You have rightly said it sir. It is not a property of any religion. So also, sir , God is not a property of any religion sir. There is one who is greater than Ramana Maharishi sir. God realization is greater than Self realization sir. Through religion you cannot realize God sir. You will have to shed all religions to realize God sir (""Sarva Dharman Parithyajya .... "" Gita 18.66). Any realization other than God is a waste in my humble opinion sir.
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Who is Brahmanan
- Thread starter Raghy
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You have rightly said it sir. It is not a property of any religion. So also, sir , God is not a property of any religion sir. There is one who is greater than Ramana Maharishi sir. God realization is greater than Self realization sir. Through religion you cannot realize God sir. You will have to shed all religions to realize God sir (""Sarva Dharman Parithyajya .... "" Gita 18.66). Any realization other than God is a waste in my humble opinion sir.
RVR
0
As per Advaitha philosophy, Jeevathma and Paramathma are one and the same. But we cannot be saying the about statement without realising it. For realising it, Ramana Maharishi's self enquiry is a path. That is my understanding of Ramana Maharishi's philosophy.
Once we go in to self enquiry, probably we may realise that we are not this body and something else. What is that some thing? Is it paramathma itself? It has to be realised by each one of us by our own experience.
Reading any amount of books will not get answer to the above question and it is my humble opinion, it has to be self realised by each one of us.
I always believe Mahathma Gandhi's famous statement `God has no religion'
All the best
did not know gandhi ji had said such a thing.....perhaps he understood that the whole concept of 'religion' is just crap.
whenever ppl approach me convert, i have asked them "what is god's religion?"
hinduism is not a religion.
its really sad if one were to merely link just the caste system with native indian spiritual beliefs...
RVR
0
I read the statement else where but I could get the following weblink immediately
StumbleUpon.com: SU Agnostics: "God has no Religion" - Gandhi
All the best
N
Nara
Guest
Hello dear Raghy, let me ask you a question, if you want to pep somebody up would you do that by putting somebody else down?
For example, let us suppose that your daughter who graduated from Ivy league school is worried about getting into say medical school. When giving her a pep talk, would you say to her that look at these x, y, z who graduated from a tiny state school with open admission -- they have gotten into medical school, so you, having graduated from an Ivy league school, why do you have any doubt, you will definitely get in?
This is what these shlokas mean. In order to boost Arjuna's morale, Krishna says to him, look at these women, vaishya and shudra, born to papayonayaha, even they can get moksham by doing saranagathi to me, that brahmanas and kshatriyas of noble and punya birth goes without saying.
This is downright abhorrent to me.
Just think about it one more time and whatever you conclude I wish you peace on this subject.
Cheers!
N
Nara
Guest
Dear HH, greetings!
I have always wondered what people mean when they say hinduism is not a religion. Perhaps what is meant by this is that hinduism is as much the customs, traditions, and practices of the people as the theistic and spiritual aspects.
If this is so, then, the caste system is part and parcel of hinduism, isn't?
Cheers!
N
Nara
Guest
Hello Smt. Renuka:
There is so much interpolation in MB it is really hard to tell what is real history and what is not. BG could very well have been one of those interpolations. BG is not referenced directly or indirectly anywhere in the Dhivya Prabhandhams. MB yuddam is cited in some pasurams. Some even reference Krishna as charioteer for Arjuna. But nothing about Krishna giving upadesham to Arjuna. This has led some academics to think BG itself was later addition, later to the Azhvars. This would put BG in 8th century CE.
BTW, academics have dated Bhagavatham to be around 8th century CE.
Cheers!
S
sapthajihva
Guest
This might be somewhat relevant to this thread....
http://www.tamilbrahmins.com/philosophy-traditions/1672-who-brahmin.html
http://www.tamilbrahmins.com/philosophy-traditions/1672-who-brahmin.html
Sorry SIR! I differ in my opinion SIR! I don't accept Advaitha philosophy SIR! Hence I don't honor Sankaracharya SIR! I am in no way obliged to honor him SIR!
Dvaitha is acceptable to me to some extent SIR!
I respect you as an erudite scholar in hinduism SIR! But in all humility I wish to state that you have not known enough SIR!
Self Realization is an utter criminal waste of time SIR! Indeed man has realized much of himself SIR! All the scientific inventions and technology, together with its evils is indeed a result of man's self realization SIR!
"Kattradhu Kai Man alavu. Kalladhadhu Ulagalavu"
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renuka
Well-known member
There is no one and only way in the journey of Self/God Realization.
Feel free to choose the multiple choice God has given us to realize HIM.
a) Advaitam(Non Dualism)
b) Vishishta Advaitam(Qualified Non Dualism)
c) Dvaitam(Dualism)
note: this is the only multiple choice question where there is more than one answer, no right or wrong,no negative marking ,you mark the answer paper yourself and you are both the student and the teacher.
Feel free to choose the multiple choice God has given us to realize HIM.
a) Advaitam(Non Dualism)
b) Vishishta Advaitam(Qualified Non Dualism)
c) Dvaitam(Dualism)
note: this is the only multiple choice question where there is more than one answer, no right or wrong,no negative marking ,you mark the answer paper yourself and you are both the student and the teacher.
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RVR
0
Absolutely no problem. You have your opinion and let me have my opinion. You don't have to use salutations at the end of every sentence.
I respect Madhvachariar and I have personally visited the Brindavan of Guru Raghavendrar. Before such great saints, what I learnt is `nothing'.
I personally feel that Sankarar, Ramanujar and Madhvar are all great saints and have left multiple choices for us to follow. It is upto us to choose the path and all the paths have the same goal.
All the best
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RVR
0
Absolutely right. There is no single answer to the question and there are three correct answers. It is up to the individual to choose the path.
Personally each one of us follow the path already chosen by our parents. Mostly we don't change the path of our parents. It is just accidental and it is not our choice.
Then coming to my personal choice, I just share my experience.
I read several books from J.Krishnamoorthi to Swamy Vivekanandha to Paramacharyal.
I read Azhwar, Nayanmar, Thirumoolar, Pattinathar, Arunagirinathar and others.
Thirumoolar is some thing which is great. Thirumandhiram is a wonderful literature. Those who don't know Tamil can have English translation also in the website.
Late CNA adopted the words of Thirumoolar `Onre Kulam, Oruvane Devan' ஒன்றே குலம் ஒருவனே தேவன். It has appealed to a declared rationalist like Late Sri CNA.
There are several wonderful sentences like the above and one has to go inside and taste it.
Pattinathar is suppose to be an avatar of wealth God Kuberan but gave up all materialistic pleasures and wrote a poem with the following meaning.
"I have a small piece of cloth to wear as கோமணம் Komanam
I have some torn clothes to cover my body from bad weather
There are several platforms to sleep
There are rivers and water tanks were I can take bath.
I have a begging bowl to practice my profession.
When I beg in front of your temple, there are several kind hearted people willing to offer me my daily requirements.
I have every thing in life.
I only require a mind which always think about you".
When I read the above, I didn't know what to do. Why I am going after worldly pleasures. If at all there is something to be achieved, it is reaching the lotus feet of God only
The topic is quite interesting and I shall write more.
All the best
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Sri Nara,
This is scary stuff! How did you know?
“Hello dear Raghy, let me ask you a question, if you want to pep somebody up would you do that by putting somebody else down?
For example, let us suppose that your daughter who graduated from Ivy league school is worried about getting into say medical school. When giving her a pep talk, would you say to her that look at these x, y, z who graduated from a tiny state school with open admission -- they have gotten into medical school, so you, having graduated from an Ivy league school, why do you have any doubt, you will definitely get in?”
Sri Nara, I don’t know how you chose this example. Such a conversation indeed took place as mentioned by you with my daughter. How ever, there were few differences though- firstly, my pep talk did not include others in praise or degradation. I gave a simple straight forward talk; secondly, she did not show any interest in medical school. So, the answer to your question is, ‘no, I will not do such a thing’.
Sri Nara said:-
“This is what these shlokas mean. In order to boost Arjuna's morale, Krishna says to him, look at these women, vaishya and shudra, born to papayonayaha, even they can get moksham by doing saranagathi to me, that brahmanas and kshatriyas of noble and punya birth goes without saying.
This is downright abhorrent to me.”
Sri Nara,
Your message in post #81 was a scary stuff for me, because, this is the exact question asked off me, years before. I am not going to patch-up with silly explanations. You are right. When you ask this question, then there can be no answer.
Sri Nara said:-
“Just think about it one more time and whatever you conclude I wish you peace on this subject.”
Sri Nara,
Thank you very much for this nice ‘debate’. From the very beginning, you did not want to ‘win’ this debate. In your shoes, possibly I would have shredded my ‘arguments’. You opted not to do that.
Here are the points you could have raised in the very first post of your ‘debate’.
1.Others were following birth based varna and jati because they were not guided by Krishna. But how did birth based jati and varna prevail in indraprastha under pandavas rule, when Krishna was their mentor and advisor?
2.Granted BG was revealed only during Kurukshetra war. But how did birth based jati and varna prevail under Dhrma’s rule after the war, after dharma listened to BG?
3. Leave alone Pandavas and others; was Dwaraka free from birth based jati and varna under Krishna’s own rule?
You could have asked any of these questions or more pointed questions. You did not do that, as I can see, you did not want to ‘win’ this ‘debate’. I bow my head in reverence to you for exhibiting the patience to ‘debate’ with me.
In the future, kindly allow me to approach you in ‘debate (!?) or in enquiry to learn from you. Thank you. Cheers!
This is scary stuff! How did you know?
“Hello dear Raghy, let me ask you a question, if you want to pep somebody up would you do that by putting somebody else down?
For example, let us suppose that your daughter who graduated from Ivy league school is worried about getting into say medical school. When giving her a pep talk, would you say to her that look at these x, y, z who graduated from a tiny state school with open admission -- they have gotten into medical school, so you, having graduated from an Ivy league school, why do you have any doubt, you will definitely get in?”
Sri Nara, I don’t know how you chose this example. Such a conversation indeed took place as mentioned by you with my daughter. How ever, there were few differences though- firstly, my pep talk did not include others in praise or degradation. I gave a simple straight forward talk; secondly, she did not show any interest in medical school. So, the answer to your question is, ‘no, I will not do such a thing’.
Sri Nara said:-
“This is what these shlokas mean. In order to boost Arjuna's morale, Krishna says to him, look at these women, vaishya and shudra, born to papayonayaha, even they can get moksham by doing saranagathi to me, that brahmanas and kshatriyas of noble and punya birth goes without saying.
This is downright abhorrent to me.”
Sri Nara,
Your message in post #81 was a scary stuff for me, because, this is the exact question asked off me, years before. I am not going to patch-up with silly explanations. You are right. When you ask this question, then there can be no answer.
Sri Nara said:-
“Just think about it one more time and whatever you conclude I wish you peace on this subject.”
Sri Nara,
Thank you very much for this nice ‘debate’. From the very beginning, you did not want to ‘win’ this debate. In your shoes, possibly I would have shredded my ‘arguments’. You opted not to do that.
Here are the points you could have raised in the very first post of your ‘debate’.
1.Others were following birth based varna and jati because they were not guided by Krishna. But how did birth based jati and varna prevail in indraprastha under pandavas rule, when Krishna was their mentor and advisor?
2.Granted BG was revealed only during Kurukshetra war. But how did birth based jati and varna prevail under Dhrma’s rule after the war, after dharma listened to BG?
3. Leave alone Pandavas and others; was Dwaraka free from birth based jati and varna under Krishna’s own rule?
You could have asked any of these questions or more pointed questions. You did not do that, as I can see, you did not want to ‘win’ this ‘debate’. I bow my head in reverence to you for exhibiting the patience to ‘debate’ with me.
In the future, kindly allow me to approach you in ‘debate (!?) or in enquiry to learn from you. Thank you. Cheers!
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You have said it right. There is only one way to realize God. And that is God Himself is the way. You humble yourself before God and He will reveal Himself to you. So simple!!. You don't need to realize yourself at all. On the contrary you need to UNREALIZE yourself, deny yourself, shed your ego to realize God. You don't need any Dvaitha, or Advaitha or Visishtadvaita which only intellectuals can understand, which an ordinary man cannot understand. In fact none of these philosophies will help you relate with God. What is the point in accumulating all knowledge if at the end you cannot relate with God, if you cannot connect with Him? God is within reach of the humble, the simple, the modest. In front of God we all are zeroes and nothing. We cannot boast of our Science which is Nescience before the wisdom of God. Our self-righteousness and Self-exultation separates us from God.
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N
Nara
Guest
I don't want any part of such a god who will show himself up only if I humble myself before him, thank you very much. I seem to have more compassion for my children than this god you talk about.
Thank you sir. Please forgive this Abhishtu. This abhishtu does not know anything. All these knowledge of philosophy, consciousness, super-consciousness, does not go into the numskull of this abhishtu. This abhishtu is no intellectual.
Yedho Angnathule appadi pesiyutten.
All that went into the numskull of this abhishtu is this. "You shall love your God with all your heart, all your soul and all your might. You shall love your neighbour as yourselves". Beyond that nothing went into the mind of this abhishtu.
"Sarva Dharman Parithyajya Ma Mekam SARANAM vraja. Aham thva sarva papebyo Moksha isyami. Ma Sucha" .. Gita 18:66
May God Bless you.
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renuka
Well-known member
We need to rid ourselves of Ahamkara( I am the Doer ship feeling) and attachment in order to discover the pure unsullied Atma.
Its not easy though. Getting rid of attachment & Ahamkara has never been an easy process.
Its a steady race one may participate in any time of one's life or maybe in another life.
There is no compulsion to participate either.
The simplest way to unfold God in us is to Love All & Serve All.
Dont place God too far way from us.
Search for Him from within and not from without.
Always remember the Mahavakya Aham Brahmaasmi and we will ultimately realize Tat Tvam Asi.
Its not easy though. Getting rid of attachment & Ahamkara has never been an easy process.
Its a steady race one may participate in any time of one's life or maybe in another life.
There is no compulsion to participate either.
The simplest way to unfold God in us is to Love All & Serve All.
Dont place God too far way from us.
Search for Him from within and not from without.
Always remember the Mahavakya Aham Brahmaasmi and we will ultimately realize Tat Tvam Asi.
You cannot realize God by your own might, your own power, your own self or by your own efforts. Even to realize God you need to humble before Him and ask Him to help you. Indeed God is willing to help, waiting for you to ask. He is gentle. Until you humble yourself and ask, He will not bother you. You need to taste the Agape Love of God. It is not at all difficult to shed your ahamkara. If you think it is difficult it is difficult indeed. Your iniquities separate you from God. His hand is not shortened that He will not save, nor His ears deaf that He will not hear. The easiest thing in this world is to realize God. Unprogram and uncondition yourself. Unrealize yourself. You will realize God and you will find Him when you seek Him diligently, with all your heart.
N
Nara
Guest
Hello,
In as far as these are Vedic statements they make sense only in the sense interpreted by bhagavat Ramanauja.
Having said that, I don't know why we need a god to be good, and why a personal god, if there is one, wouldn't show himself/herself up.
Cheers!
N
Nara
Guest
N
Nara
Guest
renuka
Well-known member
Dear Naraji,
I agree with you that we can be good on our own without any external driving force.
Being good is essentially Human.
Certain Religions have the "Devil" concept to instill fear in people to make them pray and be good.
So if just say the "Devil" is dead. many might not want to pray or be good anymore because they were driven by an external force and were good because they were afraid.
Being Good is our innate divinity verily God itself.
I agree with you that we can be good on our own without any external driving force.
Being good is essentially Human.
Certain Religions have the "Devil" concept to instill fear in people to make them pray and be good.
So if just say the "Devil" is dead. many might not want to pray or be good anymore because they were driven by an external force and were good because they were afraid.
Being Good is our innate divinity verily God itself.
RVR
0
Where is a real Brarahmin?
Can we identify a living real `Brahmin' as per the description of Lord Krishna?
If not, can we identify a person who is close to a real Brahmin living today and also deficiencies which makes him not a real Brahmin?
If we are able to find answers to the above, the purpose of the thread will be achieved.
All the best
Can we identify a living real `Brahmin' as per the description of Lord Krishna?
If not, can we identify a person who is close to a real Brahmin living today and also deficiencies which makes him not a real Brahmin?
If we are able to find answers to the above, the purpose of the thread will be achieved.
All the best
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