Is ‘staying single’ is on the increase?

[V.Balasubramani]

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Pranams to all,

Recently I attended a function at my place which was also attended by most of the local community members. As usual, members were all in pleasant mood and were in scattered group exchanging greetings, wishes and discussion going on hot topics including the latest development in each member’s family. There were few families, limited, finding difficult to handle certain members on the topic of their son/daughter not getting married as they are crossing their prime age though well settled career wise. It is learnt that their children are in the habit of avoiding marriage proposals initiated by their parents on some ground or other every time. One of them seems to have informed categorically that proposals can be initiated only on getting green signal from him. The plight of these parents was bit embarrassing and they were just covering up this with lot of other reasons. It is only a random sample I believe. What actually is influencing them and are they attracted towards staying single?
What could be impact of singleness on our community?

 

[Raji Ram]

Dear Balu Sir,

This might turn out to be a parallel thread to 'Women and engineer problem in marriage' in Sociology forum.

Starting from the difficulty of finding partners for grooms, this thread is now analyzing about relationships
between in-laws! Let us see how this grows! :ranger:

 

[Visalakshi Ramani]

Pranams to all,

Recently I attended a function at my place which was also attended by most of the local community members. As usual, members were all in pleasant mood and were in scattered group exchanging greetings, wishes and discussion going on hot topics including the latest development in each member’s family. There were few families, limited, finding difficult to handle certain members on the topic of their son/daughter not getting married as they are crossing their prime age though well settled career wise. It is learnt that their children are in the habit of avoiding marriage proposals initiated by their parents on some ground or other every time. One of them seems to have informed categorically that proposals can be initiated only on getting green signal from him. The plight of these parents was bit embarrassing and they were just covering up this with lot of other reasons. It is only a random sample I believe. What actually is influencing them and are they attracted towards staying single?
What could be impact of singleness on our community?

It is said that

A man should stay single as long as possible and
A woman should get married as soon as possible.

People get scared seeing the failure rates of
both arranged and love marriages.

The divorce rate is growing higher and higher.
The number of innocent divorcees
both male and female is alarming.

With the women coming out to work
the chances of short circuits and
love affairs are on the increase.

In fact no one feels really safe
about any marriage proposal.

The demands made by the prospective brides
are sky-high and unrealistic- to say the least.

All these put together make youngsters feel that
it is by far better to remain single
and retain their personal freedom
than get married in haste and repent in leisure.

 

[V.Balasubramani]

VR Madam,The major reason cited is to be 'Independent'. Is children staying away from parents is anything to do with this?

 

[sangom]

Pranams to all,

Recently I attended a function at my place which was also attended by most of the local community members. As usual, members were all in pleasant mood and were in scattered group exchanging greetings, wishes and discussion going on hot topics including the latest development in each member’s family. There were few families, limited, finding difficult to handle certain members on the topic of their son/daughter not getting married as they are crossing their prime age though well settled career wise. It is learnt that their children are in the habit of avoiding marriage proposals initiated by their parents on some ground or other every time. One of them seems to have informed categorically that proposals can be initiated only on getting green signal from him. The plight of these parents was bit embarrassing and they were just covering up this with lot of other reasons. It is only a random sample I believe. What actually is influencing them and are they attracted towards staying single?
What could be impact of singleness on our community?

I personally know two cases of very eligible bachelors who have refused marriage right from the beginning. They are very normal people outwardly and it is not that they could not get any eligible girl and so they have been forced to remain single. I even very politely enquired one of these as to whether his non-inclination is due to some health problem of his; he gave me his family doctor's details and asked me to enquire and find out from the family doctor himself and assured me that he is perfectly fit for married life, but does not feel that he will be able to be a husband of the present day type since it reduces the husband to a slave of the wife and, in addition, he will have to go on earning more and more to satiate the ever-increasing desire and greed of today's girls, which seems to be augmented by advertising and all that. As an unmarried fellow, he says, he is master of himself and he thinks this is very much more valuable than mortgaging his entire life to a girl just to get her sexual favours, that too at her will and pleasure only. This person is a highly placed executive in a MNC and earns fabulously.

The second non-marrying person is now nearing his 50's. He was not so forthcoming as the first, but said that marriage with a girl of these days is not worth the bargain. He is content to lead his life as an "Asthika brahmachari", read books on religion & philosophy, learn veda and mantras, undertake extensive pilgrimages, etc. Till recently he took care of his parents; father expired two years ago aged 97, and now mother lives mostly with him in their agraharam house in a remote village. This person is a bank employee but he says he had rejected promotions beyond the clerical level because he just does not want all-India transfers. His father has left lot of assets; so he is financially also very sound. Since one of his sisters married a low-caste NB many years ago with her parents' full consent and the couple still live very near the parents' house, I feel this gentleman's refusal will not have anything to do with failed love affair or something like that.

Though these are just two samples, I feel that while on one side some of our tabra boys are frantically trying to get married somehow, and grumbling about their not succeeding in it, there is a thought process going on in the minds of at least a few boys who weigh the pros & cons of the present day married life and decide that it is not worth all the life-long thralldom which ensues. To my limited intelligence it appears that this trend may also catch up as time passes and it may act as one of the factors bringing in some "levelling" in the tabra marriage market and applying brakes to the idea of women's lib., gender equality and so on.

 

[Visalakshi Ramani]

VR Madam,The major reason cited is to be 'Independent'. Is children staying away from parents is anything to do with this?

Yes Sir! most certainly!

We have become like logs floating in water,
coming closer at times and drifting apart at other times.

Parents have lost their control over their children.
Children have lost their commitment to their parents.

Everybody wants freedom and independence.
No one want to be attached by any invisible strings.

Very soon it might become each one for himself!

People think that with money they can BUY everything.

Unless and until they realize that money is not all powerful
human values are bound to deteriorate further
and we might follow the life pattern of animals...
meet, mate and part and families may disappear! :scared:

Thanks to the several methods of contraception
this is quite a possibility in reality in the society.

 

[Raji Ram]

Dear Sangom Sir,

I do not want to comment on your first hero. But the second hero, now nearing 50, should have been in his so

called 'marriageable age' two decades ago! I don't think there were so many high profile girls then. I think his

problem might have been his sister's spouse being a low caste NB. IC marriages were comparatively less then

and it was also a sort of stigma if a girl in a family gets married like this, with / without the consent of parents!

P.S: The age difference between him and his father is nearly five decades

 

[Raji Ram]

Dear Balu Sir,

We have often times discussed what are all the conditions to be satisfied by the prospective grooms to get a match!

Most of the guys who are unable to get a match just satisfy themselves and their parents by saying that they want to

be independent! Rarely it is the REAL decision by the guys. It is the sad state of our society.

Ram's nephew says that this is not the plight of tambram guys only but others too! :shocked:

 

[V.Balasubramani]

I personally know two cases of very eligible bachelors who have refused marriage right from the beginning. They are very normal people outwardly and it is not that they could not get any eligible girl and so they have been forced to remain single. I even very politely enquired one of these as to whether his non-inclination is due to some health problem of his; he gave me his family doctor's details and asked me to enquire and find out from the family doctor himself and assured me that he is perfectly fit for married life, but does not feel that he will be able to be a husband of the present day type since it reduces the husband to a slave of the wife and, in addition, he will have to go on earning more and more to satiate the ever-increasing desire and greed of today's girls, which seems to be augmented by advertising and all that. As an unmarried fellow, he says, he is master of himself and he thinks this is very much more valuable than mortgaging his entire life to a girl just to get her sexual favours, that too at her will and pleasure only. This person is a highly placed executive in a MNC and earns fabulously.

The second non-marrying person is now nearing his 50's. He was not so forthcoming as the first, but said that marriage with a girl of these days is not worth the bargain. He is content to lead his life as an "Asthika brahmachari", read books on religion & philosophy, learn veda and mantras, undertake extensive pilgrimages, etc. Till recently he took care of his parents; father expired two years ago aged 97, and now mother lives mostly with him in their agraharam house in a remote village. This person is a bank employee but he says he had rejected promotions beyond the clerical level because he just does not want all-India transfers. His father has left lot of assets; so he is financially also very sound. Since one of his sisters married a low-caste NB many years ago with her parents' full consent and the couple still live very near the parents' house, I feel this gentleman's refusal will not have anything to do with failed love affair or something like that.

Though these are just two samples, I feel that while on one side some of our tabra boys are frantically trying to get married somehow, and grumbling about their not succeeding in it, there is a thought process going on in the minds of at least a few boys who weigh the pros & cons of the present day married life and decide that it is not worth all the life-long thralldom which ensues. To my limited intelligence it appears that this trend may also catch up as time passes and it may act as one of the factors bringing in some "levelling" in the tabra marriage market and applying brakes to the idea of women's lib., gender equality and so on.

Sri Sangom Ji,

Pranams

Husband and wife relationship cannot be treated as that of slave and Master, but in reality in some families, father will dominate and in some mother acts as uncrowned monarch/Raj matha. Do such relationship of parents will have any influence over the children to avoid marriage?

I think boys evince interest over ‘care free’ life style, leading a lavish life without any responsibility such as caring babies, finding a best school and getting admission, etc etc Better avoid encumbrances.

In one case known to me, the boy is postponing the marriage and his parents have pressure from few of their relatives of both sides i.e. paternal and maternal. They have neither accepted Horoscope nor distributed since such act will lead to pursuation and end up in unpleasant situation. But now the situation is quite different, with their relatives passing rumours that the boy’s parents are looking for royal bride.

With regards

 

[Iyyarooraan]

Maybe paradigm shift of culture and civilization is in process. Gay marriages are taking places and there are voices for them in India too. But I have a fear this may last 5 years or at the most a decade. Then? Maybe the days of marrying man to ass and girls preferring dogs and cats are approaching. Man's ambition maybe to become like an inert mass/material so that he is not affected by any problem. We have should prepare for composing new mantras, different marriage venues and cut off totally from the past smooth and fine. Pray the golden era approaches past.

 

[sangom]

Dear Sangom Sir,

I do not want to comment on your first hero. But the second hero, now nearing 50, should have been in his so

called 'marriageable age' two decades ago! I don't think there were so many high profile girls then. I think his

problem might have been his sister's spouse being a low caste NB. IC marriages were comparatively less then

and it was also a sort of stigma if a girl in a family gets married like this, with / without the consent of parents!

P.S: The age difference between him and his father is nearly five decades

It is a large family of many children. The IC marriage did not come in the way of 4 or 5 marriages of both boys and girls subsequently in that family, so I discount that angle completely. The age difference may be due to late marriage of father, spacing between children and so on, but there is nothing suspicious about it; this man has 3 or 4 younger sisters/brothers.

 

[sangom]

Sri Sangom Ji,

Pranams

Husband and wife relationship cannot be treated as that of slave and Master, but in reality in some families, father will dominate and in some mother acts as uncrowned monarch/Raj matha. Do such relationship of parents will have any influence over the children to avoid marriage?

I think boys evince interest over ‘care free’ life style, leading a lavish life without any responsibility such as caring babies, finding a best school and getting admission, etc etc Better avoid encumbrances.

In one case known to me, the boy is postponing the marriage and his parents have pressure from few of their relatives of both sides i.e. paternal and maternal. They have neither accepted Horoscope nor distributed since such act will lead to pursuation and end up in unpleasant situation. But now the situation is quite different, with their relatives passing rumours that the boy’s parents are looking for royal bride.

With regards

In both the cases I have written about, the parents appear normal people, no kind of "domination". I tend to believe that these men may have seen the present day marriages more closely than I know (because they may have many young friends) and might have come to their own judgments. I remember one instance told to me by another young man (married). He lent a very costly book to one of his close friends and colleague but when it was not returned even after a year or so, he asked the friend about it. His friend reportedly apologized profusely and told him that he found the book very absorbing but his young wife felt that he was not spending quality time with her and so threw the book into the garbage bag without his knowing. This actually happened in London!!

 

[palindrome]

Parents have lost their control over their children.
Children have lost their commitment to their parents

Dear Mrs.VR, Why not parents love the children (without feeling the need to control children)? When love is true (ie., not considered a burden, obligation, chore, a job, a problem, etc) children very well sense it. Also, when love is true, it lets the loved one go, without expecting anything in return (including commitment). If love comes back to us (if at all it does, which is very rare) then we should consider ourselves blessed.

 

[kunjuppu]

Dear Mrs.VR, Why not parents love the children (without feeling the need to control children)? When love is true (ie., not considered a burden, obligation, chore, a job, a problem, etc) children very well sense it. Also, when love is true, it lets the loved one go, without expecting anything in return (including commitment). If love comes back to us (if at all it does, which is very rare) then we should consider ourselves blessed.

palindrome,

you have brought up a very sensitive point.

to my parents, it was essential, that there was a control over me. this applies, afaik, well into sons born upto the 1970s and 80s, as i have seen my nephews in india, till then brought up with a rigidity reflecting the control, which the mother usually had.

ofcourse, it extended well into the son's adulthood, and i think, many a times, in order to reinforce this control, the sons were kept ignorant of worldly matters. which is why, many of them, when they came to u.s. for higher studies, were like fish out of water, for they were unable to make even the smallest of decisions by themselves.

thankfully most of them came through this baptism by fire, unscathed. a few, including my own classmates, got usurped by equally rigid control demanding philosophies - all it meant, is to subsitute one set of control (parental) with another (religion, cult, what not).

it is a rare mother who shows love to her son. it is more by default, what is shown is control. unfortunately, even now, in my own experience, i find mothers unable to get rid of that attitude. micromanaging to an irritiating level, is a close company of 'control'

 

[renuka]

We have to acknowledge that some people have a problem staying faithful and like the thrill of a new partner.

I have a friend who knows he is afflicted with this ailment of not able to be faithful..so he had decided not to get married cos he feels it would not be fair to a wife to have such a husband.

So there are many reasons why a person might want to remain single.

Some might also be closet gays and lesbians too...so we have to ask our children what is actually stopping them from marriage instead of forcing them to get married.

 

[Raji Ram]

It is a large family of many children. The IC marriage did not come in the way of 4 or 5 marriages of both boys and girls subsequently in that family, so I discount that angle completely. The age difference may be due to late marriage of father, spacing between children and so on, but there is nothing suspicious about it; this man has 3 or 4 younger sisters/brothers.

Dear Sangom Sir,

I can 'see' your anger by the font color! I think you have added one more point against the hero!

Many siblings and some three of four younger to him! How do we expect any girl to get married in

this huge family, when this hero refuses for a transfer from his city / town?

 

[renuka]

Dear Mrs.VR, Why not parents love the children (without feeling the need to control children)? When love is true (ie., not considered a burden, obligation, chore, a job, a problem, etc) children very well sense it. Also, when love is true, it lets the loved one go, without expecting anything in return (including commitment). If love comes back to us (if at all it does, which is very rare) then we should consider ourselves blessed.

Dear Palindrome,

I totally agree with you.

A child is meant to be guided and not remote controlled by parents.

Parenting skills of yesteryears sometimes might actually make a child feel "insulted".

I always remember that when we do something that our parents had advised us not too..most parents will tell us "I told you so..you did not listen...very good lesson for you" and parents might have a triumphant look on their faces.

Even sometimes when I get children who fall down cos they have been jumping about here and there..their parents scold them when I am treating their kids.

Parents say "Who asked you to jump..when I told you not too...this is what happens when you do not listen to parents"

I always tell the parents to not scold a child in pain.

When I am treating the child...I tell them "you are lucky that the injury is not serious..jumping around sometimes might not be save..so you can always ask your parents for guidance on how to play in the house..take care when you play"

I prefer this type of parenting skill cos we do not "insult" the child.

Most parents actually control their children to exert " I am the boss scenario"..parents themselves throw tantrums when they do not get their way with children.

Sad to say..this is the average Indian way of bringing up children..."I am the Boss..you shut up and listen" attitude.

I also agree with Palindrome...that actually we should not expect anything in return.

We have to let go of feelings of expectations from spouse or child eventually.

It is actually much easier on the mind and body to just do our duty with love but not really expecting anything in return.

As we age we will realize that most of our lives we spend expecting some form of love or the other or some form of expectations or the other.

The best if to just be free from any expectations but not run away from being loving and dutiful.

 

[Visalakshi Ramani]

Marriage needs suitable life partners to last a life time.

Life span of man is increasing but the life span of

the wedded life is either non-existent or short-lived! :tsk:

 

[Visalakshi Ramani]

We have to acknowledge that some people have a problem staying faithful and like the thrill of a new partner.

I have a friend who knows he is afflicted with this ailment of not able to be faithful..so he had decided not to get married cos he feels it would not be fair to a wife to have such a husband.

So there are many reasons why a person might want to remain single.

Some might also be closet gays and lesbians too...so we have to ask our children what is actually stopping them from marriage instead of forcing them to get married.

The desire for personal freedom and independence

may be due many reasons as rightly pointed out by you! :clap2:

 

[V.Balasubramani]

Dear Mrs.VR, Why not parents love the children (without feeling the need to control children)? When love is true (ie., not considered a burden, obligation, chore, a job, a problem, etc) children very well sense it. Also, when love is true, it lets the loved one go, without expecting anything in return (including commitment). If love comes back to us (if at all it does, which is very rare) then we should consider ourselves blessed.

Sri Palindrome Sir

I agree with you sir, but IMHO despite pouring and nurturing them with more love and affection, only carrots no cane, when they leave the parents for career sake, their association also seems to have some influence over them.

 

[sangom]

Dear Sangom Sir,

I can 'see' your anger by the font color! I think you have added one more point against the hero!

Many siblings and some three of four younger to him! How do we expect any girl to get married in

this huge family, when this hero refuses for a transfer from his city / town?

Smt. RR,

It was just a coincidence that I thought I should, hereafter, write responses to your posts in your own coin, viz., bold fonts & some colour. It was not out of anger.

I have checked up with my wife re. this family. They are 7 or 8 children. This non-marrying person is now 50+, nearing retirement perhaps. There are 2 or 3 children younger to him. The marriages of all the younger siblings including males took place without any difficulty. FYI, this huge family is not a joint family; they are spread all over India except this son and the IC daughter who live close-by. The very fact that others got married without difficulty is there. Perhaps the decision of the boy not to get transferred came later on, not in his younger days, but I don't know.

I therefore feel that this is one case where the boy has really and genuinely decided that marriage is not worth the trouble.

 

[Visalakshi Ramani]

Dear Mrs.VR, Why not parents love the children (without feeling the need to control children)? When love is true (ie., not considered a burden, obligation, chore, a job, a problem, etc) children very well sense it. Also, when love is true, it lets the loved one go, without expecting anything in return (including commitment). If love comes back to us (if at all it does, which is very rare) then we should consider ourselves blessed.

Dear Mrs. Palindrome,

I do not mean :whip: when I say control.
May be I should have used the word guidance.

The parents know what is best for their children
better than the children themselves do.

But often the children do not listen to
the parent's solid and sound advice.

If they repent for it it later in life,
they keep it a secret and suffer in silence.

They do not want to hear these words,
"I told you so!" from anyone in the family :sad:

 

[V.Balasubramani]

By any chance are they waiting for their dream girl or boy? Or does the time taken bless them with nice match?

 

[Visalakshi Ramani]

palindrome,

you have brought up a very sensitive point.

to my parents, it was essential, that there was a control over me. this applies, afaik, well into sons born upto the 1970s and 80s, as i have seen my nephews in india, till then brought up with a rigidity reflecting the control, which the mother usually had.

ofcourse, it extended well into the son's adulthood, and i think, many a times, in order to reinforce this control, the sons were kept ignorant of worldly matters. which is why, many of them, when they came to u.s. for higher studies, were like fish out of water, for they were unable to make even the smallest of decisions by themselves.

thankfully most of them came through this baptism by fire, unscathed. a few, including my own classmates, got usurped by equally rigid control demanding philosophies - all it meant, is to subsitute one set of control (parental) with another (religion, cult, what not).

it is a rare mother who shows love to her son. it is more by default, what is shown is control. unfortunately, even now, in my own experience, i find mothers unable to get rid of that attitude. micromanaging to an irritiating level, is a close company of 'control'

No sweeping statements sir! :nono:
I for one will guide my sons if they ask me for guidance.
They KNOW that I am right there whenever they NEED me.
We are more like good friends than like parent and sons.
I do not believe in keeping people under the thumb or in the palm.

 

[Visalakshi Ramani]

ref#20.
Palindrome is mam and not a man.