Sankararaman murder case - Kanchi Shankaracharya Jayendra Saraswati acquitted

[கால பைரவன்]

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Cynical, blind, pissing -- is this is all you see? My dear brother KB, don't you see I was only saying you were letting your anger blind you, not that you are blind. I was only saying you are pissing on me and that is alright, I will accept it as a baby pissing on a loving brother. About cynicism, I was only telling tks to not go there as that could be a slippery slope and he has since clarified.

Let go my dear brother, we don't have to see eye-to-eye to be friends. You want to say I am a hypocrite, alright, go ahead and get it out of your system, call me a good for nothing hypocrite of all hypocrites and everyone in this forum knows that for a fact.

After that, let us be friends.

with tons and tons of love to my dear brother KB ......

I don't hold any grudges with you the person. I wish you address me normally like you would address anyone else. You may be actually sincere but I can't help see sarcasm every time you call me your dear brother!

 

[Asirvadam]

Mr Asirvadam - Could you kindly share if you are a Hindu just so we know a bit of your background?

Thanks

To post comments in this forum/thread, my religous affinity is immaterial.

You might as well refer to the Introductions thread wherein my wife and I have introduced ourselves.

Please refrain from uncivilized probe and interfering in matters hardly concerns you.

 

[Asirvadam]

tks, asirvadam, has identified himself previously here, as a christian, married to a tambram lady.

.. and an orthodox Iyengar one in that.

 

[kunjuppu]

.. and an orthodox Iyengar one in that.

 

[Nara]

I don't hold any grudges with you the person. I wish you address me normally like you would address anyone else. You may be actually sincere but I can't help see sarcasm every time you call me your dear brother!

KB, I was not sarcastic by a long shot, I felt the only way to lessen the tension between us is to refer to you as my brother and tell you I only have love for you, which is sincere and not sarcastic. As I once observed, since you are responding to me at a time when people in the east will be sleeping I gather you must be here in north America. It would be nice to see you in person and "fight" about the stuff we fight about. When we get to know each other better the tension will also simmer down

KB, I respect your wishes, I will address you as I address anyone else, but please be assured, my expressions of brotherly love for you is sincere ....

 

[prasad1]

The arrest of the Kanchi acharya involved a series of actions that started in Chennai on November 11 afternoon after Tamil Nadu Chief Minister Jayalalithaa gave the go-ahead. Tamil Nadu Police officers led by Additional Director-General of Police (Law and Order), K.V.S. Murthy flew to Hyderabad in a helicopter. The State-owned Cessna aircraft also landed in Hyderabad. The officers met their Andhra Pradesh counterparts and informed them of their plan to arrest the pontiff. The police officers then drove to Mahabubnagar, 90 km away, and took him into custody at around 11-25 p.m. in the guest house of a textile mill. They drove back to Hyderabad and flew to Chennai. At around 6 a.m. on November 12, G. Uthamarajan, Judicial Magistrate-1 at Kancheepuram, remanded the pontiff to 15 days' judicial custody. Subsequently, he was taken to the Central Prison in Vellore.


The Kanchi Mutt's lawyers, Thyagarajan and Chellappa, met the acharya in the prison on November 14. They said he told them that the case had been foisted on him and that he had asked them to take all legal measures to defend him.


The Sankaracharya has been charged with offences under Section 302 (murder); Section 201 (causing disappearance of evidence of offence, or giving false information to screen offender); Section 205 (false personation for purpose of act... ); Section 213 (taking gift, etc., to screen an offender from punishment); Section 34 (acts done by several persons in furtherance of common intention); and Section 120-B (criminal conspiracy) of the Indian Penal Code.


At this stage of the case, there is no presumption of guilt. The filing of the First Information Report (FIR) signals the beginning of the investigation and the charges can be laid or the case can be closed only after the investigation is completed.


Within hours of being sent to prison, the acharya filed a bail petition in the Madras High Court, in which he said he was "totally innocent" of the charges made against him. He said he had been arrested only on the basis of the confessions of those who had been taken into custody in connection with the murder. He said he had cooperated with the police when they questioned him about the crime a few times earlier. "I am the chief of the mutt. There is no connection between me and the murder. I am innocent. I should therefore be released on bail," his petition said.


When the petition came up before Justice R. Balasubramanian, the Public Prosecutor, K. Duraisamy, contended that the prosecution had "credible material" including "incriminating evidence" against the acharya. There were "direct links" (between him and the crime), the Public Prosecutor alleged. According to him, Rs.10 lakhs withdrawn from the mutt's account in ICICI Bank was disbursed to the other accused. A considerable amount of this money was recovered from the other accused after their arrest. The numbers on the currency seized from them tallied with the numbers on the notes withdrawn from the account, he said. A portion of this money was also disbursed to those who surrendered before the court at George Town in Chennai on October 27 and admitted to committing the murder. One of these men was in prison on the date of the murder, Duraisamy said.

Mr. Dorisamy mislead( no he lied) the court? Will he be charged with "contempt of the court"?

The police allegedly led the acharya up the garden path. At Mahabubnagar, they merely told him that they were taking him to Chennai for interrogation. After the aircraft touched down at the old airport in Chennai around 2-30 a.m. on November 12, they presented him with the fait accompli: that he was under arrest.

Was that the private plane someone was speculating? What more a defendant can do?
Let us find and Charge Mr. Dyraisamy with all sorts of crimes, will that happen?

 

[kunjuppu]

KB, I respect your wishes, I will address you as I address anyone else, but please be assured, my expressions of brotherly love for you is sincere ....

Nara,

I lovw KB too.

I love you for lowwing KB too.

Let loww prevail.

Among us. Also among Tambrams all over the world!!

 

[tks]

I do not think this is a wise advice. The seers or the Mutt do not have the legal authority to investigate. It is better to put money and efforts into social projects for the poor and needy as you had mentioned before!

KB

You are right ... Most Hindus chose to look the other way not demanding due process when an icon for Hinduism was arrested without proper foundation. Sri Prasad has highlighted the corrupt actions of the Government falsifying key information.

The same people who were afraid of the Government and could not care to stand for anything are more than happy to dole out criticism of the verdict. They know that the Kanchi Mutt will not take any actions and will play the role of a punching bag.

Anyone can hire private investigation with the idea being getting at the truth. This cannot be advertised and made public. If there was clear suppression of evidence then the Mutt using its lawyer should go after all the culprits for maximum damage - both financial and imprisonment.

Path of Ahimsa does not mean putting up with Adharma.

We need our law enforcement and media held accountable in a way that hurts them if they deliberately pursued the path of destruction and defamation.

I know the above will not happen ..

 

[tks]

auh, we are back to where we started, with so many open questions I don't think demanding answers from the seers amounts to "victimise another innocent". Of course, now that they have been cleared by the court they don't have to answer to anybody. That would be alright if these are private citizens, but they are public figures who wield enormous political, social, and economic power. So, they cannot be deemed to be innocent as long as important questions remain unanswered.

Public figure or private figure or a no-body .. in civilized society all are innocent in a criminal case until proven guilty beyond a shadow of doubt. The Government with its vast resources is the powerful entity here ...

 

[Nara]

Among us. Also among Tambrams all over the world!!

Ha K, why spoil the kumbayara with this sectarian "among us" "Tambrams". Universal love must transcend jAti, no?

 

[Raji Ram]

....why spoil the kumbayara with this sectarian "among us" "Tambrams". Universal love must transcend jAti, no?

கூரை ஏறிக் கோழி பிடிக்காதவன், வானம் ஏறி வைகுண்டம் போவானோ?

 

[Nara]

கூரை ஏறிக் கோழி பிடிக்காதவன், வானம் ஏறி வைகுண்டம் போவானோ?

Why drag a dreamer down? The Chinese are credited with the adage a journey of 1000 miles starts with a single step. Let us dream big, and if enough of us do, it may yet come true.

 

[Raji Ram]

​I too wish and pray your dream comes true, Prof. Sir!

 

[Vaagmi]

Even when I send love your way you see anger in it. No KB, I am not angry at all, I mean it, it is not a rant, what I preach is universal love and I certainly like to practice it, no hypocrisy, cross my heart and hope to die.

with all sincerity, lots of love to you my dear brother KB ....

This reminds me of the courtship of the scorpians- at the end of the courtship the male gets cannibalised by the female. Repeated stings and a stiff fight is part of the courtship. LOL.

Disclaimer: As an onlooker I say this without any malice, intention to put down, be sarcastic or add what you will to this list. I am just curious.

 

[sangom]

Dear Kunjuppu,

In today's Mathrubhumi Malayalam paper, there is a letter to the editor, which I attach. It is from a NB who usually writes to the paper. I was particularly struck by the comparison he makes, of the Sankararaman murder with the killing of Beckett!

I give below my freehold translation of the contents:

'Murder in the Devaalaya'

Henry II, who ruled England in the 12th. century used to have frequent quarrels with his former friend and Archbishop of Canterbury. In truth those quarrels were actually trial of strength of the state (royal authority) vs the Church. Once the king lost patience and loudly exclaimed " is there no one who will remove this fellow!". No sooner the king uttered these words, four people went to the Canterbury church and murdered the Archbishop. But the guilt of the murder hounded the king till his end history says. T.S. Elliot has immortalized this incident through his drama "Murder in the Cathedral".

During September 2004, the temple priest A. Sankararaman of the famous Varadarajapperumal temple of Kancheepuram was pathetically murdered.

After 9 years judgment has been pronounced letting off all the 23 accused! This murder case acquired publicity because two Sankaracharyas of the Kanchi Kamakoti Matham were involved among the accused, as conspirators and abettors to the murder. But due to the "excellence" shown in the investigation of the case, neither those two nor anyone else was punished.

The senior acharya, on being acquitted, says that it is a victory for truth & dharma. But in reality is it not the fact that these two have been concealed/sullied (darkened)? There is no reasonable ground to consider that Saakshaat Varadarajapperumaal came down from the sanctum and cut Sankararaman to pieces. Hence the truth of "who did that diabolic murder?", has been concealed. Poor Padma (Sankararaman's widow) was threatened with danger to her life and thus compelled to change her evidence. She and her children have not got justice and so dharma has also failed, it will appear normally. I am reminded of the saying by believers that "Divine Retribution has no mercy".

V. Babusenan
Vazhuthacaud "

 

[C RAVI]

To be sympathetic towards the victim and victim's family, innocents can not be punished. That would be a sadistic move and commitment of injustice!!

When the senior acharya, on being acquitted, says that it is the victory for truth and dharma, it is very much a valid statement, considering the statement in favor of the innocents who had the sword hanging on their heads unreasonably.

The case was to punish the guilty and when the guilt could not be proved, a innocent would spontaneously get relieved and would praise victory of truth and dharma, considering himself. Especially when the innocent as an accused is a public figure, a religious figure with name and respect, he/she would make such a statement as a matter of fact.

Just because Saakshaat Varadarajapperumaal would not come down from the sanctum and cut Sankararaman to pieces, just because a human or a group of people has to be jailed or hanged for the crime and just because being sympathetic to the victim and victim's family is imperative, the Law does not make any one guilty without any sound proof.

Here, Dharma might have won by relieving the innocents from the clutches of Law (if they are really innocent) and Dharma failed as well by not providing justice to Mrs.Padma Sankarraman and her children. Probably, Dharma will win by giving punishment of different sort, in different ways and at different times to all the guilty out side the frame work of law and order devised by Humans.

 

[sarang]

Is there documentary or kalvettu recortds to prove the king said this?

Once the king lost patience and loudly exclaimed " is there no one who will remove this fellow!".

 

[prasad1]

Rama banished Sita to the forrest on the say so of a washerman, was that the justice we want in India Today.
If a crime is committed, then find the nearest person and hang that person to pacify the hoards, seems to be the solution proposed by so called cultured people!!!!!

 

[kunjuppu]

Dear Kunjuppu,

In today's Mathrubhumi Malayalam paper, there is a letter to the editor, which I attach. It is from a NB who usually writes to the paper. I was particularly struck by the comparison he makes, of the Sankararaman murder with the killing of Beckett!

I give below my freehold translation of the contents:

'Murder in the Devaalaya'

Henry II, who ruled England in the 12th. century used to have frequent quarrels with his former friend and Archbishop of Canterbury. In truth those quarrels were actually trial of strength of the state (royal authority) vs the Church. Once the king lost patience and loudly exclaimed " is there no one who will remove this fellow!". No sooner the king uttered these words, four people went to the Canterbury church and murdered the Archbishop. But the guilt of the murder hounded the king till his end history says. T.S. Elliot has immortalized this incident through his drama "Murder in the Cathedral".

During September 2004, the temple priest A. Sankararaman of the famous Varadarajapperumal temple of Kancheepuram was pathetically murdered.

After 9 years judgment has been pronounced letting off all the 23 accused! This murder case acquired publicity because two Sankaracharyas of the Kanchi Kamakoti Matham were involved among the accused, as conspirators and abettors to the murder. But due to the "excellence" shown in the investigation of the case, neither those two nor anyone else was punished.

The senior acharya, on being acquitted, says that it is a victory for truth & dharma. But in reality is it not the fact that these two have been concealed/sullied (darkened)? There is no reasonable ground to consider that Saakshaat Varadarajapperumaal came down from the sanctum and cut Sankararaman to pieces. Hence the truth of "who did that diabolic murder?", has been concealed. Poor Padma (Sankararaman's widow) was threatened with danger to her life and thus compelled to change her evidence. She and her children have not got justice and so dharma has also failed, it will appear normally. I am reminded of the saying by believers that "Divine Retribution has no mercy".

V. Babusenan
Vazhuthacaud "

dear sangom,

please see my post #207 referenced here.

i was talking to babusenan the other day, and he repeated verbatim our conversation. my posting in the forum preceded mathrubhumi letter, as you can see. .. just kidding sir.

btw it is only tradition that attributes such quote to king james II. nobody really knows... the same as 'et tu brute'? did caesar really say this when he was murdered, at brutus? or did shakespeare make it up? same as 'beware the ides of march'...famous quotes, penned by authors, centuries later, but sounded so authentic, that people believe it to be true.

same as gandhi saying 'hey ram'. according to live observers, he said nothing of that sort.

 

[mskmoorthy]

Sorry for the diversion from the main topic of the thread. These two articles may be of relavant to post http://www.tamilbrahmins.com/genera...yendra-saraswati-acquitted-25.html#post217611

1) From NPR Benjamin Franklin never said that (Wrong Attributions) Benjamin Franklin Never Said That : NPR
2) From Chronicle of Higher Education Who Really Said That by Corey Robin
Who Really Said That? - The Chronicle Review - The Chronicle of Higher Education

 

[sangom]

< snipped >

btw it is only tradition that attributes such quote to king james II. nobody really knows... the same as 'et tu brute'? did caesar really say this when he was murdered, at brutus? or did shakespeare make it up? same as 'beware the ides of march'...famous quotes, penned by authors, centuries later, but sounded so authentic, that people believe it to be true.

same as gandhi saying 'hey ram'. according to live observers, he said nothing of that sort.

But, our resident Brihaspati wants to know whether there are "documentary or kalvettu recortds (sic) to prove the king said this", can you help him please?

 

[sangom]

Sorry for the diversion from the main topic of the thread. These two articles may be of relavant to post http://www.tamilbrahmins.com/genera...yendra-saraswati-acquitted-25.html#post217611

1) From NPR Benjamin Franklin never said that (Wrong Attributions) Benjamin Franklin Never Said That : NPR
2) From Chronicle of Higher Education Who Really Said That by Corey Robin
Who Really Said That? - The Chronicle Review - The Chronicle of Higher Education

Thank you, Shri Moorthy.

The point here is that many people believe and history has it that King Henry II said those words in his exasperation (about Thomas Beckett) and immediately some people went and assassinated the Archbishop. The Sankararaman murder case also let out a similar development happening and hence many people like Shri Kunjuppu, Shri Babusenan, etc., see a similarity of pattern in the two cases.

Whether King Henry II really made any such statement or not is, in my view, irrelevant to the present matter. I am sure that people like tks will not admit to any complicity by the two sanyasis, even if some documentary/epigraphical evidence is produced now, to show that Henry uttered these very words and no other.

AFAI am concerned some NB reader from Kerala thinking almost in the same way Kunjuppu also thinks, is a good pointer to what public opinion is likely to be in this matter. However, after seeing Sankararaman's fate, I believe that many people will hesitate to come forward to criticize the Kanchi Mutt or its Acharyas for anything!! And that, any way, should give complete consolation to many members here, I feel.

 

[kunjuppu]

But, our resident Brihaspati wants to know whether there are "documentary or kalvettu recortds (sic) to prove the king said this", can you help him please?

no even wikipedia says, it is only word of mouth. sooooooooo....................

 

[kunjuppu]

Thank you, Shri Moorthy.

The point here is that many people believe and history has it that King Henry II said those words in his exasperation (about Thomas Beckett) and immediately some people went and assassinated the Archbishop. The Sankararaman murder case also let out a similar development happening and hence many people like Shri Kunjuppu, Shri Babusenan, etc., see a similarity of pattern in the two cases.

Whether King Henry II really made any such statement or not is, in my view, irrelevant to the present matter. I am sure that people like tks will not admit to any complicity by the two sanyasis, even if some documentary/epigraphical evidence is produced now, to show that Henry uttered these very words and no other.

AFAI am concerned some NB reader from Kerala thinking almost in the same way Kunjuppu also thinks, is a good pointer to what public opinion is likely to be in this matter. However, after seeing Sankararaman's fate, I believe that many people will hesitate to come forward to criticize the Kanchi Mutt or its Acharyas for anything!! And that, any way, should give complete consolation to many members here, I feel.

dear sangom,

i think what happened is all misunderstanding of understanding what was said and what was understood.

when S came to visit K, K was busy and told his henchmen (H) இவரே கவனிச்சொக்கொப்பா.

now this can mean many things in tamil to many people.. right from extending hospitality to finishing him off, and all the thousand meaning inbetween.

K probably meant 'give him coffee and make him comfortable'.

H misunderstood this as an order to finish off K and pursued on that front.

all sheer misunderstanding. it is the fault of madras tamil!! serves us right for going for english medium.

the

 

[kunjuppu]

this in today's idlivadai

'என் கணவர் யாருக்கும் எந்தத் தீங்கும் செய்யாதவர். பாவிகள் அவரைத் துள்ளத்துடிக்க அவர் வேலை செய்த கோயிலிலேயே வெட்டிக் கொன்னாங்க. கொலையில சம்பந்தப்பட்டவங்க பெரிய இடம்னு தெரிஞ்ச பிறகும் விடாம வழக்கை நடத்த ஒத்துழைப்பு தந்தோம். ஒருநாள், விசாரணைக்காக போனபோது நீதிமன்ற வளாகத்திலேயே வெச்சி மூணு பேர், 'சாட்சியத்தை மாத்தி சொல்லலைன்னா உன் பிள்ளைங்களை ஆசிட் தொட்டியில வீசிடுவோம். அடையாளம் தெரியாம போயிடுவாங்க’னு மிரட்டினாங்க. கோயில்ல வெச்சி ஒரு உயிரைப் பறிக்கத் துணிஞ்சவங்க... இதையும் செய்திடுவாங்கங்கன்னு பயந்து போனேன். அவருதான் போயிட்டாரு... என் பிள்ளை களையாவது காப்பாத்து வோம்னு நீதிமன்றத்துல மாத்திச் சொல்லவேண்டியதாகிடுச்சி'' - சங்கர ராமன் மனைவி ஜூவில்.

கொலை, கொள்ளை வழக்குகள் அதிகரிக்காமல் தடுக்க புதுக்கோட்டை அருகே மாத்தூர் காவல் நிலையத்தில் போலீஸ்சார் சிறப்பு யாகம். - செய்தி

ஜனவரி 21ஆம் தேதி முதல் தமிழகத்தில் கள் இட்லி, கள் தோசை, கள் ஊத்தப்பம், கள் பனியாரம், கள் ஆப்பம் உள்ளிட்ட விற்பனை தொடக்கம் - செய்தி

.. and this is in this week's online juvee..interview with mrs S