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They had to survive.Poor souls.

Cheers.

But I thought that it is better to die than to serve a harem patronizing ruler that is wayward?

I guess everyone had their fair share of fun and not as poor things as commonly thought.

The King/Chieftain is like a tree which gives shade to all different types of creepers and growth.
So everyone had their benefit and mutual dependence.

BTW quite a lot of Indian stuff have erotic undertones...not only poetry describing the past times of Kings.

Even the mathematical text Lilavati of Bhaskaracharya had maths problems written in sexual undertones stanzas.

I guess he thought that maths alone will be boring to most people so he gave it an interesting twist.
 
Only the king is mainly responsible as he has to lead and set the direction.

The kings were successful when they acted like hindus and respected all the baggage of hindus - vedas, brahmins, varnasrama, yagnas and hindu religious and spiritual literature.

In recent times, musharaf was in indian territory in kargil and boasted about it; and our generals knew about it but made no effort to catch him. The elected king perhaps told them to leave musharaf alone.

Perhaps if they had done the homa with faith and devotion, the enemies would have run away on seeing the smoke.

What happened to Dronacharya types of Brahmins to fight with the invaders?

Many Kings had Brahmin advisers and ministers so what happened that the invaders got the upper hand as to invade.

I can only think that some Kings would have listened to some astrologer or some priest and was advised to do some Homa instead of preparing for war right away....with all the smoke signals(becos of the Homa) the enemy must have known "Oh these guys are planning to attack after the Homa..so lets get them now when the Homa is going on!LOL"
 
But I thought that it is better to die than to serve a harem patronizing ruler that is wayward?

I guess everyone had their fair share of fun and not as poor things as commonly thought.

The King/Chieftain is like a tree which gives shade to all different types of creepers and growth.
So everyone had their benefit and mutual dependence.

BTW quite a lot of Indian stuff have erotic undertones...not only poetry describing the past times of Kings.

Even the mathematical text Lilavati of Bhaskaracharya had maths problems written in sexual undertones stanzas.

I guess he thought that maths alone will be boring to most people so he gave it an interesting twist.

Yes. Every one had their share of fun because what was parted with was only disposables. The land and women. The land is still vast. What if a part of it taken away by the invader. I can live live with my harem full of women and enjoy. As long as there is no threat to that every thing is fine. Dronacharyas will play ball. Otherwise they can be arrested and thrown into a kArAgruham. Whether it is astronomical science, mathematics, logic or Ayurveda there has to be a sprinkling of sex in it so that it tickles me, the king and the size of the purse that I will give will increase with how spicy it is. I am kshatriya you see.

Cheers.
 
What you have said is just as true/stupid as Barak Obama's son marrying our Mangalam Ganapatikal's daughter Avayamba and settling down in India and begetting a grandson by name Venkata Subramanian Irudayaraj. There is a limit to allowing your imagination running riot. Better tie it down as other wise you may get hurt.

Cheers.
 
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What I stated is *fact*. Whilst you are letting your imagination run riot, not me. People like you are enough to make the entire TamBram community extinct.
Rather than an ax, Parasurama and Ravana might as well carry modern weapons and symbolize the struggle in a more effective manner.


What you have said is just as true/stupid as Barak Obama's son marrying our Mangalam Ganapatikal's daughter Avayamba and settling down in India and begetting a grandson by name Venkata Subramanian Irudayaraj. There is a limit to allowing your imagination running riot. Better tie it down as other wise you may get hurt.

Cheers.
 
Ask Velukuddi mama advise on how to marry a muslim. It will automatically make u extinct soon.

We have a new phenomenon for quite some time now. People who are generally well-qualified Chartered Accountants, M.B.A.s with specialization in different subjects etc., seem to find the pseudo-spiritual line very attractive and perhaps very much more paying than their own qualified fields of work proper. One is Velukkudi Krishnan, another is one swami sukha bodhananda (whose name I mistook for some time as "sukha bhogananda";)).

I feel this is an indication that such people find their new lines (the pseudo-spiritual) to be more attractive. At the same time these people do not bind themselves by the rigourous rules applicable to the Ashrama of "sannyAsa" like some of our erstwhile heads of mathams like the senior Kanchi Acharya or the Sringeri Acharyas, etc. For example, I am told that this sukhabodhananda (reveller in the consciousness of pleasure - sukha+bodha +Ananda) goes to the swimming pool everyday with his mother, is a jet-setting management expert who is called by many large companies like Infosys, TCS, Reliance, etc., to give motivational lectures to their staff! (What kind of motivation? inspiring the staff to follow his own path to material success?).

I genuinely feel that Hinduism can very well do without such people who are, in reality, parasites who try and succeed in beguiling the already gullible multitudes and project themselves as the "spiritual gurus" of a large number of the thoughtless people.
 
Velukoodi is a renowned "Vaishnavite" preacher who was a "chartered accountant" but found "preaching" lucrative. Then his son married a muslim although he claimed his sons followed the "bhakti marga". Mr Velukoodi also claimed to uphold strict brahmanical values and claimed to be sanskrit vidwan etc etc.

Now what, is he an arabic "vidwan"? He deflects all questions about his son marrying and converting to islam by speaking about "oneness" of all religions. This, coming from someone who till few months back was a staunch "brahmin". Is it any wonder brahmins have to protect themselves at any costs, all costs by invoking imagery such as Ravana etc??

We have a new phenomenon for quite some time now. People who are generally well-qualified Chartered Accountants, M.B.A.s with specialization in different subjects etc., seem to find the pseudo-spiritual line very attractive and perhaps very much more paying than their own qualified fields of work proper. One is Velukkudi Krishnan, another is one swami sukha bodhananda (whose name I mistook for some time as "sukha bhogananda";)).

I feel this is an indication that such people find their new lines (the pseudo-spiritual) to be more attractive. At the same time these people do not bind themselves by the rigourous rules applicable to the Ashrama of "sannyAsa" like some of our erstwhile heads of mathams like the senior Kanchi Acharya or the Sringeri Acharyas, etc. For example, I am told that this sukhabodhananda (reveller in the consciousness of pleasure - sukha+bodha +Ananda) goes to the swimming pool everyday with his mother, is a jet-setting management expert who is called by many large companies like Infosys, TCS, Reliance, etc., to give motivational lectures to their staff! (What kind of motivation? inspiring the staff to follow his own path to material success?).

I genuinely feel that Hinduism can very well do without such people who are, in reality, parasites who try and succeed in beguiling the already gullible multitudes and project themselves as the "spiritual gurus" of a large number of the thoughtless people.
 
Dear Everyone, This topic is not worth discussing in detail, because our own children esp. girls are getting enchanted by an NB who works with her, in the cabin. She praises to that extent that he is the one I want to marry? If you ask her as to whether she knows his parents or whether she has divulged the Love at its start itself ? then she has no answer. Because she has to get brief from the NB who is bent upon cheating her
Avanukku, oru brahmana Penn Kidiththal Kasakkuma?
as though no really Good groom is avl in Iyer/ Iyengar ? It is only infatuation & realisation will come soon but it would be late & parents also artificially & much against their real feelings. They must be weeping in Silence . Can any one deny this ?
Rishikesan
 
Dear Everyone, This topic is not worth discussing in detail, because our own children esp. girls are getting enchanted by an NB who works with her, in the cabin. She praises to that extent that he is the one I want to marry? If you ask her as to whether she knows his parents or whether she has divulged the Love at its start itself ? then she has no answer. Because she has to get brief from the NB who is bent upon cheating her
Avanukku, oru brahmana Penn Kidiththal Kasakkuma?
as though no really Good groom is avl in Iyer/ Iyengar ? It is only infatuation & realisation will come soon but it would be late & parents also artificially & much against their real feelings. They must be weeping in Silence . Can any one deny this ?
Rishikesan

Sri. Rishikesan, Greetings.

Personally, I can deny that. Our daughter is 20 yrs old and has the freedom to choose anyone as her life partner.

A girl is just a girl.. there is nothing special about a Brahmin girl. In fact, it would be hard to control a brahmin girl since her parents nowadays give her freedom to do anything she likes within reason. If a NB dares marry this girl, he has the obligation to match such freedom or more to stay attractive to this girl or risk loosing her. When one views from that angle, brahmin girls are not that easy to maintain in the long run.

Most NBs are also adopting to vegetarian diet nowadays. NB girls also learn to sing prayers, bhajans and they do take part in many religious activities. I don't see anything superior with Brahmin girls.

Cheating men are found in any caste, not just amoung NBs. In fact, personally I know two brahmin boys who got cold feet after getting the girl fell in love with them. Also I know two NB boys who didn't go through the love affair too. It takes guts to face the society. I know one guy took a Malaysian NB girl from Singapore to Chennai and married her in India. Now they live in Melbourne.. by the way, he is an Iyengar boy, the girl was from a NB family. So, things happen in the other way too.

Cheers!
 
Sri. Rishikesan, Greetings.

Personally, I can deny that. Our daughter is 20 yrs old and has the freedom to choose anyone as her life partner.

A girl is just a girl.. there is nothing special about a Brahmin girl. In fact, it would be hard to control a brahmin girl since her parents nowadays give her freedom to do anything she likes within reason. If a NB dares marry this girl, he has the obligation to match such freedom or more to stay attractive to this girl or risk loosing her. When one views from that angle, brahmin girls are not that easy to maintain in the long run.

Most NBs are also adopting to vegetarian diet nowadays. NB girls also learn to sing prayers, bhajans and they do take part in many religious activities. I don't see anything superior with Brahmin girls.

Cheating men are found in any caste, not just amoung NBs. In fact, personally I know two brahmin boys who got cold feet after getting the girl fell in love with them. Also I know two NB boys who didn't go through the love affair too. It takes guts to face the society. I know one guy took a Malaysian NB girl from Singapore to Chennai and married her in India. Now they live in Melbourne.. by the way, he is an Iyengar boy, the girl was from a NB family. So, things happen in the other way too.

Cheers!
hi raghy sir,
i agreed some parts with u......now we love outside of tamil nadu....our children are more western than us....so we used to

adjust our modern adopted country....becoz we brought them to this new country....just think ..if we are in tamil nadu...

even chennai/coimbatore....its difficult situation.....different situation....now we are out of our country....we dont want tp

lose our child/children....boy or girl.....we have to adjust ....i know one incident.....a devoted tami brahmin doctors

in USA...settled more than 40 years in USA....very strict follow brahmin activities....the mami is very very orthodox.....

ultra orthodox in USA..her younger brother is also doctor....she wants ONLY BRAHMIN ORTHODOX GAL FOR HER

BROTHER.... like bharata natyam with madisar doctor in USA...now his age abt 45 yrs...he never get the gal

with madisar doctor....so he still unmarried.....the doctor's son ..who is 28 yrs old ...undergoing residency....

got married WHITE GAL.... still his uncle doctor unmarried.....whole family upset over white gal.....now

the same mami says....my white gal daughter in law os very good.....becoz she does not want loose her son...

so we have to be balance in our attitudes...i said once to my daughter...who is doing medicine ....if i like ...i will

drink coffee in her home...if im not able to feel her marriage decision...i like to drink coffee from STARBUCKS than her home...
 
Dear TBS Sir, Greetings.

Let us start with coffee. I don't favour 'Starbucks' coffee that much. While in Canada, liked coffee from 'Country Style'!

There are Brahmin girls with M.B.B.S qualification who can sing or Dance. We had one enquiry from Bangalore. That mami inyour example could be expecting much more than that.

It doesn't matter, Chennai or overseas, our children's happiness is more important. When it comes to crunch, chances are we will lean only in that way.

Cheers!
 
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Dear All, most of the parents whether they are orthodox or semi modern , are left to the mercy of the girl /boy who is in US . Because of Software almost all our children are sent to US for study/ Job and then earn Dollars & be happy & do help parents amply with money , more than the parents could Dream?
The problem comes up thereafter when Marriage proposal is started. I find uniformly the boys ask the parents to suggest some girls whom they choose out of Matrimonial sites & leave it to them to talk to those girls on line at their convenience & the coveniance of the girls. This goes on for some days & may be few months in some cases.
This period is real suspense to the parents , since the boy/ girl do not keep the parents posted with their feelings & do not hint at acceptance or otherwise in time ? This position goes contrary to Mother;s claim about her daughter saying that ( I have brought her up well 7 will not betray Etc )
It is the modern day freedom practically exercised , mostly by the girls & some Boys as well. Parents have been pushed to the state of witnessing these helplessly & get consolation , discussing the same with similarly affected parents & weep in silence?
I would like to know as to whether any of those who write vociferously, have experienced what I am writing here or lucky , not faced such predicament ?
Let us find a unified way of facing this trend ( if at all ) Any one can give positive/ objective Solution ?

Sincerely,
Rishikesan
 
Dear Kunjuppu,

I saw that edition of Neeya Nana in TV. I agree with the sentiments expressed by every one there about honour killings. But I would like to be honest and say that I was feeling alien to the entire chain of happenings explained by the 'love marriage' couples there. Brahmins actively discourage their children from IC and IR marriages and they have reasons. But if the children turns stubborn and insist on their way parents just don't bother. They don't take a sickle in hand and run after the girl or the boy. They just ignore them. And that is a helluva lot of difference.

The culprits every where is the powerful middle castes. They have unrealistic exalted notions about Gouravam/honour. Only they can think about such stupid but novel rules like 'dalits not to have male pet dogs'. I repeat this- middle castes have serious problems with brahmins at one end and with dalits at the other end. They have conflicts with these two groups. They had taken the help of dalits to marginalise the brahmins when they were potential competitors in power and positions. Now it is a struggle in which they are crossed swords with dalits because dalits are challenging them at village level. Like brahmins withdrew from the unequal battle, dalits are not withdrawing because the Govt. is supporting the dalits. That is the kernel of the whole problem.

Cheers.
 
I saw that episode yesterday on Vijay TV and was really shocked!

A poor Dalit man was killed by his wife's side and even a visual impaired couple were victims of caste violence..I guess even a visual impaired is supposed to be able to "see" caste.

That whole show was a real eye opener..to the sickening state of mind that still persists.

Why does anyone have to kill anyone?

If they are not happy that their daughter married a Dalit let them go wherever they want and be happy..I can't imagine people willing to kill to maintain honour.

I was telling my husband that when other caste run freely and kill for honour I fail to understand why the Brahmin alone is always blamed for caste discrimination??
Weird isn't it..whole of India is caste infected..so why blame one community alone?
 
Temple priest’s sudden death kills caste tension in village

There are silver linings too! There are many villages with similar atmosphere.

Excerpts:

"The sudden passing away of a temple priest, a relative of former Congress minister Kakkan, due to a heart attack brought peace between two warring communities in Thumpaipatti Village in Madurai District during a temple festival since late Friday night.

"
While this was on, the temple priest, Jeyaraman (75), a Dalit and a relative of Kakkan, former TN Congress President and former State Home Minister during the Kamaraj regime, died due to a cardiac arrest. He was cremated on Saturday.

"
The villagers said that though Jeyaraman was a Dalit, people from all communities, including caste Hindus, would touch his feet to seek blessings during every temple festival.The villagers recalled the old days when Kakkan’s father too was a popular priest of the Veera Kaliamman Temple in Thumpaipatti. Kakkan had started his temple entry right agitation in 1939 from this village."

http://newindianexpress.com/states/tamil_nadu/article1523871.ece
 
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I think, as one (bearded) participant of the show said, that the crux is more about dalits vs non-dalits. In this respect, it is necessary that we tabras take up actual cases of tabra boys & girls marrying or loving dalit girls and boys respectively and how the brahmin side of the alliances have reacted. I do not have any case of brahmins loving and marrying dalits or untouchables here to cite as example. May be some other members know about such cases. They may kindly come forward and let us all know what is happening.
 
I think, as one (bearded) participant of the show said, that the crux is more about dalits vs non-dalits. In this respect, it is necessary that we tabras take up actual cases of tabra boys & girls marrying or loving dalit girls and boys respectively and how the brahmin side of the alliances have reacted. I do not have any case of brahmins loving and marrying dalits or untouchables here to cite as example. May be some other members know about such cases. They may kindly come forward and let us all know what is happening.

The bearded participant was not able to express clearly what he had in mind. He said something about calling the scheduled castes as scheduled castes stressing the scheduling aspect of it. But he was not going into the caste discrimination even there. That the BCs have not been included in the same schedule. May be they thought they could avoid the 'polution' that may be caused by being listed with the dalits. He could have talked about this which would have exposed the true colors of the so called dravidian ideologues. That was not to be. Then he spoke about the untouchability which came later than the castes into the Hindu society which is a known fact for those who have studied history of castes in the Hindu religion. He was not clear as to what he was stressing by pointing this out. He did not come forth freely. May be the effect of editing.

I know an Aiyengar girl who is a Lecturer in a college who chose to marry a dalit boy who was also a lecturer in another college. The family tried to reason out and failed. The girl was just forgotten by the other members of the family. She is living separately and of course happily with her husband and children. As far as the parents are concerned she just does not exist. That is all. Similarly I know of an Iyer girl who worked in the postal department and she married a dalit boy working along with her. The story is the same in her case too. Her father tried to discourage but failed. He has just written her off.

It must have been quite painful but they stoically put up with that reality. Both families do not speak about their particular daughter with any one. If the conversation moves in that direction they just cut it short saying she is not their daughter or some such thing and move over to other topics.

Cheers.
 
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I saw that episode yesterday on Vijay TV and was really shocked!

A poor Dalit man was killed by his wife's side(right in front of her as she was watching) and even a visual impaired couple were victims of caste violence..I guess even a visual impaired is supposed to be able to "see" caste.
That whole show was a real eye opener..to the sickening state of mind that still persists.
Why does anyone have to kill anyone?
If they are not happy that their daughter married a Dalit let them go wherever they want and be happy..I can't imagine people willing to kill to maintain honour.
I was telling my husband that when other caste run freely and kill for honour I fail to understand why the Brahmin alone is always blamed for caste discrimination??
Weird isn't it..whole of India is caste infected..so why blame one community alone?

Dear Renuka,

I quote again from Rudyard Kipling:

"If you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you
If you can trust yourself when all men doubt you,
But make allowance for their doubting too;
If you can wait and not be tired by waiting,
Or being lied about, don't deal in lies,
Or being hated don't give way to hating,
And yet don't look too good, nor talk too wise: --Then my son, yours is the Earth and everything thats in it. And, you are a Man!"

This is exactly what brahmins are doing in Tamilnadu.

Cheers.
 
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When I saw that episode on Vijay TV many times when participants spoke many words were Bleeped every now and then.

I was just wondering if these words were censored by the Indian Vijay TV Channel?

Cos out here our censors are very strict..I was wondering if the Bleep Bleep censoring was done by India or by here?
 
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