On Vishitadvaita Philosophy...

[malgova.mango]

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sathya - means which is ever-present
mithya - means which appears , stays and dissappears in time.
illusion - it is a false conception, like mistaking a snake for rope.

So the world is "mithya" not illusion.
each word conveys a definite meaning that's why structured teaching is a necessity.

Knowledge is the outcome of structured study over some time. One gets a degree after going thru- all the kg,primary, secondary classes - over the time the knowledge is built upon him to comprehend what is said in degree classes.

suddenly one doesn't jump to get a degree and the next day masters and the next day doctrate - it doesn't work that way.

IMHO.

 

[s007bala]

Lord Narayana is Saguna Brahman.But then,how to explain,four hands?

sb

 

[happyhindu]

Honestly, all of us talking here needs a guru...some of us cud even appear as way out from "basics", esp when we attach so much importance to theory and fundamentals :ranger:

 

[Seshadri Subramaniam]

where is atma?for it to reach paramathma?Can you un-confuse me!

It is a state... athma cannot become paramathma.. it retains its individual identity....

Vishista-Advaitha is Advaitha and Advaitha is Vishista-Advaitha.Is my understanding.As cyber gyaanis behind a computer,we pour out our thoughts.Each one of us,trying to explain,the Samskritam Works of ancient masters.Avaalodo Kaal Thusikkudo Naan Samam Illai..is my abhipraayam.

I think you are mixing it... their philosophies are entirely different... of course, in this, I am discussing within their framework...

A says brahman is nirguna, VA says that brahman is saguna...

A says that only consciousness is brahman and the objects that we perceive is due to maya...

Brahma Satyam, Jagat Mithya, and Jivo Brahmaiva naparah

Mithya here means transient... according to A, jagat is transient because it is a conception of a dream of the consciousness... once we realise this, we become the self ie., brahman...

VA says that the gross, subtle and the paramatma all together constitute the brahman... for the gross and the subtle are all pervaded by the supreme... in this it is oneness... but as being different entities, it is qualified... the world and all the beings here are real... there is no imagination...

 

[Seshadri Subramaniam]

advaitham ennagratha apparam parpoom

you siad...

"It is not the same adhvaitham as Shri S meant, rather in a different sense... one has to first realize this to understand vishishtadhvaitham... it is adhvaitham in the sense that narayanan (the supreme lord) encompasses all, it is vishisht in the sense that he contains different entities within himself... "

but the entities are HIM only what?

No, all entities are not HIM... though pervaded by him... it is like you need air for breathing, but you are not air...

 

[Seshadri Subramaniam]

sathya - means which is ever-present
mithya - means which appears , stays and dissappears in time.
illusion - it is a false conception, like mistaking a snake for rope.

So the world is "mithya" not illusion.
each word conveys a definite meaning that's why structured teaching is a necessity.

Knowledge is the outcome of structured study over some time. One gets a degree after going thru- all the kg,primary, secondary classes - over the time the knowledge is built upon him to comprehend what is said in degree classes.
IMHO.

Mithya means transient, temporary, perishable... and is is because, the world and all beings apart from consciousness are perceived as a contemplation, or a dream...

suddenly one doesn't jump to get a degree and the next day masters and the next day doctrate - it doesn't work that way.

Ha ha... why not... you refuse to accept something out of tradition... and that is your mental handicap...

Vivekananda says that it is the intensity that matters... generate enough intensity and one can achieve what could normally be achieved after years of practice or study...

 

[Seshadri Subramaniam]

Lord Narayana is Saguna Brahman.But then,how to explain,four hands?

sb

to depict Amsam... adhu oru pictorial representation... viswaroopa darsanam paarthelna adhule niraiya kai and thala irukkum... supernatural expressions in 2-D form could be like that only...

 

[Seshadri Subramaniam]

Honestly, all of us talking here needs a guru...some of us cud even appear as way out from "basics", esp when we attach so much importance to theory and fundamentals :ranger:

Shrimati, The real guru can only be ourself... we only have to discriminate... other persons can only guide us or indicate a way of thinking...

Or the guru should be a liberated, moksha-attained athma who comes down to teach us...

 

[malgova.mango]

sesh!

if something is not HIM, then SarvaVyapitvam is rendered meaningless, right?

say yes or no.

regards

 

[malgova.mango]

as far as intensity to compensate structured study ....

IMHO

the person who do a structured study shows he is a committed and his seeking his intense , that's why he took a proffessional approach. simple as that.

 

[Seshadri Subramaniam]

sesh!

if something is not HIM, then SarvaVyapitvam is rendered meaningless, right?

say yes or no.

regards

Your inferences are fundamentally misleading; when HE is the superset where is the question of negating sarvavyapitvam?

 

[s007bala]

Basically god is brahman.God who is brahman is formless.Brahman is a wisdom.which cannot be imparted by explanation.Brahman is invisibly visible with a special wisdom.Wisdom takes our faculties to tune and appreciate wisdom.Brahman is brahman.Cannot explain more than that.The categories are just to influence people ,like divide and rule.Major population in humanity,have a human being as god.Worship him and try to rule the world as i am witnessing it.All our philosophies are not even followed by me and rest of brahmana community.Chumma we are gassing and trying to prove a brownie point here and there.

sb

 

[malgova.mango]

you said....
"No, all entities are not HIM... though pervaded by him... it is like you need air for breathing, but you are not air."

you also said...
"when HE is the superset where is the question of negating sarvavyapitvam? "

now tell me , if HE prevades all - where HE is left out....

If HE prevades all, then it negates your " not all entities are HIM" ...

 

[malgova.mango]

Basically god is brahman.God who is brahman is formless.Brahman is a wisdom.which cannot be imparted by explanation.Brahman is invisibly visible with a special wisdom.Wisdom takes our faculties to tune and appreciate wisdom.Brahman is brahman.Cannot explain more than that.The categories are just to influence people ,like divide and rule.Major population in humanity,have a human being as god.Worship him and try to rule the world as i am witnessing it.All our philosophies are not even followed by me and rest of brahmana community.Chumma we are gassing and trying to prove a brownie point here and there.

sb

SERIA POCHU....

ITHUKKAGAVA , Bhagavan - Brahma Sutram panninar. ithukkagave BP bhashyam ezhuthinar.

Philosophy is for us to understand ... to follow we have another scripture called DS ...owing to TIME not all of that could be followed... that doesn't means nobody follows anything...

Vaicha Kudumi, Saraicah Mottaiya ?

Ram Ram

 

[s007bala]

>>Vaicha Kudumi, Saraicah Mottaiya ?<<

Kudumi is in minority in the country of origin as well as Mottais.Only Kottais are there now.

>>ITHUKKAGAVA , Bhagavan - Brahma Sutram panninar. ithukkagave BP bhashyam ezhuthinar.<<

Plato,Soctrates...so many copied all our philosophy.Copy adichavan thaan ippo jollichundu irukkan.Paapan azhinchu poiayachhu.

>>Philosophy is for us to understand ... to follow we have another scripture called DS ...owing to TIME not all of that could be followed... that doesn't means nobody follows anything...<<

We have to make time.Time is a invention of man using celestial objects.Followers are in minority,soon they will also vanish.

sb

 

[Seshadri Subramaniam]

you said....
"No, all entities are not HIM... though pervaded by him... it is like you need air for breathing, but you are not air."

you also said...
"when HE is the superset where is the question of negating sarvavyapitvam? "

now tell me , if HE prevades all - where HE is left out....

If HE prevades all, then it negates your " not all entities are HIM" ...

He only pervades...

Definition of pervades - Spread or diffuse through

By that we do not become HIM... but this pervasion of HIM in all beings is what makes HIM one...

Even though we are pervaded, we do not possess his qualities or characteristics... that is how we are different...

 

[malgova.mango]

so HE is less our qualities

so HE is less our characters

is that what you say

 

[Seshadri Subramaniam]

so HE is less our qualities

so HE is less our characters

is that what you say

No... but I find your inferences quite amusing...

 

[malgova.mango]

See I'm trying hard to understand your VA - Dont cut jokes here. I may be dim witted , but I'm committed to find out. so please help me.

I've put many question on what or which is the non-HIM part. I find your answers evasive.

Continuing...

So HE is our qualities
So HE is our character

Is that what you say?

 

[Seshadri Subramaniam]

Again "NO"

 

[malgova.mango]

or WE are less HIS qualities
WE are less HIS character

is that what you say?

 

[Seshadri Subramaniam]

No

 

[malgova.mango]

HIS qualities and character are complete and perfect
OUR qualities and character are incomplete and imperfect

is that what VA says?

 

[Seshadri Subramaniam]

Completeness, perfection are all relative terms which we use for our understanding...

What is perfection? What is completeness? can you please answer this?

 

[malgova.mango]

Please answer my question first. then you start to ask ...ok because for the past 2 nights , I'm not getting any direct answer from you for the NON-GOD part. Day before yesterday you were telling the non-god part, yesterday you questioned the same and you didn't answer my posts related to that.

By now you should know what I'm eager to Know. I just want to know if HE prevades all - in which part of WE - HE is not prevaded or if HE is prevaded in WE also , how come WE are not HIM.

because since HE prevades all , in WE also HE prevades what?