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Hinduism Vs Rest

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thuglak kalaignaa!!

sir - the latest issue of thuglak has exposed the double standards of the kalaignaa , who has arrested hindu leaders who damaged the periar statue under National Security act, but those who attacked innocent brahmins and brahmin places of worship have been let off on bail! remember during 1965, dmk staged violent agitations against hindi, resulting to loss of public and private property and precious lives. those who were charged for indulging in violence were let off and the cases, compliants and enquiries withdrawn after dmk came fo power in 1967! most of the accused were dmk men including the karunanidhi and even late anna! those who indulged in vandalism in 1967 were even 'conferred IAS' appointments! the t.nadu govts . gives pension to the goons who agitated in 1965 and even their nominees are getting pension till today!compared to this, what hindu leaders did to periar statue is nothing!!
 
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AILING Kalaignaa cabinet

SIR - Junior vikatan, a journal which supports dmk with more vigour than even murasoli, says in its recent issue that as many as 5 ministers may be dropped from t.nadu cabinet due to various reasons from poor performance to poor health!! there are atleast 3 of them whom i can guess. they are
1. kalrunanidhi himself!!
2. ramaiah anbazagan!
3. m.k.salatalin!!!

who could be the other two??????
 
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Communal Communists!!!

[sir - the title 'communal communists' may seem like an oxymoron, considering the fact that a communist is supposed to be anti religion. but in india, communists have always been religous bigots! in 1947, communists openly supported partitioning of india on religious basis. can you believe this? an anti religious party supporting partitioning of a secular country on religious basis to enable formation of a theocratic state!!!!
 
News And Views!!!

SIR - DMK chiefminister karunanidhi has increased auto fares in the state. the increase starts from 100% for lowest fare. this is the news. i leave it to you to decide about the consequences!!
 
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Sleeping Members!!

SIR - oxford online dictionary defines sleeping partner in a business as a partner who invests money, but does not take part in day to day administration. similarly i thinkthere are many sleeping members in this website! most of them neither record their views on various matters, nor react or respond to views of other members. many of them , infact,almost all of them do not mention their original names at all! i request sleepingmembers to wake up so that this site has a good future.
 
the present cm of t.nadu says he is an atheist. though a hindu(?), he denounces hindiusm totally always. at the same time he praises islam, christianity that too by comparing with hinduism. is it not like praising somebody's mother and abusing your own mother? will educated people ever do that?

it s also being said that hinduism is the only relegion which sanctions untouchability and that is why so called untouchables are given reservation. but they can always convert themselves to other religions - and there are so many religions in india itself- to escape untouchablilty. why reservations? is it not hypocrytic to denounce your own religion but still certify yourselves as 'hindu' just to get quota benefits?

Dear Suresh,

Hinduism is a great religion,but it was corrupted by casteism.Same thing happened to christianity before a few centuries.Then, christians were burning 'witches',murdering protestents, enslaving blacks and killing native indians in name of religion and god.Then a reformist movement happened in europe where atheists like ingersoll,marx, nietzsche and darwin attacked christianity vehemently.Due to their efforts christians reformed and came up with concept of secularism.

Although christians will not agree with this,it was the atheists who actually reformed christianity.

Same thing happened in india.It was the 'milecha' british who destroyed evils in hinduism like sathi,child marriage,untouchability and allowed dalits into temples.When dalits were not allowed to even walk in streets of vaikkam,it was the atheist periyar who fought for them.

Even now it is the atheists who fight to remove evils like casteism and untouchability.Only the atheistic karunanidhi bought a law permiting people from all castes to become archakas.It's a shame that such untouchability prevailed in temples in TN till 2006 and its a shame that in rest of india,such untouchability still prevails.

What happens now to hinduism, happened to christianity earlier.It will soon happen to Islam too.

And I am sad to see that you ask 'untouchables' to go to other religions,than avail the fruits of reservation.I dont think that you purposely used the word 'untouchables'.How can you ask dalits to go to other religions?I just wonder.After thousands of years of oppression and not allowed entry into temples,they still worship the god whose darshan was denied to them.

God doesnt live in temples where dalits were refused entry.He has long ago migrated to live in slums among his oppressed children.What sits in temples is just a statue.
 
the present cm of t.nadu says he is an atheist. though a hindu(?), he denounces hindiusm totally always. at the same time he praises islam, christianity that too by comparing with hinduism. is it not like praising somebody's mother and abusing your own mother? will educated people ever do that?

it s also being said that hinduism is the only relegion which sanctions untouchability and that is why so called untouchables are given reservation. but they can always convert themselves to other religions - and there are so many religions in india itself- to escape untouchablilty. why reservations? is it not hypocrytic to denounce your own religion but still certify yourselves as 'hindu' just to get quota benefits?

Dear Suresh,

Hinduism is a great religion,but it was corrupted by casteism.Same thing happened to christianity before a few centuries.Then, christians were burning 'witches',murdering protestents, enslaving blacks and killing native indians in name of religion and god.Then a reformist movement happened in europe where atheists like ingersoll,marx, nietzsche and darwin attacked christianity vehemently.Due to their efforts christians reformed and came up with concept of secularism.

Although christians will not agree with this,it was the atheists who actually reformed christianity.

Same thing happened in india.It was the 'milecha' british who destroyed evils in hinduism like sathi,child marriage,untouchability and allowed dalits into temples.When dalits were not allowed to even walk in streets of vaikkam,it was the atheist periyar who fought for them.

Even now it is the atheists who fight to remove evils like casteism and untouchability.Only the atheistic karunanidhi bought a law permiting people from all castes to become archakas.It's a shame that such untouchability prevailed in temples in TN till 2006 and its a shame that in rest of india,such untouchability still prevails.

What happens now to hinduism, happened to christianity earlier.It will soon happen to Islam too.

And I am sad to see that you ask 'untouchables' to go to other religions,than avail the fruits of reservation.I dont think that you purposely used the word 'untouchables' instead of the word harijans or dalits. Anyway, how can you ask dalits to go to other religions?I just wonder.After thousands of years of oppression and not allowed entry into temples,they still worship the god whose darshan was denied to them.Why should such devotional people leave the religion?

God doesnt live in temples where dalits were refused entry.He has long ago migrated to live in slums among his oppressed children.What sits in temples is just a statue.
 
Kalaignaa Violates His Own Order!!!

[SIR- This posting is based on a news published in recent issue of thuglak. the karunanidhi, who normally withdraws his own orders due to pressure from various quarters has done a different type of somersault now. he has violated his own order! the karunanidhi had issued an order last month that henceforth ingovt. functions, dignitaries should be presented only with books and shawls should be avoided. but , when puppet primeminister manamohan visited t.nadu last week, the karunanidhi welcomed manamohan by presenting himwith shawls, instead of books, thus violating his own order!!!
 
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Nehru, 9th Schedule And Kalaignaa!!!

[SIR- A draconian provision called 9th schedule was introduced by the nefarious nehru in 1950s, this provision allowed politicians like the karunanidhi to include even anti constitutional clauses in the constitution. if the clause is included in the 9th schedule, then even courts cannot question it! surprisingly instead of totally quashing this fascist provision, even now, after so many years,the courts have ruled that they will not totally ban this provision, but only review each and every law separately and find out whether there is anything anti constitutional in it! although this is an improvement on the present position, it is not a total victory for democratic forces, because this law still allows persons like kalaignaa to perform his antics ! but of course, instead of totally sleeping and allowing politicians to go scot free this verdict atleast puts a barrier. but it depends on how supreme court view various draconian laws which have been included in 9th schedule. my humble view is that all laws under 9th schedule should be scrapped.let us wait and hope for the best. the 9th schedule represents the ugly face of nehru. it has spread its tentacles and crushed democracy and put democracy in a coma stage for so many years. not courts have given oxygen and enabled democracy to come out of coma! but whether democracy will flourish and come back to normal , only time can answer!!!
 
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Goundamani And Kalaignaa!!!

SIR - Mr. goundamani says karunanidhi has 'reformed' by hinduism by allowing persons of all castes to perform poojas in temples! actually in saiva brahmin temples only saiva brahmins can perform poojas! even vaishnava brahmins are not allowed to be priests. likewise, in vaishnava temples, even saiva brahmins cannot be priests. but the order of kalaignaa is silent on many questions. if anybody can become a priest, can muslims and christians also? can women also? can butchers also? after all there are restrictions even among brahmins presently.even in a toilet there are 2 classes - men & women. men cannot go to womens toilet and viceversa. if the order of kalaignaa is implemented, temples will become worse than toilets. temples will become like anna arivalayam where anybody can go,provided you blindly worship kalaignaa! as far as i know, untouchability means if groups worshipping same god discriminate against each other, that is untouchability. like what happened to black christians insouth africa and other western countries. these black christians were treated worse than animals by white christians, even though both of them have same god- jesus! similarly shias and sunnis murder each other like serial killers even though both of them worship same god - allah. but in india, brahmins and non brahmins have different gods.so naturally, differences are unavoidable. untouchability was started by kshatriyas against brahmins, which led to parasurama taking a vow to eliminate all kshatriyas from the word.brahmins thus were also victims of untouchability. they only retaliated. actually even brahmins do not have a common god, as paramacharya had said. saiva brahmins worship siva, and vaishnava brahmins worship vishnu.
why were british not able to abolish apartheid in south africa even though the british ruled there for many years? if it was possible for them to reform so many things in india, why is it being said that so called untouchables still need reservation.
history has always proved that a religion can be reformed only by followers of the religion. how can opponents of brahmins like the periar reform brahminism or hinduism? the periar has been accused of being a split personality. the vomits of such a person cannot be classified as 'reforms'.
about untouchables, i only pointed out hypocrisy of so called 'rationalists' like karunanidhi who abuse religion, but still declare themselves as'hindu' just for caste quotas. why are you calling yourselves as hindu when you do not feel comfortable in that religion. moreoever, he always eulogises islam and christianity. then why does he not embrace these religions?hinduism or brahminism is certainly not depended on numbers. they are depended onquality. so if somebody quits brahminism or hinduism, the loss is not for the religion, it is a lossfor the individual.
 
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SIR - Mr. goundamani says kalaignaa has 'reformed' by hinduism by allowing persons of all castes to perform poojas in temples! actually in saiva brahmin temples only saiva brahmins can perform poojas! even vaishnava brahmins are not allowed to be priests. likewise, in vaishnava temples, even saiva brahmins cannot be priests.

The bottomline is only bhramins can become poojaris and not others.This is what I call as untouchability and casteism.

Dalits stand outside the temple.
ksathriyas and vaisyas stand outside the garbagraha.
Bhramins only allowed inside the garbagraha.

If this isnt untouchability,I dont know what else is.

but the order of kalaignaa is silent on many questions. if anybody can become a priest, can muslims and christians also? can women also? can butchers also?

read the order carefully.It doesnt say "anybody can become a priest".Only hindus can become priests.That includes people who come from butcher family also(arent butchers hindus???)



after all there are restrictions even among brahmins presently.even in a toilet there are 2 classes - men & women. men cannot go to womens toilet and viceversa. if the order of kalaignaa is implemented, temples will become worse than toilets.

Men cannot enter womens toilet and vice versa because their genitals differ in quality.How does bhramin and other varnas differ?What is the difference between them?

Do you think that if other varnas become priests,temples will become toilets?They already are worse than toilets due to untouchability.Let toilet cleaners become priests to remove this evil.

but in india, brahmins and non brahmins have different gods.so naturally, differences are unavoidable.

This shows that you know nothing about hinduism.

Then who are the millions who throng tirupathi,annamalai and palani?Bhramins or nonbhramins?

untouchability was started by kshatriyas against brahmins, which led to parasurama taking a vow to eliminate all kshatriyas from the word.brahmins thus were also victims of untouchability. they only retaliated. actually even brahmins do not have a common god, as paramacharya had said. saiva brahmins worship siva, and vaishnava brahmins worship vishnu.

:doh:

why were british not able to abolish apartheid in south africa even though the british ruled there for many years? if it was possible for them to reform so many things in india, why is it being said that so called untouchables still need reservation.

reservation was not started by British.It was started by Manu.He set aside certain jobs for bhramins,kshathriyas,vaisyas and sudras thus creating reservation in India.

history has always proved that a religion can be reformed only by followers of the religion. how can opponents of brahmins like the periar reform brahminism or hinduism? the periar has been accused of being a split personality. the vomits of such a person cannot be classified as 'reforms'.

He fought for dalits to have the right to walk in streets and not to wear chappels.If that is vomit,so be it.


hinduism or brahminism is certainly not depended on numbers. they are depended onquality. so if somebody quits brahminism or hinduism, the loss is not for the religion, it is a lossfor the individual.

Then if casteists go away from our religion,it is certainly not a loss for our religion,is it?

Good.
 
Priesthood and other sundry things

I personally have no problem against someone of any other caste becoming a priest in a Hindu temple provided:

a. They are brought up in a Veda pathashala and try to imbine as much knowledge of the rituals and traditions as possible

b. Study Sanskrit and become knowledgeable in it.

c. Be vegetarian from childhood

d. Do not indulge in alcohol or drugs or sex outside marriage

e. Refrain from violence or coarse language, and keep good company

f. Be pious and devoted to their temple, and lastly

g. Maintain personal hygiene and also take care of their surroundings


If Non-Brahmans want to part with their son and have him grow up in an Ashram so that the above are possible, then that would be fine.

Near my house there was a young Brahman priest who would occasionally mingle with porikis in the evening and the temple trustee saw him once doing that. He was soon stripped of his priesthood and another priest appointed. When I go to a temple, I want a good pious ambience which will lend itself to meditation, and the last thing I want to hear is

" Yo Naina, inga kundikinu prasadam vayula vechukka. Bejar pannama po, kasmalam somari, bemani mari paakkadhey machee"
 
The Periar, The British And The Kalaignaa!

SIR - YES! it is true that only brahmins can become priests in brahmin temples. but even here, brahmin of one sect cannot become priest in temple of brahmin of another sect.only brahmin of that particular sect can become a priest. how can non brahmins be allowed to become priests in brahmin temples, when even brahmins of rival sects are not allowed to do so???

The karunanidhi's absurd order on 'anybody can become a priest' is silent on whether a vaishnava brahmin can become a priest in saiva temple and vice versa. in mosques only muslims can become priest. in church, only christians can become priests. like that in brahmin temples which worship brahmin gods or avtaars of brahmin gods only brahmins of that particular sect can become priests. even supreme court has ruled that there is nothing unconstitutional in this. butchers are certainly hindus. but they cannot be brahmins. and in brahmin temples only brahmins can become priests. allowing persons of other religions to becomes priests is like asking to play a cricket match with a football! the nadir of absurdity!

though men, women belong to same class of humanbeings they cannot remain together even privately in many matters. here leave non brahmins. even among brahmins there are 2 different sects with 2 different gods, 2 different customs and pracititioners of 1 sect do not impose their views on other. in that case, how can non brahmins who completely differ from brahmins in god, in the food, inthe culture be clubbed together particularly when it is accepted by many that temples are already worse than toilets. it was because nonbrahmins like kalaignaa got control over these temples and imposed practices like cinema shooting, corruption, igoring agamas etc., that these temples became worse than toilets. handing over administration of saiva brahmin temples to saiva brahmins and vaishanava brahmin temples to vaishnava brahmins is only way to clean this toilet. brahmins should not impose or interfere in non brahmin temples. similarly non brahmin should also not impose or interfere in brahmin temples. of course, persons of any caste can enter any temple for worshipping god. but the temple should be controlled only by the devotees belonging to the sect of the temple and the agamas should also be the agamas of the sect to be followed in the temples.


Manu divided society into various religions.whats' wrong in this? even indian constitution does this! remember when manu did this, brahmins were in a huge majority in india and other castes were in a minority. so there is nothing wrong in that. in modern india, politicians collect tax from all castes. so it is a violation to spend the money selectively for some caste alone. moreover, it is a violation of basic structure of indian constitution which says that 'everybody is equal before law. caste quotas encourage people to have large families so that they can demand increase in percentage of quotas. caste quotas favour urban indians at the expense of rural indians who form majority. thus where as caste quotas are in favour of a small minority of urban indians, manu's laws were in favour of majority of indians.

whatever the british, the periar and the karunanidhi did, are doing and will be doing are all in favour of urban people only, who form a minority of india's total population. more than95% of people lived in rural areas in india in those days. the british totally neglected them. even the periars policies (like opposing freedom movement, welcoming partitionof india on religious basis, observing independence day as black day, asking women not to have any chastity, advocating drinking etc.,) were out and out in favour of urban, rich at the expense of rural poor. that is why mahatma gandhi opposed british and the periar tooth and nail.

like the periar, the karunanidhi , goundamani is also getting confused by mixing brahminism with other religions. in other religions, there is only one god for all sects. but in hinduism, each and every sect has a different god, and thus hindusim is a religion of religions! when other religions which have 1 god for all sects have failed miserably to enforce equality, how can there be 100% equality inhinduism. hinduism is actually religionof non brahmins. brahminism is a separate religion. actually, my humble opinion is brahmins cannot be called hindus. hindus in my view means non brahmins alone. it were foreigners who clubbed all indians together and started calling hindus. that habit continues till today. actually even i used to wonder many timeswhether i should rename this thread as 'brahminism vs rest'

i may not be knowingmuch about hinduism, but i certainly know something about brahminism.

it is not brahminism,but other religions and so called 'rationalists' and persons who advocate reforms for brahmins, who should be reformed!!!







:doh:
 
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When dalits were not allowed to even walk in streets of vaikkam,it was the atheist periyar who fought for them.
Aside from attacking Brahmin women, decorating Vinayaka idols with sandals, calling tamil a barbaric language et al. If this is reform, we might as well invite the taliban to reform us.:love:

Even now it is the atheists who fight to remove evils like casteism and untouchability.Only the atheistic karunanidhi bought a law permiting people from all castes to become archakas.
The guy is a politician, and has an axe to grind. It has nothing to do with his alleged love for dalits or whoever. It is done to spite Brahmins rather than protect dalits, if you know what I mean.

Hinduism is a great religion,but it was corrupted by casteism
Varnashrama Dharma is an integral part of Hinduism, so there's no point in repeating leftist propaganda in this matter. Accoding to Lord Krishna's own words, no jiva can remain without doing karma, and that karma has to be determined by one's varna and ashrama in life. And who determines one's varna and ashrama? The Lord Himself, as he's the dispenser of the fruits of action. Which is why he says in 2.47:

karmany evadhikaras te
ma phalesu kadacana
ma karma-phala-hetur bhur
ma te sango 'stv akarmani

This is the essence of nishkaama karma, which is a fundamental tenet in Hinduism. If one reasons that varna is not birth-based, then the jiva will be forced to choose according to its 'ahamkara' and 'kaama.' Action resulting from such foundation is kaamya karma that binds the jiva to prakriti. Therefore, in order to become liberated, one has to perform nishkaama karma in tune with one's varna. Opting for another person's dharma is dangerous, and the Lord warns us about this, 3.35:

sreyan sva-dharmo vigunah
para-dharmat svanusthitat
sva-dharme nidhanam sreyah
para-dharmo bhayavahah



In effect, Hindus brainwashed by leftists must stop bashing caste system. Hindus who know nothing about caste system must abstain from making such 'expert' comments.:thumb:

 
SIR - YES! it is true that only brahmins can become priests in brahmin temples. but even here, brahmin of one sect cannot become priest in temple of brahmin of another sect.only brahmin of that particular sect can become a priest. how can non brahmins be allowed to become priests in brahmin temples, when even brahmins of rival sects are not allowed to do so???

Dear suresh,

When this law is implemented any hindu can do pooja in any hindu temple,after learning the manthras and rituals of that temple.So rival sect bhramins can also do pooja in another rival sect's temple.

After some time,there wont be 'rival sects',but only one sect-humans.To ensure that such thing happens such laws are necessary.

The kalaignaa's absurd order on 'anybody can become a priest' is silent on whether a vaishnava brahmin can become a priest in saiva temple and vice versa.

Any hindu can become a priest in any hindu temple.That includes vaishnava bhramins and saiva bhramins also.

in mosques only muslims can become priest. in church, only christians can become priests. like that in brahmin temples which worship brahmin gods or avtaars of brahmin gods only brahmins of that particular sect can become priests. even supreme court has ruled that there is nothing unconstitutional in this. butchers are certainly hindus. but they cannot be brahmins. and in brahmin temples only brahmins can become priests. allowing persons of other religions to becomes priests is like asking to play a cricket match with a football! the nadir of absurdity!

in mosques only muslims can become priest. in church, only christians can become priests.Like that in Hindu temples all hindus can become priests.

The temples in which bhramins do pooja are not bhramin temples and the gods are not only bhramin gods.The temples were built by kings like rajaraja chola, rajendra chola,pandya kings, etc.who belonged to ksathriya and vaisya tribes.These temples belong to all hindus and no caste can claim ownership to the temple.

though men, women belong to same class of humanbeings they cannot remain together even privately in many matters.

why not?Who said so?

here leave non brahmins. even among brahmins there are 2 different sects with 2 different gods, 2 different customs and pracititioners of 1 sect do not impose their views on other. in that case, how can non brahmins who completely differ from brahmins in god, in the food, inthe culture be clubbed together particularly when it is accepted by many that temples are already worse than toilets.

Non-bhramins form 97% of hindus and 97% of devotees who come to temple.So your argument that they differ from bhramins in god is not valid.
I dont know how culture becomes an issue here.when people of any culture can become engineers and doctors and can work together,why not they become priests and work together?

brahmins should not impose or interfere in non brahmin temples. similarly non brahmin should also not impose or interfere in brahmin temples. of course, persons of any caste can enter any temple for worshipping god. but the temple should be controlled only by the devotees belonging to the sect of the temple and the agamas should also be the agamas of the sect to be followed in the temples.

There is nothing called as bhramin temples.Temples like thanjore bigtemple were built by devar kings and you cannot call such temples as bhramin temples.


Manu divided society into various religions.whats' wrong in this? even indian constitution does this! remember when manu did this, brahmins were in a huge majority in india and other castes were in a minority. so there is nothing wrong in that.

Indian constitution did not impose an apartheid in name of god like manu did.If manu did what he did because bhramins were majority,thenwhat hitler did to jews was also right because germans were majority and jews were minority.

in modern india, politicians collect tax from all castes. so it is a violation to spend the money selectively for some caste alone. moreover, it is a violation of basic structure of indian constitution which says that 'everybody is equal before law.

earlier kings collected taxes from all people and spent it selectively for welfare of bhramins in name of manudharma.They donated entire villages like bhrammadeyam villages and uthamadhanapuram etc. to bhramins.If that is right,then what happens now is also right.If that is wrong,then what happens now should continue till the effects of that wrong is undone.

hinduism is actually religionof non brahmins. brahminism is a separate religion. actually, my humble opinion is brahmins cannot be called hindus.

:doh:

97% of devotees who come to such temples are non-bhramins.As per your argument they belong to a different religion and hence should not be allowed entry into temples.
 
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Varnashrama Dharma is an integral part of Hinduism, so there's no point in repeating leftist propaganda in this matter. Accoding to Lord Krishna's own words, no jiva can remain without doing karma, and that karma has to be determined by one's varna and ashrama in life. And who determines one's varna and ashrama? The Lord Himself, as he's the dispenser of the fruits of action. Which is why he says in 2.47:

karmany evadhikaras te
ma phalesu kadacana
ma karma-phala-hetur bhur
ma te sango 'stv akarmani

This is the essence of nishkaama karma, which is a fundamental tenet in Hinduism. If one reasons that varna is not birth-based, then the jiva will be forced to choose according to its 'ahamkara' and 'kaama.' Action resulting from such foundation is kaamya karma that binds the jiva to prakriti. Therefore, in order to become liberated, one has to perform nishkaama karma in tune with one's varna. Opting for another person's dharma is dangerous, and the Lord warns us about this, 3.35:

sreyan sva-dharmo vigunah
para-dharmat svanusthitat
sva-dharme nidhanam sreyah
para-dharmo bhayavahah



In effect, Hindus brainwashed by leftists must stop bashing caste system. Hindus who know nothing about caste system must abstain from making such 'expert' comments.:thumb:​

All atrocities done in the world are done in name of god.Usama quotes quaran to kill kaffirs and christians quoted bible to burn witches and upper caste hindus quote geetha to enslave dalits.

All such oppressors argue that they follow the 'word of god' and they do what they do in the best interests of world and people.

Muslim butchers kill goats after chanting "bismillah".Hindus spray water mixed in turmeric on goats,chant manthras and sacrifice them. Should goats accept these butchering because 'word of god' justifies those actions?
 
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Confused Kalaignaa!!!

SIR - the karunanidhi always confuses brahminim with other religions. unlike inother religions, where all sects have only one god, in hinduism and even in brahminism each sect has a different god. even allowing a saiva brahmin as a priest in vaishnava brahmin temples and vice versa will be a blatant violation of the sacred agamas. when even brahmins are not allowed into temples of each other sect as priests, making non brahmins and anti brahmins as priest in brahmin temples, betrays the ignorance and illiteracy of the karunanidhi in matters like this.

in mosques only muslims can become priest. in church, only christians can become priests, this is because in these religiions all sects have same god. the same logic will not apply to hinduism because, here each and every sect has a god, a custom and practice peculiar to its own sect. Temples are not identified by who built it , but by what customs they are following. any hindu can enter any temple for worshipping. but the temples should be controlled only by the sect whose customs the temple is following. similarly, no sect should impose its own customs or interfere in the running of temple of other sects. can a shopowner who sells a saree to a woman say' you are wearing the saree of my shop. so i have a right to touch you'. similarly for anti brahmins to try to impose and interfere in rituals of brahmin temples on the pretext that these temples belong to all hindus, is as vulgar as the shopowners logic. of course anyhindu can enter any temple. the dispute is who should control and what rituals the temple should follow.

All the top three gods are brahmins- the creator brahma, the protector vishnu and the destroyer siva. even rama and krishna are avataars of these brahmin gods. remember lord rama worshipped lord shiva in rameswaram. so if you are a hindu,you have to tolerate brahminism -even if you do not respect or accept brahminism. when even brahmins do not allow persons of other brahminical sects to become priests in their temples, how can anti brahmins &non brahmins be allowed? will any non brahmin be admitted as a member in brahmin association? will any non vanniar be admitted in vanniar sangam? will men be admitted as members in womens' association? will doctors be admitted in lawyers association. even if lord shiva comes to a vaishnava temple, he cannot be allowed to become a priest! the laws of brahmins are so sacred , it is not like dravida naadu which dmk once clamoured and suddenly dropped for political reasons.

a temple which has got a brahmin god or avtaar of brahmin god, which has brahmin priests and follows brahmin customs is a brahmin temple, even if it is built by a non brahmin. brahmins and nonbrahmins going to each other temples and funding each other places of worship is common for centuries.
even rajaraja cholan would not have approved of anti brahmins like karunanidhi tampering with temple customs. of course, only as a gratitude to non brahmins who built these temples, non brahmins are allowed to worship in the se temples and rightly so. remember, brahmins have never tried to impose their practices or interfere in rituals on non brahmin temples anywhere in the world. so nonbrahmins should also not interfere in rituals of brahmin temples.
just like a shopowner selling his shops'saree to a womancustomer cannot claim rights over that woman, just because you fund a temple, you should not tamper withthe customs of that temple.

what happened many, many centuries ago, cannot be taken as a barometer to be followed for today. we have a written constitution, laws, rules and regulations. moreover, brahmins have also suffered more than any community under buddhist barbarism, islamic fascist onslaught and british christian repression, so much so that brahmins who formed a majority of population once are now a miniscule minority. so it is brahmins who should be given benefits even today.remember even fathers of indian constitution originally provided quotas only for sc/st that too only for 10 years and only in a few areas. if it is true that brahmins had tortured nonbrahmins for centuries, our founding fathers would have provided quotas to all non brahmins and permanently for all sectors!
yes indian constitution has not imposed any apartheid because it awards quotas only for limited period. but theconstitution has been tampered by politicians to extend tentacles of quotas beyond permissible limits, so much so that now evensupreme courts have started putting reasonable barriers on quotas. manu did not advocate genocide of any community unlike hitler.he only segragated various persons on basis of their religions, like most constitutions of democratic countries do.

muslims and christians torture even their own sect followers inthe name of religion. that is not there in brahminism and hinduism. so brahminism is certainly tolerant.let us first stop the atrocities being committed in the name of athesim, rationalism and reforms before lecturing about atrocities committed in the name of religion!! animal sacrifice is completely absent in brahminsm. only fascist religions allow animal sacrifice. it is these religions which should be reformed, not brahminism.

it is very pleasing to hear 'there should be only one sect-of humans alone' but it is too late! after so many sects have originiated and flourished for many centuries to this extend, it is impossible and uncecessary to tamper with subsects in the name of reforms!!!











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Brahmanism more tolerant than Communism

There are various sects of Brahmins all following different philosophies, different dieties, different kinds of Yoga (karma, bhakti, hatha, etc...) different tantras, different shashtras, different gurus, etc etc etc... how wonderful we have had such a live and let live attitude and not interfere in anothers chosen Istha Devata, life style, choices, etc...

So many different Brahmins and we are all so accepting of each other. There may be intellectual disputes but never a war or revolution.

Now we got Big Brother who wants to tell us all what to do. What's it to them how we live if we don't interfere with their life?

Why don't they just build separate temples and have their own way their? Why are they taking away our temples and telling us how to run them? They will not control another man's church or mosque. Those who have taken care of temples for many generations may finally have to leave in this generation.

The Government controls temples. How ludicrous! THis is not FREEDOM OF RELIGION. THIS IS AN OPPRESSIVE TOTALITARION REGIME!
 
According to Brahmins (as they have been taught for generations)

All atrocities done in the world are done in name of god.Usama quotes quaran to kill kaffirs and christians quoted bible to burn witches and upper caste hindus quote geetha to enslave dalits.

All such oppressors argue that they follow the 'word of god' and they do what they do in the best interests of world and people.

Muslim butchers kill goats after chanting "bismillah".Hindus spray water mixed in turmeric on goats,chant manthras and sacrifice them. Should goats accept these butchering because 'word of god' justifies those actions?

Sorry to say, there is nothing about Dalits in our hindu tradition. The "lowest" cast given is Shudra. And that is not lowest. According to Brahminism, Shudra is the FOUNDATION of society. Where would society be without it's workers. Therefore, the foundation is always worshipped whenever we see a Murthi or Holi man. We touch his feet.

We bath the feet. We take special care to care for the lord's feet. The vedic representation of Shudra is the feet, as the vaisyas are the thighs, the kshatryas the arms, and the Brahmin the mouth of God Prajapati.

We are the God. Shudra is God. There is no-one who isn't part of the body of God. We are all cells in God's body. Each cell needs to be taken care of and every cell is interdependent on every other.
 
SIR - the kaliaignaa always confuses brahminim with other religions. unlike inother religions, where all sects have only one god, in hinduism and even in brahminism each sect has a different god. even allowing a saiva brahmin as a priest in vaishnava brahmin temples and vice versa will be a blatant violation of the sacred agamas. when even brahmins are not allowed into temples of each other sect as priests, making non brahmins and anti brahmins as priest in brahmin temples, betrays the ignorance and illiteracy of the kalaignaa in matters like this.

Many sects share the same god.Srirangam vishnu,tirpupathi balaji,palani muruka all these gods are istadevatha of people across many sects and castes.No single caste can claim ownership of these deities and argue that they own these deities.who owns tanjore shiva temple?saiva vellalar or saiva pillai?The king who built that temple built it for all hindus and all castes.

When all hindus can go to all temples,it is ludicrous to claim that one sect owns a god.It is even more worse to claim that only one caste has the right to do pooja in a temple owned by government.

All sects and castes share same holy book-vedas.So it is ludicruous to claim that each jathi belongs to a different religion.

If each caste is a different religion,then people of other castes cannot come to temples,let alone become priests.If you argue that each jathi is a different religion,you cannot claim that they can visit all temples,but cannot become priests.



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n mosques only muslims can become priest. in church, only christians can become priests, this is because in these religiions all sects have same god. the same logic will not apply to hinduism because, here each and every sect has a god, a custom and practice peculiar to its own sect. Temples are not identified by who built it , but by what customs they are following. any hindu can enter any temple for worshipping. but the temples should be controlled only by the sect whose customs the temple is following. similarly, no sect should impose its own customs or interfere in the running of temple of other sects.

This is the order of manu,which the country no more follows.Bhramin only should do poojas,ksathriya only should become king..such laws are outlawed.We have become a secular nation and laws of land take precedence over everything else.

can a shopowner who sells a saree to a woman say' you are wearing the saree of my shop. so i have a right to touch you'. similarly for anti brahmins to try to impose and interfere in rituals of brahmin temples on the pretext that these temples belong to all hindus, is as vulgar as the shopowners logic. of course anyhindu can enter any temple. the dispute is who should control and what rituals the temple should follow.

Temple can follow any ritual.Question is whether other castes have right to become preist in temples or not.

If temple laws are anti-constitutional,discriminatory and propogate untouchability they can be scrapped by law.

All the top three gods are brahmins- the creator brahma, the protector vishnu and the destroyer siva. even rama and krishna are avataars of these brahmin gods. remember lord rama worshipped lord shiva in rameswaram. so if you are a hindu,you have to tolerate brahminism -even if you do not respect or accept brahminism. when even brahmins do not allow persons of other brahminical sects to become priests in their temples, how can anti brahmins &non brahmins be allowed?

Bhramins now dont have the power to allow or disallow. That era is gone for good.Now nobody is holier than the rest.All are equals.Rule of law is above religious laws.

the laws of brahmins are so sacred , it is not like dravida naadu which dmk once clamoured and suddenly dropped for political reasons.

Age of bhramins making laws is over.Those laws are superseded by indian constitution.Manudharma has been replaced by indian constitution.

of course, only as a gratitude to non brahmins who built these temples, non brahmins are allowed to worship in the se temples and rightly so. remember, brahmins have never tried to impose their practices or interfere in rituals on non brahmin temples anywhere in the world. so nonbrahmins should also not interfere in rituals of brahmin temples.

Now you talk as if bhramins own these temples.

These temples are owned by government and people and only as a gratitude they allow the people who do poojas there to poojas.

An employee cannot claim ownership of owners property.A bus conductor cannot claim ownership to the bus.Bhramins do not own these temples.They belong to government and people.Bhramins were employees and can never become owner of temples.



just like a shopowner selling his shops'saree to a womancustomer cannot claim rights over that woman, just because you fund a temple, you should not tamper withthe customs of that temple.

These temples were not sold to bhramins.They werent given as donation either.Bhramins were appointed as employees to do a service and they cannot claim that they own the temple.Even if a station master sits ina railway station for generations he or his family doesnt own the railway station.It always belongs to government.
 
We are the God. Shudra is God. There is no-one who isn't part of the body of God. We are all cells in God's body. Each cell needs to be taken care of and every cell is interdependent on every other.

Uppercaste Hindus will call shudras as god and will make this god to clean their toilet for generations.How ironical?Is this how we treat our god?Shame on our religion.
 
The Government controls temples. How ludicrous! THis is not FREEDOM OF RELIGION. THIS IS AN OPPRESSIVE TOTALITARION REGIME!

Temples were conrolled by the right people we got independence.What was the result?Shudras were denied temple entry,shudra women were made to work as prostitutes in temples as devadasis.

Only after this oppressive totalitarian regime took control of temples prostitution in temples (devadasi system) was stopped.Till government took over temples functioned as brothels and centers that propogate untouchability.

Which is more ludicrous madam?Believers ruining temples or unbelievers saving temples?

If athesists fight for right for dalits to enter temples,that is the height of irony. We Hindus bought such a shame to our religion.Shame on us.
 
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TN is Fascist State

Bhramins now dont have the power to allow or disallow. That era is gone for good.Now nobody is holier than the rest.All are equals.Rule of law is above religious laws.

Age of bhramins making laws is over.Those laws are superseded by indian constitution.Manudharma has been replaced by indian constitution.

These temples are owned by government and people and only as a gratitude they allow the people who do poojas there to poojas.

An employee cannot claim ownership of owners property.A bus conductor cannot claim ownership to the bus.Bhramins do not own these temples.They belong to government and people.Bhramins were employees and can never become owner of temples.

These temples were not sold to bhramins.They werent given as donation either.Bhramins were appointed as employees to do a service and they cannot claim that they own the temple.Even if a station master sits ina
railway station for generations he or his family doesnt own the railway station.It always belongs to government.


A. Brahmins don't allow or disallow, nor do they want to allow or disallow. You are the ones who are allowing and disallowing.

B. Brahmins did not make Manudharma. Even Manu, I doubt, would make Manudahrma for Manusmritri has so much that is contrary to rest of Dharmashastra (various legal codes of various times and places) and Brahmanas (the real instructions on living as a Brahmin which is contrary to Manusmritri) that no personage in entire Brahmin history even bothered to give commentary or mention or even footnote this text. So why do you think it's so important?

C. Why doesn't the government take over Churches and Mosques? A Catholic Church is run by the rules as laid down by the Vatican which is headed by a Pope who allows and disallows and his rules supersede your so-called constitution. Anyway, I've recently read the American consitution and have come to the conclusion that India doesn't really have a constitution, just a paper by the same name.

D. The temples should be run by the custodians of the religion Hinduism who are the Brahmins and the acharyas. If you don't like the Vatican, you stop being a Catholic and join another Church or create your own. If you don't like the way Brahmin's run Hinduism, you start your own form of Hinduism. But why destroy the right of others to practice how they wish? Roman Catholic religion is allowed to thrive in all countries that had lutherian and protestant churches which were started as a defiance of the church.

E. You see, you are trying to subvert the very idea of Democracy and Freedom. You are oppressing those who are not believing exactly the same thing or practicing the same way you do. This is and has always been know as FASCISM.
 
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