A conclusive Proof of Spiritual Energy. Call to forum members

[sravna]

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A conclusive proof of spiritual energy would be to show that energy beyond the power of what is theoretically produceable by the body can indeed be produced. That would show that there is a source of energy that is non physical. So, reality also includes non physical entitites. This is the gist. I would talk more about the theory after conclusive proof of existence of such an entity.

I would like to show this by inviting forum members to have spiritual energy cure their health problems or improve their general health. They just have to post their names on this thread

Once a sufficient number of members have responded, I would start treatment for all of them and try to cure their problems

That would actually show that not only is the energy possessing power to do physical work but also intelligence to do mental work by curing the diseases. I will discuss all that after the results are achieved.

 

[renuka]

Ok Sravna,

Lets see how this goes.


I dont have major health problems but I have cluster headache from time to time..its not that bad now but may be once in 4 months it can get bad..can last for 1 whole day and it would not respond to medication.


I don't want you to 'cure' me cos I take some incurable non fatal conditions as having Karmic causes and try to ignore my symptoms and live with it since its not a daily occurrence.

Ok..the exact reason for cluster headache is not yet fully understood...so since you say you use spiritual powers can you "find" out what is the cause of cluster headache so that I can find my own way to manage myself.

Note: Cluster headache is not a migrane...its much worse than that.


Note : Do NOT "cure" me...just let me know the causative factor.

 

[sravna]

Dear Renuka,

OK I will not cure you. One of the objectives of this exercise is to find out what is the spiritual rationale behind what is happening to us including health problems. I confess I do not know the causative factor right now but if I get an insight I will definitely share that with you. I do hope I will get some insights in due course. As you say let us wait and see.

 

[CHANDRU1849]

Will the treatment individual-wise or group-wise? The health problem varies from individual to individual. It requires personal attention.

 

[sravna]

Will the treatment individual-wise or group-wise? The health problem varies from individual to individual. It requires personal attention.

Dear Shri Chandru,

The treatment is for the whole group. I have seen it work for a group even though the diseases are different.

 

[sravna]

Please note no need for mention of problem or any details of the problem.

 

[sravna]

Please note no need for mention of problem or any details of the problem.

The above would show that there is a spiritual reality

 

[sangom]

My dear Sravna,

I have more than one health condition in bad shape, giving troubles, and because I have reservations about modern day hospitals and their services (highly profit-motive) I have not been ready for surgery etc., and am carrying on with the help of medicines prescribed by my family physician.

I do not want you to cure me of any of my diseases through your spiritual energy method because I am more or less convinced that whatever it is, this procedure will only bring great harm to you and your mind & body. I don't have the power or authority to tell you not to persist with your quixotic ideas of "spirituality" and its powers, but even so, I will take this opportunity to suggest to you to forget about all this spirituality blah blah and lead life as a normal, earthy human being for which all of us have been born. If you find my suggestion not acceptable, no harm, but at least please remember that I had forewarned you.

 

[renuka]

My dear Sravna,

I have more than one health condition in bad shape, giving troubles, and because I have reservations about modern day hospitals and their services (highly profit-motive) I have not been ready for surgery etc., and am carrying on with the help of medicines prescribed by my family physician.

I do not want you to cure me of any of my diseases through your spiritual energy method because I am more or less convinced that whatever it is, this procedure will only bring great harm to you and your mind & body. I don't have the power or authority to tell you not to persist with your quixotic ideas of "spirituality" and its powers, but even so, I will take this opportunity to suggest to you to forget about all this spirituality blah blah and lead life as a normal, earthy human being for which all of us have been born. If you find my suggestion not acceptable, no harm, but at least please remember that I had forewarned you.

I fully agree with you Sangom ji.

Sravna I do not want to encourage you in your belief of spiritual powers becos I can clearly see you are losing touch with reality...that is you are not seeing the dangers of your intention even though you have good intention to help others.

Mostly I still participate in your threads becos I try to keep you connected to reality which I feel you are still very convinced that you do posses spiritual powers.

I am not saying you are imagining it but I feel as long you do not have all answers yet to most questions on how the powers work..the best is not to venture into this.

Frankly speaking...how can one group session of people of various conditions be cured for you without getting disease specific?

Even Ayurveda is disease specific..there is no one medication that can cure all diseases.

Even those who really have spiritual powers have different curing methods for different diseases.

Even sadhana for each person is guna based and that too differs.

You know very well even identical twins differ from each other in behavior..so I do not really believe a mass curing is possible.

I hope you do not mind my post..you could agree to disagree but its my humble suggestion to stop all these practice for now.

The reason I asked you about the cause of my cluster headache is just to see how you would address it....you did say you have no idea about it which I accept becos even doctors dont really know the exact cause and treat it symptomatically but yet you feel that any disease can be cured by group healing sessions.

Sravna...you have no answers yet..may be give yourself sometime..if you really have some powers in time you should be able to know more about it.

I know everyone did not believe Noah when he built a boat cos he felt the great flood was coming and finally he was right.

So likewise to be fair to you I wont disbelieve you a 100% but all I can say now is "If you do not yet have all answers and do not know how your powers work..do not try to cure anyone..you would only be damaging yourself"

 

[sravna]

Dear Shri Sangom, Renuka,

It is not about using spiritual power but what it would mean if its existence were true. Would that knowledge not benefit everyone ? When I have seen results happening, don't you think it is right to ponder what makes it work? Remember it may also mean that what our scriptures say are also likely to be true and that the sages got real revelation about reality. All this would have tremendous implications on our current understanding of nature. It would also pave the way for a scientific understanding of spiritual knowledge.

The interest is more in testing whether the truth is as said in our scriptures and if so how it works. I do not foresee any harm to myself because of pursuit of knowledge. If one does not believe in spiritual reality it doesn't make sense talking about repercussions and if one does, one can say that understanding how spirituality works only fortifies belief in spirituality by creating a scientific basis.

But I thank you for your concern though it seems to me there is no cause for worry.

 

[renuka]

The interest is more in testing whether the truth is as said in our scriptures and if so how it works. I do not foresee any harm to myself because of pursuit of knowledge. If one does not believe in spiritual reality it doesn't make sense talking about repercussions and if one does, one can say that understanding how spirituality works only fortifies belief in spirituality by creating a scientific basis.

But I thank you for your concern but it seems to me there is no cause for worry.

Dear Sravna,

So that means you plan to use others as guinea pigs to test your spiritual powers and truth of the scriptures?

Sravna...now this is totally unfair cos what if you cause harm to others?

Even when a person becomes a doc during internship he/she is not allowed to treat patients unsupervised.

Sravna..please do not use human beings as your test subjects when you are not even sure how your powers work.

All these while I was concerned about adverse effects to you but after reading you want to test spiritual powers now I am concerned about your "patients".

The most moral thing to do is stop all forms of spiritual treatment.

 

[sravna]

Dear Sravna,

So that means you plan to use others as guinea pigs to test your spiritual powers and truth of the scriptures?

Sravna...now this is totally unfair cos what if you cause harm to others?

Even when a person becomes a doc during internship he/she is not allowed to treat patients unsupervised.

Sravna..please do not use human beings as your test subjects when you are not even sure how your powers work.

All these while I was concerned about adverse effects to you but after reading you want to test spiritual powers now I am concerned about your "patients".

The most moral thing to do is stop all forms of spiritual treatment.

Dear Renuka,

As I said it is not that I do not have any understanding of how it works. My intention is to bring it to the level of details that science does. Now what is the guarantee that the cure you effect through medicine does no harm. As a matter of fact unlike spiritual treatment it has numerous side effects even on the physical body. Think about the spiritual ramifications if you are not supposed to cure any health problem at all.

Science need not be the only source of knowledge or solutions. In my view spirituality does better than what science does and in a holistic way but has been suffering because of not getting enough empirical affirmation. Renuka, you have get more open minded about possibility of knowledge through means other than science.

 

[Vaagmi]

Dear sravnaji,

I have been reading this conversation from the beginning. I gained the following impressions:

1. You have not defined the terms that you are using and you intend to use clearly so that others can un derstand what is your project. Any quest requires this defining as the first requirement to be fulfilled so that others get what you are going after and you communicate what you are after.

2. You have not yet determined the path you are going to take for achjieving your objective. Please tell us how you are going to achieve your goal.

3. What is happening here is at best a peer review of whatever you have in mind. That, as you know, will remain for ever nebulous.

First things first please.

Added as an afterthought:

I have mentioned somewhere else that transcending physical barriers for mental/spiritual energy transmission has already been achieved long back. We have mercury shivlings made by sidhdhas which involved transmission of mental energy to overcome interatomic forces to keep a mercury shivling solid. Pursuing this route by reading ancient literature on this sidhdhi may help you in your task--that is if I have understood your goal correctly. LOL.

 

[sravna]

Dear Shri Vaagmi,

Let me first state the problem and sum up my understanding of the solution to the problem

Problem: Disorders in the human body
Solution to the problem: By increasing spiritual energy in the body.

To understand how exactly the problem gets solved one has to first understand what is spiritual energy and how exactly it solves the problem. To understand spiritual energy, I rely on the understanding due to our scriptures.

One school of thought is there is soul that is the actual self and it is God or pure consciousness. As pure consciousness, it has immense powers . However it is veiled. There also exists in between the physical body and the soul, an intermediate entity called the mind, which basically is what interacts with the external world.

The mind constantly keeps interpreting the physical signals from the external world and reacts to them. The mind may be either swayed by the physical reality or use its own strength attained from the power of the soul to overpower the signals from the physical reality. The power that the mind can use depends on how pure or unveiled the soul is at any time. The power that the mind generates comes out as spiritual energy which can be projected onto the external physical reality.

In the case of performing health cures , the spiritual energy generated from the mind is projected onto a body so that the spiritual energy in that body increases. Spiritual energy has the power of making something it acts on to be interconnected. The disorders of a body are caused from moving away from the state of holistic nature and so when spiritual energy acts on it, it regains that state.

The above is my understanding of how cure is effected.

What I want to achieve through the current effort is to see if I can get clues on the details of how spiritual energy works so that at some point downward science can take over and the knowledge becomes complete.

 

[Vaagmi]

Sravnaji,

Do you believe the following facts can help you in your project:

1. There was a Russian who could bend an iron nail just by looking at it intently. And there are recorded facts available about that.

2. Our own sidhdha has made a shivling out of the liquid metal mercury and it remains solid to date.

3. There is a healing process in vogue which is called by names such as pranic healing, Reicki etc.,


And the following facts can derail you:

1. Pain and disease like colour and taste are completely individual experiences and they can never be fully conveyed to others through a medium. It is as if every being is a unique sealed entity inside a body and there can never be any thing which can be truly commonly un derstood by them. My pain experience is not your pain experience. How do we exchange communication about this? My blue color may not be your blue color and it may be your red color experience wise. With this kind of a formidable handicap in place, how do you think you can break b arriers between two minds?

2. Crossing the physical boundaries may be easier than crossing the mental boundaries (since you have used the term mind) if you are going to handle only the energy part of it. This is because energy is a physical stuff and is understood better in that realm. you may have to coin a diffferent term for energy.

Just some loud thinking. LOL.

 

[sravna]

Dear Shri Vaagmi,

Regarding breaking barriers, I think you say one may have a different understanding of reality to that of another. That I accept. But my view is that there is an absolute reality and as two people get deeper and deeper understanding of reality, the understanding would converge.

Thanks for other info. I am aware of them.

 

[Raji Ram]

Let me share my experience. I bought a book which describes 'Solar powered water' as medicine. Three types of glass bottles in

the colors Orange, Green and Blue are used in this concept. Fill up three fourths of the bottle with drinking water and 'charge' it

in the sunlight for 8 hours. The water gets 'solar powered' and has its effect for 5 days! Different color bottles are used for different

ailments. I tried the solar powered water in green bottle for about four months and got rid of my migraine completely!

Yes! It DID happen!!


The story does not end here. My doctor brother said that I was cured ONLY by my belief that the miracle water will cure me!

I guess my brother is 200% correct!

So, those who have strong belief in Sravna are sure to be cured!! :thumb:

P.S: The lady living next to my son's sweet home in Boston has huge glass bottles in all the three colors, reminding me of Alibaba

story and she gives the SP water to her near ones whenever they need. She told me that she learnt this treatment from her uncle.

 

[sravna]

Dear Smt.RR,

To be close to fact, belief facilitates the cure but does not cure by itself.

 

[Raji Ram]

......... To be close to fact, belief facilitates the cure but does not cure by itself.

Dear Sravna Sir,
Now I am thinking whether the 'solar powered water' is really effective! :decision:

BTW, my mom could find the difference between the tastes of 'those' three waters!! :thumb:

 

[sravna]

Dear Smt.RR,

The reason why faith in spirituality can be effective to some extent is that those who believe in spirituality are themselves spiritual and so have inherent mental power in them which can be used against problems .

In general faith is a valuable quality if it is towards values.

Your mom probably does not have blind taste.That explains why she was able to find out the difference.

 

[sravna]

I think if we can connect what ayurveda explains and the current understanding of western medicine we can connect spiritual understanding with scientific understanding. I have some thoughts about how ayurveda would help me to explain my theory in some more detail. Let me think about them more and I will get back.

 

[sangom]

My dear Sravna,

From your different posts under this thread I get the impression that according to you the soul or the actual self is pure consciousness, and that as this "pure consciousness" the soul has immense powers. While my own take on these topics are slightly different, kindly note that you have used the adjective immense and not infinite. This means that the soul may have very great powers in one or more areas but not in every possible area. Therefore, we will require some more data to experiment this spiritual power in curing diseases of a person, much more when we talk of group cures.

You say that your project is intended to test whether the truth is as said in our scriptures and if so how it works. Now, if this means that you have some doubt about whether our scriptures say truth only, then it is absolutely necessary that you first approach a competent person (guru who has spiritual healing power) and learn from him/her as to how s/he goes about it before trying out any spiritual cure, individual or group cures.

Diseases are held, by our scriptures, to be the wages for the past sins or "mujjanma karmas" and even great Acharyas have reportedly held the view that it is impossible to 'counter' or 'destroy' the pain & suffering from disease, unless there is a complementary good karma. (Karna's thirst in his dying moments and Krishna telling him to suck the finger with which he (Karna) pointed out the direction of a well to a very thirsty person, is a story which we have heard of.) Hence interfering in the cosmic law or rtam of another person's fate through the so-called spiritual energy medium may give rise to drastic negative effects for the practitioner. Many people who took to Reiki/Pranic healing practice have now completely stopped it because they found unpleasant happenings arising in their lives suddenly and one guru said that these were due to the karma of interfering in others' karma for which humans have no authority. Even Krishna says in the Mahabharata that he is at best a "nitya sAkshi" only and cannot interfere on his own, in other's affairs, referring to Dharmaputra's decision to gamble, without consulting Him.

If the so called spiritual energy really exists, as you seem to believe, why not try that in producing/materializing a few packets of Tayir sAdam every afternoon and then distribute those packets to hungry children who roam the streets? Why after all should curing illness be the first target for experiment?

 

[sravna]

Dear Shri Sangom,

You are right about what constitutes interfering with one's karma. Think about this. Why should anyone be endowed with spiritual power if it is not to be put into use? The answer I think is to understand what constitutes normal use of power. It is the responsibility of one who possesses the power to ensure that he doesn't interfere with spiritual laws such as the law of karma.

But the fact is as spiritual ability goes up there is an automatic tendency to do the right things which are in sync with nature because the higher the spiritual ability, the greater it syncs with nature and an automatic safety mechanism operates.

My take on what constitutes normal use of power wrt healing, is this. One has to consider the nature of a person's body. Ayurveda sheds some light on the nature of physical body. It says that a person is born with certain type of constitution. As long as that constitution is maintained he would be of normal health. Disorders start when the proportions of the three doshas that make up the constitution deviate from the original or natural proportion of that person.

It seems to me we are not violating karma as long as we stick to maintaining his original constitution. IMO karma is violated only when one's nature is sought to be altered but not otherwise. Spiritual power is the only means by which nature can be altered or spiritual laws can be violated. That is probably the reason why caution needs to be exercised in the use of spiritual power. However as I mentioned, the safety mechanism automatically kicks in when spiritual energy syncs more and more with the spiritual reality.

Overall, I think there is no cause for worry, especially given the fact, that the spiritual power is put to the use of expanding knowledge and for creating greater awareness and acceptance of spirituality.

 

[renuka]

Dear Sravna,

I will write my post in point form for easier understanding.

1) I am open to the concept of 'spirituality" cos there is always something beyond what meets the eye.I am open minded enough to acknowledge the existence of the paranormal too.

2)But what I want to emphasis here is the lack of conclusive evidence based from the spiritual point of view in your personal quest to cure others.

3)I know your good intention of wanting to put your "spiritual powers" to good use but again I would like to share some info on this.

4)You are not the first person I have noticed to want to cure others and have "spiritual powers"..I have seen this phenomenon is mostly very religious people and also in those who do Kundalini activation meditation.Believe me I have seen people go down hill after dabbling with all these.

5)Why? Why this occurs to people who are religious and with good qualities? One starts to wonder?

6)I feel one of the possible reason is these sorts have some amount of Kundalini awakening but it gets halted becos of desire.

7)Dont get me wrong..but most of these types want to cure others..may be deep down inside they have a desire to be spiritual and use the spiritual powers for the benefit of the world..they do have good intentions to change the world and make it a better place.

8)Now..since you say spiritual energy is harmonizing ..let me agree with you on this.

From what I have read that Kundalini is indeed harmonizing and re-balancing..it focuses on correcting imbalance in our body due to vasanas of these birth and also of past births..but at times when it rises..if a person has a strong desire even to do good, the Kundalini halts and tries to re-balance over and over again to rid the person of even that desire..but the human mind is at times too strong and will over ride even the harmonizing effects of the Kundalini..so what we get is a person with some amount of activation but stagnated due to intense desire.

9)Next stage is intense desire leads to lack of reasoning power and finally everything is lost..

10)I feel may be you have had some activation of some sort subconsciously hence your obsession with using spiritual power.
Now this obsession in fact acts in the opposite direction of your activated Kundalini and drags you down.You might feel you are getting more spiritual but in fact the reverse might be true.

11)So what to do?

Simple..give up the desire to cure others..just do not hold on to the concept at all..only then your Kundalini can harmonize and move on to the next step.

12) Be patient...let your Kundalini take its time to reach where it should reach..it could be in this birth or next or may be even 10 births from now...there is no hurry to reach the summit of any kind.

13)When we simply exist and lets nature take its course..finally we realize there was even no summit at all to climb.

14)Sometimes to try we actually have to stop.

15)A desire even the most Sattva is still a desire..in fact its Sattva guna which is most difficult to transcend.

 

[Dr.Dinesh]

hi everyone
spiritual energy of person can be known...there are instruments to know one's own energy...as Mr sangom said energy practicing will cause adverse effects on the practitioner(if they are not protected properly--i have seen cases related to these things)...our physical, mental,emotional and spiritual body is maintained through a specific frequency...for example our skin generates 30hz normally...if it goes higher or lower causes defects...(another example s empty glass and a shout of a women in high pitched voice,it breaks the glass)...so my request for Mr sravna is kindly know the frequencies...studies have proved frequency can change one's own DNA itself. this post s through my experience guys...plz correct me if i am wrong...