Pity the nation

[Nara]

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....I don't require any certificate from this gentleman about my intellectual bankruptcy.

Wow, another volley of personal attacks. BTW, folks, my comment about intellectual bankruptcy was about the author of the article from alt.politics Google groups, not about Mr. RVR.

thanks ....

 

[RVR]

Wow, another volley of personal attacks. BTW, folks, my comment about intellectual bankruptcy was about the author of the article from alt.politics Google groups, not about Mr. RVR.

thanks ....

The author of the article is social media commentator and regular contributor to Pioneer News Paper.

The Pioneer :: Home : >> Intellectually dishonest

Pioneer Newspapar has a long list of illustrious contributers and Sri Sashi Sekhar is one among them

The Pioneer :: Home

I don't expect every body to accept his views but he need not be classified as `intellectual bankrupt'

All the best

 

[sangom]

Dear Shri RVR,

Pl. see

Arundhati Roy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

and

Court issues notices to Rahul Gandhi, Arundhati Roy

It seems Arundhati Roy has been in the habit of making such irresponsible utterances in the past also. GOI has taken a wise decision not to grant her any undeserving publicity by arresting and all, I think. If she continues in this fashion, perhaps world will forget her also. Hence we need not overly worry. What is the cause for court issuing notice to Rahul Gandhi is not known (to me at least). Any idea?

 

[sangom]

Let us hope that both India and China sorts out border problem once for all in the best interest of both the countries.

India, China for 'practical solution' to border row: PM - The Times of India

During Vajpayee regime, China recognised Indian accession of Sikkim by opening a trade route through Sikkim

Trade Routes: China's 'Ancient Tea-Horse Road' in Historical Perspective

Let us hope the issue of Arunachal Pradesh is sorted out once for all in the future and there is no border dispute between both the countries.

All the best

Dear Shri RVR,

While I also will like to "hope" the way you do, the situation looks like not so promising.

'I don't think Obama's visit will be a success' - Rediff.com India News

 

[Nara]

right defeated is stronger than evil triumphant

Folks, once there was a man, not long ago, gunned down for who he was, and the justice he dreamed about. He was hounded by the power of the day, the FBI spied on him, he was a despicable opportunist, a publicity hound, a trouble-maker, an anti-American (like the anti-Indian who is supposed to hate India), a bloody commie. Read the letter he wrote to his detractors, here. It is a log letter, but there is so much parallel there, we might learn a thing or two, if only we have the patience and a kind heart. This may be too much to ask. It is lot easier to pile on. Who does she think she is, Gandhi, MLK? You may have put your life on the line for the least powerful, but you are an elite. Look at us, we serve our "community" and let others serve their community, so much better. Our rishies are trillion time better than the "western" scientists, all they can do is to make life here on this earth better, but our rishis can make you life after you die a lot better. We have never been to Kashmir, and even if we did it was only for vacation like going to Germany or Singapore, but it is ours, it is ours I say, an integral part, come what may, let a million people die, it is still ours, ours I say.

 

[RVR]

Here is an interesting article by Mahatma Gandhi on Kashmir written just few days before his assassination.

Kashmir Issue

Subsequently Pakistan signed Simla Agreement in which it has committed to respect the line of control and discuss & settle everything peacefully. Mahatma Gandhi has wished peaceful settlement between the nations way back in 1948 itself and has also clearly said that UNO will not have any role if such thing happen

When Pakistan signed the Simla agreement, the UN resolution on Kashmir has become irrelevant.

Simla Agreement - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It is Pakistan which violated the spirit of the agreement by both through proxy war in Kashmir and also by direct war in Kargil.

Now there is no point in talking to Pakistan and we, Indians have to resolve the issue taking all Kashmiris in to confidence. Unfortunately a part of Kashmir is Occupied by Pakistan and we have to talk to POK to solve the issue.

Let us hope that the Interlocutors succeed in their mission.

All the best

 

[KRS]

Dear Professor Nara Ji,

Please do not even try to compare the Mahatma and the Reverand's works with that of this petty minded (she quarrels with other writers/historians she does not like), and serial heckle raiser. Both the Mahatma and MLK spent years in jail, reflecting inwards. They both loved their countries and loved ALL the people in each. This lady marches around, vilifying almost all who do not subscribe to her line of leftist ideology, calling others witout hesitation as oppressors, killers etc.

As I have already said, because of this, she has no ability to properly think through any issue, where multiple interests collide. She also thinks that she is above any normal responsibility of a citizen of a country. Both Gandhi Ji and MLK had never done that, when it came to inciting violence.

The ONLY good thing she has said was that 'terrorism is a heartless ideology', which by the way tells me that she is capable of independent thinking. If she unshackles herself from this leftist/hate Israel/hate America/hate India ideology based 'intellectualism', then may be, people will take her seriously.

By the way, between paying Rs2,500 and spending a month in jail on the contempt sentence for criticizing the Supreme Court, your MG/MLK wannabe chose to pay the fine!

When Assam went through internal strife, like other states in India, where unrest caused so many deaths, did you hold the position that they secede?

Here we know that Pakistan has been playing the proxy game, as they themselves have proudly admitted, and so, why should India allow them to secede?

Here is a sample of how her remarks are being played over in Pakistan:
http://www.ahmedquraishi.com/2010/1...e-life-of-arundhati-roy-over-kashmir-remarks/

I submit that Sow. Roy's thinking is colored by the loss of life alone and does not go further. Same as in the flawed thinking about Israel. They fail to take in to account what is reality and yes, their whole thinking is solely based on sappy emotionalism, based on one sided stories.

Gandhi Ji, I definitely think,if he had visited Kashmir today, would have come back to New Delhi, met with the Indian Gov. authorities behind the doors and asked them to do certain things consistent with what is right or wrong. He would not have stood on a world platform asking India to let go of Kashmir, let alone say that 'Kashmir was never a part of India'. By speaking up like she did, she has only made life harder for those Kashmiris, the very people she claims to help, with hardening of positions by everyone.

But then, given what the Nobel Prize has become, I would not be at all shocked to see her win the prize soon.

By the way, YES, KASHMIR IS AN INTEGRAL PART OF INDIA. 'It is ours', say the Indians with a single chorus.

By the way, why would she assume that the only solution to end of 'violence' in Kashmir should be secession?

Regards,
KRS

Folks, once there was a man, not long ago, gunned down for who he was, and the justice he dreamed about. He was hounded by the power of the day, the FBI spied on him, he was a despicable opportunist, a publicity hound, a trouble-maker, an anti-American (like the anti-Indian who is supposed to hate India), a bloody commie. Read the letter he wrote to his detractors, here. It is a log letter, but there is so much parallel there, we might learn a thing or two, if only we have the patience and a kind heart. This may be too much to ask. It is lot easier to pile on. Who does she think she is, Gandhi, MLK? You may have put your life on the line for the least powerful, but you are an elite. Look at us, we serve our "community" and let others serve their community, so much better. Our rishies are trillion time better than the "western" scientists, all they can do is to make life here on this earth better, but our rishis can make you life after you die a lot better. We have never been to Kashmir, and even if we did it was only for vacation like going to Germany or Singapore, but it is ours, it is ours I say, an integral part, come what may, let a million people die, it is still ours, ours I say.

 

[sangom]

Here is an interesting article by Mahatma Gandhi on Kashmir written just few days before his assassination.

Kashmir Issue

Subsequently Pakistan signed Simla Agreement in which it has committed to respect the line of control and discuss & settle everything peacefully. Mahatma Gandhi has wished peaceful settlement between the nations way back in 1948 itself and has also clearly said that UNO will not have any role if such thing happen

When Pakistan signed the Simla agreement, the UN resolution on Kashmir has become irrelevant.

Simla Agreement - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It is Pakistan which violated the spirit of the agreement by both through proxy war in Kashmir and also by direct war in Kargil.

Now there is no point in talking to Pakistan and we, Indians have to resolve the issue taking all Kashmiris in to confidence. Unfortunately a part of Kashmir is Occupied by Pakistan and we have to talk to POK to solve the issue.

Let us hope that the Interlocutors succeed in their mission.

All the best

Dear Shri RVR,

I think MKG thought that the whole world will be principled like him when he wrote, "...But if India and Pakistan come to a settlement the big powers in the UNO will have to endorse that settlement. They will not object to the settlement. They themselves can only say that they will do their best to see that the two countries arrive at an understanding through mutual discussions." He did not or could not envisage that by taking the Kashmir issue to the UN, India was giving a potential conflagration which can be kept alive indefinitely by third parties who will benefit by selling arms to both the sides and thus enjoy!

We should also note that Gandhi is very clear when he says "...At the same time Pakistan is being requested to get out of Kashmir and to arrive at a settlement with India over the question through bilateral negotiations. If no settlement can be reached in this way then a war is inevitable." Why is the Indian Government still dragging its feet instead of taking control of the entire Kashmir by waging a full scale war, if need be?

 

[RVR]

Dear Shri RVR,

I think MKG thought that the whole world will be principled like him when he wrote, "...But if India and Pakistan come to a settlement the big powers in the UNO will have to endorse that settlement. They will not object to the settlement. They themselves can only say that they will do their best to see that the two countries arrive at an understanding through mutual discussions." He did not or could not envisage that by taking the Kashmir issue to the UN, India was giving a potential conflagration which can be kept alive indefinitely by third parties who will benefit by selling arms to both the sides and thus enjoy!

We should also note that Gandhi is very clear when he says "...At the same time Pakistan is being requested to get out of Kashmir and to arrive at a settlement with India over the question through bilateral negotiations. If no settlement can be reached in this way then a war is inevitable." Why is the Indian Government still dragging its feet instead of taking control of the entire Kashmir by waging a full scale war, if need be?

Sri Sangom Sir,

Please go through the UN resolution on Kashmir


United Nations Security Council Resolution 47 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

First Pakistan has to vacate the portion which it occupied. Pakistan has made things worse by giving some portion of its occupied Kashmir to China. Now Pakistan has to get back the portion from china first, then vacate its own portion and then plebiscite has to be conducted.

Is it possible under the present circumstances?

That is why none of the countries in the world talk about UN resolution now.

Kashmir is a highly complicated issue now. Indian portion has three distinct areas. Buddhist dominated Ladakh, Muslim Majority Kashmir valley and Hindu majority Jammu. Kashmiri pandits who have been thrown out of the valley have to be kept in the talks.

POK and Chinese portion of the Kashmir are other two parts to the dispute.

Integrating all these areas into one zone and finding a solution is a very complex issue.

May be accepting Simla agreement and finding a solution with the line of control as international border seems to be the best solution.

The international border could be made soft enabling people on both sides to move without much of hassles so that they can feel comfortable and not divided by national boundaries.

Decentralization of powers to grass root levels to the maximum extent may meet the aspirations of the people at local levels.

Let us hope that better sense prevails among the people and accept the reality in the right spirit.

All the best

 

[KRS]

Dear Sri Sangom Ji,

Let me post the core issues here with some articles I found useful. Please do not hesitate to shoot my ideas down - I will learn:
1. The treaty had it's genesis first with President Bush and PM Manmohan Singh agreeing on this Framework:
India has a huge need for energy and the fastest and the safest way is through rapid expansion of it's civil nuclear program. If India agrees to the IAEA regime, for her civil program (not military), then USA will ask the NSG(the suppliers) to lift the embargo in place for India. India still do not need to sign the NPT.

This was a huge gesture by President Bush, because he believed implicitly in India as a democracy (may be to contain china's influence in Asia), because I at least at that time knew that the lobby representing NPT was vehemently opposed to this. They felt that by giving India a pass, a precedence is being made and NPT will be violated, not signed by other countries. They pressured the Congress to make India sign the NPT, but the President prevailed - victory, India.

2. MM Singh Ji and Congress had to withstand a 'no confidence' vote because of the communists (they seem to not understand what is in the best interest of India). and got it approved. USA also passed it in congress (despite, I may add, a vigorous lobbying by the usual anti India forces - Pakistan for example).

3. India now passes a liability law not protecting the suppliers (the usual norm is that only the operators are exposed) with huge liabilities, that would bankrupt a small country (by the way, the standard internationally is that only the operators are liable), based on the same emotional issue you cited, on Union Carbide, where I still think that the Indian Government dropped the ball.

4. So, not surprisingly, private company suppliers, such as GE and Westinghouse, (Private companies in the USA have shareholder responsibilities and I do not think that their boards would let their management to expose the company to such huge liability risk) have balked. By the way since these US companies are supplied by a couple of Japanese private companies, I understand that PM MM Singh will be addressing Japanese concerns on this as well.

5. This is why, India's law will not take precedent, irrespective of counter claims. Either India signs the new international regime for liabilities or these companies truly will not supply. This not just about the US. Includes ALL private suppliers.

6. So, India has a choice - they can stand their ground on the law, and lose getting most of the supplier choices. Or they can sign the CSC, which is now signed by many (but ratified by 4).

7. My take on this - I do not think people in India understand how much the USA has done to make this technology available to India.

Please read:
India Weighs Measure to Ease Nuclear Liability Law - WSJ.com
India signs CSC on nuclear damages - The Economic Times
Nuclear Liability: A Continuing Impediment To Nuclear Commerce

Regarding the American weapons - that is a different topic altogether. I would only ask our folks to think through our enemies in the area, what their capabilities are and how best to counter it.

Regards,
KRS

Shri KRS,

The conclusion that the Sonia-Manmohan government is eager to please the US interests at any cost arises mainly from the Indo-US nuclear deal and how the Indian Government has gone about it till now.

The past pronouncements in Parliament about how India would maintain its independence to negotiate, in regard to the nuclear deal, that a repeat of the Bhopal tragedy in which Union Carbide went scot-free will not be allowed in any case, etc., ultimately India has signed on the dotted line. Despite all that is still told for public consumption here about the safety and compensation clauses in the Indian legislation, I am of the view that if some accident happens (God forbid it!) the US suppliers cannot be proceeded against because US has signed the CSC itself with a caveat that US suppliers will be not involved.

It may be recalled that the Manmohan govt. had, at one stage, even tried its best to block the Indian Parliament from scrutinizing the deal, claiming secrecy and privilege. And a majority for passing it was obtained by resorting to very unethical methods. To me there is no need for any more evidence to show that India under the present Govt. is either being secretly blackmailed to comply or the Indian govt. is over-eager to please US at any cost.

The latest position may be seen in Several lacunae remain in `subservient` liability bill: Sinha

Thus the lives of Indians have been sacrificed, for some unexplained reason, to help the US suppliers who have unused parts and want to make money by pushing it on to some pliant country. The original plea of Manmohan govt. about the energy gap etc., was doubted by many persons here.

Again US does not want India to use the Uranium but to surrender it to US. Who else but a factotum will agree to do such unenviable job of running the reactors, taking upon itself all the dangers, and then supply the Uranium for increasing US' own nuclear arsenal?
There are many conjectures floating around as to why this is happening but these are not relevant.

In my opinion President Obama does not consider India as a necessary ally to balance China in Asia. He seems to feel that direct dealings with China will be a better way. For example he has accepted China's role in Pakistan. Now China wants to be a party in the Kashmir dispute. China is saying Kashmir is not Indian territory by issuing stapled visas to Kashmiris. Perhaps it will be difficult for Obama to antagonise China on this issue. Hence, India is some how helping US on the terms set by it and this is what is viewed as subservience.
Please also see page 5 specially of-

Are we going to fight Pakistan or any other country along with the US - Rediff.com News

This article reflects the truth I feel.

 

[sangom]

Sri Sangom Sir,

Please go through the UN resolution on Kashmir


United Nations Security Council Resolution 47 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

First Pakistan has to vacate the portion which it occupied. Pakistan has made things worse by giving some portion of its occupied Kashmir to China. Now Pakistan has to get back the portion from china first, then vacate its own portion and then plebiscite has to be conducted.

Is it possible under the present circumstances?

That is why none of the countries in the world talk about UN resolution now.

Kashmir is a highly complicated issue now. Indian portion has three distinct areas. Buddhist dominated Ladakh, Muslim Majority Kashmir valley and Hindu majority Jammu. Kashmiri pandits who have been thrown out of the valley have to kept in the talks.

POK and Chinese portion of the Kashmir are other two parts to the dispute.

Integrating all these areas into one zone and finding a solution is a very complex issue.

May be accepting Simla agreement and finding a solution with the line of control as international border seems to be the best solution.

The international border could be made soft enabling people on both sides to move without much of hassles so that they can feel comfortable and not divided by national boundaries.

Decentralization of powers to grass root levels to the maximum extent may meet the aspirations of the people at local levels.

Let us hope that better sense prevails among the people and accept the reality in the right spirit.

All the best

Dear Shri RVR,

You said-

"When Pakistan signed the Simla agreement, the UN resolution on Kashmir has become irrelevant.

Simla Agreement - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia"

Now you say something different. I am confused. Can you kindly elaborate?

 

[RVR]

Dear Shri RVR,

You said-

"When Pakistan signed the Simla agreement, the UN resolution on Kashmir has become irrelevant.

Simla Agreement - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia"

Now you say something different. I am confused. Can you kindly elaborate?

Sri Sangom Sir,

UN resolution is there only on paper and it is difficult to implement at this juncture.

On the contrary, both the parties to the dispute, i.e. India and Pakistan have signed Simla Agreement.

Subsequent to Simla agreement, both India and Pakistan are suppose to sort out the matters relating to Kashmir between themselves only through negotiations.

Hence I earnestly feel that Simla agreement has superseded UN resolution as far as India and Pakistan are concerned.

Since UN resolution is not cancelled or amended subsequently, it is still alive but only on paper.

I hope it clarifies my position.

All the best

 

[ganeshrev]

Look at us, we serve our "community" and let others serve their community, so much better. Our rishies are trillion time better than the "western" scientists, all they can do is to make life here on this earth better, but our rishis can make you life after you die a lot better.

Shri Nara

With due respect, I am not sure if the above is any way related to the topic under discussion?It seems to me that you are recording your views on the US Bashers .

In spite of not being relevant, I feel this is a point which deserves separate discussion.

Regards
Revathi

 

[sangom]

Dear Sri Sangom Ji,

Let me post the core issues here with some articles I found useful. Please do not hesitate to shoot my ideas down - I will learn:
1. The treaty had it's genesis first with President Bush and PM Manmohan Singh agreeing on this Framework:
India has a huge need for energy and the fastest and the safest way is through rapid expansion of it's civil nuclear program. If India agrees to the IAEA regime, for her civil program (not military), then USA will ask the NSG(the suppliers) to lift the embargo in place for India. India still do not need to sign the NPT.

This was a huge gesture by President Bush, because he believed implicitly in India as a democracy (may be to contain china's influence in Asia), because I at least at that time knew that the lobby representing NPT was vehemently opposed to this. They felt that by giving India a pass, a precedence is being made and NPT will be violated, not signed by other countries. They pressured the Congress to make India sign the NPT, but the President prevailed - victory, India.

2. MM Singh Ji and Congress had to withstand a 'no confidence' vote because of the communists (they seem to not understand what is in the best interest of India). and got it approved. USA also passed it in congress (despite, I may add, a vigorous lobbying by the usual anti India forces - Pakistan for example).

3. India now passes a liability law not protecting the suppliers (the usual norm is that only the operators are exposed) with huge liabilities, that would bankrupt a small country (by the way, the standard internationally is that only the operators are liable), based on the same emotional issue you cited, on Union Carbide, where I still think that the Indian Government dropped the ball.

4. So, not surprisingly, private company suppliers, such as GE and Westinghouse, (Private companies in the USA have shareholder responsibilities and I do not think that their boards would let their management to expose the company to such huge liability risk) have balked. By the way since these US companies are supplied by a couple of Japanese private companies, I understand that PM MM Singh will be addressing Japanese concerns on this as well.

5. This is why, India's law will not take precedent, irrespective of counter claims. Either India signs the new international regime for liabilities or these companies truly will not supply. This not just about the US. Includes ALL private suppliers.

6. So, India has a choice - they can stand their ground on the law, and lose getting most of the supplier choices. Or they can sign the CSC, which is now signed by many (but ratified by 4).

7. My take on this - I do not think people in India understand how much the USA has done to make this technology available to India.

Please read:
India Weighs Measure to Ease Nuclear Liability Law - WSJ.com
India signs CSC on nuclear damages - The Economic Times
Nuclear Liability: A Continuing Impediment To Nuclear Commerce

Regarding the American weapons - that is a different topic altogether. I would only ask our folks to think through our enemies in the area, what their capabilities are and how best to counter it.

Regards,
KRS

Dear Shri KRS,

India's projections of its energy requirements were questioned at that time itself by many. Again, the nuclear power is expected to bridge only a small fraction (if my memory is correct, 9 percent) of this gap. The extreme urgency and, as I said, the personal interest shown by MMS (and Sonia, of course) raises suspicions about the bonafides of the whole deal to a lot of people here, not only communists and their sympathisers. Government has not given wind power the importance it deserves.

In my view, the GOI which has not been able to provide potable drinking water to most of its people, talking about energy requirements as if the country will be doomed if the nuclear power reactors are not in place, is not convincing at all.

There is a lot of pressure on India by US now, to amend its nuclear liability law. If it is all for India's welfare and benefits US could have just said "Either India signs the new international regime for liabilities or these companies truly will not supply. This not just about the US. Includes ALL private suppliers.", as you say, and stopped there. That is not the attitude of US. There is some undue interest shown by them also. It is therefore reasonable for an average Indian to suspect something unholy in the whole deal (treaty). You have not tried to answer why MMS tried to withold crucial aspects of the deal from the Indian Parliament itself, unless he has certain selfish interest in getting the deal through and report to Bush that "he has done the job", and as if he (MMS) is more knowledgeable than the Indian Parliament itself about what is good for India.

As regards NPT, the whole treaty does not aid India a bit in its nuclear armaments programme. So, there is not much substance in GOI claiming that India is not signing NPT, which is a victory for it.

There were many opinions expressed to the effect that whereas all the developed countries have in principle, decided not to have any more nuclear power stations, there is concerted effort by suppliers like GE and Westinghouse, to unload their inventories on gullible third world countries, and Indian authorities are falling into their traps for reasons not known. The developments so far lend credence to this line of thinking.

I will not be surprised if Sonia and SOFA(viz., MMS who is known as Sonia's First Assistant!) buy another majority (by crook rather than by hook) and amend and dilute the nuclear liability law in order to fall in line with the wishes of their American masters. Much will depend upon the Bihar election results, I feel.

 

[Nara]

With due respect, I am not sure if the above is any way related to the topic under discussion?It seems to me that you are recording your views on the US Bashers.

Yes Revathi, this is not directly connected, but what I was trying to say is, perhaps rather poorly, any opposing view is always derided in these lines -- e.g. "my views are great yours is an ideological rant, etc." It is about bashers in general, and I cited US Bashers as an example.

Cheers!

 

[kunjuppu]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/31/world/asia/31china.html?_r=1&hpw

from today's new york times.

foreign policies and national interests are multi dimensional - for example with the u.s.a, we do need the technology for our energy requirements (just look at continuing blackouts all over based on seasonal rainfall).

the article in the times talk about the nervousness of the neighbours re china. i do not know if there is any nervousness. what is china going to do? occupy india with its billion + problems. occuply vietnam (who kicked them in the battle field about 20 or so years ago)?

i think the days of one country occupying another is long gone. in the long run, it might not matter whether parts of arunachal remain with china, to the expansion of trade and relationships with beijing. half of kashmir may be pakistani, but i think there will be continued cultural exchanges between karachi & mumbai, lahore & delhi ie old affinities reinforcing themselves inspite of official suspicion.

we in the south, especially those who have lived in the south only, i do not know how much we can understand or appreciate the complex hindu muslim relationships especially with its offshoots in pak or kashmir. f

to my muslim tour guide in agra, it felt as if only yesterday aurangzeb ruled. the british simply did not exist.

to my hindu tour guide in jaipur, it was the rajputs of pre islamic india who ruled. the mughals and the english simply were ignored.

once we accept the facts and experiences of history, i think, we will be able to move on. till then there is only stagnation. both of thought and deed.

thank you.

 

[RVR]

Actions are taking place mostly in Asia and hence not only President Obama, other countries have started looking to Asia now.

Recent interview of an ex-Australian Prime Minister is interesting

India will supersede ageing China in Asia: Former Aussie PM - The Times of India

All the best

 

[Nara]

Greetings!

This is a rant, skip if you have already had one too many from me ....

We all have opinions about how others must behave. If our expectations are not met, we react in varying degrees of frustration, some with zero frustration and some others with tons and tons of it, so much so, it must be expressed as loudly as possible. I hope we all know shouting can never make an argument stronger.

Arundhati is a novelist and a social activist. When she won the Booker Prize, the entire nation thought she did them proud. Now, when she takes activist and unpopular stands, she is derided -- go write another novel, she paid a fine instead of going to jail, etc., etc. The point I was trying to make, perhaps it is too fine a point for those under the influence of frustration, even MLK had severe opposition for his activism and for the stands he took, even from his own people. This kind of comparison is often made to illustrate the vapidness or even viciousness of the put downs, not to say she is like MLK or MKG.

For conservative men, all others must behave in a way consistent with their world view, particularly women. If not, her uppity character must be lynched from the nearest web site. It is easy to shoot the messenger, shouting epithets while doing it. But the validity of the message, good or bad, does not change one iota.

 

[RVR]

Militants are submitting peace plans in Jammu & Kashmir

The Hindu : News / National : Militants want to submit peace plan to interlocutors

All the best

 

[Iyyarooraan]

Pity our Netas

Kashmir is head to India, that is, Bharatvarsh, it is a tilak on Bharatmata. Saraswati resides in the North. Kashmir is famous for kumkumum. Kashmir is Indias, but Pakistan got itself separated. Bharatvarsh extended beyond Afganistan. Whatever the international conventions may say Kashmir is not negotiable. The subject of Kashmir is kept alive by the enemies of India, so that the world’s energy group headed by the US, can feed Pakistan. Thus if Kashmir is not there Pakistan will not be there, consequently, the US will not be there in international politics and when that happens, there will be peace, peace and peace. Therefore, Kashmir’s accession should be made complete and irrevocable. The US policy-makers have been consistently eccentric and chase the wild goose. Pakistan has given the US many warnings and the US has proved over and over again that it is hard of learning. Maybe it serves the US’s present interest to pit Pakistan and China against India. We have many volunteers within to serve them, too. Over and above, non-Hindu religions may also be playing a part to destroy our very culture. We have spineless leaders to stand up against the trouble makers. You have to pity these kowtowing netas. India’s economic power is a false build up. The sooner we realize this the less we deceive ourselves. Of course, India can become a nation for reckoning; but we should jettison off the US.

 

[sangom]

Actions are taking place mostly in Asia and hence not only President Obama, other countries have started looking to Asia now.

Recent interview of an ex-Australian Prime Minister is interesting

India will supersede ageing China in Asia: Former Aussie PM - The Times of India

All the best

John Howard says:

"I think one of the problems China has is eventually she will have to decide whether she can maintain a position where the country is economically liberal and open and, politically, still closed and controlled."
But this is not correct, IMO. China is, as of now, not economically liberal or open, nor does it show any sign of changing to one.

As to ageing population, China is a country where unpredictables can happen. Perhaps the outside world does not have a full picture of the remote interiors and whether the one child norm is followed by them. In the meanwhile nothing prevents the ageing population from enjoying the comforts of a larger country!


http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...sie-PM-/articleshow/6846678.cms#ixzz13xZBQek1​

 

[KRS]

Dear Sri sangom Ji,

Please read the following that I found. This generally answers your questions, in a manner more eloquent than I can. Before that however, let me address 3 items you have raised:

1. It is not true that the western nations have concluded that the nuclear energy is not for them. In the USA, where the nuclear power was viewed as risky, because of the famous three rivers mishap, the majority now supports using that energy. In fact two reactors are approved by Obama administration to be built in Georgia this year. France has been aggressively pursuing nuclear energy for decades, if you do not know.

2. India is the only country in the world, who as a non signatory to NPT is getting the benefit. For sustainable energy with minimal carbon foot print, this is an alternative among many choices, as the article points out below. Seems like a victory for India, to me.

3. Profit is not a dirty word. Appropriate profit based on value is how wealth is created. With globalization, everyone competes.

Now the post:

India Needs Nuclear Energy and the Deal
Jump to Comments
By Vinay Gudagatti

I live in a village, a beautiful village and I am very proud of it.


India lives in villages, not one or two but in six lakh villages. Their collective conscience forms the soul of India. When these villages breathe India breathes, when they wilt India wilts. Each village has a life, a vibrant and colorful life. Toiling people form the flesh and bone and their sweat the lifeblood of India. People call them India’s backbone.

On July 22nd in his speech inside the Parliament Mr.Rahul Gandhi mentioned the name of Shashikala, a labourer and a widow belonging to Vidharbha region who was finding it difficult to feed her two boys who were dreaming of becoming District Collectors one day. These two boys daily went to school and when they came back they had to study under a kerosene lamp in the evening as their house is unelectrified.


Shashikala’s family is not alone in their ordeal; there are six hundred million people in India living in the hope of accessing better life and salvation from eternal bondage. In 2007 there were 1, 20,000 villages waiting to be electrified and as per the 2001 census only 43.42% households were electrified!


People living in villages have this strange ability to adapt to any new challenge that they face in their lives. They think that it is in their fate that things happen the way they happen. When things go wrong they blame the fate not the real culprits. Centre to their belief in the fate for every wrong thing that occurs to them is their lack of education. It is only when they realize that they themselves lie at the centre of everything good that occurs in the world, they would be able to come out and question the world why they were forgotten and neglected. And then ascertain their rightful place in the world.


In my village it is not uncommon to see 12-14 hours power cut everyday. Nobody questions why we are deprived of this basic necessity. Nobody questions it because it is NORMAL for them. They have not seen 24 hours of power supply in their lifetime and when they are given little of it; they believe that the things are like this only.


In India villages are the victims of everything. Successive governments have formulated numerous policies, plans, schemes, and projects for the development of villages and its people, but little has changed. They remain the same.


Power crisis in India


On July 24th, Karnataka Government announced 20 percent cut in power supply for Bangalore and 70-80 percent for rural areas. It means unscheduled power cut of 4-6 hours in Bangalore and 16-18 hours in rural areas every day sine die.


Bangalore alone contributes 35 percent of India’s software exports. Service sector contributes 52 percent of India’s GDP.


India faced 9.6 % energy deficit in 2006-2007 and worst is expected this year.


Energy crisis is so grim in India that the government is making all possible efforts to fill this gap. From the Nuclear deal with U.S. to Indo-Pak-Iran gas pipeline to begging small neighboring countries for a portion in their Hydro powers, India is struggling hard. India has signed agreements with Bhutan, Nepal, Myanmar and Nepal for importing Hydro power.


Present state of energy production in India:


Total installed capacity – 1, 44,564 MW


Thermal - 92, 216. 54 MW (64.6%)


Hydro - 36, 033. 76 MW (24.7%)


Nuclear - 4, 1200 MW (2.9%)


Renewable - 12, 194. 57 MW (7.7%)



In 1947, India had only about 4, 000 MW of total installed capacity. Indeed it is a remarkable achievement that we have come so far. But we are still short of about 50,000 MW of energy to sustain the present growth.


Some of the recent policies by the government regarding electricity are:


1) In its Common Minimum Programme the UPA government planned to electrify every household in India by 2009. This project was named Rajiv Gandhi Grameen Vidyutikaran Yojana with an outlay of Rupees 16,000 crore. Still 1, 20,000 villages remain to be electrified.


2) In the National Electricity Policy 2005, it is aimed to increase per capita power consumption from current 631kWh to 1000kWh by 2012. Even in 2008 per capita power consumption remains at 640kWh. World average is 2590 kWh.


3) The Eleventh Plan (2007-2012) has a target of 78,577MW of capacity addition to the present total installed capacity of 1, 44,564.17MW. During 2007-2008 a total of 7,263MW has been commissioned and it is expected to add 10, 821MW by mid 2009.


4) The Eleventh Plan expects power sector to grow at 9.5% per annum. The energy generation growth was 2.34 per cent in June 2008 against a projected 12.19 per cent.



We need nuclear energy


Nuclear energy alone is not the solution. It should be complemented with other resources available within the country.


Out of all other green energy resources nuclear energy has much potential to enhance our energy production program:


1) Hydro power production in India faces stiff resistance from the unfriendly terrain, associated environmental problems, displacement of large number of people, slow implementation due to legal hassles, dependence on unpredictable monsoon, maximum loss in power transmission due to its geographical location and in some cases earthquakes are also caused.

2) Solar energy is the cleanest one but it is also the costliest. Because of its prohibitive cost large-scale implementation is not a viable option. More research is needed in this direction. Until then we can’t sit idly waiting for technological breakthroughs.

3) Wind energy is also a best bet but it can’t be installed in all places and it needs more space for large scale production.

4) Thermal energy production is the mainstay of India’s energy security program. We can’t depend upon them for long as the availability of coal, petroleum and natural gas will decrease with increased demand and also because of lessened reserves.

India has 2, 53, 301 million tonnes of proven reserves of coal. It will be completely depleted by 2070.

India is the 3ed largest oil importer in the world (2.44 million barrels per day)

In April-May 2007 India spent US$11.106 Billion on oil import and in April-May 2008 it spent US$16.484 Billion, whopping 48.5% increase.

5) Thermal power stations are big threat to environment and the atmosphere.


Why India needs the nuclear deal?


If the present growth rate is maintained and the deal fails, then India will face a deficit of 412 GWe by 2050 assuming the requirement of 850GWe of energy by that time.


To fill this gap India has to import 1.6 billion tonnes of coal per annum!


If the deal succeeds, we will be able to import 40GWe LWR’s and unhindered supply of Uranium for all the reactors. With these reactors in place, we can bridge the 412 GWe gap by 2050. The rationale behind this is that, the spent fuel from 40GWe reactors will be used in indigenous FBR program and by 2040 thorium based reactors (AHWR) will pick up their pace due to advancement of technology and the ready availability of fuel. This will consolidate our energy security and by 2060 we will have around 35% of nuclear energy in the country. (DAE)


Initial costs will be heavy but our scientists are working hard towards building more efficient reactors which are also cost effective. Best example is our indigenous space program; best in the world and also cheapest in terms of operational, design and launching costs.


With the deal in place, France, Russia, canada and Australia would find it easy to negotiate more India friendly deals in the future.


Why many people oppose the deal?


Most of the people who oppose the deal are from urban areas (not all). Let them first feel how difficult it’s to live a life in villages with daily 14 hour power cuts.


Those who fear for the sovereignty of India need to be reassured that India is a nation of billion people and has second largest standing army in the world.


Those who think that India would become junior partner of US must be told to have self confidence and self respect first. We can become as powerful as US once this fear of unknown vanishes from the mind and in its place self respect establishes.


There is no meaning in being concerned about how much profit US companies would make, because we also stand to gain much from it.


For a moment please leave aside your argument that India is not being recognized as a nuclear weapon state, it doesn’t matter. We do have nuclear weapons and we can still make bombs.


Lesson from France:

In 1973 France was producing just 3 % of its energy from the nuclear resources. When, in 1974 ‘oil shock’ occurred, it switched to resources other than oil. Until then most of the power plants were run by imported oil alone.


In 2007 France produced 79 % of its energy from the nuclear reactors. It is the largest exporter of power in the world today. It exports 18% of its energy and earns billions of dollars as revenue.


It runs 59 nuclear reactors and till date all have functioned safely. French people love their reactors and are proud to have more of them.


India must grab the opportunity. Fear is our real enemy not the United States of America. Conquer the fear and conquer the world.


If you still think the deal is not good, please come to my beautiful village and stay at my place for a week.



This was posted here:
India Needs Nuclear Energy and the Deal « REFLECTIONS

Regards,
KRS

 

[KRS]

Dear Professor Nara Ji,

I am done talking about Sowbhagyavathi Arundathi Roy. I have said what all I have to say about her recent comments about kASHMIR.

However you said:

For conservative men, all others must behave in a way consistent with their world view, particularly women. If not, her uppity character must be lynched from the nearest web site. It is easy to shoot the messenger, shouting epithets while doing it. But the validity of the message, good or bad, does not change one iota.

Professor, since you have tagged me as conservative before, this seems directed at me. You do not know me, yet you say I am against her because I 'expect her to behave in a particular way, especially because she is a woman?' I do not understand on what basis you are alleging this, based on what facts? Criticizing one particular woman for her remarks that are not based on truth, does not make one a misogynist.

I think, it is the other way around. You can not argue against the truth that Kashmir is a part of India and my detailed rebuttals to your points. So, you go on to making blanket statements, to diminish me. So be it. This Forum knows.

Regards,
KRS

 

[kunjuppu]

folks,

can we please refrain from labelling our honourable brothers and sisters with epithets - intellectuals, pseudo-intellectuals, liberals, conservatives, nri ignoramuses - how much more should we paint each other?

the english language, i don't know, has atleast a billion words and we chose the most limited of that to paint our fellow brethren.

i am always of the view, that no single view or views, should break the foundation of the terms of membership here - ie sense of brethren. we agree in a thread, disagree in a couple. so what? but should we it to such an extreme that we should epithets at each other.

i think great care should be taken in wordsmithing, that we only refer to the subject (topic) and not to the subject (person).

i was hurt a lot when i was inferred as a nonsensitive NRI, which is simply not true. i am not a liberal either, whatever that means.

folks like arundhathi fires passions on both sides. she reminds me of jane fonda of the vietnam war era. 'hanoi jane' she was cursed, as she went to hanoi to witness the u.s bombing of that state.

re kashmir, it flares passions within india and without, that i simply don't know even how to utter that word without inciting feelings of one sort or the other. what i have come to realize that we are all pawns in some big game played by folks in delhi or beijing or islamabad or moscow or washington.

no amount of screaming from the rooftops would make an iota of change anywhere. historical events have proceed at their own speed, and it would be a few decades from now, as to to judge how events progress now.

had we known the facts in 1947 that we know now, our attitude towards kashmir might be different. but then, at that time, nehru was next to god and he could do no wrong. rajaji, kripalani, lohia, dange, masani - all congressmen at one time or the other forsook him, and whatever source of introspection within the congress party there was, disappeared.

soooo, no matter what happens to kashmir, arundhathi or faizal guru, let us not lose our bearings here. let us maintain our dignity and when we write, imagine how this would be read if read out loud, and that alone should be a guide , to a more polite and calmer interaction.

let us not forget, that it is not our aim, to shout out what we believe in. it should not be. for truth only needs to be whispered. and would turn to a scream loud enough to break our ear drums. but in the case of kashmir, truth is hidden deep among an avalanche of lifes, and i think will take a very long time before unearthed...not in my time, anyway.

peace.

 

[kunjuppu]

John Howard says:

"I think one of the problems China has is eventually she will have to decide whether she can maintain a position where the country is economically liberal and open and, politically, still closed and controlled."
But this is not correct, IMO. China is, as of now, not economically liberal or open, nor does it show any sign of changing to one.

As to ageing population, China is a country where unpredictables can happen. Perhaps the outside world does not have a full picture of the remote interiors and whether the one child norm is followed by them. In the meanwhile nothing prevents the ageing population from enjoying the comforts of a larger country!


http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...sie-PM-/articleshow/6846678.cms#ixzz13xZBQek1​

sangom,

i agree with you. much is said of china's ageing population and there is i suspect a (death) wish in the west (particularly usa) that china will behave like japan and have a lopsided old population and the young will refuse to breed.

i credit the chinese government and leadership with far more intelligence than that. one only have to look at their domestic or foreign policy since deng xiao ping. not one misstep.

the chinese are a patient lot, believe that time is on their side, took a long term view of economic vision and have ruthless pursued those pots of gold at the end of the rainbow.

just yesterday, china announced that it has the fastest computer in the world - 1.4 times faster than what the usa the hitherto champion had. they have had a singluar purpose ie to make china a respected nation in the world. they do not waste words and i have to agree, that a majority of the chinese people, view the dissident movement, at the most a distraction.

none of my chinese friends give a kind thought to the dissidents. to these, who have been born in china, the challenge starts from the enormous task of feeding more than a billion people. there are a lot of articles these days, particularly from the west, quoted extensively in india, that in the long run, due to our democracy, india will race ahead of china.

i think, it is not right to quote those westerners - many of them, i think, are ignorant of both india and china. many would like nothing better than incite the both of us, and watch the fun. and supply arms and make money.

to deal with china, we should know ourselves. we should know our goals. we shoud know our limitations. even if we want, we cannot behave like china. if we become a dictatorial nation like china, all probabalities are that we would likely turn into another pakistan or similar tin pot dictatorship.

due to our multiple ethnicities, languages, religions, castes, creeds, religions - i think democracy is the best mode of government. but we all know the pace of democratic development. so it is best, that we do not compare ourselves to china. let us compare ourselves to where we were, and how far we have come. better still, how far we still have to go.

thank you.