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without comments
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Raji Ram
Active member
I think this is your comment, Sir, though the caption says 'without comments'!the work of விஷமிகள் no doubt..........
Smt RR
:clap2:
Yay Yem
:clap2:
Yay Yem
Brahmanyan
Active member
Surprised, but interesting !
Brahmanyan,
Bangalore.
Brahmanyan,
Bangalore.
The title of this thread prompts me to post this:
Rahul Gandhi's general knowledge!
From a mail I received:
Shocking state of Rahul Gandhis General Knowledge - YouTube
Rahul Gandhi's general knowledge!
From a mail I received:
Shocking state of Rahul Gandhis General Knowledge - YouTube
Brahmanyan
Active member
Congress Vice President Rahul Gandhi is a reluctant leader pushed to position of importance by self seeking sycophants. If he is serious in heading the Government, first he should read the book "Discovery of India" written by his great grand father .
Brahmanyan,
Bangalore.
sangom
0
But look at the advantages—Rahul will make Gujarat bigger than UK and India bigger than Europe & UK put together. His ggf could not do any such thing and, in fact, he, the ggf, lost half of Kashmir and much of the NE India because he was not as intelligent as the ggson, possibly!!
bi-camera gives stereo vision is old news. Today, bi-camera refers to front and rear cameras of ipad or mobiles, giving my-view and mine-view!
renuka
Well-known member
Dear Suraju ji,
That is not what I meant.BTW I am 100% sure you know what I meant in my post.
I have high regards for true religious individuals like Jayendra Saraswathi who dedicate their lives to God.
Such individuals have Sama Darshinah..that is what I meant as he does not have dualistic vision like the rest of us who still see the pairs of opposite.
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tks
0
All cynicism aside about Nithyananda I do think this is a good thing for Sri Jayendra Swamigal to do.
I know my view will NOT be popular view within this 'quick judging community'.
While I have not tracked all the scandals in details I do have some idea based on limited exposure and interest.
Nithyananda having elevated himself to a leadership role in the eyes of many should have been more careful since by engaging in questionable activities he brought bad name to the tradition of Sannyasa. But he has been politically astute and has secured his leadership role again. I am sure he may have lost many followers but he can always find more. If there are people willing to pay $1000 to touch his feet that is their business. He has created his own brand of 'teaching' that sells.
In my view Nithyananda has done largely good for many people. Some years ago I came to know of Nithyananda's existence from some people in positions of influence. I heard he was visiting the Ganesha temple at NY from one of his followers and since I happened to be in the area I was curious to see who this person was. By the time I got around to visiting that area his lecture must have been over but there was a long line stretching out into the street just to see him.
Rather than see him I talked to those standing in the line. There was quite a number of Americans who had come from many different places to see him and get his blessings. Many told me that they had many ailments that got cured after attending his sessions and following his teaching. Perhaps they are fools or perhaps they are not. Who are we to judge? All I could sense from that interaction is that Nithyananda has had some good effects on these people.
Later the scandals broke out. If he had sex or not it is really irrelevant in my view . Perhaps he is not a true Sannyasi but it need not negate the effects of whatever brand of Tantra and other things he was teaching. If people wanted to pay him money to see him that is their choice. There is no need in my view to be parental or narrow minded that he ought to fit into our mold of what a teacher should be. Except for the Tantric R&D with some willing women (possibly) he has largely done good for people.
I am sure there are too many things fabricated against him that are simply not true and turned out to be so. Plus the way the recording was done requiring sophisticated planning that leads me to think that there are larger forces behind the creation of the scandal.
Christianity and Islam like to rule the world. Pope in 2000 had declared that India has to be 'harvested' in this new millennium. There are people with lots of money who would love to target those that call themselves the umbrella term Hindus.
Nithyananda was becoming a power icon and he was a non-brahmin by birth if I understand correctly. I am sure powerful money is behind a lot of fabrication and he was a easy target. He failed to protect himself.
Similarly Swami Jayendra Saraswathi was targeted and slapped with murder charges. Even if there is a small chance it could be true there was no due process when he was put in Jail. If Pope was arrested by Police on Christmas I am sure courageous Christians would be willing to do anything to demand justice all around the world. But many Hindus and many so called Brahmins by birth would not come forward to ask for due process.
Swami Jayendra Saraswathi was an easy target and I will not be surprised if destroying this icon of Hinduism had its origin in those with enormous money power perhaps outside India.
If Swami Jayendar Saraswathi is truly a great person he need not reason like the average person on the street.
Besides joining hands with Nithyananda will assure mutual survival for both playing leadership roles within Hindu communities.
Playing such leadership roles does not mean they cannot be true Sannyasi - only a person with limited understanding will see contradiction in this statement.
I do not think there are any God men or any such thing.
All these people tend to do some good, hence people go to them.
Let us wish them the best..
I know my view will NOT be popular view within this 'quick judging community'.
While I have not tracked all the scandals in details I do have some idea based on limited exposure and interest.
Nithyananda having elevated himself to a leadership role in the eyes of many should have been more careful since by engaging in questionable activities he brought bad name to the tradition of Sannyasa. But he has been politically astute and has secured his leadership role again. I am sure he may have lost many followers but he can always find more. If there are people willing to pay $1000 to touch his feet that is their business. He has created his own brand of 'teaching' that sells.
In my view Nithyananda has done largely good for many people. Some years ago I came to know of Nithyananda's existence from some people in positions of influence. I heard he was visiting the Ganesha temple at NY from one of his followers and since I happened to be in the area I was curious to see who this person was. By the time I got around to visiting that area his lecture must have been over but there was a long line stretching out into the street just to see him.
Rather than see him I talked to those standing in the line. There was quite a number of Americans who had come from many different places to see him and get his blessings. Many told me that they had many ailments that got cured after attending his sessions and following his teaching. Perhaps they are fools or perhaps they are not. Who are we to judge? All I could sense from that interaction is that Nithyananda has had some good effects on these people.
Later the scandals broke out. If he had sex or not it is really irrelevant in my view . Perhaps he is not a true Sannyasi but it need not negate the effects of whatever brand of Tantra and other things he was teaching. If people wanted to pay him money to see him that is their choice. There is no need in my view to be parental or narrow minded that he ought to fit into our mold of what a teacher should be. Except for the Tantric R&D with some willing women (possibly) he has largely done good for people.
I am sure there are too many things fabricated against him that are simply not true and turned out to be so. Plus the way the recording was done requiring sophisticated planning that leads me to think that there are larger forces behind the creation of the scandal.
Christianity and Islam like to rule the world. Pope in 2000 had declared that India has to be 'harvested' in this new millennium. There are people with lots of money who would love to target those that call themselves the umbrella term Hindus.
Nithyananda was becoming a power icon and he was a non-brahmin by birth if I understand correctly. I am sure powerful money is behind a lot of fabrication and he was a easy target. He failed to protect himself.
Similarly Swami Jayendra Saraswathi was targeted and slapped with murder charges. Even if there is a small chance it could be true there was no due process when he was put in Jail. If Pope was arrested by Police on Christmas I am sure courageous Christians would be willing to do anything to demand justice all around the world. But many Hindus and many so called Brahmins by birth would not come forward to ask for due process.
Swami Jayendra Saraswathi was an easy target and I will not be surprised if destroying this icon of Hinduism had its origin in those with enormous money power perhaps outside India.
If Swami Jayendar Saraswathi is truly a great person he need not reason like the average person on the street.
Besides joining hands with Nithyananda will assure mutual survival for both playing leadership roles within Hindu communities.
Playing such leadership roles does not mean they cannot be true Sannyasi - only a person with limited understanding will see contradiction in this statement.
I do not think there are any God men or any such thing.
All these people tend to do some good, hence people go to them.
Let us wish them the best..
Last edited by a moderator:
renuka
Well-known member
BTW what really surprises me is...many were not very happy with Kamal Hassan's Anti TB undertones in the movie Vishwaroopam...but seeing many post here..many are sort of not too happy with Jayendra Sarasawati's meeting with Nithyananda..so aren't many people here being anti Jayendra Saraswati who is a fellow TB?
So what actually makes people happy??
So what actually makes people happy??
sravna
Well-known member
I personally feel that religious leaders should stay away from politics. Unless you are an avatar of God you cannot but dirty yourself if you get yourself involved in politics. There is so much at stake for those who are in politics and high positions that if anything contrary to their interest happens they don't hesitate to neutralize that whoever might be the cause.
Ultimately and inevitably it is the Godmen who get involved in politics who earn a bad name for themselves and along with that for the religion. So they should be aware they carry the responsibility of upholding the sanctity of religion and not involve themselves in matters that are not only extraneous to their responsibilities but are also detrimental to self and religion.
Ultimately and inevitably it is the Godmen who get involved in politics who earn a bad name for themselves and along with that for the religion. So they should be aware they carry the responsibility of upholding the sanctity of religion and not involve themselves in matters that are not only extraneous to their responsibilities but are also detrimental to self and religion.
renuka
Well-known member
Dear Sravna,
But how does Jayendra Saraswathi action proves detrimental to self and religion?
I don't get it..can you be more specific?
Dear sravna,
You said:
One way of keeping away from controversies is to keep aloof as suggested by you. Attend to only religious matters, do your daily pooja, give lectures to sishyas, offer clarifications on Sruti and smrutis and keep quiet rest of the time. This is not possible these days. Being in the thick of a fast changing society the acharyas have to guide their followers in many worldly matters too. Not doing anything in worldly matters to the followers will be equivalent to disowning them and followers will go looking for alternative leaders. So there is another way of dealing with the situation. I am giving this as a suggestion. If this happens to be read by some one in the higher levels of the hierarchy in the matom he may give some thought to this. My this suggestion comes from my experience with christian religious heads ( I had the opportunities to deal with them).
Present administrative set up in matoms:
This leaves much wanting. The religious head is all in all here. From a simple decision like what should be dumped in a room in the matom which has fallen vacant to how to deal with a scandalous attack on the matom and its followers, every decision is taken by the religious head personally. Most of the assistants in the immediate circle around the religious head (RH) are just time servers. They have no modern education and hence their knowledge of history and geography is next to nothing. The curriculum of many of the patasalas(this is the training ground from which the Srikaryams, Dharmathikaris and mudhrathikaris of the matom are recruited) and their syllabus are such that there is a marked slant towards religion to the complete exclusion of worldly matters such as economics, finance, management, law of the country and local and national politics. So, when a problem presents itself, the RH is given unnecessary early exposure to the public. Every action he takes to deal with the problem is sort of on a grand stage in lime light with every Tom Dick and Harry having a grandstand view of them. Most of the RHs are satvic in nature and can not tell a lie easily as it is against their very basic and dear values. Not even a புரைதீர்த்து நன்மை பயக்கும் பொய். So he blunders from interview to interview with media sleuths, from encounter to encounter with Government agencies (which all can speak a lot of lies, plant stories, spread innuendos etc). In the world of RH there is no conceit or deceit, no game playing, no lies, no double talk and no disrespect to his position. The Dharmathikaris, mudhradhikaris etc are also belonging to the same category as they have been chosen by the RH for these very qualities. So it is a big crowd of well-meaning, innocent in a way, blundering most of the time, feeling like scared chicken let out in the open suddenly in a forest kind of people. The world outside the matoms is a ruthless world from which sishyas of different kind come including those who want to shine in the world flaunting the apparent approval from the matom as a certificate and ticket to dignified society. So what do we do? We can not desire to change the acharyas/RHs. Let us see what can be done.
Please read my next post on what I have in my mind as suggestions. Please hold fire till then.
Cheers.
You said:
One way of keeping away from controversies is to keep aloof as suggested by you. Attend to only religious matters, do your daily pooja, give lectures to sishyas, offer clarifications on Sruti and smrutis and keep quiet rest of the time. This is not possible these days. Being in the thick of a fast changing society the acharyas have to guide their followers in many worldly matters too. Not doing anything in worldly matters to the followers will be equivalent to disowning them and followers will go looking for alternative leaders. So there is another way of dealing with the situation. I am giving this as a suggestion. If this happens to be read by some one in the higher levels of the hierarchy in the matom he may give some thought to this. My this suggestion comes from my experience with christian religious heads ( I had the opportunities to deal with them).
Present administrative set up in matoms:
This leaves much wanting. The religious head is all in all here. From a simple decision like what should be dumped in a room in the matom which has fallen vacant to how to deal with a scandalous attack on the matom and its followers, every decision is taken by the religious head personally. Most of the assistants in the immediate circle around the religious head (RH) are just time servers. They have no modern education and hence their knowledge of history and geography is next to nothing. The curriculum of many of the patasalas(this is the training ground from which the Srikaryams, Dharmathikaris and mudhrathikaris of the matom are recruited) and their syllabus are such that there is a marked slant towards religion to the complete exclusion of worldly matters such as economics, finance, management, law of the country and local and national politics. So, when a problem presents itself, the RH is given unnecessary early exposure to the public. Every action he takes to deal with the problem is sort of on a grand stage in lime light with every Tom Dick and Harry having a grandstand view of them. Most of the RHs are satvic in nature and can not tell a lie easily as it is against their very basic and dear values. Not even a புரைதீர்த்து நன்மை பயக்கும் பொய். So he blunders from interview to interview with media sleuths, from encounter to encounter with Government agencies (which all can speak a lot of lies, plant stories, spread innuendos etc). In the world of RH there is no conceit or deceit, no game playing, no lies, no double talk and no disrespect to his position. The Dharmathikaris, mudhradhikaris etc are also belonging to the same category as they have been chosen by the RH for these very qualities. So it is a big crowd of well-meaning, innocent in a way, blundering most of the time, feeling like scared chicken let out in the open suddenly in a forest kind of people. The world outside the matoms is a ruthless world from which sishyas of different kind come including those who want to shine in the world flaunting the apparent approval from the matom as a certificate and ticket to dignified society. So what do we do? We can not desire to change the acharyas/RHs. Let us see what can be done.
Please read my next post on what I have in my mind as suggestions. Please hold fire till then.
Cheers.
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The second and final part of a 2 part post:
1. If we take the matom and its followers as a group, the undisputed leader and final authority should always be the RH only. The power to accept or reject some one from joining this group should continue to lie with the RH but it should be on the basis of a laid out principle. Each member should be issued a ID card for this purpose with biometric verification made possible. The age at which a person becomes eligible to join the group should be determined in advance and made public. The card will entitle a member to many of the benefits which will be mentioned below.
2. A nominal fee of Rs. 100 per year should be paid by each member to retain the membership.
3. Every 3 years (or some such interval) the members shall elect a senate from among themselves with the prior approval of the RH. The senate members will populate the slots in various committees each of which will have just 5 members the sixth member being the RH himself with veto powers. Each committee will handle different subjects like a)interpretation of religious texts on questions of importance. This will include formulation of new codes depending on the needs of the time.b)managing the financial assets(funds) of the matom c)managing the fixed assets of the matom d)formulating the policies of the matom with respect to social issues in the society e)managing the tours and visits of the RH f) Looking after the public relations of the matom-this will include relation with Government, relation with heads of other denominations of Hinduism and other religions g)dealing with all legal issues h)managing the temples and the employees of the matom etc.
4. More committees can be formed depending on the need of the time and situation. One committee will not interfere with another committee. The RH will have the absolute power to remove any one from any committee or appoint any one to any committee.
5. Every year the finance committee shall prepare a statement of accounts and get it recorded for posterity with the approval of the RH.
I can add a few more points to the above. But I am sure members would have by now understood the thrust of my argument. In simple terms this involves democratisation of the matom partly retaining the RH as the Head with veto powers. This, if achieved, would ensure participation of the laity in each and every aspect of the religion even while retaining the clear distinction of the RH as the fountainhead of authority.
If we had this kind of a set up in place , we would not have exposed our acharyas to innumerable instances of humiliation. Experts would have handled the situation with only approval from the RH. a spokesperson on behalf of the matom would have spoken about the need for including Nityanand in the religious discourse and not the Acharya himself. When an expert handles the task of talking to the media the results are qualitatively different irrespective of whether the subject is Nityananda, babri Masjid or Narendra Modi.
I stop here. The post has become lengthy already.
Cheers.
1. If we take the matom and its followers as a group, the undisputed leader and final authority should always be the RH only. The power to accept or reject some one from joining this group should continue to lie with the RH but it should be on the basis of a laid out principle. Each member should be issued a ID card for this purpose with biometric verification made possible. The age at which a person becomes eligible to join the group should be determined in advance and made public. The card will entitle a member to many of the benefits which will be mentioned below.
2. A nominal fee of Rs. 100 per year should be paid by each member to retain the membership.
3. Every 3 years (or some such interval) the members shall elect a senate from among themselves with the prior approval of the RH. The senate members will populate the slots in various committees each of which will have just 5 members the sixth member being the RH himself with veto powers. Each committee will handle different subjects like a)interpretation of religious texts on questions of importance. This will include formulation of new codes depending on the needs of the time.b)managing the financial assets(funds) of the matom c)managing the fixed assets of the matom d)formulating the policies of the matom with respect to social issues in the society e)managing the tours and visits of the RH f) Looking after the public relations of the matom-this will include relation with Government, relation with heads of other denominations of Hinduism and other religions g)dealing with all legal issues h)managing the temples and the employees of the matom etc.
4. More committees can be formed depending on the need of the time and situation. One committee will not interfere with another committee. The RH will have the absolute power to remove any one from any committee or appoint any one to any committee.
5. Every year the finance committee shall prepare a statement of accounts and get it recorded for posterity with the approval of the RH.
I can add a few more points to the above. But I am sure members would have by now understood the thrust of my argument. In simple terms this involves democratisation of the matom partly retaining the RH as the Head with veto powers. This, if achieved, would ensure participation of the laity in each and every aspect of the religion even while retaining the clear distinction of the RH as the fountainhead of authority.
If we had this kind of a set up in place , we would not have exposed our acharyas to innumerable instances of humiliation. Experts would have handled the situation with only approval from the RH. a spokesperson on behalf of the matom would have spoken about the need for including Nityanand in the religious discourse and not the Acharya himself. When an expert handles the task of talking to the media the results are qualitatively different irrespective of whether the subject is Nityananda, babri Masjid or Narendra Modi.
I stop here. The post has become lengthy already.
Cheers.
sravna
Well-known member
Dear Shri Raju,
I am not saying that religious heads should not be guiding the followers on worldly matters. In fact they should do that. My point is that they should not involve themselves in the politics of the country. I think there is no need to. If the religious heads can properly guide the people on religious and worldly matters they would not be abstaining from any of their responsibilities. I think religious heads would only be vitiating their credibility by getting involved in politics because there is no way they can have their way in a corrupt world.
But your suggestions are good and I think such a set up as you suggest would be helpful irrespective of whether the mutt heads are active in politics or not because they inevitably have to present the right image to the public especially when they are popular, to counter efforts to ruin their name and reputation.
I am not saying that religious heads should not be guiding the followers on worldly matters. In fact they should do that. My point is that they should not involve themselves in the politics of the country. I think there is no need to. If the religious heads can properly guide the people on religious and worldly matters they would not be abstaining from any of their responsibilities. I think religious heads would only be vitiating their credibility by getting involved in politics because there is no way they can have their way in a corrupt world.
But your suggestions are good and I think such a set up as you suggest would be helpful irrespective of whether the mutt heads are active in politics or not because they inevitably have to present the right image to the public especially when they are popular, to counter efforts to ruin their name and reputation.
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Dear Shri Raju,
I agree with your suggestions...How are you going to articulate this to the Math heads.....Most of math heads are inside a coccoon and it is really difficult to convince them
Hope better sense prevails and present administrative arrangements which are from the days of Raja & Rani are modified to reflect the current needs
I agree with your suggestions...How are you going to articulate this to the Math heads.....Most of math heads are inside a coccoon and it is really difficult to convince them
Hope better sense prevails and present administrative arrangements which are from the days of Raja & Rani are modified to reflect the current needs
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