Poonam Pandey

[Nara]

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A lot has been written about Poonam or Pandey or whatever, but surely, she is no more than an imitator as Cricket is to Football. When it comes to world-wide appeal, just look at this beauty from Paraguay, who not only vowed to bare it all for the team she ostensibly loves, but run in public in that condition -- some revealing pictures here.

All said and done, to harp on the supposed sexual hold women have on men is, in the final analysis, nothing more progressive than to see women as sex objects -- enough with it, please.

Cheers!

 

[renuka]

A lot has been written about Poonam or Pandey or whatever, but surely, she is no more than an imitator as Cricket is to Football. When it comes to world-wide appeal, just look at this beauty from Paraguay, who not only vowed to bare it all for the team she ostensibly loves, but run in public in that condition -- some revealing pictures here.

All said and done, to harp on the supposed sexual hold women have on men is, in the final analysis, nothing more progressive than to see women as sex objects -- enough with it, please.

Cheers!

Dear Nara anna,

U know thats one real advantage woman have over man..the visual appeal of a woman can get wonders done.

See I feel to handle a male sometimes all we need is to boost his ego and Lo behold!!! you get your stuff done..no use trying to project an image of a intelligent and powerful woman..that doesn't work!!!

So at the end of the day..the male got deceived and we female got our work done and now that whats being intelligent is all about.

 

[sangom]

Dear Nara anna,

U know thats one real advantage woman have over man..the visual appeal of a woman can get wonders done.

See I feel to handle a male sometimes all we need is to boost his ego and Lo behold!!! you get your stuff done..no use trying to project an image of a intelligent and powerful woman..that doesn't work!!!

So at the end of the day..the male got deceived and we female got our work done and now that whats being intelligent is all about.

Smt. Renuka,

I agree 101% with you. That is what nature wants too.

Regarding Gita and Arjuna, one version I have read, and it is highly pragmatic, is that the war-deciders were, after all, Arjuna and Karna on the two sides. Krishna was aware of Indra protecting his offspring Arjuna by depriving Karna of the latter's kavaca & kundala. Kunti also had obtained a promise from Karna that he would spare Arjuna, if there was war. So, if Arjuna was not to take part in the war, the result would be well-known beforehand — defeat of the Pandavas. Krishna did not want this because, as yet another ruler of the Vrishni clan, temporarily settled in Dwaraka, exiled from Mathura, he had an eye on the long-lost Mathura; he wanted the friendly Pandavas in the west, not the inimical Kauravas (though Pandavas were also Kauravas, technically) if he was to come back to rule Mathura. Hence Krishna's all-out effort at persuading a reluctant Arjuna to fight.

There is also a view of some history scholars that in the Gupta dynasty, or nearabout (I forget the details now) there was one fratricidal war for which one brother was extremely reluctant — just like Arjuna, because killing one's own people would be an unpardonable sin — but the crafty brahmans wrote down a long poem in a short period to convince the reluctant ruler that there was puranic precedent for fratricidal war. The original geeta was short, consisting of about 100 slokas or less, and confined to Samkhya principles only. This longish poem as also the original geeta, both got embellished continually to the present behemoth of an epic and the present BG!

 

[renuka]

Dear Sangom sir,

I would beg to differ...Is kiling Svajana a sin?
Why are we seeing difference in Svajana and non Svajana?
So is it Ok for a police officer to arrest anothers son and let his son go free for the same crime?

Why do we shed tears for the death of our kinsmen but when a non related individual dies( even in a terrible manner we read in papers) most of us dont shed a tear..

For nonsvajana all principles of Dharma applies but for Svajana nothing is applied..becos of ATTACHEMENT....

Its not easy getting over attachment its like a crocodile gripping our leg in the river till we realize that we are our own crocodiles.

I dont think Krishna had any personal interest for any land or throne.He was just teaching all of us through Arjuna how to rise above everything and anything.
He didnt even have a needle point surface area of interest besides upholding Dharma in the well weaved Bhagavad Geeta.

 

[sangom]

Dear Sangom sir,

I would beg to differ...Is kiling Svajana a sin?
Why are we seeing difference in Svajana and non Svajana?
So is it Ok for a police officer to arrest anothers son and let his son go free for the same crime?

Why do we shed tears for the death of our kinsmen but when a non related individual dies( even in a terrible manner we read in papers) most of us dont shed a tear..

For nonsvajana all principles of Dharma applies but for Svajana nothing is applied..becos of ATTACHEMENT....

Its not easy getting over attachment its like a crocodile gripping our leg in the river till we realize that we are our own crocodiles.

I dont think Krishna had any personal interest for any land or throne.He was just teaching all of us through Arjuna how to rise above everything and anything.
He didnt even have a needle point surface area of interest besides upholding Dharma in the well weaved Bhagavad Geeta.

Smt. Renuka,

Re. Krishna I know your views. What I wrote was for general info of all members/readers, and not to inconvenience your beliefs.

Killing anyone is wrong, but our dharmasastras say that it is the duty of a kshatriya to kill enemies in a war; so no sin arises. This is certified by Krishna (whom you and most others hold as the Supreme Godhead itself) indirectly —

hato vā prāpsyasi svargaṃ jitvā vā bhokṣyase mahīm |
tasmāduttiṣṭha kaunteya yuddhāya kṛtaniścaya: || bha. gī. 2-37

"you will gain swarga if killed in the war" and an act which facilitates such "swargapraapti" cannot be a sin just as, according to the Vedas themselves, sacrificial killing of animals was not a sin at all. But killing swajana that too fratricide, killing guru, grandfather, etc., was considered sin even if it was war. That is my impression. The dharmic way out for the Pandavas would have been to go and seek shelter in some other country, even they could have gone to Dwaraka. But curiously, it was the "Dharmaputra" who decides on war and the martial Arjuna who has rethinking.

That Krishna was depicted only as an ordinary mortal prince/king in M.Bh. even in the first two chapters of BG; it is only in Ch.III that he is made to utter "puraa proktaa mayaa" which is interpreted to mean "by me at the beginning of this world/chaturyuga, etc., and superhumanist aura is foisted on him.

M.Bh. also talks of Arjuna suspecting Krishna making the Kurus fight to extinction so that he could conquer the Kuru country easily; Arjuna draws out his sword, in the heat of anger, to kill Krishna but is forbidden by Yudhishtira.

 

[renuka]

Smt. Renuka,

Re. Krishna I know your views. What I wrote was for general info of all members/readers, and not to inconvenience your beliefs.

Killing anyone is wrong, but our dharmasastras say that it is the duty of a kshatriya to kill enemies in a war; so no sin arises. This is certified by Krishna (whom you and most others hold as the Supreme Godhead itself) indirectly —

hato vā prāpsyasi svargaṃ jitvā vā bhokṣyase mahīm |
tasmāduttiṣṭha kaunteya yuddhāya kṛtaniścaya: || bha. gī. 2-37

"you will gain swarga if killed in the war" and an act which facilitates such "swargapraapti" cannot be a sin just as, according to the Vedas themselves, sacrificial killing of animals was not a sin at all. But killing swajana that too fratricide, killing guru, grandfather, etc., was considered sin even if it was war. That is my impression. The dharmic way out for the Pandavas would have been to go and seek shelter in some other country, even they could have gone to Dwaraka. But curiously, it was the "Dharmaputra" who decides on war and the martial Arjuna who has rethinking.

That Krishna was depicted only as an ordinary mortal prince/king in M.Bh. even in the first two chapters of BG; it is only in Ch.III that he is made to utter "puraa proktaa mayaa" which is interpreted to mean "by me at the beginning of this world/chaturyuga, etc., and superhumanist aura is foisted on him.

M.Bh. also talks of Arjuna suspecting Krishna making the Kurus fight to extinction so that he could conquer the Kuru country easily; Arjuna draws out his sword, in the heat of anger, to kill Krishna but is forbidden by Yudhishtira.

Dear Sangom sir,

See in war even these days..do we call a soldier a murderer and give him a death sentence?
Can i be viewed as a murderer becos in my day to day job as a doctor i prescribe antibiotics to kill bacteria in any clinical bacterial infection?
Its the same circumstances here also in Mahabharat.
Isnt a soldier who fights,defends and kills the unrighteous enemy of the country also decorated with medals?
Isn't that like 'Svarga' too?
Why isnt the same honour given to a serial killer...the word is Dharma.
One followed Dharma and one didnt.

So its very clear Krishna doesn't sanction unjust killing and neither was He tempting Arjuna that "Yo dude! whats your problem? just kill these guys.. you will get the earth or heaven..either way you will benefit ...so dont stop!!! never give up!!!"

Regarding Arjuna angry with Krishna and drew sword to kill Him..see that just shows symbolically the deluded Jeeva unaware of Paramatma who is right in front of him and may need to draw out the Sword of Discrimination to decide whats best for him..he can make the wrong choice too by not realizing his mistake and regretting later or finally making the right choice when Dharma(represented by Yudhisthira) intervenes.

a song i know describes the deluded Jeeva well..just a line from it..

तू मुजको देख रहा कबसे

मैं तेरा दर्शन कर न सका

tu mujko dekh rahaa kabse
main teraa darshan kar na sakaa

 

[biswa]

Gita vs Koran vs Bible

Ok, since this thread has a mind of its own that always makes it veer away from Poonam Pandey towards Bhagavad Gita, I thought I will ask a question regarding the absolute nature of Gita.

Many of us downplay the Koran as a historical text which emphasize medieval values, suppression of women etc. Likewise the Bible that we may ridicule when faced with evangelists who disavow evolution, superiority of their god over ours and so on.

Does the Gita have any such problems when viewed from the outside? Or is it timeless (the outdated stuff in our religion being confined to docs such as Manusmriti?)

 

[biswa]

All said and done, to harp on the supposed sexual hold women have on men is, in the final analysis, nothing more progressive than to see women as sex objects -- enough with it, please.
Cheers!

Ok tell me this, why is it that only women come up with these declarations like Ms. Pandey did? We all know that the real targets are not those male footballers/cricketers.

And when do you think we may see a similar announcement from Mr. Abhishek Bacchan, Surya or Yuvraj Singh, and how many takers will there be for that show? After all, there should be gender equality in the absence of the afore-mentioned "hold", don't you think?

 

[biswa]

Dear Sangom sir,

See in war even these days..do we call a soldier a murderer and give him a death sentence?
Can i be viewed as a murderer becos in my day to day job as a doctor i prescribe antibiotics to kill bacteria in any clinical bacterial infection?

Perhaps this has already been quoted here before:
“Kill a man, and you are a murderer. Kill millions of men, and you are a conqueror. Kill everyone, and you are a god.”
Jean Rostand quotes (French Historian and Biologist, 1894-1977)

No doubt the god he was referring to must be Krishna. I think a clause should be added for a doctor and bacteria.

 

[Iyyarooraan]

Ok tell me this, why is it that only women come up with these declarations like Ms. Pandey did? We all know that the real targets are not those male footballers/cricketers.

And when do you think we may see a similar announcement from Mr. Abhishek Bacchan, Surya or Yuvraj Singh, and how many takers will there be for that show? After all, there should be gender equality in the absence of the afore-mentioned "hold", don't you think?

Why celebs, many munis and sanyasins are ready to occupy space. In a nation, we have not tolerated total naked "Shravanabelagola" and the like. But here we will be infringing women's rights!?

 

[Nara]

Ok tell me this, why is it that only women come up with these declarations like Ms. Pandey did?

Well, I don't know, may be some women are manipulative as sis Renu says. But, to streak or not, is gender neutral, David Niven was startled by one of his own gender in an Oscar awards ceremony many years ago.

Streaking in sports events is an equal opportunity exhibitionist activity, men are no less into such proclivities. There have been at least as many men streakers as women.

Anyway, my point was not about who wants to streak, but it was about the habit among some men who claim abject vulnerability to the sexual charms of women. This oversimplified stereotyping, I think, promotes, or at least acquiesces viewing women as sex objects.

......Does the Gita have any such problems when viewed from the outside? Or is it timeless (the outdated stuff in our religion being confined to docs such as Manusmriti?)

BG does contain droplets of such poison, see 9.32.

Cheers!

 

[Raghy]

Sri.Biswa asked -

Ok tell me this, why is it that only women come up with these declarations like Ms. Pandey did? We all know that the real targets are not those male footballers/cricketers.

I have seen members of the male gender bare for a cause too. Here is an example .... (There are more too; like foot ballers, defence force etc.). Baring for a cause is just that. Gender is not counted.

Gallery Calendars

(More information can be had in that web page).

Cheers!

 

[renuka]

Sri.Biswa asked -



I have seen members of the male gender bare for a cause too. Here is an example .... (There are more too; like foot ballers, defence force etc.). Baring for a cause is just that. Gender is not counted.

Gallery Calendars

(More information can be had in that web page).

Cheers!

Dear Raghy Sir,

I clicked open the link and what I see..no one is Bare!!!!..heheheheheehe
No Digambara i see all with some Ambara only..anyway since they are from AgniKula(fire fighters) so its still some eye candy....Thanks Raghy sir..U Rock!!!

 

[sangom]

Ok, since this thread has a mind of its own that always makes it veer away from Poonam Pandey towards Bhagavad Gita, I thought I will ask a question regarding the absolute nature of Gita.

Many of us downplay the Koran as a historical text which emphasize medieval values, suppression of women etc. Likewise the Bible that we may ridicule when faced with evangelists who disavow evolution, superiority of their god over ours and so on.

Does the Gita have any such problems when viewed from the outside? Or is it timeless (the outdated stuff in our religion being confined to docs such as Manusmriti?)

Shri Biswa,

BG shares one characteristic with Quran and Bible, IMHO. All three ultimately project a certain view of some supreme, inerrant godhead. Krishna who would most probably have been an ordinary mortal, has become the very highest god, mainly because of BG. That text itself is much revised, with probable additions and interpolations because, once Krishna was depicted as having endorsed the samkhya pov, the yoga pov was added, then slowly the advaita pov, like that. That the mischief started possibly with some yoga-supporter may be guessed by the fact that each chapter is called by the name of one yoga or another. (arjuna vishaada yoga may be interpreted as the combination or harmonization of arjuna and sadness, for example )

 

[renuka]

Dear Sangom sir,

May i kindly seek your opinion on Parashuraama,Raama,Buddha too..just curious a little.
Cos in a previous thread you had mentioned that Lord Krishna is a recent entry into Hinduism ..and you kind of view Him as a mortal like us..cos I was wondering why then in Narayana Upanishad Lord Krishna's name is mentioned as Devaki Putrah when the attributes of Narayana is described if He was recent entry and why linked to Narayana if He was a mere mortal.

I really want your opinion on the other Avatars of Lord Vishnu too.
Hopefully you will oblige..

 

[CLN]

renukakarthikayan 's post #65

Perhaps you may get some answers in the thread I started some time ago called "Dasavatharams of Lord Vishnu" under the same 'General Discussions'. I hope Shri Nara, Shri Sangom and others who have contributed there may add some thing more now to your specific query too.

 

[renuka]

Perhaps you may get some answers in the thread I started some time ago called "Dasavatharams of Lord Vishnu" under the same 'General Discussions'. I hope Shri Nara, Shri Sangom and others who have contributed there may add some thing more now to your specific query too.

Dear Sir,

Thanks sir..but i want Sangoms opinion ...cant wait.hehehehheeh

 

[CLN]

Dear Sir,

Thanks sir..but i want Sangoms opinion ...cant wait.hehehehheeh

Sure madam! I won't stop, or rather, I can't stop him answering, Can I? But, as I have pointed out, Shri Sangom himself has answered there to my query (which is some what similar to yours) also in my thread, you can see.

 

[CLN]

Bad news for all those who were waiting for Poonam Pandey to do her promised act!

Please read http://www.bollywoodmantra.com/news/bcci-forbids-poonam-pandey-from-striping/7156/

 

[renuka]

Sure madam! I won't stop, or rather, I can't stop him answering, Can I? But, as I have pointed out, Shri Sangom himself has answered there to my query (which is some what similar to yours) also in my thread, you can see.

Ok sir..thank you..i will see..

 

[renuka]

Well, I don't know, may be some women are manipulative as sis Renu says. But, to streak or not, is gender neutral, David Niven was startled by one of his own gender in an Oscar awards ceremony many years ago.

Streaking in sports events is an equal opportunity exhibitionist activity, men are no less into such proclivities. There have been at least as many men streakers as women.

Anyway, my point was not about who wants to streak, but it was about the habit among some men who claim abject vulnerability to the sexual charms of women. This oversimplified stereotyping, I think, promotes, or at least acquiesces viewing women as sex objects.


BG does contain droplets of such poison, see 9.32.

Cheers!

Nara anna,
u know its not being manipulative to deal with a male ego as i had mentioned..u see its has benefits:
1)less conflicts
2)work is done
3)male thinks he is God and a female is a demigod or an Apsara.
4)female thinks" who cares which God he thinks he is as long in Bhuloka there is peace at home"

And dear Anna BG 9.32 is not Poison...see Lord Krishna didnt enumerate woman,vaishyas,sudras etc as low born,,He was saying Low born and the following that is other varnas,females etc..you see He knew our poisoned dualistic biased minds so He made sure any so called low born and other Varnas and females are not left out for anything.
He was just very technical..thats all..Its palatable..not Poison..

 

[sangom]

Dear Sangom sir,

May i kindly seek your opinion on Parashuraama,Raama,Buddha too..just curious a little.
Cos in a previous thread you had mentioned that Lord Krishna is a recent entry into Hinduism ..and you kind of view Him as a mortal like us..cos I was wondering why then in Narayana Upanishad Lord Krishna's name is mentioned as Devaki Putrah when the attributes of Narayana is described if He was recent entry and why linked to Narayana if He was a mere mortal.

I really want your opinion on the other Avatars of Lord Vishnu too.
Hopefully you will oblige..

Smt. Renuka,

Knowing your firm belief in whatever religion/religious orthodoxy wants one to believe, I wonder why you are seeking my opinion! Anyway, my opinion on the ten avataars is , as Shri CLN rightly said, in this post.

As regards Buddha, the only prevalent document treating him as an avataar is the geetagovindam. So, I am not going into that now.

Narayanopanishad (NU) is not the Mahanarayanopanishad which forms part of the Taittireeya Krishna Yajurveda. This NU, very like Krishna himself is a much later concoction, most probably by the gaudeeyas. Hence no wonder that Devakeeputra is depicted as brahman itself ! I attach an excerpt from Paul Deussen's book on Upanjshads.

 

[renuka]

Dear Sangom sir,

I dont view you as different from me in my beliefs..You feel i have a firm believe in religion/God and to me i feel you give your opinion on religion/God..see our views might differ but the Topic is the same..so either way we are contemplating on the Truth which you are entitled to call it in anyway.

thank you for prompt reply.

 

[kunjuppu]

Bad news for all those who were waiting for Poonam Pandey to do her promised act!

Please read BCCI forbids Poonam Pandey from striping | Poonam Pandey

bcci is a bunch of old men with constipation a right cause for being uptight. they should learn to 'hang loose', or maybe they are already, and need some medication. and i do mean to be punny here.

 

[CLN]

bcci is a bunch of old men with constipation a right cause for being uptight. they should learn to 'hang loose', or maybe they are already, and need some medication. and i do mean to be punny here.

Ha Ha Ha !