Is the petition justifiable

[Raji Ram]

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The Guruvayoor temple does not deserve the privelege/honor of being visited by Yesudoss.

Is it so?

This line really deserves LOL!!

 

[Raji Ram]

A Hindu would not step into any temple that discriminates human beings. A place/structure that discriminates does not deserve status of a temple.

Srirangam temple gives special privilege to one group of brahmins.

Don't we call it BhoolOka Vaikuntam?
P.S: May be because of this discrimination, you entered that temple on your special DAY!! :decision:

 

[Kuvalayavalli]

Srirangam temple gives special privilege to one group of brahmins.

Don't we call it BhoolOka Vaikuntam?
P.S: May be because of this discrimination, you entered that temple on your special DAY!! :decision:

How are the 'bhooloka kailasams' different from bhooloka vaikundams!!!

 

[BRAHMACHARI]

How are the 'bhooloka kailasams' different from bhooloka vaikundams!!!

Mz Deepthi,

Iyer Women follow religous ethic and self-discipline. they don't enter any place of worship, be it hindu temple or church or mosque on those 3 days every month. they honor the sanctity of such places and don't profane.

 

[krish44]

Did God commit incest and homosexuality? A brahmin is one who sheds ego, is open to criticism and corrects himself, who is above all emotions and ... many more. Quit bursting out, learn to remain composed, maintain equanimity, ane above all humility. These and many other positive traits have helped us, brahmin women, to conquer great heights. Follow us. Aspire to be commanding as we are and not demanding.

And.....last but not the least.....cease from misunderstanding! as much as sporting a namam does not make one an iyengar, mention of christ does not make one a christian. a brahmin does not jump to conclusions, invariably amiss.

dear K
when you are born in a brahmin family and hinduism is your religion, it is wise to see its good points and ignore what you do not like.

we cannot help the accident of our birth in any family following any religion.

if you have married a christian ,it is your choice.

hindu religion is a liberal religion

it does not lynch non believers or those who break the rules of hindu religion

you might have your grievences regarding practitioners of the religion.

still no other religion can be tolerant like hindu religion

I am a hindu . not much of a believer in hard core hindutva

but I would never leave the folds of this religion as it puts up with me and tolerate my deviant behaviour

i would suggest you do the same and not give vent to negative feelings about the hindu religion or its followers.

it does no one any good to be over critical of those following a faith

it only hurts the critic

 

[Raji Ram]

How are the 'bhooloka kailasams' different from bhooloka vaikundams!!!

FYI, only Srirangam temple is supposed to be bhooloka vaikuntam.

Those who worship Lord Shiva are not respected much in that place.
And, one section of brahmins will never visit bhooloka kailasam, if it exists! :decision:

 

[krish44]

FYI, only Srirangam temple is supposed to be bhooloka vaikuntam.

Those who worship Lord Shiva are not respected much in that place.
And, one section of brahmins will never visit bhooloka kailasam, if it exists! :decision:

a new route is opened to kailah mansarovar. all sections might be tempted to pay a visit if it is convenient.

when pathway is made difficult many avoid going to such places.

even in vaishno devi in jammu, one has has to crawl thru a narrow entry.besides walking a lot from katra or taking pony

I found even after temple entry to dalits. the higher castes are treated differently from others by the priests.

it is this discrimination that hurts people

 

[Raji Ram]

1. a new route is opened to kailah mansarovar. all sections might be tempted to pay a visit if it is convenient.
........
it is this discrimination that hurts people

1. May be tempted to take the trip for fun! Hut I wonder how many will enter the temple!

2. Yes! That is why it hurts a bit while praying at Bhooloka Vaikuntam!

 

[krish44]

dear RRji

some years back my office colleague , one south indian girl around 29 yrs back shared with me her experiences of her visit to kailash mansarovar.

she was telling me that she was escorted by chinese soldiers in uniform for the last mile.

she was shivering in her boots due to the escorts

but she enjoyed the pristine blue and white snow and well maintained temple.

there is hardly any people there except the few who go for pilgrimage.

miny. of external affairs every year advertises for applications from indians wanting to take the yatra and helps in getting the visa

now with the new govt it might be simple and yatra itself might be tourist friendly

 

[Kuvalayavalli]

Mz Deepthi,

Iyer Women follow religous ethic and self-discipline. they don't enter any place of worship, be it hindu temple or church or mosque on those 3 days every month. they honor the sanctity of such places and don't profane.

When Sankara encountered a chandala emanating pungent odour in kasi, sankara commanded him to move away. the chandala quickly retorted, 'in physique or in soul?'. sankara shockingly realized the folly of his conduct. sankara was quick to realize that the chandala may be emanating foul odour in physique but sankara himself was stinking in soul. realizing who it is in the guise of the chandala to teach sankara a lesson, sankara remained mute.

it is not the physique that profanes or defiles but soul. it is not that which enters through the mouth that defiles but that which proceeds from your mouth that defiles you coz that which comes out from the mouth comes from the heart.

please quit addressing me with some assumed name. i am not the deepthi whom you have imagined. that deepthi is settled in hyderabad and i am not from hyderabad.

 

[Vaagmi]

When Sankara encountered a chandala emanating pungent odour in kasi, sankara commanded him to move away. the chandala quickly retorted, 'in physique or in soul?'. sankara shockingly realized the folly of his conduct. sankara was quick to realize that the chandala may be emanating foul odour in physique but sankara himself was stinking in soul. realizing who it is in the guise of the chandala to teach sankara a lesson, sankara remained mute.

it is not the physique that profanes or defiles but soul. it is not that which enters through the mouth that defiles but that which proceeds from your mouth that defiles you coz that which comes out from the mouth comes from the heart.........

What a clever twist to the story and what a clever twist to its interpretation too. Wow. And what a great conclusion which resonates with Bible.

It is not that which enters through the mouth that defiles. So eat any amount of beef, mutton, chicken,eggs, pork and seafood. They never defile any thing. And do not worry about marrying a non-vegetarian because you can start on a diet which will not defile anything. And dont ever believe that what enters through the mouth will ever affect what comes out from the mouth and from the heart. Good advice from a proselytiser. God save TBs.

 

[Vaagmi]

My view is that if someone is not Anti Hindu they should be permitted into any Hindu temple.
One should not be required to pledge they follow Hindu religion in order to enter a temple.

There is a need to ensure security precautions are taken but that need not be complicated.

One need not follow the Hindu religion to enter the Hindu temple alright. But he will have to subject himself to a certain discipline that is required to be followed as per Hindu temple rules. A christian can go to church and attend a mass-even give qurbani- with his shoes on. But you can not enter a hindu temple with your shoes or chappals. You have to leave them out.

There is a rule in Indian civil Law which is called the right that accrues due to usage and practices. If a devout muslim goes to a temple regularly just like our christian Yesudoss, in course of time he may insist that the deity should be facing only east as a deity facing west hurts his other religious sentiments when he stands and prays before that deity and may file a suit. In India such a suit may go upto Supreme Court and a judgment may come with a solutionwhich is neither here nor there. LOL.

 

[Vaagmi]

I like the view that anyone who is not anti hindu should be free to enter a hindu temple.

it is not wise to put restrictions for entering places of worship for those who want to do so

I view with distaste the middle men who take upon themselves to decide who should enter unless it is their private property.

similarly , insisting men should be bare bodied above waist.

I refuse to go near temples which have such restrictions.

when I sometimes go accompanying my wife who is a believer , I stay outside the temple if I find some such diktat which is revolting.

We think we are right with our ideas and the temple thinks they are right. The best way is to ask them and find out why they have such a rule. And then criticise the rule on merit and try to change it if there is an inclination to do that. Saying 'I don't care to enter the temple and go before the deity because I do not like to subject myself to their rules and restrictions' is, to say it mildly, reveals a 'my way is highway' mindset.

 

[Vaagmi]

Doctor Mam,

I reproduce hereunder extract of news item appeared in IBN Live dated: June 17, 2007.

Yesudas is a singer who has sung an immense number of Hindu devotional songs. Yet it is him who is not being allowed into Guruvayoor temple because he happens to be a Christian.

When asked if this is severe injustice, the singer said, “I am not saying injustice or anything. For me Krishna, Christ are all the same. I sing Muslim songs also. My father taught me that you are a singer; you should be like a free bird. That is the advice I have stuck to all my life.”

Is Yesudas is allowed entry into Guruvayoor, would that freedom is given to the common citizens or only to VIPs?

“Let them first decide whether they want to allow me or not. We will look at that issue then. That question is for later,” Yesudas said.

“A new day will come. The sun will rise when I will be allowed to go inside the temple without any hassles. Lets wait for that day,” the singer added.

Source: Should non-Hindus be allowed in temples? - IBNLive

That was actually a malayalam song he sang long back " Guruvayur ambalanadaiyil oru divasam jnan pokum, gopura vathil thurakkum jnan oru gopakumaranai kaanum" he sang long back.

 

[krish44]

We think we are right with our ideas and the temple thinks they are right. The best way is to ask them and find out why they have such a rule. And then criticise the rule on merit and try to change it if there is an inclination to do that. Saying 'I don't care to enter the temple and go before the deity because I do not like to subject myself to their rules and restrictions' is, to say it mildly, reveals a 'my way is highway' mindset.

Thanks for pointing it out.

Too old to change my mindset now.

 

[Vaagmi]

The Hindu Gods are an exception.

The understanding is flawed.

A hindu temple is not only a place of worship. It is also a place where the God is present in the form of a deity.

The devotee goes to the temple and to the deity seeking contact. At the devout who visit the temples.

 

[Vaagmi]

The Guruvayoor temple does not deserve the privelege/honor of being visited by Yesudoss.

Yes we do understand that. That is because his name has Yesu in it. LOL.

 

[Vaagmi]

A Hindu would not step into any temple that discriminates human beings. A place/structure that discriminates does not deserve status of a temple.

Yes only a hindu. Not a doss of Yesu or an ex hindu now a convert.

 

[Vaagmi]

Srirangam temple gives special privilege to one group of brahmins.

Don't we call it BhoolOka Vaikuntam?
P.S: May be because of this discrimination, you entered that temple on your special DAY!! :decision:

This is really taking the discussion to a very low level. Now a bird in my neighbourhood tells me to inform RR madam that in their boologa kailasam Chidambaram there are special privileges enjoyed by another group of brahmins. The privileges include misappropriation of Nataraja's properties and income. Perhaps that is why Chidambaram is called a kailasam on earth what with almost every Nayanar singing about the God in that temple.

Privileges are what managers of the temple decide. Not the God or the deity. Managers are just human beings with all their weaknesses.

 

[Vaagmi]

1)FYI, only Srirangam temple is supposed to be bhooloka vaikuntam. Those who worship Lord Shiva are not respected much in that place.
2). And, one section of brahmins will never visit bhooloka kailasam, if it exists! :decision:

1. Similarly those who worship Jesus is not given respect or muthal mariyathai in Srirangam temple. Any objections? Worshipers of Shiva are saivites and they belong to a different religion according to Vaishnavs who worship only Narayana. What is the problem of Saivites here? Why do you expect respect in the temple in the first place. People who go to temple go there in all humility. Don't allow your antennas to become over active while standing before God whether he is Narayana in Srirangam or Nataraja in Chidambaram. Just be yourself with all your self respect in tact. That is enough.

2. And yes vaishnavites will never visit a bhoologa kailasam just as they never visit the wailing walls of Jerusalem or the Macca in Saudi Arabia. What do you want them to prove to you? If you call yourself a secular or broadminded individual you can go Srirangam, Macca, Madina, Jerusalem, etc in turn and have darshan of Pope in Vatican before returning to your home. Vaishnavites do not believe in doing all that. Period.

 

[CHANDRU1849]

Cool!! But how do we find it out? :spy:

To have VIP dharshan at the Tirumala temple, my Iyer friends joined the group of one Jeeyar swamigaL, disguised as Iyengars!

The transfer from pattai to nAmam went unnoticed!

This shows how disciplined are Iyers in Tamil Nadu. These Iyers will do anything for the sake of preference. It is nothing but temporary conversion. Please show this to the Iyers friends who have done this.

The disciplined and religious Iyers must put their head down in shame.

My point is also proved very well that most of the Iyers in Tamil Nadu are pseudo-Vaishnavites. They lack religious discipline.

 

[Raji Ram]

1. This shows how disciplined are Iyers in Tamil Nadu. These Iyers will do anything for the sake of preference. It is nothing but temporary conversion. Please show this to the Iyers friends who have done this.

2. The disciplined and religious Iyers must put their head down in shame.

3. My point is also proved very well that most of the Iyers in Tamil Nadu are pseudo-Vaishnavites. They lack religious discipline.

1. They know very well that Hariyum Sivanum oNNu! :decision:

2. No need to feel ashamed, if one follows Guru of another sect of brahmins!

3. Do you mean to say that Iyers should not pray Vishnu and his other forms? That is not fair. :nono:

 

[Raji Ram]

This is really taking the discussion to a very low level. Now a bird in my neighbourhood tells me to inform RR madam that in their boologa kailasam Chidambaram there are special privileges enjoyed by another group of brahmins. The privileges include misappropriation of Nataraja's properties and income. Perhaps that is why Chidambaram is called a kailasam on earth what with almost every Nayanar singing about the God in that temple.

Privileges are what managers of the temple decide. Not the God or the deity. Managers are just human beings with all their weaknesses.

Vaagmi Sir,

If you consider my point as taking the discussion to a low level, you also should NOT write about Chidambaram temple!

God blesses everyone who believes HIM but only the humans make the differences and give priorities to some.

P.S: You are not a Saivite and will never know how some priests in Bhooloka Vaikuntam treat them like untouchables!!

 

[Raji Ram]

1. Similarly those who worship Jesus is not given respect or muthal mariyathai in Srirangam temple. Any objections? Worshipers of Shiva are saivites and they belong to a different religion according to Vaishnavs who worship only Narayana. What is the problem of Saivites here? Why do you expect respect in the temple in the first place. People who go to temple go there in all humility. Don't allow your antennas to become over active while standing before God whether he is Narayana in Srirangam or Nataraja in Chidambaram. Just be yourself with all your self respect in tact. That is enough.

2. And yes vaishnavites will never visit a bhoologa kailasam just as they never visit the wailing walls of Jerusalem or the Macca in Saudi Arabia. What do you want them to prove to you? If you call yourself a secular or broadminded individual you can go Srirangam, Macca, Madina, Jerusalem, etc in turn and have darshan of Pope in Vatican before returning to your home. Vaishnavites do not believe in doing all that. Period.

1. I don't expect any red carpet welcome in any of the temples. But it surely hurts if some priests treat me like an untouchable!
2. OMG! What a great idea, Sir Ji ! Shall consider visiting those sacred places. After all, God is ONE! ray2:

P.S: But I will surely hesitate to visit bhoolOka vaikuntam once again!

 

[tks]

One need not follow the Hindu religion to enter the Hindu temple alright. But he will have to subject himself to a certain discipline that is required to be followed as per Hindu temple rules. A christian can go to church and attend a mass-even give qurbani- with his shoes on. But you can not enter a hindu temple with your shoes or chappals. You have to leave them out.

There is a rule in Indian civil Law which is called the right that accrues due to usage and practices. If a devout muslim goes to a temple regularly just like our christian Yesudoss, in course of time he may insist that the deity should be facing only east as a deity facing west hurts his other religious sentiments when he stands and prays before that deity and may file a suit. In India such a suit may go upto Supreme Court and a judgment may come with a solutionwhich is neither here nor there. LOL.

Indian bureaucracy and thinking which is a legacy of the British is to design rules based on worst case.
If there are law suits etc coming up those can be handled at that time.

Hindus can and do welcome others as human beings into their house and their temples without requiring any change in their religion. The visitors have to follow the rules and custom of the Hindu house. But they do not have to declare they are Hindus to enter a temple.

My wife routinely keeps Golu and invites both TB and other Indian families. She also invites others (non Hindus, including an Muslim family). Anyone visiting our house know to take their shoes off and spend time in a respectful manner. The connection in such a meeting is at a human level.

I know sections of Hindus feel exclusive and superior. Just like a few misguided jews feel that Jews are the chosen people I have come across narrow minded Indians of certain Hindu religion (you can make a guess).

Let us relate each other as people first and open the gates of our temple to visitors who pledge to follow rules of the temple with respect.