God Exists

[Yamaka]

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Proof God Exists:


(1) Brahmins, in spite of less than 10% population, were able to "oppress" the other 90% for centuries, without touching any weapon!

(2) Brahmins controlled 90% of population for centuries, even though British and other aliens were sitting in Rock Fort with weapons and running the government!

The only way Brahmins could have accomplished (1) and (2) would be, if the Almighty God was on their side!

Q.E.D.

Historians say that Brahmins colluded with Warrior Caste to accomplish 1 and 2 above.

The Belief manufactured was that God wanted that way! Lol.

That's exactly what we have been debating here... that is, the Modus Operandi has been to invent a God and sell it to the unsuspecting innocent people to control, to exploit and to dominate them!

This is the Eureka moment for this Thread, IMO!

 

[DrBarani]

Latest Breaking News, Folks:

Brahmins are Atheists!

They deliberately invented some "God" so they can put down 90% of the population, which means Brahmins they never really believed in God, they were only after putting down the rest of the population! Those evil evil scheming Brahmins! *Gnawing my teeth and frothing in my mouth*

 

[renuka]

Just want to add about animals and God.When I was in India in 1995 I was at a small shrine and I noticed a bird that was building its nest at a nearby tree.
The bird would swoop down each time from the tree branch pick up twigs and fly to the idol of that shrine(with the twig in its mouth) and fly back to the branch and was making the nest.This went on for almost 1 hour and I was just thinking that for each twig the bird is taking to make the nest it was keeping in on the idol as in seeking blessings.
So I guess animals are better equip than us Humans in recognizing Divinity.
And if we keep our minds open we can "see" God even through a little bird.

 

[subbudu1]

if i could arrange your posts,

1) man came from apes
2) apes dont believe in god
3) so man dont need to believe in god
4) concludes, man is nothing more than an animal.

this logical deduction is what i was talking about the dangerous position, atheism could lead to. interestingly this position may contradict richard dawkins self-mutating genes stand, cos, your logic positions the man on par with animals, and no mutation could have resulted in mankinds advance nature of looking for god and doing good.

outcome of the dangerous position is here is, while keeping animals on par with humans,and in the absence of god and any divine guidance, any man could take up his own rule book and live an animal live and write jungle law.i have explained this in previous post

further deduction of that logic could lead to ..

1) animals force any weaker female and mate any time and any place, so any human can prey on any women.

2) animals eat their own sibling, so can a man, and the fittest would survive.

3) monkey robs the tourist, so why put the robbers in jail? after all we came from apes.


the thing is, humans though came from monkey, its the highest of the gods creation or evolution. it has the powers to seek god, commune with god, pray to god, which animals dont have that intelligence. and the science has grown along with human advancement, the search for god and his proof also went on with a higher level of thought process.

sadest part is, if god exists are not, atheist ideology, will push man down to the level of animal thinking.


anyway, i have an interesting question. how do you know that animals do not worship. though they lack constructional ability to build temples/do rituals, they must be silently praying to god, through their mind, while living in their burrows.. like how you asked proof for existence of god, can you please attempt to prove animals don't pray to god? i would appreciate your response to this

You conveniently choose my statements to make your deductions. I have said in one of my posts that evolution to human and getting rationality is irreversible.
It is our rational thinking that prevents us from doing something wicked . It has become part of our genes that we feel when our fellow humans suffer. There are these others who dont care for the suffering of anyone. But a large percentage of these wicked believe in God. Yet has no effect on their morality. If it is necessary for you to believe in God, why not think that nature itself is God. What you do to nature comes back to you, as you are a part of this ecosystem.

One does not need any genius to understand that what makes a person moral is the fact that he is unable to tolerate the suffering of another. Why is that? Because either he is his ally or because he remembers his own feeling and feels the other person identical to him. This continuous programming happens at the unconscious level at our genes. We have already gained rationality as humans. And hence we will not be wicked even if there is no fear of anyone or no fear of anyone being a witness to our actions. The waywardly are a minority and are dealt with by the law. Even today we are all much better as humans than the medieval times, when people had no regret if a person of another race died. All this happened in the name of religion and god in the past. So let us not use bogus arguments advocate things based on paranoia.

 

[கால பைரவன்]

Independent India wants to correct the historical injustice done to the SC/ST/OBC for the past atleast 500 years by the Oppressive Caste System practiced by the Upper Caste.

The lines between oppressor and oppressed have long been blurred and "social justice" reduced into a vote-bank tool. TN is in the forefront of such travesty of justice.

Reservation, as practiced today, is discrimination, period!

 

[tks]

Latest Breaking News, Folks:

Brahmins are Atheists!

They deliberately invented some "God" so they can put down 90% of the population, which means Brahmins they never really believed in God, they were only after putting down the rest of the population! Those evil evil scheming Brahmins! *Gnawing my teeth and frothing in my mouth*

Thanks for the late breaking news

Most have their head up in the cloud !
There are betterAmerican expressions but we cannot use it here

 

[C RAVI]

Just want to add about animals and God.When I was in India in 1995 I was at a small shrine and I noticed a bird that was building its nest at a nearby tree.
The bird would swoop down each time from the tree branch pick up twigs and fly to the idol of that shrine(with the twig in its mouth) and fly back to the branch and was making the nest.This went on for almost 1 hour and I was just thinking that for each twig the bird is taking to make the nest it was keeping in on the idol as in seeking blessings.
So I guess animals are better equip than us Humans in recognizing Divinity.
And if we keep our minds open we can "see" God even through a little bird.

Dear Renuka,


Also there are many epic stories that indicates such recognition of Divinity by animals..

I witnessed a discourse here in Bur Dubai in "Sindhi Ceremonial Hall" in the year 2008. In that it was stated that some Animals do recognize divinity in the form of refined qualities. There are such refined qualities in them that are absolutely contrary to their natural behavior pattern.

As a man of present era, I could accept the discourse when I got to watch youtube video, updated in Face Book. The video was about a Tiger hunting a Adult Monkey. The Tiger could easily catch it's prey as the Monkey could not move effectively. When the tiger cought hold of the monkey and was dragging, the Tige, much to its surpise could see the monkey delivering a baby. The monkey delivered and died. the moment the baby came out, the Tiger left its prey, took the baby into safe place and started taking care of it, lovingly.


In the discourse, it was explained that, just one step below are the animals from Humans. The soul which is granted the animal form, if could able to sense the divinity and observes the basic sense of sympathy and sensitivity, if subconsciously could sense the need of peace and tranquility and could live by that, gets elevated to be granted with the form of humans with human "Brain". Many chances of a soul as a boy in a family being in the form of Dog in previous janma. Genes are just scientifically synchronized to equate and substantiate the biological proof. But the soul got nothing to do with these genetic lineage.

The maturity and purification process of the soul, takes the soul to the elevated form of Humans, granted with exclusive "human brain", that can sense, "Vekkam", Maanam", "Soodu", "Soranai" and that of "Ego", "Descipline", "Love & Care", "Empathy", "Rational Thinking", "Scientific Advancement" etc..etc..for the sake of more better life. And also can understand God much better and work towards liberation.

 

[suraju06]

Dear Mr. Raju:

In my mind, what's hatred?

1. What that Norwegian Mass killer (Andre Breivik?) did to those innocent teenagers and his view against Muslims and Islam!

2. What some of the Rednecks in the US did to Blacks in Southern States (mostly around 1960s and before)!

3. What Israelis are doing in the Occupied Territories of Palestine against the Natives!

4. What Hitler did to Jews in Europe!

NEVER ever such things happened in TN against TBs.... what all we hear is just political rhetoric from a few Political Party cadre... that's all.

Even the most ardent followers of Periyar and Suyya Mariyathai Movement do allow their children to marry Brahmin boys and girls. Some people in the Forum even call Mu Ka as MK Iyer! (Ask Ms. Harini).

This "hatred against TBs" is another manufactured Belief started by some Theists, IMO.

Take care.

Peace.

Dear Mr. Yamaka,

I had been a direct witness or I have a friend who had witnessed these following incidents:

1. The place-Tuticorin . Time -sometime in 1960s. The exact location-pudugramam aka Brahmins colony, an area having mostly brahmins as residents. The incident: Some politician wanted the name of the locality to be changed to something else and wanted the word brahmin removed . He gathered a few hooligans and went on a rampage. They entered the brahmins' residences and molested women folk.

2. The place- Trichy.Time-sometime in 1960s.The place-in a town bus running between Trichy and Srirangam. The incident:A brahmin purohit travelling in the bus may be of age 65 years quickly occupied a seat which was vacated at a bus stop when the bus stopped. Another gentleman who tried to occupy the seat was unable to beat him to it because of the distance and the crowd. He was wearing a black shirt. He went near the purohit and spat on his face and then let out a big lecture with expletives about brahmins(not about the purohit sitting there). None in the bus including the purohit could do anything about this.

3. Place-Trichy/Srirangam. Time - again 1960s. A group of brahmin boys taking bath in the Cauvery had all their poonools cut by a group of ruffians who sweared in the name of Periyar and Kazhagam.

These are incidents which are worse than those listed by you above. In your list, the situation is either you shoot or he shoots and who shoots first survives. Here fear is the key. You should put the fear of life into the minds of your target so that he will never dare to raise his head or hand in defiance!! This is what we call terror in modern times.

Now please tell me whether there is hatred against brahmins or not.These are not cooked up stories. Please read the first two lines of this post for confirmation. The well informed SCs/STs have no hatred for brahmins. They just think that brahmins are all loonies sitting in their ivory towers with strange ideas and practices.It is their right to have their views. They are harmless. But the middle aggregate in the caste ladder which includes all powerful castes like thevars, mudalis,gounders, pillais, vanniyars, naidus, naickers is the most mischevous ones. They kill and maim SC/STs day in and day out (if you do not read one such news item in the news paper in a period of one month you can be sure that you are not in Tamilnadu). They invent new reasons every day to keep them down. They deny them entry in the temples managed by them. They even confined the panchamans into a separate (SC/ST) schedule in the constitution so that the schedule which will later give them too the reservation will not be polluted by the presence of these panchamans in the same schedule. But they told the panchamans that it is the brahmins who are responsible for all this!! They said it and got away with it. Most of the MBC group in Tamilnadu are castes who exploited and brutalised the panchamans. But they too got reservations and, to boot, the percentage is higher in their case. I am saying all this because of your attempt to include and bracket these MBCs with SC and ST and take advantage of non-existent victimhood. That there is not a single panchaman in the position of Vice-Chancellor of any university in Tamilnadu(pvt as well as Govt owned) speaks volumes about the kind of social revolution that has been brought about by Periyar and Anna in Tamilnadu. By the way, most of the VC s are Mudaliyars and incidentally Anna, Anbazhagan, Nedunchezhian, Mathiyazhagan, Krishnaswamy etc-the doyens of Kazhagam were all Mudaliyars. How is that!!

In Tamilnadu hatred against brahmins is real and palpable. The culprits are the middle castes.

Cheers.

 

[wrongan]

Dear Mr. Yamaka,

I had been a direct witness or I have a friend who had witnessed these following incidents:

These are incidents which are worse than those listed by you above. In your list, the situation is either you shoot or he shoots and who shoots first survives. Here fear is the key. You should put the fear of life into the minds of your target so that he will never dare to raise his head or hand in defiance!! This is what we call terror in modern times.=======================================
Mr.Suraju you have correctly said.Fear is the main reason for bearing all these atrocities unleashed on us . An entirely different scene which I witnessed.During 1966 I have Just entered Tamilnadu government service as a junior engineer.My boss an ordant Iyengar used to have tuft and wear thiruman always.both of us were travelling by bus to Chengleput from Thiruvannamalai.the bus was near full.When a passenger had to stand near the driver for want of a seat the driver called my boss "ai,sindu pappan,namam,nagarnthu idam vidu.My boss is a short tempered man too..Immedietely he rose from his seat and gave a strong blow to the driver. driver stopped the bus and starred at this man.He rose his voice and told him to behave properly with the passengers.No one in the bus were dared to question him.No one in the bus know who he is.our journey continued.

 

[nachi naga]

Proof God Exists:


(1) Brahmins, in spite of less than 10% population, were able to "oppress" the other 90% for centuries, without touching any weapon!

(2) Brahmins controlled 90% of population for centuries, even though British and other aliens were sitting in Rock Fort with weapons and running the government!

The only way Brahmins could have accomplished (1) and (2) would be, if the Almighty God was on their side!

Q.E.D.

doc,i know god exists.not only outside of me but within me,just like in ever being of the lord.whenever scriptures explained this,people misunderstood the content.when we come from the source of god,we automatically are part and parcel of god.we have water as the source but its manifestation are many like water vapour,ice,steam etc.the brahmin community has selflessly for centuries promoting gods existence and truth.brahmin by definition for me,is a person who uphelds sathya dharma shanthi prema ahimsa ananda as the shad-swabava wherever in the world whichever community he/she belongs to.

 

[amala]

I came across this recently and thought its befitting this thread.

Atheism | India Religion | Non-believers

 

[nachi naga]

I came across this recently and thought its befitting this thread.

Atheism | India Religion | Non-believers

i wonder how many atheists are there in malaysia?maybe a link from there would show how islamic majority handles atheists,hindu religionists too amala.

 

[amala]

I have no idea mama. Maybe you can look for it. I just came across this and posted the link. If you would care to give your opinion on the article instead that would be very nice

 

[nachi naga]

I have no idea mama. Maybe you can look for it. I just came across this and posted the link. If you would care to give your opinion on the article instead that would be very nice

amala,i am an indian citizen,like to know malaysian citizens views about islamic majority treating non-islamic believers in your country.since we indians know about us it would be befitting to know malaysians in this thread about tolerance and secularism about god in your country.renu is a great example for malaysians imho.

 

[Haridasa Siva]

I see that the members have come a long way after my post no.801. But I feel I owe an explanation to the members who responded to my post. Here is part 1.

Let me clarify my position first. Besides my posts in this thread, I have also expressed my thoughts earlier in the following posts in TB forum:‘

Tamilbrahmins dharmam’ in Literature forum:
“Since the forum is for the “Brahmins community spread across the entire globe”, I expect the views in the forum to enrich Brahmanism. But the very word is treated with contempt in some of the threads. To me, it is unfair. In my view, such anti-Brahmin views dampen the spirit of the forum.”
“I can not take condemnation of anything and everything of Hinduism and/or Brahmanism as a “constructive criticism”. Many such comments often reflect the individual’s negative views on Hinduism/Brahmanism and in my opinion those comments are not for the improvement of our religion/caste but sheer ridicule”
“I had also expressed my concern that we should not get derailed by vendetta against Hinduism/Brahmanism being spread in some of the posts in the forum.”

I also wrote in the thread ”Let a Dalit become Sankarachariyar” (post no.92; page no.10) as follows:
“Though I might only be a "week-end or wannabie brahmin", I am happy to learn the truth about actions of Brahmins in the past and of course I know their suffering in the present - all Brahmins - vedik or "wannabie". Vast majority of people have been reading politically doctored articles, it seems. And the anti-Brahmin group had the audacity to tell Brahmins that it is for them to "pay the price for their actions in the past" and make today's generation of Brahmins guilty.
Leave alone the past. Even today, Dalits suffer more at the hands of "other forward communities" than Brahmins. I have first hand experience in this. Aadeenams would never allow a Dalit to enter their mutt but our "reformers" would expect a Dalit to be a Sankaracharya. Even they are aware that Sankaracharya does not hold any position of influence but it pays them politically to still say what they say.”

The above posts must give a clear idea of what my position is. Why then did I choose to write post 801 in this thread? I think Nara has answered it in his post no.825.
“Isn't it ironic that a thread like "Immortality in the Vedas" a good one by Shri vikrama, attracts 13 posts (most from vikrama himself) and 828 views since early June, and this thread, started 3 weeks ago, has already attracted 824 posts and over 10K views. It seems conflict attracts more interest than interesting topics.”

 

[Haridasa Siva]

Part 2 of my response:

For the sake of brevity, let me selectively address the issues raised by theists.
Dr.Barani (post 817)You take this "Like" thing very seriously! It is merely a shorthand notation to avoid repeating what the other person said.
Perhaps you do not take it seriously. But most of the times, it is to express support. People are political about clicking ‘like’ and people do take note of who clicks ‘like’ for what.

Suraju (post 821):I have absolutely no problem as long as an atheist does not try to impose his views on me. His attempts are multi pronged. He teases me, ridicules me, calls me names and even makes the but of jokes using third rate American long distance truck driver’s lingo. This I fight. So what is the problem? Please answer. Now it is your turn to answer.
To be honest, I do not share this view in totality. On the contrary, I have found theists making (silly) jokes, which is one of the reasons for my post.

Budhdhikkoormai is dangerous when not accompanied by Budhdhiththelivu . A blade can be used to sharpen a pencil as well as to cut someone’s jugular vein.
Quite true. I believe you are hinting at atheists. I also feel the same about atheists. They are clear about their ideology but I am afraid they are not clear (or they do not care for) the consequences of their writings.

You appear to presume that atheists do not hurt. Not at all. Could you please give instances where theists have hurt the atheists?
I can but it would sound like I am getting personal.

The reply of theists regarding the middle-path people is not convincing.

My selective response to non-theists:
I am happy to note the following comments:Nara (post 821)
“I have not said Brahmins are evil. I firmly believe TBs are no more evil than any other group.”

Yamaka (post 827)“I totally reject the underlying assumption that Atheists are anti-Brahmins and they hate Brahmins.... I believe that most of the Brahmins are intellectuals and they analyze ALL issues to the core...”
Periyar was an utter failure. If he was successful, the vast majority of people (at least in T.N.) would not be theists. Tamilians have gone to the extent of making temple even for film stars. Considering the fact that he married a woman far younger to him, I think Periyar would not have objected to making temple for film stars in as much as he did so for building a temple for Lord Ram.

Though I have high regard for Sangom sir, I do not find his response (post 813) to my questions to theists to be in good taste.

God exists or not, conflict sure exists!

 

[nachi naga]

Historians say that Brahmins colluded with Warrior Caste to accomplish 1 and 2 above.

The Belief manufactured was that God wanted that way! Lol.

That's exactly what we have been debating here... that is, the Modus Operandi has been to invent a God and sell it to the unsuspecting innocent people to control, to exploit and to dominate them!

This is the Eureka moment for this Thread, IMO!

what is already there need not be invented,and that is gotcha moment.

brahmins faithfully loyally royally have been contnuing this tradition and we do it with even more gusto when atheist confused mortals are looking for answeres.hip hip hurray

 

[C RAVI]

Shri Haridasa Siva,

This is Kali Yoga. Theists with their values and belief may look like conflicting with fellow theists views and belief..My humble suggestion is better not to draw a check list and trail balance of which group is wrong in debating styles and where, to be fair and constructive.

Did we find any member from atheist camp, pointing out the presentation errors of both the groups for a better cause?

Just contribute your belief and views. This thread is for heated arguments and each group is trying hard only with the intentions of helping each other.

In that bargain, some are getting agitated, getting into some unpleasant comments. The parties involved are solving between them then and there and are moving on, concentrating on the subject matter.

I can understand the strains that you took to post last two of your posts. I can also understand that this initiative is out of some sort of hurt feelings.

Please let it go. Let us jointly present our views on the subject matter, to debate constructively..

 

[sangom]

Proof God Exists:


(1) Brahmins, in spite of less than 10% population, were able to "oppress" the other 90% for centuries, without touching any weapon!

(2) Brahmins controlled 90% of population for centuries, even though British and other aliens were sitting in Rock Fort with weapons and running the government!

The only way Brahmins could have accomplished (1) and (2) would be, if the Almighty God was on their side!

Q.E.D.

Dr.,

Why did the "Almighty God" suddenly forsake the brahmins as soon as the aliens left the Rock Fort for ever? What was the mistake committed by the brahmins for their sudden downfall? Since you seems to be 101% sure of whatever you write, it is incumbent on you to enlighten the members on these points also, I feel.

 

[B.Krishnamurthy]

Refernce post no.864.
I find there are a number of comments from different persons below the article.
I read in some other forum that India having chosen Pandit Jawaharlal Nehru
as the first Prime minister of India when India became independent,continue to be dominated by western thinking and left oriented ideologytill date.
Jawaharlal Nehru was influenced by western mode of thinking and the country is
suffering till date to breathe freely.
IN INDIA,common people are cheated always taking the name of Mahatma Gandhi
and in TamilNadu people are cheated in the name of Kamaraj Nadar and 'Pacchai tamilian'
It is really a misfortune that in India,Mother Thressa's activities will be highlighted and internationalised,but noble souls like Late Nanaji Deshmukh,Acharya Vinobha Bhave will neger get recognition even by Indians.
We Indians have not developed the ability to see good things in our past culture
but excel in perverted thinking.
PS.I have read a book written by a Bengali Doctor settled in UK many years ago in which
he narrated that 'Mother Thressa needed Calcutta very badly to get international fame
by assisting and helping a few poor people among lakhs of Poor people living in the city,but
Calcutta will survive without Mother Thressa.
I have great regards for Mother Thressa,but I feel bad when similar work by local Indians do not get publicity.
Recently Prime Minister of Australia has openly challenged all immigrants and asked them to leave
Australia if they cannot live like Australians.But In India majority population has to adjust
and put up with all injustices of influences from outside.Since Indians lack National Character as a Nation,the majority community in India has to put up with all sorts insults
and will never be allowed think in oriental ways.

 

[C RAVI]

My humble request to all

It would be better and meaningful, if we dont indulge in the roles of Brahmins and Non-Brahmins. As Humans we have Theist and Atheist group in all the castes.

Brahmin support and Brahmin Bashing we did a lot exhaustively and gonna continue for ever. Let us keep this thread free from such debates.

Let us stick to the subect matter of this thread and continue debating..

 

[sangom]

Latest Breaking News, Folks:

Brahmins are Atheists!

They deliberately invented some "God" so they can put down 90% of the population, which means Brahmins they never really believed in God, they were only after putting down the rest of the population! Those evil evil scheming Brahmins! *Gnawing my teeth and frothing in my mouth*

Brahmins may or may not have believed in "Gods", but they surely have been time-servers, opportunists or self-seekers because they had absolutely no compunction in changing one set of gods with another, later, model and spinning yarns about the new set of gods and then eulogizing them. It can therefore be safely concluded that brahmins have been and are, untrustworthy, when viewed from the point of view of gods

 

[DrBarani]

Dr.,

Why did the "Almighty God" suddenly forsake the brahmins as soon as the aliens left the Rock Fort for ever? What was the mistake committed by the brahmins for their sudden downfall? Since you seems to be 101% sure of whatever you write, it is incumbent on you to enlighten the members on these points also, I feel.

Dear Sir

The post isn't about Almighty, it is about the stupidity of ABB (anti Brahmin Brigade). Thank you!

 

[Yamaka]

I came across this recently and thought its befitting this thread.

Atheism | India Religion | Non-believers

Hi Amala:

Thanks for posting this here.

 

[DrBarani]

Brahmins may or may not have believed in "Gods", but they surely have been time-servers, opportunists or self-seekers because they had absolutely no compunction in changing one set of gods with another, later, model and spinning yarns about the new set of gods and then eulogizing them. It can therefore be safely concluded that brahmins have been and are, untrustworthy, when viewed from the point of view of gods

Yes, Yes! Those "Evil Brahmins"! Who would stay anywhere near them! The door is that way Sir, you can use google and find some nice ABB forum! Nice debating with you! Hasta La Vista!