Who is treating?, thats the whole point. What happened to the schemes for the welfare of this society which is prevailing for many years. By my earlier post, I have told about the chandalas from Chinese travelers notes. Clearly there were none who were untouchables in those times. So, if you still hold brahmins responsible, it is not going to change their status for ever. Because it is wrong nail you are trying to hit.
Regards
I think you did not read the passage you quoted for me, yourself first. Am reproducing it for your benefit:
"According to
Fa Hien, a Chinese Buddhist pilgrim who visited India in the early 4th century AD said Throughout the country the people kill no living thing nor drink wine, nor do they eat garlic or onion, with the exception of Chandalas only.
The Chandalas are named 'evil men' and dwell apart from others; if they enter a town or market, they sound a piece of wood in order to separate themselves; then, men knowing they are, avoid coming in contact with them. In this country they do not keep swine nor fowls, and do not deal in cable; they have no shambles or wine shops in their market-places. In selling they use cowrie shells. The Chandalas only hunt and sell flesh.
Thus indicating even by then they have been segregated from the mainstream society as untouchables."
Ref:
Chandala - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Who is treating?....So, if you still hold brahmins responsible, it is not going to change their status for ever. Because it is wrong nail you are trying to hit.
It does not matter to anyone that you, your family and your friends, do not treat anyone badly based on caste; or indulge in segregation / discrimination.
The mutts endorse segregation and discrimination. Please read the kamakoti articles. Am doing a copy-paste:
Caste according to the Vedas and the Gita from the Chapter "Varna Dharma For Universal Well-Being", in Hindu Dharma : kamakoti.org:
The present contention about what the Vedas say about caste is similar, being based on a passage read out of context. What is mentioned as an exception to the rule is being interpreted as a rule itself. I will give firm proof in support of the view that caste is based on birth and not on the nature or quality of individuals....
Whatever 'proof' has been mentioned in the subsequent pages, has been refuted not only by historians who have documented jaati as a later development, but also by all the ekadandi traditions (note that kanchi mutt supposedly follows the saraswati sanyasa marga amongst the dasanamis; so why do not the other saraswati dasanamis have the same views? why kanchi mutt's views are so exclusively its own).
The article then goes on to endorse birth segregations and expects each varna and jaati to follow their own dharma and codes of conduct.
Which means, that a chandala must continue to be treated as an outcaste, and must not be allowed to listen to vedas. Same goes for shudras who must not accumulate money, be servile and not listen to vedas. And women must also continue to be servile and not get educated or go to work and be independent.
Except brahmins, no other caste has a scriptural basis as a "spiritual" basis to follow any of these as "dharma" or a code of conduct.
Other castes can, have and will give up discriminatory practices over time, as and when education and awareness increases. They have no "dharma" obligation to follow such things.
But as long as mutts continue to endorse these things, people like the abnomals we see here will continue to exist. They will continue to talk of their existence since yugas or thousands of years, about brahmin exclusivity, greatness, and about "victimhood" for not being allowed to "practice their dharma". [In what way is the anger and "victimhood" of a dalit wrong then? Dalits have indeed suffered 'like the jews'].
And these 'brahmin' abnormals are the ones who will continue to become part of right-wing activism working against "secularism" or the state. They do not consider indian constitution lawful since (like muslims who want sharia), they want to turn back the clock into times when they are free to practice their "dharma" or codes of conduct of segregation and discrimination (with themselves as 'brahmins' on top of the varna ladder - it does not matter to them that they do not follow anything required for a 'brahmin' to follow since they are already 'brahmins by birth', so that is sufficient for them..).
And do note, that extremist-watchers do believe that just like wahabbis, in future, the right wing extremists won't hesitate to "take up arms" like "parashurama" and fight. They already do not hesitate to kill. We already have people as part of various senas. They attack churches, TV stations, and of late, such people have also become involved in things bomb blasts (like the malegaon bomb blast).
So i have clearly explained where i am coming from.
We fail to realise that we are heeding in the same direction as islam with hindusim.
I was interested in MS because it was the one attracted so many criticism. Many of them directly jumping to punishment part. Nobody could give a picture of ancient society. How they lived. Anyway, its a big subject. Care should be taken to simulate those times before jumping into conclusions.
BTW, May I know, how do you find the age of MS. According to you, it is written approx during 2 AD!.
Regards
Age of Manusmrithi: between 200 BC and 200 AD. See Wiki article.
a) For composition between 200 BCE and 200 CE see: Avari, p. 142.
b) For dating of composition "between the second century BCE and third century CE" see: Flood (1996), p. 56.
c) For dating of Manu Smriti in "final form" to the second century CE, see: Keay, p. 103.
d) For dating as completed some time between 200 BCE and 100 CE see: Hopkins, p. 74.
e) For probable origination during the second or third centuries AD, see: Kulke and Rothermund, p. 85.
f) For the text as preserved dated to around the 1st century BCE. see:
Encyclopedia Britannica Concise,
Manu-smrti (Hindu law) -- Britannica Online Encyclopedia.
Dear Smt HH Ji
I have not received a reply from you to my original post regarding the interpolation.
Thanks
I think i already replied. Are you asking in a diff context.
From wiki article:
Read:
Vishuddha Manusmriti, (Arsh Sahitya Prachar Trust, Delhi, Fourth Edition), by Surendra Kumar, p. 5.
Surendra Kumar, who counts a total of 2,685 verses, finds that only 1,214 are authentic, the other 1,471 being interpolations on the text.
[27] In reply to the criticism of the
sudra caste, the verses critical of the sudras and women are considered to be later interpolations, but not later than
Adi Shankara (7th-8th century CE). The law in Manu Smriti also appears to be overtly positive towards the brahmin (priest) caste in terms of concessions made in fines and punishments. The stance of the Manu Smriti about women has also been debated. While certain verses such as (III - 55, 56, 57, 59, 62) glorify the position of women, other verses (IX - 3, 17) seem to attack the position and freedom women have. The education of women is also discussed in the text. Certain interpretations of Verse (IX - 18) claim that it discourages women from reading Vedic scriptures. Verse (II - 240), however, allows women to read Vedic scriptures. Similar contradictory phrases are encountered in relation to child marriage in verses (IX - 94) and (IX - 90).
If you go to monks, they are not able to connect certain verses to the explanations which they are able to give on the rest of the text.
But what historians like Surendra Kumar, other monks, other people, etc think will make a difference only to the people who follow them - not to the larger masses, not to 'brahmins'.
If these things can make a difference to the society as a whole, only mutts have to act on it - since they are the ones propagating smrithis asking all hindus to follow them - they have to be clear about which smrithis to follow, what parts to follow and which parts are to be considered null and void (inapplicable in present times).
Regards.
