How to arrest the slide in TB numbers

[Vaagmi]

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It is very poor reasoning that TB boy should not worry about dating as many are like him. How does it help him to get married? .

Most parents cannot get their boys married as educated career oriented girls are choosy and look down on TB boys who are dime a dozen.

They can marry only if they themselves take the initiative and become desirable marriage material.

who would like to be stuck with them?

It is a wrong understanding of the situation.

we are parents of TB girls and we know the issue well. The girls these days are well educated and well employed and they look for a certain level of matching in these basic parameters. And there are many TB boys in the marriage market who are just "also ran" horses in the race. They earn well because of the general prosperity in the economy. So a good salary alone does not get one anywhere. An IT "mechanic" these days get a starting pay of Rs. 1 lakh plus. Girls know,because they are intelligent, the difference between a mechanic and an Engineer. For the same pay they would choose an Engineer in preference to a mechanic. The reasons are obvious.

So if your son is from Harward Business School you will land an equally accomplished girl.

If your son is a product from a local institution run by a politician for profit you will have to set your sights lower. No use complaining. No use believing that improving dating skills will get your son an accomplished girl of mirror cracking beauty.

Dating is not a mode preferred by our girls. They prefer their parents to do all the legwork while retaining the veto with them. They date only on phone and in Saravana Bhavan Hotels. No roaming around beaches lonely with blind dates and no staying for a night with that date to measure him up. It is ingrained culture, Stupid.

Parents role is to be just supportive. Start the search early and keep giving them new proposals as they come. Keep repairing the injured or frayed ego as the failures mount up. It is a long search. Patience gets you there finally. Dont be overactive giving them immature inputs. They know their way. Those who are wayward and indisciplined will any way do whatever they want. Dont waste time over them. Wish them well and bid goodbye. You have far better things to do than tending to their Crossbred offsprings.

 

[CHANDRU1849]

Dating is a Western concept and it may not be used as a tool for physical relationships. It is likely that its usage in West, in all fairness, is linked to people of similar educational background, professions etc. to have wider knowledge about career growth. As sex is no more a taboo in the West, there is no need to treat Dating as an instrument for physical relationships.

The role of Dating in our country is not known - whether physical, hobby, time passing etc. But this word is being constantly used in Bollywood.

 

[vgane]

I am not against dating in arranged marriages...A marriage should no be stopped just because of dating need shared by either boy or girl!...In India I am sure 99% of our TB brethren will not cross the Rubicon even in dating...As far as Western notions of dating is concerned I think both sides will be prepared for the consequences..After all they are grown up and mature adults...Why should we rant about it?

 

[prasad1]

In 1960's my collage days, i had a shock of my life. Having been raised a TB in north India I was naive to say the least in the matter of relations between boys and girls.
In my engineering collage we had girls, and together we had been to movies and dinners (NOT dates). I had to go to get my visa in Kolkata. Not being rich I had to find cheap (free) accommodation. A friend of mine suggested that his brother had a flat and I could crash in. Of course I was overjoyed. I land in his flat, I am invited in and there is a Girl who in introduced as friend. I get the couch, and to my horror and cultural shock they retire to the bedroom (together).
Talk of cultural shock.
The next morning the girl is going back to England.

It took me months to get over the shock.
Then I came to England and the world overwhelms me. I realized how limited was my knowledge of human nature and social norms of the world.
I sympathies with some of the people who still are in pre 1960 world of a TB.
There is a marvelous world exposed to us by Google, we do not have to limit our knowledge to what out parents taught us. We can expand our knowledge base and learn new things everyday. Some we may practice other bit of information you just store it away.
Please do not put blinders of yourself, or on your children.

I never learned the art of dating, and fortunately my parents chose a beautiful and smart wife, who married me in one of her weak moments.

 

[prasad1]

I still do not know What are we arresting?
If number of children born to TB men is what we are trying to get, why not ask TB men to get kids from as many women as possible. Is rape and plunder counts (like they used to do in olden days)?
To what purpose is this TB culture required? What are the benefits to the individual and the society of this culture.
The present culture is different than the culture of the past, but culture lives on.

The king is dead, long live the king!

 

[prasad1]

Our children wayward or otherwise are our children. It is very UNCULTURED to cut your own family because of EGO. Family is more important than any doctrine.

I have seen parents suffering in their old age because they ostracized their own kids just because they had "stupid" and "immature" differences with them.
It is never too late to kiss and makeup.
As someone said:

Parents role is to be just supportive.

If the children go against the parents wishes, it is the parents responsibility to be "mature person". Sometimes you have to swallow your pride and ego. It is difficult but must be accomplished.

 

[renuka]

I feel Hindu principles are on a decline...I mean Hindus are known for their broad mindset and logical thinking but off late some amount of Non Hindu thinking has started to influence Hindus.

Everything and anything seems Haram and Forbidden.

Why fear change when a person has grown up with a mind that can rationalize and think logically?

It only spells total lack of self control,values,faith,confidence and also grey matter if one fears change.

When I went to study in India it was my first time I was exposed to dating culture..as a freshman I saw many seniors openly kissing behind the hostel and this was India..back in 1990 and not some USA or some alien planet.

I did not get a shock cos I had seen kissing in movie etc..human express their lust and affection by kissing..so what is there to get a shock?

It also seemed romantic to see Public Display of Affection...after all one gets knowledge from observation too!LOL

 

[biswa]

Renukaji, you should done a caste/community census of the kissing couples.

 

[renuka]

Renukaji, you should done a caste/community census of the kissing couples.

Couples were from all states..ranging from Kashmir to Kanyakumari.

Inter state..intercaste..inter countries too.

We had international crowd too.from South Africa,Msia,Iran,Bahrain,UK,USA..name it..the whole world was involved.

Everyone was broadminded..no one thought this is mine..that is yours..that type of thinking is only for the small minded..for the large hearted ones..the whole world is family(Vasudhaiva Kutumbakam)

When one kisses..one closes his/her eyes...that time one only contemplates on SELF.

Kissing too is like meditation.

So why hold back?

 

[mkrishna100]

So if your son is from Harward Business School you will land an equally accomplished girl.

If your son is a product from a local institution run by a politician for profit you will have to set your sights lower. No use complaining. No use believing that improving dating skills will get your son an accomplished girl of mirror cracking beauty.

LOL Vaagmiji I always like your way of presentation .
Coming to the point a relative of mine who did his BE and also an MBA from a local institution ( he was very average in his studies ) and used to roam in his bike usually with the Girls form his collage or from his school ( whom he maintains contact with FB ) and took pride in fact he has many girl friends and was having a great time roaming with girls , watching movies with them and taking them out to restaurants ( he was the only one spending ) . This guy is a TB and basically wealthy ( his father earn a lot in Gulf ) and he is still to get a proper job but keeps roaming around with girls and boasting to everyone only to realize later that none of the Girls were interested in marrying him .They all told him that he is good for a time pass ( provided he pays for the same ) but not fit for marrying them as he is average in his studies , lack of skill in getting a decent job and just living with his father's money and many of the girls got married to the boys arranged through their parents or through other networks but basically the Boys belonged to that categeory and standards that were set by the girls .
So in the end my relative realized the harsh truth that dating and flirting are no doubt enjoyable but when it comes to marriage a different yard stick operates .BTW my relative is yet to get a decent job and even now finding dates is difficult as his father has stopped giving him money ( and also blocked his credit cards ) and asked him to spend from his own pocket and all the peanuts that he earns is just sufficient for him to take care of the fuel for his bike and his afternoon lunches at the canteens .

 

[renuka]

.
So in the end my relative realized the harsh truth that dating and flirting are no doubt enjoyable but when it comes to marriage a different yard stick operates .

May be your relative was not interested in marriage either..ever thought about that?

I have seen many types of guys like this..they eventually become very religious in later part of life.

I call these types...the potential sanyasis.

The carefree attitude leads one to detachment eventually.

So bad boys eventually go to heaven and good guys remain in hell with their nagging wives!LOL

 

[tbs]

hi

i got in my email....


The Marriage Dictionary!A new dictionary is soon to come out, defining some issues in marriage that people were curious about. Here are some of the definitions we thought we'd offer to include in it:
Bachelor
1. A man who has been able to avoid the opportunity of making some woman miserable.
2. A man who is said to be foot-loose and fiancee-free.
3. A man who never made the same mistake once.
4. A bad boy who has cheated some poor girl out of her alimony.
5. A person who believes in life, liberty, and the happiness of pursuit.
6. The only man who has never told a wife a lie.
Bride
A girl with great prospects of happiness behind her.
Compromise
A nice little arrangement between husband and wife whereby they both fully agree to let her have her own way.
Diplomat
A man who is able to convince his wife that a fur coat would make her look fat.
Gentleman
A husband who holds the stepladder tightly so his wife doesn't fall while she's painting the ceiling.
A man who notices his wife dropping her knitting and immediately kicks it over to her so that she can pick it up.
Housework
What a wife does without anyone noticing it until she doesn't do it.
Husband
A man who has decided to give up privileges he never knew he had.
A guy who controls the house and everyone in it, and is allowed by his wife to say so.
Joint Checking Account
A great little device which allows a wife to beat a husband to the draw.
Love
An obsessive delusion easily cured by a wedding.
Mother-in-Law
A woman who slowly destroys a man's peace of mind by telling him what's on hers.
Mrs.
A job title involving long duties, very light earnings and zero recognition.
Spouse
Someone who will protect you, help you and help you solve all the problems you wouldn't have had if you'd stayed single.
Wife
A partner who is always complaining that she doesn't have a thing to wear at the exact same time she complains about not having enough room in the closet.

 

[renuka]

So if your son is from Harward Business School you will land an equally accomplished girl.


If your son is a product from a local institution run by a politician for profit you will have to set your sights lower. No use complaining

.

Whatever happened to Sare Jahan Se Accha..Hindustan Hamara?

So is it...Sare Jahan Se Achha..Havard Tumhara?

 

[auh]

Our children wayward or otherwise are our children. It is very UNCULTURED to cut your own family because of EGO. Family is more important than any doctrine.

I have seen parents suffering in their old age because they ostracized their own kids just because they had "stupid" and "immature" differences with them.
It is never too late to kiss and makeup.
As someone said:

If the children go against the parents wishes, it is the parents responsibility to be "mature person". Sometimes you have to swallow your pride and ego. It is difficult but must be accomplished.

I agree. Sad that there are still people who think of breeds among humans... and label people as "crossbreeds" and such.

 

[tbs]

Our children wayward or otherwise are our children. It is very UNCULTURED to cut your own family because of EGO. Family is more important than any doctrine.

I have seen parents suffering in their old age because they ostracized their own kids just because they had "stupid" and "immature" differences with them.
It is never too late to kiss and makeup.
As someone said:

If the children go against the parents wishes, it is the parents responsibility to be "mature person". Sometimes you have to swallow your pride and ego. It is difficult but must be accomplished.

hi

i agreed fully...its time to change......it is difficult......its hard too...

 

[auh]

Coming to the point a relative of mine who did his BE and also an MBA from a local institution ( he was very average in his studies ) and used to roam in his bike usually with the Girls form his collage or from his school ( whom he maintains contact with FB ) and took pride in fact he has many girl friends and was having a great time roaming with girls , watching movies with them and taking them out to restaurants ( he was the only one spending ) . This guy is a TB and basically wealthy ( his father earn a lot in Gulf ) and he is still to get a proper job but keeps roaming around with girls and boasting to everyone only to realize later that none of the Girls were interested in marrying him .They all told him that he is good for a time pass ( provided he pays for the same ) but not fit for marrying them as he is average in his studies , lack of skill in getting a decent job and just living with his father's money and many of the girls got married to the boys arranged through their parents or through other networks but basically the Boys belonged to that categeory and standards that were set by the girls .
So in the end my relative realized the harsh truth that dating and flirting are no doubt enjoyable but when it comes to marriage a different yard stick operates .BTW my relative is yet to get a decent job and even now finding dates is difficult as his father has stopped giving him money ( and also blocked his credit cards ) and asked him to spend from his own pocket and all the peanuts that he earns is just sufficient for him to take care of the fuel for his bike and his afternoon lunches at the canteens .

I think we are not talking about wayward TBs... the general point is that a TB who has a good schooling and landed a decent job is unable to move the coin forward due to lack of social skills.

 

[sravna]

Most of those who are against maintaining cultural values are those who find going good and are enjoying comforts. Some others who are equally successful financially find something good drifting away and are worried. These are the people who worry about culture.

When you worry about culture you are worrying about the long term. We try to preserve something because we have put a lot of thoughts and efforts on it. I can understand if we renovate or even demolish a building and raise a new structure. But do we abandon the foundation which has been holding the structure for so long? What is the meaning to those thoughts and efforts that have gone into making the foundation ? But we are living in a time that we do not even understand that focusing on short term and instant gratifications does a lot of harm.

America with all its might is terrified of terrorism and is also decaying internally. That exemplifies the extent to which selfish interests can harm you. The country talks of women's equality, gay rights but practices arrant capitalism and looks only to its own interests even to the detriment of others. How trustworthy are their talk and those who try to ape them?

Let us not be carried away by the success of science and technology and the luxurious life we are enjoying because of them. It is only blinding us to imminent threats which are already beginning to happen. Culture is what taught us to be compassionate, disciplined, embracing and not science or technology. Let us understand that.

 

[auh]

Most of those who are against maintaining cultural values are those who find going good and are enjoying comforts. Some others who are equally successful financially find something good drifting away and are worried. These are the people who worry about culture.

When you worry about culture you are worrying about the long term. We try to preserve something because we have put a lot of thoughts and efforts on it. I can understand if we renovate or even demolish a building and raise a new structure. But do we abandon the foundation which has been holding the structure for so long? What is the meaning to those thoughts and efforts that have gone into making the foundation ? But we are living in a time that we do not even understand that focusing on short term and instant gratifications does a lot of harm.

...... Culture is what taught us to be compassionate, disciplined, embracing and not science or technology. Let us understand that.

I am amazed that you have thrown around so many words without defining what is that culture that we are trying to preserve? Does culture mean "all good things" in your opinon? Is that the view of the majority here? If so, we can just say "good things" instead of "TB culture". When you say that TB culture is what has taught one to be compassionate and disciplined, you are implicitly declaring that other cultures do not do so. Hence, several members including me have asked you to specifically point out that "something" that is unique to TB culture, which is not present in any other? You and none of the "culture-supporters" have spelled it out.

New things evolve and only with evolution, we progress. Had Adi Sankara stuck to his spoonfed material and not thought about Brahman et al, you would not be talking about Spirituality here. So it is by breaking old paths and creating new ideas that we explore ourselves more. By exploring we become aware of the nature of our self. And that in itself is a meditation.

 

[mkrishna100]

May be your relative was not interested in marriage either..ever thought about that?

If you have read my post I have mentioned the fact that none of the Girls were interested in marrying him and all his poposals were declined for the reasons mentioned and he has to confront the hard reality of attending the marraige of each of the Girls whom he flirted earlier and wondering what went wrong . He is now very misreable that he is neither getting married nor ending up in a decent job . Actually this chap watches lot of movies and he was emulating the various Bollywood and Tollywood heores ( have u ever seen a Indian Hero going for job etc , they may be poor car drivers , mechanics etc but flirt with Rich girls and finally end up marrying them overcoming all odds ) and he too believed that he could be such a Hero only to find that reel life and real life are different .

 

[sravna]

I am amazed that you have thrown around so many words without defining what is that culture that we are trying to preserve? Does culture mean "all good things" in your opinon? Is that the view of the majority here? If so, we can just say "good things" instead of "TB culture". When you say that TB culture is what has taught one to be compassionate and disciplined, you are implicitly declaring that other cultures do not do so. Hence, several members including me have asked you to specifically point out that "something" that is unique to TB culture, which is not present in any other? You and none of the "culture-supporters" have spelled it out.

New things evolve and only with evolution, we progress. Had Adi Sankara stuck to his spoonfed material and not thought about Brahman et al, you would not be talking about Spirituality here. So it is by breaking old paths and creating new ideas that we explore ourselves more. By exploring we become aware of the nature of our self. And that in itschange is not somehielf is a meditation.

Dear Auh,

I have never talked about only TB culture but only the good aspects of the past. Change is not something people should be averse to but the point is you need to maintain more than you change. That is when you evolve and not just change. You may be even regress if it is just change.

 

[Janaki Jambunathan]

It is a wrong understanding of the situation.

we are parents of TB girls and we know the issue well. The girls these days are well educated and well employed and they look for a certain level of matching in these basic parameters. And there are many TB boys in the marriage market who are just "also ran" horses in the race. They earn well because of the general prosperity in the economy. So a good salary alone does not get one anywhere. An IT "mechanic" these days get a starting pay of Rs. 1 lakh plus. Girls know,because they are intelligent, the difference between a mechanic and an Engineer. For the same pay they would choose an Engineer in preference to a mechanic. The reasons are obvious.

So if your son is from Harward Business School you will land an equally accomplished girl.

If your son is a product from a local institution run by a politician for profit you will have to set your sights lower. No use complaining. No use believing that improving dating skills will get your son an accomplished girl of mirror cracking beauty.

Dating is not a mode preferred by our girls. They prefer their parents to do all the legwork while retaining the veto with them. They date only on phone and in Saravana Bhavan Hotels. No roaming around beaches lonely with blind dates and no staying for a night with that date to measure him up. It is ingrained culture, Stupid.

Parents role is to be just supportive. Start the search early and keep giving them new proposals as they come. Keep repairing the injured or frayed ego as the failures mount up. It is a long search. Patience gets you there finally. Dont be overactive giving them immature inputs. They know their way. Those who are wayward and indisciplined will any way do whatever they want. Dont waste time over them. Wish them well and bid goodbye. You have far better things to do than tending to their Crossbred offsprings.

This was inthing in1969 when I married i was in a hostel I went roaming Madras pillion on Vespa i was droped back at 7 PM We decided to marry after one year dating It was different with my son when he married in 2000 details to follow

 

[krish44]

JJ ji

You are the only person who is open and challenge the make believe thinking of some here .

These live in their own world and have a 19th century mindset.

They believe girls never dated 40 years back before marriage and were sold in marriage by parents to other families as kanyadaanam.

They claim the right to fix the marriage of 28 yr old educated working girls and 40 year old unmarried boys based on their stupid beliefs.

Good luck to them.

You may not be able to puncture their beliefs .lol

 

[sravna]

For the record:

Culture is collective value system and practices of one's past and pertaining to one's group.

 

[Janaki Jambunathan]

JJ ji

You are the only person who is open and challenge the make believe thinking of some here .

These live in their own world and have a 19th century mindset.

They believe girls never dated 40 years back before marriage and were sold in marriage by parents to other families as kanyadaanam.

They claim the right to fix the marriage of 28 yr old educated working girls and 40 year old unmarried boys based on their stupid beliefs.

Good luck to them.

You may not be able to puncture their beliefs .lol

I was 19plus He was 25 Doctor working in Medical college Tanjore No emails or cell phones You should know I took t he first step Wrote an lnland asking to come to Madras the next week and meet me in the hostel We went for a movie Aradhana and I had to explain every scene he doesnt understand Hindi Next day to Mahapaliuram! After that he.was in Madras every week end! You see boys didnot have the drive even then!

 

[krish44]

JJ ji
Keep it up .

I am waiting to hear more .

In those days I thought public transport was used for travelling with a date.