Hinduism Vs Rest

[NARAS]

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SIR = There is no link between tamil in temples and cricket. the italian flag matter is connected with my another posting about Mr. karunanidhi becoming chairman of indian cricket board.
Tamil belongs only to tamils like other languages. but sanskrit belongs to everybody. it s a universal language. there will be very few people in the world who will have sanskrit as their mother tongue. it s a common language to all. karunanidhi boasts always about being follower of periyar, anna both of whom are dead. likewise there is nothing wrong in hindus following sanskrit even if according to pseudo rationalists sanskrit is 'dead'

THERE IS NO LANGUAGE IN THE WORLD WHICH CAN CHALLENGE SANSKRIT AS FAR AS SLOKAS, MANTHRAS are concerned. in other matter sanskrit may be of not much use. but as far as slokas,manthras, scriptures are concerned SANSKRIT IS ONE AND ONLY. it s out of sheer jealousy against sanskrit that karunanidhi imposed tamil in temples. in a secular country there cannot be gvt. temples. all orthodox temples were built by people and maintained out of their own funds. it s not govt's property. so the dmk govt. has no business to interfere.what is the need to change sanskrit which has been there for centuries. when a govt. goes for a change in any matter there must be something wrong with the existing arrangement. what s wrong sanskrit?is tamil a better option in temples than sanskrit? certainly not. M.karunanidhi openly spit venom against sanskrit inthe assembly in 1998 when he was the chief minister and retorted that those who oppose(?) tamil should be chased out of t.nadu. is he a chief minister or dada? is this venom or not? is this decency? who gave him the right to say this? if i say to him to go back to his native village and not stay in chennai will u accept that? please advice him not to stoop low and spew venom at things he does not like. why should he have so much fear and inferiorty complex against sanskrit the so called dead language.for your information tamil WAS THERE in orthodox temples many, many years before M.karunanidhi was even born! it was not dmk which introduced tamil in temples. it was their for centuries. a law must be introduced in parliament to allow places f worship to continue their age old customs, practices. Temples are not laboratories for Mr.karunanidhi to experiment his ideals. temples are not lavatories for him to discharge his unwanted filth
even if there is no tamil in temples what will happen? will tamil flourish only if it s recited in temples? is it such a weak language that just beause some people do not use it in their worship it will disappear? just like dravida nadu i think dmk should drop this move of imposing tamil.
Remamber DMK was shouting about dravida nadu in the 60s? when a law was passed to ban outfits promoting separatism, immediately dmk dropped dravida nadu!! if law comes tomorrow that any outfit opposing sanskrit will be banned,immediately dmk will drop the idea of tamil imposing and will start supporing sanskrit to escape getting banned!!
There is nothing wrong in supporting DMK. but please get your facts right before doing so.

 

[NARAS]

SIR - the present c.m. of t.nadu had issued an order that persons of all castes can become archakas in temples. temples were not built and are not maintained by govt. funds or tax payers money. in fact it is other way round. temple funds have been used for govt purposes, public purposes. what right does a govt have to regulate temple practices, when it is not owned by govt. after all in secular democracy you cannot have govt. temples or govt. places of worship. all temples belong to private maths not govts, and govts. cannot interfere n this. it is good to see that the supreme court has quashed this fascist orders.

There r 2 types of temples in the world - brahmin temples and non brahmin temples. the rituals, customs & practices followed in brahmins temples are totally opposed to functioning of non brahmin temples. for example, brahmin temples are 100% vegetarian. but non brahmin temples are non vegetarian. brahmins were in a majority in india once. brahminism was then a separate religion - not just a caste as it is now. but after islamic barbaric invasion the demographic pattern of india was altered by force of sword. brahmins were reduced to a minority. the british then 'merged' brahmins with non brahmins and branded them as 'hindus' brahmins were reduced to the status of a caste. non brahmins were forcibly allowed to enter brahmin temples. adminstration of brahmin temples came under non brahmins. the karunanidhi govt.s move to impose non brahmin methods in brahmin temples is illegal, unconstitutional, anti secular, not demcratic, fascist, indecent & uncivilized. its like asking a man t wear a saree with blouse. its like a christian controlling mosque. its like a buddhist heading a gurudwara. persons belonging to one religion should not poke their nose into other religions.brahmins should not interfere in non brahmin temples. like wise, non brahmins should not tamper with brahmin temple administration. mutual tolerence (not necessarily respect or acceptance) of each others culture is only way.

dmk justifies this invasion of brahmin temples by saying that since the temples were built by non brahmins they have right to interfere inthe adminstration.this s carrying logic to point of absurdity. does a house belong to a labourer who has constructed it?

dmk chief minister karunanidhi is an atheist no no no sorry...a rationalist. so he does not believe in any god or religion. but he greets(!) people on the occasion of muslim & christian festivals. why? because the dmk onits ownhas only20% of popular vote in t.nadu. of this muslims, christians form almost 90%. without muslim , christian sponsorship dmk cannt win even a municipal election.

 

[NARAS]

SIR - J.M. Lyngdon an election commissioner who behaved more like an agent of sonia maina gandi during his tenure, was recently 'rewarded' by appointing him as chairman of committee. Krishnamurthy, another sonia maina favourite was appointed chairman of anothe committee few months back. justice Ratnavel pandian who scoffed at merit and upholded mandal commssion caste quota for bc has been appointed as chairman of BC Commission by sonia maina govt. immediately after his appointment he went to meet karunadhi to 'greet' him! where is the country heading for ?

 

[NARAS]

]SIR - ALL OF OUR MEMBERS SHOULD PLEASE VISIT THE FOLLOWING SITE IMMEDIATELY :

arunshourie.voiceofdharma.com

please know truths about all fascist ideologies - communism, congress, islam, christianity, rationalism,pseudo secularism, athesim etc

 

[NARAS]

SIR - ALL OF OUR MEMBERS SHOULD PLEASE VISIT THE FOLLOWING SITE IMMEDIATELY :

www.[URL="http://www.arunshourie.voiceofdharma.com"]arunshourie.voiceofdharma.com[/URL]

please know truths about all fascist ideologies - communism, congress, islam, christianity, rationalism,pseudo secularism, athesim etc

 

[vijay]

I think Cho has written a lot about this.

It is a pity that Thuglak does not have an online presence.

hi chintana
thuglak has online presence.its url is www.thuglak.com

 

[aditya]

What is wrong if Tamil is used in place of the already extinct sanskrit in temples.

There can be apathy against DMK and MK but i dont like stooping so low to say MK would punish anyone who carries Indian flag. Agreed MK does not have the guts to question muslims but two wrongs cannot make things correct. MK did not say he would throw out people who dont have Tamil names. In fact even MK's name is a sanskrit name. Hope we dont stoop too low and spew venom at people whom we dont like.

First of all, Sanskrit is NOT completely dead! It has always been in use, albeit for religious purposes. Unlike many other 'dead' languages, which have either disappeared totally or have been replaced by modern languages that have evolved from them (eg. Sangam Tamil), Sanskrit is still widely used and has been preserved for thousands of years, and is now enjoying a revival among common man. So let's not try to kill it completely, by suggesting replacing it, especially where it has always been used, with other languages.

Second, I wonder if MK would be really stupid to suggest that people who do not have tamil names are not eligible to live in Tamil Nadu. His son, Stalin, is named after a Russian fascist - shouldn't he be the first one to be kicked out of TN by his own father's government? But then again, nothing would surprise me as far as MK is concerned. Most of what he says and does is self-contradictory, and he thinks he can get away with it because he feels that people of TN, specifically Hindus, are apathetic, and can be bullied into total submission.

 

[kudumi]

Hinduism is not failing-Its the followers who fail.

More than 50000 people converted to Buddhism last week from hinduism. So Mr. suresh why is Hinduism failing ? I dont think Dalai lama is pumping any money.

Grass is greener on the other side.
So people convert.

Put a black dot in a white paper. People will only see the black dot.
So it is easy to find fault with anything, divert people's attention to that and promise them anything.

All religions evolve. People also change. People are corrupt and hence they corrupt religion also.

Budhism which started as a poor man's religion soon accumulated so much wealth that monastries were raided for wealth. So its not religion's fault. Its people's fault.

Before you say hinduism is failing, please remember its an eternal religion and encompasses the knowledge and theories of all religions combined.

Budhist are equally zealous in converting others. If not money, it should be something else.

 

[kudumi]

He did say if the gods cannot understand tamil we dont need such gods.

I fail to understand sir what is the link between Tamil in temples with Italian flags in cricket stadium.

Few of the good things this DMK govt. has done is giving an option to worship in Tamil. It is ridiculous to say that tamil has been given a honour that sanskrit slogas are written in Tamil.

But in fact we should say Sanskrit is given an honour to stay alive with the help of Tamil. What is wrong if Tamil is used in place of the already extinct sanskrit in temples.

There can be apathy against DMK and MK but i dont like stooping so low to say MK would punish anyone who carries Indian flag. Agreed MK does not have the guts to question muslims but two wrongs cannot make things correct. MK did not say he would throw out people who dont have Tamil names. In fact even MK's name is a sanskrit name. Hope we dont stoop too low and spew venom at people whom we dont like.

Check your facts. He did say gods have to leave if they dont understand tamil.
Two wrongs do not make one right. But keep provoking a submissive group of people again and again and cash on it,and retain power on that basis, sensible people will react.
Its the apathy and selective amnesia, or rather filtered assimilation that surpirces me.

 

[aditya]

More than 50000 people converted to Buddhism last week from hinduism. So Mr. suresh why is Hinduism failing ? I dont think Dalai lama is pumping any money.

Many of the Dalit conversions are engineered and sponsored by christian evangelical institutions. They pump in enormous amounts of money to induce people to convert from hinduism to christianity mainly, but also instigate conversions to buddhism as a way to attack and weaken hinduism.

 

[NARAS]

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[kabali]

Many of the Dalit conversions are engineered and sponsored by christian evangelical institutions. They pump in enormous amounts of money to induce people to convert from hinduism to christianity mainly, but also instigate conversions to buddhism as a way to attack and weaken hinduism.

The percentage of Christians in India has remained steady at around 2.3-2.6% in our country from the time of Independence. I dont know why this demographic statistic did not undergo a sea change with the amount of money allegedly pumped in .

As long as the Dalits are not treated on par with others conversions will not stop. Why poor brahmins are not getting converted even though the church promises money for anyone converting?

In christianity dalits can become fathers,priests and bishops and even cardinals. i dont think a dalit till a few decades ago could even enter kanchi mutt.

 

[aditya]

The percentage of Christians in India has remained steady at around 2.3-2.6% in our country from the time of Independence. I dont know why this demographic statistic did not undergo a sea change with the amount of money allegedly pumped in .

As long as the Dalits are not treated on par with others conversions will not stop. Why poor brahmins are not getting converted even though the church promises money for anyone converting?

In christianity dalits can become fathers,priests and bishops and even cardinals. i dont think a dalit till a few decades ago could even enter kanchi mutt.

Your delusion regarding the superior treatment of dalits by christian churches is most amusing. Reports after reports show that the dalits are NOT treated any better after conversion to christianity. On the contrary, they end up hving their own church because the mainstream christian community do not want them in their churches.

I would request all those who hold similar misconceptions regarding christianity's treatment of dalits and other socially deprived communities after conversion to read the series of articles on this web page, compiled from different sources.

http://www.christianaggression.org/search.php

Dalit Christians barred from entering church in Tamil Nadu
Posted December 29, 2003
Los Angeles Times​

MADRAS, India — Police were guarding a church in southern India on Thursday after more than 250 lower-caste villagers who converted to Christianity were barred from a Christmas Mass.

The villagers, known as Dalit Christians after the lower-caste Hindu social group they once belonged to, were prevented from attending midnight Mass at St. Ebiben's Church in Manjakuppam, in southern Tamil Nadu state, about 1,100 miles south of New Delhi, by high-caste converts, Father Christopher Rethinasamy said.

He said he was helpless to do anything because he feared an outbreak of violence.

Dalits, also known as "untouchables" because higher castes would traditionally refuse physical contact with them, are at the bottom of India's ancient caste system.

Many of India's Christians, who account for about 2% of the country's 1.02 billion population, have changed their faith to escape the Hindu caste hierarchy.

The Dalit Christians were made to wait an hour and half as Mass was conducted for the converts from the Vannia community, who were formerly high-caste Hindus.

They were allowed entry an hour after the ceremony ended, after police intervened and negotiated with church authorities.

"I know it is against the teachings of Jesus," Rethinasamy said. "But I had to go along with the decision of the Vannia Christians. I did not want the situation to deteriorate."

About 50 police officers were posted at the site to prevent any clashes, said a senior police official in the area, Rajeev Kumar.

Read these articles, and all the others on this web page, and then come and have discussions with me on this!

The situation is the same in the west. The non-whites typically have their own church, primarily because they are unwelcome in the white churches. Many Indian christians who go to the west, with such illusions of christianity equality, are shocked to find rampant discrimnination by skin color in the US. They end up starting their own church or joining black church.

I remember the case of my own Indian christian colleague, who was always criticizing and attacking hindus for caste discrimination in India. When this man and his family moved to a small town in mid-west US, he joined a large protestant church, where he was the only non-white. He was dismayed to find himself and his family discriminated and isolated. They treated him cordially at first as a newcomer, but soon it became apparent that they were uncomfortable having a non-white amidst them. No one would talk to him and his family, or socially interact with them. None of the other children would mix or play with his children during sunday school; noone would socialise with his wife during the after-service coffee gatherings and other church-related social events. His family felt completely isolated and humiliated, that eventually he went and joined a non-white church. Now, one rarely hears him talking about christianity's sense of equality or constantly harping about the social ills in hindu society.

As for your other assertion on christian demographics: The percent may seem to remain constant over time, but the main problem with christianity is that many Indian converts are crypto-christians. That is, they convert to christianity, but retain their hindu names and caste identity, mainly to derive caste benefits. This problem has already been addressed by sociologists and demographers. The churches give higher estimates on percent of christians in India, but the national census gives a lower percent, mainly because of the tendency of many converted christians to retain their caste identity.

 

[aditya]

As long as the Dalits are not treated on par with others conversions will not stop. Why poor brahmins are not getting converted even though the church promises money for anyone converting?

In christianity dalits can become fathers,priests and bishops and even cardinals. i dont think a dalit till a few decades ago could even enter kanchi mutt.

Here's another article:

Dalit Christians Demand Equality
Posted February 18, 2004
Times of India
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/496862.cms​

NEW DELHI: A Christian organisation representing Dalits or the socially underprivileged on Saturday questioned the church leadership for demanding special treatment for them and accused it of exploiting their economic and social backwardness.

Stating that Dalit Christians accounted for about 70 percent of India's Christian population, the Poor Christian Liberation Movement (PCLM) accused high-caste Christians of exploiting them.

The church leadership wanted to exploit the poverty and unemployment among the Dalit Christians to demand reservation of government jobs for them by getting them classified as scheduled castes, PCLM president R.L. Francis said in a statement.

People belonging to the scheduled castes benefit from reservations in educational institutions and government jobs.

"It is worth mentioning here that when they (Dalit Christians) were in Hindu society, they were the victims of the caste system . The foremost reason for their coming to the fold of Christianity was that there would be no discrimination and they would be treated as equals.

"But despite a wide network of (Christian) missionary schools and colleges, most children of Dalit Christians have not been able to rise above the literacy level because these convent schools are busy catering to the educational needs of upper and high caste people. The neglect of Dalit Christian children by these institutions is the root cause of the problem.

"The same is the case with job opportunities and entrepreneurship development. Dalit Christians are being denied all these facilities while the church leadership continues to flourish by usurping vast foreign funding and real estate resources," Francis charged.

Demanding a Dalit Christian Development Board, he said that in the coming parliamentary elections, members of the community would only vote for parties which supported this.

 

[aditya]

I made an error in citing the address of the web page from where the articles above were drawn. Please note their correct webpage address:

http://www.christianaggression.org/

Under search, if you specifically type in 'dalit church' (without quotes), it will draw up a list of articles related to the Dalit plight in christianity.

 

[kabali]

Dear Aditya,

All the articles you have posted are just abberations but not the norm. It is a pity that casteism is creeping iinto christianity also. But what to do it is just the bad influence of some bad tenents in Hinduism on christianity also. Just like Hinduism had to soften its "untouchability" stance with the influence of christianity some unwanted Hindu concepts also is slowly creeping into christianity.

As far as your demographic quote, i wish you could furnish proofs. It is not good to accuse without any proofs.

 

[kabali]

Check your facts. He did say gods have to leave if they dont understand tamil.
Two wrongs do not make one right. But keep provoking a submissive group of people again and again and cash on it,and retain power on that basis, sensible people will react.
Its the apathy and selective amnesia, or rather filtered assimilation that surpirces me.

I think there is nothing wrong in what he said if he supposedly said it. But the main greviance i have with the pseudo-secularist MK is he does not have the temerity to question Islam on this issue.

But the question we are talking here is about chasing people having non Tamil names. I dont think MK said anything like that.

 

[NARAS]

SIR - Dr. arun shourie has clearly stated that the main reason why christianity flopped totally in india was beause hindus DID NOT convert in large numbers to christianity as expected by the church inspite of pumping billions of dollars by the pope. It is strange that casteism is creeping into christianity. because unlike hinduism which is pure vegetarian religion christianity is an impure religion which allowes christian to eat anything-pig, cow, buffalo,goat, rabbit, rat etc. so there is no possibility of untouchability or casteism in christianity unlike hinduism which brands meat eater(even if they are brahmins) as untouchables on scientific grounds.

It is the inner strength of hindiusm that even low caste hindus HAVE NOT converted to christianity in numbers as expected by the christian clergy. also possibly many who have converted initially due to allurement of money, material by church reconvert to their mother faith - hinduism- frustrated that the church has not delivered its promise.

 

[NARAS]

SIR-Mr. Karunanidhi has said that hindu gods do not understand tamil. so they should leave t.nadu. who is he to tell this? is he a dada? a person who is so intolerant of opposite views has no place in public life. the sooner we see the back of this fellow the better for everybody including himself.

Mr. KABALI feels 'happy' that M.karunanidhi has not said that anybody who does not have tamil names should leave t.nadu. dont worry kabali! even if Mr.karnunanidhi has not said this before, the day is not far off when he will say this. BEWARE!!

 

[NARAS]

SIR - The only reason why Mr. karunanidhi has not got the guts or spine to question islamic religion is because even the periyar did not do so!M.karunanidhi is a blind follower of the periar. He does not hav any original ideas on any matter on his own. all his vomits are views of the periar.He a puppet of the periar. He will not do anywhich which the periar has not. DMK will bark at brahmins with sanskrit names. but muslims in DMK have arabic names. DMK will ask hindu gods to go out of t.nadu on the pretext that they do not understand tamil. but they have no shame about flirting with arabic mouthing mullahs & latin mouthing bishops.the dmk has a pathetic 20% vote int.nadu on its own. and almost 90% of this 20% forms of muslims, christians. the dmk will go into a political coma if muslims, christians do not support it.to retain their support DMK dances to their tune like baffoons.DMK is the prime dancer in the secular cabaret.

 

[aditya]

Dear Aditya,

All the articles you have posted are just abberations but not the norm. It is a pity that casteism is creeping iinto christianity also. But what to do it is just the bad influence of some bad tenents in Hinduism on christianity also. Just like Hinduism had to soften its "untouchability" stance with the influence of christianity some unwanted Hindu concepts also is slowly creeping into christianity.

As far as your demographic quote, i wish you could furnish proofs. It is not good to accuse without any proofs.

Abberations? Abberations! I give you an entire site filled with materials from difference sources on various topics relating to Indian christianity, and you dismiss all that as Abberations! What can any one possible do for someone living in such denial. Either you are very naive (and this is possible, considering that the Indian media is careful to present only the rosy picture of christianity, lest the christians get 'upset,' thus many Indians in India remain clueless about the true facet of christianity in the country, believing in the christian propaganda by the good old missionary or evangelist), or you must be a crypto-christian yourself. No don't bother to respond to that, because my question is rhetorical. I am in deep wonder. Here's something to feast on:

Crypto-Christianity at Work!
Posted July 22, 2003
Author: Rajendra Chadha
Publication: Organiser
Date: September 2, 2001 ​

The Census Commission of India is yet to publish the details pertaining to the latest census of 2001. One does not know if the Indian Christian leadership were able to scoop out some inside information from the office of the Census Commission. They have already started asserting that there will be marginal decline in Christian growth rate on this time as compared to the previous census this is aimed at rebutting the “nationwide propaganda” said to be made by some people that large scale conversion of people, in particular the poor tribal and dalit Hindus, into Christianity is taking place and to assert that such propaganda is totally false and misleading.'

Dr Jose Nedumpara, in his report on Religious Composition of India, which has been recently published in the “Indian Christian Directory for the New Millennium (Published by Rashtra Deepika, Kottayam) says: “Had the Christian missionaries resorted to large scale conversion techniques as alleged, the Christian population would have registered a growth rate much above the national average growth rate. Since the Christian community has registered a decadal growth rate (1991-81) of 16.9 per cent much below the national average growth rate of 23.79 per cent, it is assured that the numerical share of the Christian population in India is actually decreasing...”


...Again quoting the projected population figures of the Union Home Ministry. Dr Nedumpara argues that die population of the Christians in India would come down to a mere 2.18 per cent, a sharp decline from the 2.34 in 1991. Whereas in 1991, there were 1,96,40,284 Christians in India in 2001 there will be 2,20,98,000, he says. Between 1981-1991 Christian population growth rate was recorded at 16.89 per cent as against the national average 23.79 per cent. However, the same directory of about 1,500 pages puts the population figures of the Christians in India to 2,57,6M84 as on April 2000. This means that between the nine year period on 19912000 there was a substantial increase of 61,27,981 Christians in the country. Even If we consider that there was no further growth till the last Census was completed in March this year, then also the Christian population during this decade registered a growth of 31 per cent between 1991-2001, which is much above the national average once again. It is to be noted here that as per the 1991 census the decadal growth rate between 1981-1991 was recorded at 16.89 per cent as against the national average of 23.79 per cent. This means that the decadal growth rate between 1991-2001 has been nearly double as that of 1981-1991...

...According to the Directory, the Catholics in the Country has a population of 1,55,49,218, thus constituting the majority of the Christian population in India. While the Methodist have a population of 6,56,499; Syrian Orthodox (Jacobite) Church 12,85,000; Mar Thoma Church has about nine lakhs population; Malankara Orthodox Syrian Church has 25,11,833; the Church of North India Dioceses has 9,94,400; the church of South India has 31,18,574; and the Salvation Army has a population of 2,92,315. Among the other churches the Christian population has been estimated to be 4,60,426. Curiously enough, these figures do not include, the Crypto-Christian population, which are strategically hidden by the Christian leadership during every census operation. Certainly there figures must he at least a' few lakhs if not more.

All these figures are contrary to the view and argument put forth by the prominent Christian leaders of the country and certainly put a question mark on their claim that there has been no large-scale conversion of the non-Christians during the decade. Once the final details of the latest Census are brought out, certainly more revealing facts would come out. One wonders how they will defend the massive and several times increase in the population in some of the States, particularly in the Northeast and tribal areas of the Country. Take for instance the massive growth in the Christian population in Arunachal Pradesh between 1971 and 1991, which increased from 0.85 per cent to 10.29 per cent. The phenomenal growth rate of the Christians in the country is further authenticated by the Christian literatures and internal missionary documents, which reveal that them are hundreds of Christian organizations engaged in the conversion of large number of people into Christianity. While some of them proudly proclaim that they succeed in converting at least a few thousand Hindu populations per year, many say that they have been converting villages after villages. While their main area of concentration so far has been in the northeast and the tribal areas, the Christian missionaries are now shifting their concentration to the other areas like Punjab and other northern States, where, their literature claims is the “fertile ground for conversion”. All these figures, facts and statements quoted from the Christian literature reveal that their leaders are themselves engaged in a false propaganda at the national and international level with regard to their actual population Figures and the conversion. Whereas they have been engaged in massive conversion, well documented in their internal documents, they publicly proclaim otherwise, trying to shift the entire blame on others. Can now one believe on the argument of Prof Nedumpara; “Hardly have the much debated missionary activities done anything to skyrocket the Christian population. There is not a grain of truth in the arguments that Christian missionaries resort to massive conversion of Hindus to Christianity”.

In the light of the arguments put forth by the Christian leaders, contradicting their own statements pertaining to the game of figures, one is only compelled to conclude that there is a desperate attempt on the part of the Christian missionaries to employ one more ruse to mislead the gullible Hindu and catch him unawares. It is high-time for the Christian sect to realise that they are an integral part of the society in Hindustan and treat the non-Christians as their brethren without resorting to hypocratic crypto-techniques, aimed at destroying the heritage and culture of the land of their ancestors.

 

[aditya]

...it is just the bad influence of some bad tenents in Hinduism on christianity also. Just like Hinduism had to soften its "untouchability" stance with the influence of christianity some unwanted Hindu concepts also is slowly creeping into christianity.

Are you sure that it isn't the other way round, with many ugly aspects of christianity creeping into hinduism?

Slavery, racial discrimination, and persecution of non-christians and non-whites has been rampant in many parts of the christian world, specifically in the west, since the advent of christianity. Even today, in the US, in mainly the bible-belt, racial discrimination and mistreatment of non-whites by pious white christians is acute. Where is the hinduism influence in all that? In fact, when I was living in the midwest US, small town, there used to be a joke among many Americans, that a good christian is one who attends church every sunday, and comes out and flings his bible at the first black guy he sees. Even couple of days ago, there was article in one of the newspapers in the US about a particular christian denomination in a small town: that despite the blacks and whites belonging to that same denomination, they each had their own churches even in this 21st century, because the whites couldn't somehow see the blacks as their equal and didn't want any social interaction with them.

I really think that many Indians are misled into believing in the 'goodness' of christianity, mainly because of our movies, which always paints the christian as the good guy and the hindu as the bad one. Plus, our media delibrately blocks out any bad news on the christian world from Indian readers - like the sex scandals of the church rocking the entire western world. While this issue has dominated the western news media, the Indian media has hardly covered this issue.

Because of tremendous hypocricy, injustices, and exploitation of the poor and the vulnerable by christian churches world-wide, christianity in the west is on the decline. More and more people in the west are disillusioned by christianity, and are turning to hinduism, buddhism, and other spiritual practices. This explains why the western churches are flooding India and other developing countries with evangelists and missionaries, and pumping millions of dollars to try and pump up the numbers of christian population.

 

[kabali]

. he will bark at hindu gods and ask them to go outside t.nadu on the pretext that they do not understand tamil. but he will have no shame about flirting with arabian mouthing mullahs and latin mouthing bishops. [\quote]

The bishops in India dont mouth latin. The christians in india adopt to the local language. The christian churches in Tamilnadu do most of their sermons and worship in Tamil and mind that Bible is the highly translated book in the world. It is pity that some stubborn brahmins have killed vedas because they want it to just die with the already dead sanskrit.

 

[kabali]

Are you sure that it isn't the other way round, with many ugly aspects of christianity creeping into hinduism?

Slavery, racial discrimination, and persecution of non-christians and non-whites has been rampant in many parts of the christian world, specifically in the west, since the advent of christianity. Even today, in the US, in mainly the bible-belt, racial discrimination and mistreatment of non-whites by pious white christians is acute. Where is the hinduism influence in all that? In fact, when I was living in the midwest US, small town, there used to be a joke among many Americans, that a good christian is one who attends church every sunday, and comes out and flings his bible at the first black guy he sees. Even couple of days ago, there was article in one of the newspapers in the US about a particular christian denomination in a small town: that despite the blacks and whites belonging to that same denomination, they each had their own churches even in this 21st century, because the whites couldn't somehow see the blacks as their equal and didn't want any social interaction with them.

I really think that many Indians are misled into believing in the 'goodness' of christianity, mainly because of our movies, which always paints the christian as the good guy and the hindu as the bad one. Plus, our media delibrately blocks out any bad news on the christian world from Indian readers - like the sex scandals of the church rocking the entire western world. While this issue has dominated the western news media, the Indian media has hardly covered this issue.

Because of tremendous hypocricy, injustices, and exploitation of the poor and the vulnerable by christian churches world-wide, christianity in the west is on the decline. More and more people in the west are disillusioned by christianity, and are turning to hinduism, buddhism, and other spiritual practices. This explains why the western churches are flooding India and other developing countries with evangelists and missionaries, and pumping millions of dollars to try and pump up the numbers of christian population.

There might have been racial discrimination in christianity but thats all long long long in the history. It is this adaptability of christianity that has made it the largest religion. With untouchability and other nonsesne still in vogue with Hindus we are just sitting on a religion which has no future because of the fact it is the only religion which discriminates its followers!!!!

Do you say slavery did not exist in Hinduism? Even Raja harishchandra's wife and kids were slave.

I live in the US for the past 8 years. I dont see any racial discrimination as rampant as the caste discrimination which Dalits face in India.

Parading of Dalits in naked, killing dalits for eating beefs , debaring dalits from pulling temple cars etc., are still practiced widely in India.

It is better we plug in those than trying to point a non-existent stuff in another religion. Discrimination is the norm in hinduism whereas it is just a small samll unheard of abberation in christianity.

To say the truth the shankarachariyal of sringeri has said he does not mind getting arrested under the discrimination act rather than he mingling with Dalits. Does even a bishop says like that leave alone pope.

 

[aditya]

Kabali :
There might have been racial discrimination in christianity but thats all long long long in the history.

Which parts of my writing did you NOT understand? It seems that you are in such hurry to reply, that you don't give a thorough reading to other people's posting. I have clearly stated, time and time again, that racial discrimination IS still rampant in the US, especially in the more pious christian areas. I am now convinced that you are a converted christian yourself; either that, or you are filled with so much blind hatred for Brahmins that you e willing to support christian underhandness and hypocricy just for spite. Well, good luck with your mission! But know this much, that there are many others who are NOT fools!

By the way, have you bothered to go through the website I recommended for your edification. Here it is, one more time.

http://www.christianaggression.org/

Go through it at your leisure. I'm sorry if those articles will make you uncomfortable, and squirm with embarrassment, at the fact that christianity's devious ways have been totally exposed. it may anger and sadden you to know that Indians in India will no longer remain fools, and will begin to see the light as many of us in the west have already seen.

By the way, there is a wonderfully illuminating documentary being shown in BBC: Sex Crimes and the Vatican. The entire documentary is about the sex scandals rocking the churches in the US, in which the vatican has been involved. It is very painful to watch it, let alone here how these priests preyed on children. Here is the synposis of the documentary:

Sex crimes and the Vatican


A secret document which sets out a procedure for dealing with child sex abuse scandals within the Catholic Church is examined by Panorama.

Crimen Sollicitationis was enforced for 20 years by Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger before he became the Pope.
It instructs bishops on how to deal with allegations of child abuse against priests and has been seen by few outsiders.
Critics say the document has been used to evade prosecution for sex crimes.

Crimen Sollicitationis was written in 1962 in Latin and given to Catholic bishops worldwide who are ordered to keep it locked away in the church safe. It instructs them how to deal with priests who solicit sex from the confessional. It also deals with "any obscene external act ... with youths of either sex."

It imposes an oath of secrecy on the child victim, the priest dealing with the allegation and any witnesses.
Breaking that oath means excommunication from the Catholic Church.

Reporting for Panorama, Colm O'Gorman finds seven priests with child abuse allegations made against them living in and around the Vatican City. One of the priests, Father Joseph Henn, has been indicted on 13 molestation charges brought by a grand jury in the United States. During filming for Sex Crimes and the Vatican, Colm finds Father Henn is fighting extradition orders from inside the headquarters of this religious order in the Vatican.

The Vatican has not compelled him to return to America to face the charges against him. After filming, Father Henn lost his fight against extradition but fled the headquarters and is believed to be hiding in Italy while there is an international warrant for his arrest.

Colm O'Gorman was raped by a Catholic priest in the diocese of Ferns in County Wexford in Ireland when he was 14 years old. Father Fortune was charged with 66 counts of sexual, indecent assault and another serious sexual offence relating to eight boys but he committed suicide on the eve of his trial.
Colm started an investigation with the BBC in March 2002 which led to the resignation of Dr Brendan Comiskey, the bishop leading the Ferns Diocese.

Colm then pushed for a government inquiry which led to the Ferns Report. It was published in October 2005 and found: "A culture of secrecy and fear of scandal that led bishops to place the interests of the Catholic Church ahead of the safety of children."
The Catholic Church has 50 million children in its worldwide congregation and no universal child protection policy although in the UK there is the Catholic Office for the Protection of Children & Vulnerable Adults. In some countries this means that the Crimen Sollicitationis is the only policy followed. The Vatican has refused repeated requests from Panorama to respond to any of the cases shown in the film.