Sharing my shock with you!

[renuka]

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renu

witness for what?for action isn't it?

not action only...Atma is the witness for Thought,Word and Deed..
Hence the Trikarana Suddhi (Purity in Thought,Word and Deed) is of utmost importance.

 

[vijisesh]

Dear KR Subramanian ji,


Agreed, that It would be worth while to gain some positive karma by looking after elders when they are alive , rather than helping them elevate step by step ,going up the pathway to heaven by doing tharpanams !

So much of techno breakthru's why haven't they installed elevators/ escalators to heaven ?

But more often , the practice / rituals that comes having cultural backgrounds get embedded into deep layers within ourselves that we chose to perform them to make others happy !

Dear Friends Arewe not drifting away from the original thread posted? The discussion is now regarding pindam etc. It is better to look after elders when there are alive and get their blessings rather than doing rituals after their death. After death rituals are helpful to vadhyars only.

IN ancient days female were not given education and kept looking house hold duties. Now having received education and widened their knowledge earning money have changed their view towards life. We have not fully westernised to look at par with women. We are in transit period hence we could not digest full freedom of women. When we upgrade ourself to look at par with women where is the question of caste religion etc?

 

[nachi naga]

Sri nachi naga ji,

Well said....

As you said there is nothing wrong to be in guise through out our life and play different role with different mind set and motive as the situation demands...

After retirement, social involvement comparatively declines, physical fitness drastically declines and in many cases need to show to the society that "I am a religious man carrying bundle of philosophical knowledge and experience, and wants to bless the growing kids" and be in bakthi maargam...because that's seems to be only solution to be in peace and to seek apology to God for the sins we have committed knowingly or unknowingly as the situation demanded and the brain/body acted. Because many believe that Atma is not the doer, it's just witness what the body does..

But I believe with my limited self knowledge and understanding that, the whole body from the head to the toe, is just apparatus for the atma to act and react as per the gunas of the Atma, that again with the help of spirituality and basic human knowledge, that atma gains during its tenure of survival in this earth in the form of human, can understand and strive to live the right way. The more the atma understands, carrying all the senses of its pre-programmed exclusive apparatus, it helps the atma to strive for moksham.

In all the religion, it's believed by many people that, one can do what ever one wants in his/her life time for the benefit of one self and one's family, but if surrendered to GOD seeking apology sincerely before death, can wash out all their sins.

It's really interesting to get to know such tricks...

"Ishwar, Allah, Wahe Guru, Chaahe Kaho Sri Ram, Maalik Sabka Ek Hai, Alag-Alag Hai Naam"

And in the same way, what ever we have done during our life span, doesn’t matter.. When we surrender to GOD at the end, we all are purified souls.

ravi sir

well written,there is no doubt in my mind,of your pure honest self.thanks for being with us in the forum,appreciate your posts a lot and enjoy them.

 

[nachi naga]

not action only...Atma is the witness for Thought,Word and Deed..
Hence the Trikarana Suddhi (Purity in Thought,Word and Deed) is of utmost importance.

renu

true well said,actually it could be called as 'chatur-karana' siddhi too,as we are living miracles on earth.pray to our mom and dad,to have been instrument,for delivering our athma with their part bodies sharing with us.jai ho matha pitha bandhu tum he hoe

 

[suraju06]

The shocking episode.......

Friends! please excuse me for breaking the line and taking you back to the original shocking incident reported by the starter of this thread.
To me it appears that the following reasons can be attributed to such shocking incidents happening in some brahmi9n families.
1. Unlike in old times when marriages used to be arranged early in life when the girl and boy would not have formed firm likes and dislikes, these days we arrange the marriage of boys and girls beyond the age of 20. They would have already acquired what behavioural scientists call "values" and would have formed firm likes and dislikes. If the parents had understood the uniqueness of being a brahmin they should have passed on that knowledge to their children by having frequent dialogues with them in the formative years. Many parents do not do that. The values picked up in schools and generally in their interactions with friends go as gospel truths into the value systems of the children. When they look for confirmation and reiteration of these values to their parents, it is not forthcoming either because of ignorance on the part of parents or because of indifference or lack of time. For instance when a child comes and asks "are all equal?" it requires a detailed answer spread over several sessions at different levels depending on the child's evolution and growth. Unfortunately this is not happening. This is one of the reasons for such shocking incidents.
2)Parents never bother to equip themselves first with the necessary knowledge about the uniqueness of being a brahmin. They are themselves in the dark and they know only intuitively that there is something special about it and that it should not be lost. They never go to a learned guru to know more.
3)Parents fail to closely observe the changes that are taking place in the minds of their children and take steps to handle them on time. They become wise only after the event. Interacting with your children as a friend and following what is happening to him or her is an onerous duty and many parents just skip it.
4)Finally the effect of body chemicals. No human being can win over the tyranny of these chemicals unless he/she is tethered to his/her roots with strong bonds of parental love & affection, knowledge about ones roots and will power. Those who did not get the benefit of these anchors from their parents simply drift and we have such shocking incidents as explained in the first post here.
I am ready for a debate on what i have posted above if there are questions. Cheers.

 

[nachi naga]

Friends! please excuse me for breaking the line and taking you back to the original shocking incident reported by the starter of this thread.
To me it appears that the following reasons can be attributed to such shocking incidents happening in some brahmi9n families.
1. Unlike in old times when marriages used to be arranged early in life when the girl and boy would not have formed firm likes and dislikes, these days we arrange the marriage of boys and girls beyond the age of 20. They would have already acquired what behavioural scientists call "values" and would have formed firm likes and dislikes. If the parents had understood the uniqueness of being a brahmin they should have passed on that knowledge to their children by having frequent dialogues with them in the formative years. Many parents do not do that. The values picked up in schools and generally in their interactions with friends go as gospel truths into the value systems of the children. When they look for confirmation and reiteration of these values to their parents, it is not forthcoming either because of ignorance on the part of parents or because of indifference or lack of time. For instance when a child comes and asks "are all equal?" it requires a detailed answer spread over several sessions at different levels depending on the child's evolution and growth. Unfortunately this is not happening. This is one of the reasons for such shocking incidents.
2)Parents never bother to equip themselves first with the necessary knowledge about the uniqueness of being a brahmin. They are themselves in the dark and they know only intuitively that there is something special about it and that it should not be lost. They never go to a learned guru to know more.
3)Parents fail to closely observe the changes that are taking place in the minds of their children and take steps to handle them on time. They become wise only after the event. Interacting with your children as a friend and following what is happening to him or her is an onerous duty and many parents just skip it.
4)Finally the effect of body chemicals. No human being can win over the tyranny of these chemicals unless he/she is tethered to his/her roots with strong bonds of parental love & affection, knowledge about ones roots and will power. Those who did not get the benefit of these anchors from their parents simply drift and we have such shocking incidents as explained in the first post here.
I am ready for a debate on what i have posted above if there are questions. Cheers.

suaju06,

sterling truth explained succintly.even here in this forum we see the uniqueness of a heritage and a eagerness to value and tradition,to future generation.the process of being born is te same,but all of us are not equal despite given equal oppurtunities.each of us have a ceratain personality traits.as brahmins,we need to learn our hindu culture,from our gurus,but they themselves need,shanthi,owing to number of mundane things that they need to get involved.

at least india is fortunate to have a lots of sath athmas guiding,in this some maybe a bogus spurious fraud,who learnt the vedic sutras,but indulges in activities,that do not behoove,of that of a rishi.

chilren by nature like to mingle with other children of their own age group,or peers.its natural curiousity for them to ask questions,as parents it love bound emotion,that we explain all questions that children ask,to their satisfaction,to instill self-esteem and self-confidence,in their character.

 

[Ramacchandran]

The presnt day brahmins prefer money rather than tradition and culture. We sacrifice our Sandyavanthanam to catch our first bus and return after a hard day work. Even retired people are fiding it difficalt to chant japa as they loose teeth.

In the matrimonial sites we find profiles of the girls/ or from their parents seeking a groom who is well educated earning more than 50,000 to 100,000 per month!1 (Really don't know if a person at the age of 25/27 will earn Rs 100,000 per month???

If the boy earns Rs100,000 per month the girls side quote she need not worry for expances!!! (What kinds of expances???). This will create OODARITHANAM, which is un natural.

Our ladies are good in savings and a calcullated life. But why Rs100,000 per month??
If a big house is owned or rented we need several servents to maintain, and we feel all alone in a big house.
We refer our house with the palaces that is shown in Cinemas not kowing that they are only artificial sets and compare ouselves with heros and heroines.
This un wanted desire is mentioned as KAMA in our litreture and we must/ the ladies must rule them/ controll them. So they are identified as KAMAKSHIs

Let us suppose a man gets Rs100,000 per month at the age of 25/ 27 he wish to spend onParties, drinks and girls, hiding the fact that he is drunkard or womanazer and marriage is fixed and conducted and lateron the wife finds it, what she will do? will she compansate the loss with money he earns??

This I had seen many of our Brahmin boys who earns money, spending on week end parties and says that he is relaxing after a hard work.

The companies also throw open parties with high priced liquors after successful compleation of a project with a foreigner which earned him a good amount and sharing his joy over liquors.

To make a self control our forefathers conducted meditations and called them as japas which was misunderstood as waste of time.

Hence through this I appeal!!! our young generation when you marry and give birth to a child teach our culture and traditions and avoid parties and unnessary expances.

 

[vtv_ram9002]

Dear all,

For the last some months I didn't take part in this. Reason, I had a shocking news at that time that affected me a lot. After a long think over I am posting the news here.

One of my good friend, a philosopher, a top official in a govt org, daughter who is highly qualified, a brahmin drawing more than Rs.100,000 per month married a non hindu!

Few weeks before that marriage I visited him, enquired about the proposals and he proudly said, "You know Ram, I am looking for a groom who either doing his own business with two or three cars in his door, he must pay salary to at least 50 staffs and a good profit" etc., etc., or he must be a doctor, for whom I can gift a nursing home. But he should be in India that too in Tamil Nadu.

I agreed with him and left the palace.

After nearly 15 days I was told by some one that the girl married a Non Hindu, at the register office and at that time of marriage she was 3 months pregnent!
Now a baby boy born but with disabilities.

Now that every parent of the bride or groom offer education to his son/ daughter and after good education placeing them in high paid job using his influence and after that searching for a groom who is earning more than the bride.
They prefer IAS/IPS USA IIM, IIT etc., and if you ask the groom side they say our Sambhandhis should be wealthy enough so that he can spend more for the marriage and honey moon should be in SWISS!

Our brahmins now a days wish to go behind money but money can make manythings but not satisfaction. You can buy rituals at your door by paying high fees to the prohit. But you can not change a Chritisn or Muslim as brahmin.
The Brahmin community is facing a set back, where getting a seat in Engg collage itself is a dream for brahmin. He might be a good student in learing but hardly 20% get a seat. Wherever he goes he is facing challange and he fights for his rights.
The life will be sweet if the couple earns their own hard earned money and save and spend them.
If a rich man / couple after marrying if they coceive and after the brth of the baby, will hand over the responsibilties to MiL or house maids.
The parents fail to understand that the Grand Son or daughter should offer thila tharpanam after the death of the Grand father!
The vasam will break its chain if it is not continued and the unwanted wish will put every one in trouble.

I wish our members to share their views. Ofcourse I guess my friend who is affected will also read this tread as a guest!
He already admired my postings in this site and encouraged me a lot.

For those who have been watching the matrimonial scene for the past 10 years, there is absolutely nothing shocking about this. An artificial scarcity of brides has been created by a few vested interests , who are thriving on matrimonial business. The girls believe that they are much in demand and hence have built up tall expectations. The boys are slowly but steadily drifting towards intercaste marriages. If this situation coninues, one can find brahmins only in the elite circle!!

 

[Iyer]

Firstly every Brahmin needs to realize and understand that we are living in a dynamic world and a competitive one in that. Brahmins have since long realized that intelligence is not exclusively their's. Non-brahmins have proved intelligent too. Gone are the days when brahmins could confine themselves like a cocoon in agraharams and chathirams. Merely because one is born in a brahmin family does not ensure one could overcome the desire to earn money. Almost every brahmin youth of the present century wants to land in America. That is their priority in life. Everyone shall please admit it. Sandhyavandanams and brahmin culture are not the priority of today's brahmin youth. Almost every brahmin youth in america is a non-vegetarian, drinks, flirts with girls, gratifies his lust by visiting call girls, throwing into air every ethic and etiquette that was an asset of brahmins. Has Being Born a Brahmin naturally instilled in one the power to overcome temptations, lust etc.? I have seen many non-brahmin youth who live a sanctified chaste life. They choose only vegetarian food having realized the value of it. They abstain from sexual immorality and live a life of integrity. By conduct and character they are more brahmin-like than many kula-brahmins. So what is in being born of brahmin parents? Somewhere something is wrong. We need to identity the root cause and correct it, if brahminism needs to survive. Else in this rapidly changing world, the brahmin race is sure to become extinct. It is high time brahmins come out of their shell, adjust to change while yet retaining their pristine culture. Mechanical performance of sandhyavandanams and gayathri japas does not build character. Character building shall be separated from adherence to rituals and every brahmin parent shall prioritize character building and rear their wards accordingly.

 

[renuka]

Firstly every Brahmin needs to realize and understand that we are living in a dynamic world and a competitive one in that. Brahmins have since long realized that intelligence is not exclusively their's. Non-brahmins have proved intelligent too. Gone are the days when brahmins could confine themselves like a cocoon in agraharams and chathirams. Merely because one is born in a brahmin family does not ensure one could overcome the desire to earn money. Almost every brahmin youth of the present century wants to land in America. That is their priority in life. Everyone shall please admit it. Sandhyavandanams and brahmin culture are not the priority of today's brahmin youth. Almost every brahmin youth in america is a non-vegetarian, drinks, flirts with girls, gratifies his lust by visiting call girls, throwing into air every ethic and etiquette that was an asset of brahmins. Has Being Born a Brahmin naturally instilled in one the power to overcome temptations, lust etc.? I have seen many non-brahmin youth who live a sanctified chaste life. They choose only vegetarian food having realized the value of it. They abstain from sexual immorality and live a life of integrity. By conduct and character they are more brahmin-like than many kula-brahmins. So what is in being born of brahmin parents? Somewhere something is wrong. We need to identity the root cause and correct it, if brahminism needs to survive. Else in this rapidly changing world, the brahmin race is sure to become extinct. It is high time brahmins come out of their shell, adjust to change while yet retaining their pristine culture. Mechanical performance of sandhyavandanams and gayathri japas does not build character. Character building shall be separated from adherence to rituals and every brahmin parent shall prioritize character building and rear their wards accordingly.

Dear sir..

what you have brought up is very significant not only to the Brahmin community..but the entire human race...
Parents should prioritize character building...and parents should also know that they can only try their best and dont hope too much to reap the results they want for their children..

sometimes parents try their best for children...but children will eventually do what they want to..its destiny..

so just do our duty and leave the results whether good or bad entirely up to God..

To a certain level its all up to Takdir...


YouTube - Michael Jackson - Heal The World

 

[Ramacchandran]

First of all maximum ladies prefer to quit the job after delivering a child! They need to take care of their child. The newly wed couple prefers to separatly after marriage which lands them in trouble since there is no one to look after their child once she leaves for work, the child is at the mercy of her/his care taker.
When seeking the groom they sy their daughter i earning 75,000 per month and the groom should earn t least Rs100,000 per month!
I use to wonder how far it is possible. Few marriage websites if you go through you will the funniest announcements/ needs. (In Expectations Column)
We are brahmin caste and most of us are brahmins and it is well known fact most of us are educated but live with moderate salary.
I happen to see some divorced profiles too, that states innocent!!! bride divorced within months god alone the reason for the divorce!
Even that girl also says she needs a groom who earns Rs50,000 per month.

 

[C RAVI]

First of all maximum ladies prefer to quit the job after delivering a child! They need to take care of their child. The newly wed couple prefers to separatly after marriage which lands them in trouble since there is no one to look after their child once she leaves for work, the child is at the mercy of her/his care taker.
When seeking the groom they sy their daughter i earning 75,000 per month and the groom should earn t least Rs100,000 per month!
I use to wonder how far it is possible. Few marriage websites if you go through you will the funniest announcements/ needs. (In Expectations Column)
We are brahmin caste and most of us are brahmins and it is well known fact most of us are educated but live with moderate salary.
I happen to see some divorced profiles too, that states innocent!!! bride divorced within months god alone the reason for the divorce!
Even that girl also says she needs a groom who earns Rs50,000 per month.

There are many such comedies going on in this regard Sir...

We must request Vaigaipuyal Mr.Vadivelu to do a movie on this subject with the title - "Iruvathi voraam Nootraandu Pulagesigal"

 

[Ramacchandran]

Whoever (The persons against us) sees the marriage websites will think that Brahmins are the richest and Tamtam that since all the grooms and brahmins are rich, they should not be given any reservation and if at all they need let them enjoy with 0-1%.

 

[puzhavai]

But these earning wives,hate to have their parents in law at home...They earn enough to employ a daytime servant who can do household activities and see to the needs of a child or two..The loving mamiyar and mamanar can .and will,supervise evrything including childcare..There shud b sme adjustment both sides...This is the advice i've given to my daughter who got married recently and who wished to postpone childbirth for the reasons u quoted...Dr Bhavani Chandrasekharan.

 

[kr subramanian]

Merely because one is born in a brahmin family does not ensure one could overcome the desire to earn money. Almost every brahmin youth of the present century wants to land in America. That is their priority in life

have seen many non-brahmin youth who live a sanctified chaste life. They choose only vegetarian food having realized the value of it. They abstain from sexual immorality and live a life of integrity. By conduct and character they are more brahmin-like than many kula-brahmin

Sir your above two lines itself shows that not by birth one becomes brahmin. I can give many examples of how a cultured brahmin boy (as assumed by us on his behaviour here) in India goes to the other maximum extent when lands in a foreign country.
There are umpteen examples in PUranas, of Rishis, Munis who fell down in small temptation. Whether it is anger, Nari or drinks they fell down cheaply. So wher is the control ? where is the culture. If a person trained for years controlling his mindand budhi fells down ina fraction of second how can you blame adhunik brahmin boy?

 

[Iyer]

"........Sir your above two lines itself shows that not by birth one becomes brahmin.

How many of us in this forum agree to this Truth? How many would claim he is indeed Brahmin by virtue of Character, Conduct and rules laid out in scriptures and not by virtue of birth?

I can give many examples of how a cultured brahmin boy (as assumed by us on his behaviour here) in India goes to the other maximum extent when lands in a foreign country.

Why would a Brahmin boy yield to temptations of lust of the eyes, lust of the flesh and pride of life in a foreign country?

There are umpteen examples in PUranas, of Rishis, Munis who fell down in small temptation. Whether it is anger, Nari or drinks they fell down cheaply. So wher is the control ? where is the culture. If a person trained for years controlling his mindand budhi fells down ina fraction of second how can you blame adhunik brahmin boy?

Then why are we still regarding them as rishis and sages? Why are we calling ourselves Brahmins just because we are Brahmins by birth?

Regards,
Iyer.

 

[renuka]

dear all..
actually on a personal basis..i rather not identify myself with any caste or tribe..
its much better that way..too much identification will put unwanted pressure on anyone and all hell might break loose when "freedom" is available..
regarding the rishis..they were also humans..and they learnt the hard way what brings them eternal bliss..if we dont experience sorrow brought upon by the 6 headed serpent ..Kama,Krodha, Lobha,Mada,Moha,Matsarya how will be appreciate and attain bliss?
a child learns to walk by falling down a couple of times..thats all..look at it that way...

Its better if we strive to be good humans instead of being a good brahmin or good kshatriya,vaisya,sudra etc..
Just be our own selves..let our own innate divinity rule us..

after all arent we all Chidananda Roopa Shivoham Shivoham..

YouTube - CHIDANANDA ROOPAH SHIVOHAM by Pandit Jasraj Shiv Upasana Vol 3

 

[Neeyathi]

Dear Folks,
Being a brahmin myself, i was a bit dismayed to read such a thing happening. We know are a minor part of the society i guess and the social behaviour in the society about our Brahmin creed is declining.

It is just that one gives in too much importance to the superficial aspects of life that one tends to make such mistakes and sin carries on.
yada yada karmam tada tada jannanam. Part of such behaviour and changes not to follow our tradition springs from past karma, present karma and future karma.

I am not sure if this post is meaningful , but we should abide by our scriptures, vedas and rituals. they govern our life in some way or the other.

 

[C RAVI]

Dear Folks,
Being a brahmin myself, i was a bit dismayed to read such a thing happening. We know are a minor part of the society i guess and the social behaviour in the society about our Brahmin creed is declining.

It is just that one gives in too much importance to the superficial aspects of life that one tends to make such mistakes and sin carries on.
yada yada karmam tada tada jannanam. Part of such behaviour and changes not to follow our tradition springs from past karma, present karma and future karma.

I am not sure if this post is meaningful , but we should abide by our scriptures, vedas and rituals. they govern our life in some way or the other.

:yo:

 

[suvarchas]

Dear NachiJi,

I thought the Gandharva form of marriage is not permitted for a Brahmin.
And in Gandharva form of marriage..Garlands/rings are exchanged ala Shakunthala and Dushyant..

You are right.Gandharva vivaha is not for Brahmins,but only arsha,Daiva and Praajapatyam

 

[nachi naga]

brahmin is one who knows brahman,for them such a gandharva marriage is permitted.the present lot of brahmins fall either as by birth alone or by virtue of carrying the life as ordained by brahmanas,which by the way varies geographically from place to place.a brahmana of west bengal is different in many life style as compared to a brahmana of tamizh nadu or kerala or karanataka or andhra pradesh....it's kinda relative,no absolutism in sanathana dharma as we are a constant dynamic religion...

 

[C RAVI]

we are a constant dynamic religion...

waah waah....Sahi jawaab...

Nachi naga avargale....in this context I believe, the reason behind the saying - "Hinduism in not a religion, it's a way of life", stands perfectly good...

 

[nachi naga]

ravi saar

the darshana's are the basis of our religion or sanathana dharma.so,it's important one follow's his sva-dharma,which has to be ascertained by virtue of spiritual inquiry,for which guru's guide us.some follow hereditary pattern like gene theory some follow the ability to live life as sanctified by rituals & scriptures.rituals and scriptures are tools for enlightenment,but not a absolute necessity for attaining self-realisation,as whom you seek resides within oneself itself.

 

[kr subramanian]

ravi saar

the darshana's are the basis of our religion or sanathana dharma.so,it's important one follow's his sva-dharma,which has to be ascertained by virtue of spiritual inquiry,for which guru's guide us.some follow hereditary pattern like gene theory some follow the ability to live life as sanctified by rituals & scriptures.rituals and scriptures are tools for enlightenment,but not a absolute necessity for attaining self-realisation,as whom you seek resides within oneself itself.

So a person need not be a brahmin to attain self realisation. He has to be a Human first and last. He shoud have love to his fellow beings as well as animals.
Let me ask how many of us are following the rituals correctly as designed by elders. WE are either not following or acting in front of society as if we are following.Since we are in the transit period we want to show ourself modern to the society/world and at the same time convince ourself we are following rituals. From the bullock cart era we are in the internet era. The whole world, their way of living ,are in front of us and temptation, freedom are a click away.
Let us first learn to love our parents, family members, fellow humans neighbours. The rest will follow :gossip:

 

[nachi naga]

So a person need not be a brahmin to attain self realisation. He has to be a Human first and last. He shoud have love to his fellow beings as well as animals.
Let me ask how many of us are following the rituals correctly as designed by elders. WE are either not following or acting in front of society as if we are following.Since we are in the transit period we want to show ourself modern to the society/world and at the same time convince ourself we are following rituals. From the bullock cart era we are in the internet era. The whole world, their way of living ,are in front of us and temptation, freedom are a click away.
Let us first learn to love our parents, family members, fellow humans neighbours. The rest will follow :gossip:

well said krs.ray: