Mahadevan,

Dear happyhindu,

Do I have to advise you as I did sapthajihva? Does quoting from scriptures which you think is not yours, be construed as proselytizing? Why do you always jump to conclusions? This is an inherent issue with members of the community.

Was seeking a clarification. Am not sure why you felt i was jumping to a conclusion (??). Perhaps it is possible that you too might be jumping to a conclusion in thinking this way...

What is 'Gospel'? It is a Greek word which means 'Good News'. Any good news is gospel. If Bagwadgita is good news to you, it is gospel to you.

I cannot explain more nor can I be more clear.

And please do not drag on this point in this thread any longer. Br PV Raman has started this thread with a noble motive. Let there be no digression.

If anyone desires to debate with me on the confusion called conversion, you may please do say in an entirely different forum but not in any of the threads in this forum. I wish to stick to the objectives of this forum.

sounds familiar. but anyways, i agree, thanks.

Thanks.

Regards,
Nagesh

 

[sapthajihva]

Dear nagesh,

That's your subjective, narrow minded opinion. Please introspect. Answer your own conscience (not me), had you been born and raised in an orthodox christian or muslim family, would you still proclaim this?

If believing in the ultimate truth is a narrow minded approach, so be it. It is a result of our karmas that we are born in such cultures - I strongly believe in that. Being born in a culture which upholds the vedas, is in itself, in my opinion, a starting light which guides the self on the path to enlightenment. So it is not a question of catching on one's root alone, rather the maturity to choose the right path.

Please do not jump to conclusions, as is characteristic and typical of orthodox brahmins. Apostles never created isms. Men like you made isms out of what the Apostles preached. Come out of your shell gentleman.

Can you please elaborate what you meant by the above statement? Making a superficial statement out of your perception about my character is not the perfect logic to support an argument.

So tell me now - who coined the ism?

Why did you subscribe to it? Is it because the external forces are white skinned after all?

A confused statement altogether deviating from my statement.

This thread is about Hinduism and its edicts; in my opinion there is no necessity to bring in any other scriptural references.

Regards,

 

[pvraman]

Dear Mr Nagesh Ji,

Thanks for your comments and thanks for your Kural.

Lets not compare other religions. I understand that, here is the group who deeply support SD. So am I. My intention is to get some light with respect to the topic, and I need comments on that.

I am honestly putting my doubts and queries, it does not mean that any unknown person can start to advice me. I do not want personal Advice.

I want opinions only on the subject.


If One religion can win over other in a debate, there are many scholars, who would have done that and in this world, then only one religion would have remained. [the latest religion islam is 1500 years old approx). Like, there are good things in every religion, there are bad things also in every religion.

So weighing the things, we have chosen to remain as a follower of SD. Defending one's belief is not arrogance. Certainly, its our duty. As I said, without knowing Hindu scriptures, many people gets converted to other religion. Its not logical and acceptable. Because they are using their poverty and ignorance.

(for aggressive debates on religion (!), join Hinduism & Hindu groups in facebook)


I wish to mention one more thing. You have talked about orthodox brahmin nature and also said what would a orthodox christian would do.

Without any doubt Orthodox Muslim will support only kuran, if somebody dare to tell anything about, leave alone kuran, even his 'Namas', he certainly will not hesitate to kill. Similarly, my pastor friend believes Bible, if somebody tells any thing about jesus or bible, they will endup with lots of bible and lot of bit notices abusing our gods, he may bless us with his eyes closed, parisuththamana aavi.. No christian will tell, kuran is better, similarly no muslim will tell, yes Bible is better. :nod:. So lets get on with the subject in hand.

Sorry, for my language. I can not help it.

With Regards
PV

 

[pannvalan]

Dear Mr. Nagesh,

Please understand the mood of the members here. Do not attempt to impose your dogmas or what was taught to you somewhere else.

All the members of this forum are well-informed and we interact with each other, only to learn further. We are not in a dilemma or a confused state, as you might have perceived.

Please do not cross the limits in preaching something, which may be kept reserved for a different audience.

 

[nageshmahadevan]

Dear nagesh,



This thread is about Hinduism and its edicts; in my opinion there is no necessity to bring in any other scriptural references.

Regards,

Dear Sapthajihva,

For you SD is greatest because, YOU were born in SD. If you had been born in a Christian or Muslim family, either one of them would have been the greatest respectively. According to you, YOUR birth in SD makes SD great. YOU seem to be adding value to SD and not vice versa.

Regards,
Nagesh

 

[sapthajihva]

Dear nagesh,

Dear Sapthajihva,

For you SD is greatest because, YOU were born in SD. If you had been born in a Christian or Muslim family, either one of them would have been the greatest respectively. According to you, YOUR birth in SD makes SD great. YOU seem to be adding value to SD and not vice versa.

Regards,
Nagesh

Frankly this comment has no relevance to this topic; you are only dragging it on... anyway I think you have not understood the import of my previous post. Am just highlighting the relevant part:

If believing in the ultimate truth is a narrow minded approach, so be it. It is a result of our karmas that we are born in such cultures - I strongly believe in that. Being born in a culture which upholds the vedas, is in itself, in my opinion, a starting light which guides the self on the path to enlightenment. So it is not a question of catching on one's root alone, rather the maturity to choose the right path.

You can argue against this till kingdom come, but am not interested to pursue this, in this thread, any further.

Moreover, I think that such a debate is not necessary within the scope of the site itself.

Regards,

 

[tvvaradan]

Hinduism

Sirs,
please go through this link patiently. We can refresh our thoughts on our great religion.

http://www.kamakoti.org/hindudharma/part2/chap2.htm

 

[pvraman]

Dear tvvaradan Sir,

Thanks for the link.



"Brahmins were, are and will always be a “Prize Catch” for Christian evangelists. For them, converting even a single Brahmin is a great achievement. A converted Brahmin becomes a great asset, for with one Brahmin convert they would be able to easily convert a hundred non-Brahmins. Of late, Christian missionaries have started targeting the Brahmin community, and in the last four or five years, they have been able to achieve some gains.
"
Christian Sadhus and Sastris: shameless conversion games - Conversions | hindujagruti.org.

Is it not a matter of concern?

 

[tvvaradan]

hinduism

True. We should be vigilant.

 

[nageshmahadevan]

Dear PVRaman Ji,

It has become a trend and fashion for everyone to proclaim that their religion is not a religion but a way of life. It began with christians who started saying, 'christianity is not a religion but a way of life', notwithstanding the existence of numerous denominations who are clashing with each other. Now muslims also say, 'Islam is not a religion, but a way of life'. Hindus followed suit. Now every tom, dick and harry says his religion is a way of life.

As a Brahmin you need to realize that Bagwad Kripa is greater than dharma.

You had mentioned about evangelists converting brahmins. I fail to understand what one gains by converting others to his religion. At best it can increase the numbers. Why would anyone convert to another path, if he is strongly convinced about the path he has chosen to follow? Even if the whole world converts to another religion, or dogma or doctrine which is inimical to yours, if you are strongly convinced of your chosen path, you can remain single and win the world.

My best wishes to you.

Regards,
Nagesh

 

[pannvalan]

One of my Christian friends is working in a bank. When I met him recently, he told me that might leave his job soon. When I asked him why, he said, 'I am expecting a few crore rupees, from abroad, anytime'. Obviously, it is going to be an advance for attracting Hindus to Christianity.

Once his mission is over, he will get bigger reward in cash and in kind. Usually, it is proportionate to the number of Hindus converted to Christianity.

Because I know him from 1988, I did not say anything and came back.

 

[happyhindu]

There is a relative prosperity associated with being or converting to a Christian in India. That is undeniable.

 

[sadasivam.sridharan]

From historical events we have seen such sparodic attempts have been made by different religious groups to convert innocent people from Hinduism to their respective religions through threats,luring them with money and brainwashing them with the assurances that all their problems will vanish once they get converted to their relegion.Our religion has not only with stood these onslaughts but also continued to grow thanks to efforts of great Mahatmas like Adi Shankara,Shri Ramanujacharya and other noble souls.Our religion is Kalpa vriksham and this can never be weakened by any other religious groups however much they try,whatever method they to adopt for the purpose.All their efforts will only broaden the base and our religion will continue to grow from strength to strength.
S.Sridharan

 

[pannvalan]

Hinduism does not qualify to be called a separate religion because -

1. Unlike other religions of the world today, Hinduism was not founded by one
individual.

2. It does not have only one holy book; nor does it have one person's preachings or
instructions as the basis for it.

3. The time of birth of Hinduism could not be ascertained by anybody. By any
yardstick, it is more than 3500 years old, according to western researchers. Our
scholars say it is much older.

4. There are no rigid practices prescribed for Hindus in general, even though duties of
everyone have been properly codified.

5. Hinduism alone permits 'nihilism' (naasthikam) as a separate branch in itself.

6. Innumerable number of tenets, texts and codes are there to guide all to choose
their own way/path, to reach the almighty.

7. In spite of being subjected to repeated violent attacks during the last 1500 years,
no one could take away its force, spirit and character.

8. Despite being the oldest, Hinduism keeps on growing by nicely adapting to the
changing times.

9. In the field of philosophy and spiritualism, Hinduism is simply nonpareil.

10. Hinduism has ready answers for every one's queries. Never does it remain on the
defensive, by evading any questions or by giving vague answers.

 

[anandb]

Shri. Pann,

You said it, Sir. Unfortunately Hinduism is a much misunderstood religion thanks to the Hindus themselves who don't make deeper efforts to understand it and arrives to conclusions on a pre-determined mindset. When decades back, when India was averaging a growth rate of 2% P.A., it was called the Hindu rate of growth as if Hinduism was responsible in keeping India in poverty. This mindset is still prevalent as we can see. There are so many rich Hindus and there are Hindus who have made it big from the bottom of the society but none of this is highlighted. People still blame casteism for poverty while leaving out conveniently other factors like bureaucracy, corruption, wastage and inefficiency which are probably more responsible.

I like to argue on the basis of logic. Castesim was much prevalent 1000 years ago before the Mughals and the British. Even Westerners agree that India was once the richest nation in the earth during those times. It should be because you don't try to rule over a vast area of land if it is not wealthy already. It is quite a documented fact that the Mughals and later the British looted and pillaged India and carried away most of its wealth. Proof is in the fact that these are found in museums and private collections all over the world. My question is how come India was so wealthy when caste divisions were more pronounced than today? Today, the fact is India is becoming more prosperous but also the rich-poor divide is becoming wider. So what is causing it? Is there a guarantee that once India becomes a Christian or Muslim country, poverty will disappear? Then why is African countries which are either Muslim or Christian among the most poor nations in the world?

So let us stop blaming casteism for all the ills and start looking at what is basically wrong with us as humans beings. Even assuming the world population is going to become one very big happy family all from the same caste, there will still be poverty and hunger and I wonder what other scapegoat we will start looking out for that time?

What we Hindus need to do is run a counter propaganda and ask the Christians what they are doing to solve the problems in their own countries before blaming casteism and convert the Hindus to their fold.

 

[SuryaKasyapa]

Quote from msg 43"So let us stop blaming casteism for all the ills and start looking at what is basically wrong with us as humans beings. Even assuming the world population is going to become one very big happy family all from the same caste, there will still be poverty and hunger and I wonder what other scapegoat we will start looking out for that time?


Right words spoken.

 

[pvraman]

Dear Sirs,

Sorry for the delay in replying to your comments. I took some time to read the comments and think about it. Those were great comments. It really makes one Wonder about our present situation and our duties (Karmas). Its hard to think casually esp after the great replies posted by you.

I understand, the Varna's (which has a complex definition) became Castes (with a simple definition) because of Social recognition,compulsions due to the Changed times.The Varna System is a social order defined in the ancient times with great code of conduct for the social harmony and the Caste is a social requirement created by the greedy civilization. The way the politicians nonchalantly abuse this system, shows that it is surely not for social harmony.

Everybody needs a group for self protection in this world, that's why i think the modern religion's are created. But, Hindu society are not grouped, but divided by the modern caste systems in India, purely for the politician's advantage. So, now, each sub group is in a very defensive position to save their own skin (from our great politicians and social reformers), where, our status is no where near the main stream by the present social orders.

Since, Caste has taken the form of big groups, Yes I mean it!, if one would see the social differences within each group,[ A "group", seems to be an appropriate word to describe], there is lot of imbalance within any group [Financially, social status wise, knowledge out of education, even habits also seems to have a mark, in differentiating people within once own group], Which is still united by a slim thread of our ancestor's connection. Now what could be our code of conduct, to remain in the group, and in order to survive. Survive gracefully as prescribed by our Dharma.How to bridge the huge gap between A brahmana by varna and brahmin by caste?.

I take up this subject to think more deeply, the values of a Brahmana (Varnas) has changed to the Brahmin (By) caste, which is linked by common believes, social interactions, and "approximate" common style of living.

Nowadays, It seems that some of us being so modern in thinking, we are giving up this common connections and sliding further away.

Brahmana is defined in our sacred scripts, but, where is the characteristic of our Brahmin Defined? Is a definition is required at all???!!!???. Because except Dalits no body seems to have have any definition, instead we are made to live simply by their group's common strength.

Our ancestors have left us with a wealth of guidelines in the form of sacred scripts. Should we not think to have definition on the common qualities that we are having and we should preserve, among us, and have discipline within our society guided by elders & the sacred scripts, to recharge our faiths?. If I put this entire post in a single line, When we don't live as per a Brahmana's life described in Scripts, what are the common qualities a Brahmin should have and how many of us really qualifies against that definition?. Is it enough to have Brahmin parents? [all groups and religions are having this qualifications issue, in this modern world!!). A clear idea will help us to be (not only us but other Hindu castes) united.


Namaskaram.

 

[kunjuppu]

Dear Sirs,

.How to bridge the huge gap between A brahmana by varna and brahmin by caste?. ....

.........If I put this entire post in a single line, When we don't live as per a Brahmana's life described in Scripts, what are the common qualities a Brahmin should have and how many of us really qualifies against that definition?. Is it enough to have Brahmin parents? [all groups and religions are having this qualifications issue, in this modern world!!). A clear idea will help us to be (not only us but other Hindu castes) united.


Namaskaram.

very nice post pvraman.

i have highlighted a couple of paras above pertaining to which i have some queries, if you don't mind.

1. from many threads here, i get the feeling that a significant number of our members do not differentiate between brahmana & brahmin, varna & caste.

i also get a feeling, that most brahmins assume to have inherited the best of the brahmanas, and irrespective of their current standing, feel somehow enhanced by this belief.

i am not so sure, whether this belief as i understand it, is to the current TB's favour as it might put a chip on his shoulders and in doing so, deprive him of one of the essential ingredients of social interaction ie an open mind.

this above, is solely, from my reading of the posts in this forum and not from anywhere else. i could entirely be offbase here. i could accept that too.

2. something relating to what are the common qualities that a brahmin should have....etc is being discussed in the 'can brahmins have pets' thread.

if you don't mind participating there in the requested exercise re the top 5-10 'must do's of a practising brahmin, i would appreciate it.

incidentally, this above exercise is viewed more from a casual standpoint by myself. any attempt to inject seriousness may not be appropriate, considering the sensitivities of the issues.

my desire is to understand the mandatories of a brahmin and how they rank in importance. a purely academic exercise.

thank you.

 

[nachi naga]

actually,i am only namesake brahmin,as a caste.but i don't follow any rituals.even pithru karyam,i have proxied to madhya kailash,in adyar.i simply feel people are divine or satvik or demons or asuric.this nature exists in all of us.there is simply no meaning in brahmins these days.frankly i feel very idiotic to call myself brahmin,but just holding to this tag.i feel all castes are man made and not by god.god will never differentiate.anyways don't know,just writing my views.i read posts,seldom post here,but this thread could not control myself.please excuse my honesty.

naga.n

 

[kunjuppu]

actually,i am only namesake brahmin,as a caste.but i don't follow any rituals.even pithru karyam,i have proxied to madhya kailash,in adyar...
naga.n

hi naga,

can you please explain re proxying your pithru karyam to madhya kailash.

this is a temple that came after i left madras and so don't know much about it.

i looked it up in wikipedia, and there was mention of this process. so what do you have to do to avail yourself of this process?

is it popular?

wikipedia says that it is open to all castes, which is really to be welcomed. i am all for it. for in death, we are all the same.

 

[sadasivam.sridharan]

Dear Sri.pvraman
I totally agree with you with your view that the Varna system is a social order set up by our elders whereas the caste system is the invention of the political class to serve their selfish ends.
Congratulations for a well thoughtout post!
S.Sridharan

 

[Raghy]

actually,i am only namesake brahmin,as a caste.but i don't follow any rituals.even pithru karyam,i have proxied to madhya kailash,in adyar.i simply feel people are divine or satvik or demons or asuric.this nature exists in all of us.there is simply no meaning in brahmins these days.frankly i feel very idiotic to call myself brahmin,but just holding to this tag.i feel all castes are man made and not by god.god will never differentiate.anyways don't know,just writing my views.i read posts,seldom post here,but this thread could not control myself.please excuse my honesty.

naga.n

Sri Nachi naga,

The message in your post is beautiful. You should post more messages. You need not feel discouraged to call yourself a brahmin. There is no hard fast rule as such to be a brahmin. As long as you lead a honourable life, you will feel satisfied. What you feel about yourself is more important than what others feel about yourself. In my case, I could not go for my father's first anniversary; I requested my brother to do the thivasam. I requested Swami Narayan temple to conduct the ceremony for my father and sponsored (along with 2 others) prasad for all devotees for one evening on a week-end on my father's behalf. I explained my action to my mother. She said she was very satisfied and pleased. Kindly feel encouraged to participate more in the forum. Only people like us make the bulk of the brahmin community. Our views and feelings are credible for our community. Thank you.