Spiritual Frauds

[C RAVI]

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Dr.Renuka ji,

Really an interesting thought and a great twist to this hot thread...

But one thing....If the whole episode is a pre planed drama for some motive and under cover work, all the players of the drama would have their own role to play perfectly...

 

[anandb]

Nityananda's experiments with Ranjitha

It was an experiment: Nithyananda,It was an experiment: Nithyananda

All the best

Haha, these buzz guys are stupid. In his interviews, Nithyananda has clearly said that part of the video is real and part of it is morphed and they are trying to find exactly which is which. Conveniently, they have quoted what they want to quote and not what he actually said. shame on this media.

 

[anandb]

Dear all,

I am starting to admire Nithyananda now because he can handle blame and persecution really well...whether he is innocent or even guilty...
He still appears so calm and composed despite being so targetted...

I actually did not believe this nonsensical video from the beginning. Of late, Nithyananda and his movement had touched me personally (in fact twice) and some people in my family which has had a transformational effect on behaviors and attitude within ourselves. If there is no inner purity, a human being can never effect such a transformation in the lives of so many others. If he is calm and composed there is some inner force which I would call the "truth" which makes it happen because a person can never put up such an act in public after this shameless witchhunting.

 

[nachi naga]

renu,anand,

i am so happy that saner sensibilities is prevailing.this is how the kanchi gurus got targetted.the only difference is,paramahamsa nithyanandam is facing the media boldly,and speaking.using the exact same gift,which god has given to all of us.i am seeing if jyotisham can throw some light,as when one undergoes in majority of cases,rahu major dasa,somethings are unexplainable.

nachi naga.

 

[talwan]

bad samiyars

Even after so many exposures of samiars like Nityananda we don't seem to have learnt lessons.
In my view if we do services to unable,small help for Annadhana,etc it is the real service to God.
Alwan

 

[anandb]

Even after so many exposures of samiars like Nityananda we don't seem to have learnt lessons.
In my view if we do services to unable,small help for Annadhana,etc it is the real service to God.
Alwan

Talwan,

I suggest you talk to the huge community of educated, intelligent people who are followers of Nithyananda than believing a hotch-potch video put up by a dubious channel called Sun TV. I am no follower of Nithyananda but as a person who respect our Guru parampara, I think we should reserve our judgment till the entire episode is proved beyond doubt either way. As Nithyananda correctly says, in his case he is judged guilty till proved innocent, no way to treat someone, man.

 

[Nara]

....As Nithyananda correctly says, in his case he is judged guilty till proved innocent, no way to treat someone, man.

Dear Anand,

Innocent until proven guilty is a good principle for criminal courts where a guilty verdict will result in one's very personal liberty taken away.

Nityananda being a person of supposed high moral character, and attracts huge following, and the matter is not in a criminal court of law, the standard of innocent until proven guilty cannot apply. Ceaser's wife must be free of suspicion and appear to be so as well.

Nityananda vehemently denies he did anything illegal, which to me means whatever he did was not a criminal act. He does not deny even in a feeble manner that he did not do anything immoral, like an avowed proponent of celibacy having sexual intercourse. Why does he need to figure out which parts of the video is authentic and which parts are morphed to categorically state that he did not do anything against his own oft proclaimed moral principle of celibacy?

Special transformational experiences are often internal and self generated that are then projected on an external entity as the source that just happens to be around at the time it occurs.

He staying calm and in control can also show he has the ability to lie and make it look genuine, nothing admirable in that.

I have no problem with Nityananda having a good time, everyone is entitled to it. But he is not entitled to any special veneration, especially after showing himself to be dishonest.

 

[RVR]

Prof Nara said

I have no problem with Nityananda having a good time, everyone is entitled to it. But he is not entitled to any special veneration, especially after showing himself to be dishonest.

I fully endorse your above statement.

All the best

 

[renuka]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]God is present in everyone.[/FONT] [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]He resides in every heart. So, do not confine God to a temple, mosque or church.[/FONT] [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Where man is, there God is! As you do not realize this, you indulge in the criticism of others.[/FONT] [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]To overcome this habit, enquire within yourself, "Whom do I adore? Whom am I criticizing?" God is present in everyone.[/FONT] [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]So, when you criticize another, it amounts to criticizing yourself. When you love others, you love yourself.[/FONT]

- Divine Discourse, Prema Vahini​

 

[Nara]

Divine Discourse, Prema Vahini

Dear sister Renu, if Prema Vahini is taken seriously, we might as well let all the convicted prisoners out.

A society has some practical consideration to take into account to protect itself from people like Nityananda. I just saw an interview given by this charlatan, and the more interviews of him I see the more convinced I am that he is a complete and unrepentant fraud.

He has the gall to wear saffron and talk about his privacy in the midst of sexual allegations. This is an affront to all who wear saffron with deep and abiding sincerity. It takes just one dishonest, self-serving fraud to discredit all other honest sanyasees.

If this Nityananda is an honest person he must either categorically deny he had a sexual relationship with that woman, or give up his presidency err, his saffron.

Cheers!

 

[tbs]

hi folks,
the whole divided into three gunas...satva , rajas and tamas...
even all human beings in this three gunas...even lord krishna
said...trayee gunopatah...in this trigunatmika jagat...even
sadus/god mans are also in satva ,rajas, tamas....depends
upon their their vritti...even ayurveda...the medical text
describes the whole body system are based on kapham/
vadam/pitham....so even sanyasis also included in this
three categories....
regards
tbs

 

[anandb]

Dear Anand,

Innocent until proven guilty is a good principle for criminal courts where a guilty verdict will result in one's very personal liberty taken away.

Nityananda being a person of supposed high moral character, and attracts huge following, and the matter is not in a criminal court of law, the standard of innocent until proven guilty cannot apply. Ceaser's wife must be free of suspicion and appear to be so as well.

Nityananda vehemently denies he did anything illegal, which to me means whatever he did was not a criminal act. He does not deny even in a feeble manner that he did not do anything immoral, like an avowed proponent of celibacy having sexual intercourse. Why does he need to figure out which parts of the video is authentic and which parts are morphed to categorically state that he did not do anything against his own oft proclaimed moral principle of celibacy?

Special transformational experiences are often internal and self generated that are then projected on an external entity as the source that just happens to be around at the time it occurs.

He staying calm and in control can also show he has the ability to lie and make it look genuine, nothing admirable in that.

I have no problem with Nityananda having a good time, everyone is entitled to it. But he is not entitled to any special veneration, especially after showing himself to be dishonest.

I don't agree with your assessment at all. The law is equally applicable to all whether it is a swami or a common man. When a terrorist like Kasab caught red-handed killing people can be offered a trial along with biryani and fruit juice, definitely, Nithyananda cannot be assessed randomly and that too based on footage from Sun TV.

The very fact that he says he did not do anything illegal is from the point of view that he is a celibate from the beginning and people following him have believed to be so. So from a legal point of view, consensual sex is not illegal but from a moral point of view where the movement believes he is celibate it will be a big letdown if it is found that he did have sex like a normal human being. To me it seems, he is not indicating about the legal point of view because it is anyway not illegal but from the point of view of morality. If he thinks that there was no sex involved then it makes perfect sense to me to investigate the genuine and morphed parts because that is the only way he can prove his innocence.

Transformational experiences are internal no doubt but a lot of times triggered by an external source called Gurus. You need to do a lot of reading on what we call "Dheekshai". I am sure you will still not be convinced because you will ask for scientific proof. The relationship between a Guru and a follower or disciple is similar to the role of mentoring you probably do for a doctoral student under your wings except there is a huge spiritual dimension which is added to the Guru-Shisya relationship. That is why disciples or followers talk about a constant spiritual guidance from their Guru even if the Guru is not physically present near them. Over ages, thousands and thousands of people have vouched for these intense personal experiences and we cannot categorize all of them as mindless delusions lacking scientific proof. Life is strange and may be you may have one such experience in future and you will know what I mean.

One of the reasons to stay calm in these type of situations is where the mind is conditioned enough not to let external circumstances affect you. Though I have been impacted by Nithyananda, I am not ready to pronounce a judgment either way. It it later out turns that the video is true, he will definitely go down hugely in my opinion due to the perception of a celibate guru. But it will still not remove the transformational experiences I have had through him. For me, it is "Judgment Reserved" till clarity emerges on the whole issue.

I know for you, the Judgment has been pronounced and I am happy that you are happy. To each his own.

Santhi.

 

[s.srinath]

Spiritual frauds

SWAMI NITHYANANDA should stop giving interviews and marry his devoted BAKTHA RNAJITHA and set rest to the whole controversy on the the legitimacy of having sex with dresess on in privacy.

 

[pannvalan]

Neither Nithyananda Paramahamsa nor his followers have answered these questions.

1. Why 'panividai' (sisurusha) in a private, secluded setting?

2. Why only a young woman should do this?

3. If he was really sick, a qualified male/female nurse could have been employed.
Why this was not done?

4. The two explanations that "I was in a deep samaadhi (trance)" and "I was sick at
that time" do not reconcile with each other.

5. In the CD released, this man was repeatedly referring to himself as "I" as well as
"We", alternately. That showed he lost his equipoise at that time, like any other
common man. Is this a correct state of mind for a sanyasi?

6. Why did he hide himself somewhere and did not come out openly, immediately after
the expose? What was he doing in the intervening period?

7. What did he mean exactly by saying that 'he did not do anything unlawful' in the
first of his responses?

All the important videos have already been removed from You Tube and other sites,
except for TV9, a Telugu channel.

It appears that this man is really an influential guy and he may stage a come back, with renewed vigour (!) and continue to do his business as if nothing has happened.

Mera Bharath Mahaan!

 

[Ganamukundhapriya]

Tolerance is a value for Hinduism

If what reported in media has to be believed then the Sankaracharya of Kanchi Mutt also is a tainted Sanyasi. But I think that we should not jump the guns. Also we should not do the mistake of evaluating the virtues of a Sanyasi from a ideal personality that we have in our mind. Often our mind is a bundle of contradiction and tries to derive pleasure out of other's misery. The Sun TV tried exposing the Kalaingnar family by conducting survey and paid heavy prize for it. It has changed its stand now. The present expose is also for generating media attention. Tomorrow it will ensure that authentic Sanyasis are those approved by Sun TV channel.

It shold be noted that just as Brahmins have reverence for Sankaracharyas and Jeers, the Hindus in other communities do their Aadheenams. Though they differ in custom and rituals, they all are Sanyasis and it is not ethically right to talk or write ill of them. Brahmins are Hindus and Brahmins cannot apply for affiliation to Christianity or Buddhism if they have to denounce the value of Hinduism.

 

[pannvalan]

Your analogies are wrong and arguments shallow.

 

[Ganamukundhapriya]

Bhakthi is our path and one just has to believe

No problem and time can prove me wrong for taking a neutral stand on this issue for now. But I still feel that we should not jump the guns and fire adverse comments that we could not take back later. Remember that even Adi Sankara ventured to learn the pleasure of (or ills of it) family life by switching his soul with that of King. It is not possible for mortals to understand everything and it is always prudent to choose a path earmarked to oneself. Believers are not going to change their path by any gimmicks of Sun TV. They will be right even if Nithyananda or Sankaracharya is proved wrong.

 

[C RAVI]

Dear sister Renu, if Prema Vahini is taken seriously, we might as well let all the convicted prisoners out.

A society has some practical consideration to take into account to protect itself from people like Nityananda. I just saw an interview given by this charlatan, and the more interviews of him I see the more convinced I am that he is a complete and unrepentant fraud.

He has the gall to wear saffron and talk about his privacy in the midst of sexual allegations. This is an affront to all who wear saffron with deep and abiding sincerity. It takes just one dishonest, self-serving fraud to discredit all other honest sanyasees.

If this Nityananda is an honest person he must either categorically deny he had a sexual relationship with that woman, or give up his presidency err, his saffron.

Cheers!

Sri Nara ji,

We said.....

Philosophical teachings of considering every one innocent and finding god within him/her in my opinion would stand good among the general public living together and related to each other in some or the other way in day to day life, where no one bear any sort of public image/representations.

In case of culprits/criminals who all are convicted prisoners, the teachings of Sri Prema Vahini ji can stand good to reform the prisoners and lead them to the right path along with the punishment of confinement for having done unlawful deeds.

But the people who all are public personalities, bearing philosophical and moral responsibilities towards the people around the world can not be considered alike unless they were been legally punished if found guilty of unlawful deeds.

If some God man has been considered to be unfit to be a Guru due immoral activities against the principles of being a God man, than the God man has to withdraw his guise. Or at least public should be smart enough to refrain from being followers.

My comments above are all in general and not in support or against any God man.

 

[nachi naga]

re

No problem and time can prove me wrong for taking a neutral stand on this issue for now. But I still feel that we should not jump the guns and fire adverse comments that we could not take back later. Remember that even Adi Sankara ventured to learn the pleasure of (or ills of it) family life by switching his soul with that of King. It is not possible for mortals to understand everything and it is always prudent to choose a path earmarked to oneself. Believers are not going to change their path by any gimmicks of Sun TV. They will be right even if Nithyananda or Sankaracharya is proved wrong.

ganamukundhapriya,

i agree.we shud not become judgemental,that too fro media reports.media is owned as business entity,with political affiliations,to generate income for an idealogy.communism is for dravidians as well as capitalism.in what way can we prove either is true or false.

this is the same way bhagavan sathya sai baba was bismirched,our own mahaswamigals policy of sticking to shastras and sampradayas,our own hdg jayendrar and vijayendrar,why even ramanuja bhagavath pada was said to have sired a two dozen kids in hebbar,mandyam,karnataka,after he ran for his life from tamizh nadu to karnataka.

same way again,from tiruvanamalai,paramahamasa nithyanandam had to set up ashram in bidadi.because of generosity of donors.maybe vested business interests are jealous,maybe political rivalry of endorsement...maybe an 'act' as if a s**ual intercourse or fellatio is to hoodwink the public by the actress itself,to protect him or whatever reason...so unless a proper investigation is done,we cannot jump into conclusions

the paramahamsa nithyanandam is INNOCENT.

there is insufficient proof,as bhagavan sathya sai baba says,its all "tricknology" by technology of some evil minds.

nachi naga.

 

[anandb]

Poor Nithyananda. If he had got all angry and upset and did an emotional outburst on TV, people would have mocked at him and said how a Sanyasi cannot have his tantrums under check? Speaking calmly and saying openly he does not want to blame anyone, people still say "What a masterful actor he is"?

He should be thinking - நரி எந்த பக்கம் வேன்னாலும் போகட்டும். மேலே விழுந்து பிடுங்காம இருந்தா சரி.

 

[Nara]

Poor Nithyananda. If he had got all angry and upset and did an emotional outburst on TV, people would have mocked at him

No Anand, I am not asking him to get emotional, there was a suggestion that his calmness is a sign of his innocence. I was just pointing out that is not necessarily so. Yes, if he got emotional and shouts, that will count against him also. What he needs to do is come clean. Here are couple of things he said (I am paraphrasing) that makes a mockery of his sanyasiness:

• I did not do anything illegal
• My personal life is misrepresented

Why can't he just say, like Clinton did, "I did not have sexual relationship with that woman"?

 

[nachi naga]

nara,

Why can't he just say, like Clinton did, "I did not have sexual relationship with that woman"?

Yes,he spoke truth in private,what happened.

Kama Sutra by vatsayana has speial section about relationships.

nachi naga.

 

[renuka]

Dear all,

You know what...I have a got a better way to escape this situation...
All he has to say is "Naan Avan Illai"

renu

 

[suvarchas]

In most of the cases we ourselves are to blame as most of us get carried away by the propaganda by mass media without using our discretion.Ofcourse our awareness and judgement is also poor.A real saint or sage can easily be distiguished by the calmness and the serenity radiating from his face.Most of us look upon such persons who are claimed by devotees to have performed miracles as real yogis or saints.Real yogis or sages live in oneness with nature without a taint of artifciality

 

[nachi naga]

re

pannvalan,

Neither Nithyananda Paramahamsa nor his followers have answered these questions.
1. Why 'panividai' (sisurusha) in a private, secluded setting?

private means private,why public wants know whats going on private?

2. Why only a young woman should do this?

Is there a ban on young women to do seva?

3. If he was really sick, a qualified male/female nurse could have been employed.
Why this was not done?

Healing is done by many.There is no qualification absolutely neccessary.There are umpteen doctors,nurses,who are devoted and do seva.A spycam was installed,to sanyasis life in private.That itself is a suspicious motive,to nail someones poularity.Any professional editor who edits films,will see the dis-jointed,additions,when the video is lab analysed.

4. The two explanations that "I was in a deep samaadhi (trance)" and "I was sick at
that time" do not reconcile with each other.

How?

5. In the CD released, this man was repeatedly referring to himself as "I" as well as
"We", alternately. That showed he lost his equipoise at that time, like any other
common man. Is this a correct state of mind for a sanyasi?

Because he is genuine and not putting a act of show.At such young age,his meteoric rise,has made people jealous.Plus god knows what his devotees PR was.Even the proponents of various sampradayas,religion heads,have been maligned, one was even killed,despite this fact,its the number one religion in the world today.

6. Why did he hide himself somewhere and did not come out openly, immediately after
the expose? What was he doing in the intervening period?

shud appreciate his beloved devotees,who valued his security,and true love blossomed,and he listened to his devotees.foolish valour in front of mob crazy anger,is unwise.wisely he ducked and hooked a sixer,like an accomplished batsman.a true homerun,like in baseball.

7. What did he mean exactly by saying that 'he did not do anything unlawful' in the
first of his responses?

that his actions are above board.which is a lawful thing to do.

All the important videos have already been removed from You Tube and other sites,
except for TV9, a Telugu channel.
It appears that this man is really an influential guy and he may stage a come back, with renewed vigour (!) and continue to do his business as if nothing has happened.
Mera Bharath Mahaan!

Maybe it will be posted later.who knows,the guru ways are mysterious.preaching,if its construed as a business,maybe we agree,as definitely he will rise.the stars says so and its written and moreover his dharma will protect him like a shield.Dharmo Rakshathi Rakshithaha
mera bhu-lokam mahaan.
nachi naga.