Is the Community digging its own grave

[kunjuppu]

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Dear kunjuppu,

Your post #308:



1. There is no proof that manu smriti was the handiwork of brahmins.

2. EVR did not say anything new. It was already thought of by brahmins who were members of the Constituent Assembly which framed the Indian Constitution. If affirmative action is a reality in India we owe it to the foresight of those learned members of the Constituent Assembly. EVR's contribution to that was a big zero. He was at that point of time asking the Colonial power to stay in India and continue for ever. The forced equality did not affect me because I could obtain a loan scholarship for my higher studies and I paid back the amount to the central government with interest to the last paisa. Perhaps a brahmin boy was the best bet and would not cheat them on repayment of principle and interest.

My perception in this matter is quite different from yours. Thank you.

dear vaagmi,

1. manu smrithi is what we all tend to quote for our current day practices. no? i think it is immaterial whether manu was a brahmin. he put the brahmin at the head of the totem pole and the rule stayed for milleniums, till today's current morality challenged, a stratification by birth, the unfairness of the concept of panchamas, and above all the treatment of women. vaagmi i am quite sure you know what manu had suggested for women. and i am sure you are not following that inyour own household.

2. i am talking of periyar during his congress days, when he was outvoted on all power sharing issues by the brahmins. the congress representation from the erstwhile madras was overwhelmingly brahmin, and protected brahmin interests. i can dig up relevant documents but it is of no point as much water has flown under the bridge. i would rather discuss today and tomorrow's issues. we cannot change the past, but we can influence tomorrow. i hope.

 

[prasad1]

dear vaagmi,

1. manu smrithi is what we all tend to quote for our current day practices. no? i think it is immaterial whether manu was a brahmin. he put the brahmin at the head of the totem pole and the rule stayed for milleniums, till today's current morality challenged, a stratification by birth, the unfairness of the concept of panchamas, and above all the treatment of women. vaagmi i am quite sure you know what manu had suggested for women. and i am sure you are not following that inyour own household.

2. i am talking of periyar during his congress days, when he was outvoted on all power sharing issues by the brahmins. the congress representation from the erstwhile madras was overwhelmingly brahmin, and protected brahmin interests. i can dig up relevant documents but it is of no point as much water has flown under the bridge. i would rather discuss today and tomorrow's issues. we cannot change the past, but we can influence tomorrow. i hope.

Most of us are born Brahmin, we qualify to be called brahmin by the Indian constitution. But to me that is another classification, just has human being, Tamilian, Indian etc. Manu smirithi has been superseded by the Indian constitution to a great extent. All Indians should be treated as equal as per the constitution. This prejudice of caste based personality is abhorrent. if the bank used this criteria

Perhaps a brahmin boy

then it is wrong.

I would not bring up that <..........> name in this forum. As he was an insult to humanity and Brahmins.

 

[Vaagmi]

dear vaagmi,

1. manu smrithi is what we all tend to quote for our current day practices. no? i think it is immaterial whether manu was a brahmin. he put the brahmin at the head of the totem pole and the rule stayed for milleniums, till today's current morality challenged, a stratification by birth, the unfairness of the concept of panchamas, and above all the treatment of women. vaagmi i am quite sure you know what manu had suggested for women. and i am sure you are not following that inyour own household.

2. i am talking of periyar during his congress days, when he was outvoted on all power sharing issues by the brahmins. the congress representation from the erstwhile madras was overwhelmingly brahmin, and protected brahmin interests. i can dig up relevant documents but it is of no point as much water has flown under the bridge. i would rather discuss today and tomorrow's issues. we cannot change the past, but we can influence tomorrow. i hope.

Dear Kunjuppu,

1. Manusmriti is not the only dharma sastra that is followed. It is just one among the many. I have already given proof to the rule that whenever there is a difference between what is said in vedas and what is said in smritis, the sruti(vedas) take the authority and hence the precedence. The manu smriti is a much maligned document. It is the first handy weapon in the hands of the dravidian charlatans including EVR. They cleverly hide the fact that manu smriti is not created by brahmins. Brahmin was put at the top of the pole by the clever middle castes for a purpose. I (though an ignoramus myself) do not subscribe to manu smriti like many other knowledgeable SVs. I have my own views on some of the rules there. But that does not mean either that I trash the whole of manusmriti. If you read it fully you will know why I say this.

2. I know you are a diehard EVR enthusiast. My view is that he was a hypocrite of the first order. It was time and circumstances which kicked him up in the political arena. A third standard drop out, he would have miserably failed in any area other than politics. Getting outvoted in politics is a common thing. It happened to many politicians including MGR. Whether it was brahmins or their intrests which was at the centre of the voting is debatable. EVR made it out that way because he could not fight the entrenched leadership in congress. That was his way of hitting below the belt. Any amount of respectability hog wash will not take away these facts. Yeah, let us discuss the issues of today.

Thanks.

 

[Vaagmi]

Most of us are born Brahmin, we qualify to be called brahmin by the Indian constitution. But to me that is another classification, just has human being, Tamilian, Indian etc. Manu smirithi has been superseded by the Indian constitution to a great extent. All Indians should be treated as equal as per the constitution. This prejudice of caste based personality is abhorrent. if the bank used this criteria then it is wrong.

I would not bring up that <..........> name in this forum. As he was an insult to humanity and Brahmins.

Dear Prasad,

Those were the heady days of "dravidian uprising" in TN. Brahmins were persona non grata every where. Brahmin women were leered at in public places for their dress and gait. I had just finished the SSLC in a remote village school and was dreaming of joining a typewriting Institute in a town just 5 miles away to pick up skills in TW and shorthand and then prepare for the MPSC (in those days it was MPSC and not TNPSC)examination for selection of LDCs(Lower Division Clerks) for TN Government. I scored excellent marks in SSLC exam and stood first in the school in all subjects. It was then that my class teacher advised me to bring my father for a meeting with him. He advised my father that I should join the college and study further. When my father assessed the cost he backed out as it was beyond him. The teacher then advised me to go for the Govt. loan scholarship from the Central Government. There were many scholarships for students given by the state Govt. but they were all for reserved category students. I applied, got the scholarship which was adequate to see me through the college. It was a princely sum of Rs. 60 per month and in those days it was a great help to my parents. So it was not any bank which gave me a loan. It was the Govt. which had provided a way out for students like me who can not get a scholarship(non-repayable)in the normal category. And all of us in my college who got this scholarship paid back the loan promptly after we got a job. This is the full story. Thank you.

 

[prasad1]

Dear Prasad,

Those were the heady days of "dravidian uprising" in TN. Brahmins were persona non grata every where. Brahmin women were leered at in public places for their dress and gait. I had just finished the SSLC in a remote village school and was dreaming of joining a typewriting Institute in a town just 5 miles away to pick up skills in TW and shorthand and then prepare for the MPSC (in those days it was MPSC and not TNPSC)examination for selection of LDCs(Lower Division Clerks) for TN Government. I scored excellent marks in SSLC exam and stood first in the school in all subjects. It was then that my class teacher advised me to bring my father for a meeting with him. He advised my father that I should join the college and study further. When my father assessed the cost he backed out as it was beyond him. The teacher then advised me to go for the Govt. loan scholarship from the Central Government. There were many scholarships for students given by the state Govt. but they were all for reserved category students. I applied, got the scholarship which was adequate to see me through the college. It was a princely sum of Rs. 60 per month and in those days it was a great help to my parents. So it was not any bank which gave me a loan. It was the Govt. which had provided a way out for students like me who can not get a scholarship(non-repayable)in the normal category. And all of us in my college who got this scholarship paid back the loan promptly after we got a job. This is the full story. Thank you.

Yours was a merit based scholarship / loan. You deserved it and more power to you. Thanks for the info.
Your original posting made it look like it was caste specific (or I interpreted it wrong). I am sorry if I hurt your feeling, thanks for the clarification.
I assume we agree on the other issue.

 

[kunjuppu]

for-the-endangered-tiger-genetics-may-finish-what-the-raj-started

on the first glance, one might wonder what the forecasted decline in tiger population has to do with forecasted decline in tambrams numbers.

this is one point i have been stating all along, and i feel strongly, that this is the cause of our declining numbers, vis a vis, other communities, more than anything else.

as is stated above, with a declining gene pool, the quality of the genes gets worse, and so does the ability to multiply.

whereas when families had about 8 children on the average, the choice were aplenty for both boys and girls to chose their partners. today that is hardly the case, and in a few generations, if this trend continues, we too would be like the tigers described in the article. horrible thought!!

 

[kunjuppu]

dear vaagmi,

thank you for your post #328, 329. i would like to bow before you re your struggles and your subsequent achievements.

i myself have been lucky and that is the only word, for but a twist of accident, i could have been you, ie a rural brahmin in tamil nadu. even though my dad was orphaned at 3, he managed to get free education and board at psg institute coimbatore (courtesy of the naidus) and with this education managed to start a business and run it to the extent to provide a good life for me and my sibling.

the issue of social revolution is always a story of winners and losers. our india, is a large country, with even larger numbers of poor and a society where caste and creed and religion often offers or denies you opportunities. at this point, by the law of india, affirmative actions to uplift those sections of the society that have been historically disadvantaged or wronged, is the rule.

your 'dravidian uprising' was a legal transfer of power from the congress to the dmk. if you might remember right, rajaji, in his dislike of congress and kamaraj, too joined the group that caused congress' downfall. but the writing on the wall was there. every community needed a share of the opportunities, and while in india, this was done through the vote, in france, russia and china, it was during through the barrel of the gun and guillotine.

as tambrams, those of us who are economically challenged, nowadays, i think, the best way, is to seek and receive help from the better endowed members of the community. i myself belong to one, and while it was the norm a few years ago to help needy students with grants to pay for college education, nowadays, the appeals appear to come mostly for medical bills for the aged.

periyar, from a crude anti brahmin viewpoint, is as much anethema to me as to anyone. but his overall call for the society in terms of small families, female education and doing away with superstition, is as much a valid reality today for tambrams, who probably follow these more seriously than many other communities. that we now experience unexpected consequences of a few generations of small families, and more recently educated womenfolk, is something we are learning to deal with only now, albeit painfully for some, re finding spouses.

best wishes.

ps..no-exits-from-these-tunnels-of-death .. when i read this, it is tough to believe we are in the 21st century..and that is the challenge that is india.

 

[Nara]

The elementary school drop out went on to change the way people thought about themselves, a kind of "I am a Man" message out of Memphis, TN. His name and achievements are well known all over India and abroad as well. It is no wonder then UNESCO described EVR aka தந்தை பெரியார் as "the prophet of the new age, the Socrates of South East Asia, father of social reform movement and arch enemy of ignorance, superstitions, meaningless customs and base manners".

Proved hypocrites and caste-purity bigots can trash and malign this hugely respected great reformer endlessly, but all that will amount to no more than a reflection of their own childishly parochial caste-centric mindset. There is no intellectual honesty or bravery in criticizing EVR from the safe confines of this forum where such trash talk will only receive applause. This is not entirely unexpected when their minds are infected by such trash as caste-purity, superior Brahmin gunas, etc. EVR will always remain a hypocrite to these hypocrites who are apt to respond வீசை என்ன விலை if asked to show some intellectual honesty.

 

[kunjuppu]

The elementary school drop out went on to change the way people thought about themselves, a kind of "I am a Man" message out of Memphis, TN. His name and achievements are well known all over India and abroad as well. It is no wonder then UNESCO described EVR aka தந்தை பெரியார் as "the prophet of the new age, the Socrates of South East Asia, father of social reform movement and arch enemy of ignorance, superstitions, meaningless customs and base manners".

Proved hypocrites and caste-purity bigots can trash and malign this hugely respected great reformer endlessly, but all that will amount to no more than a reflection of their own childishly parochial caste-centric mindset. There is no intellectual honesty or bravery in criticizing EVR from the safe confines of this forum where such trash talk will only receive applause. This is not entirely unexpected when their minds are infected by such trash as caste-purity, superior Brahmin gunas, etc. EVR will always remain a hypocrite to these hypocrites who are apt to respond வீசை என்ன விலை if asked to show some intellectual honesty.

blunt words, but true.

when history is written of the 20th century, periyar would be remembered. maybe kamaraj. not rajaji. bharathiar yes. i think barring the tambrams the rest of tamil society and most of india, would give periyar his dues..for radical thinking and breaking the shackles of the past.

much as tambrams would deny it, periyar is an icon. unbeloved by tambrams, but respected and to an extent loved by rest of the society.

i read in a kongu blog the other day, that today's kongunaadu folks, none of them have heard of c.subramaniam, the father of our food revolution, and thanks to whose initiatives, we developed the green revolution. this person was moaning the fact, that today's kongus were more interested in their jaadhi than in our nationalist past. such is life...

 

[auh]

In a city of fools, a wise man is considered as an alien; perhaps even as an enemy.

Mass support, or even social causes will not hold up an ideology of hate. The sun does not change its course to be remembered in the pages of history.

It is the age when people debate about abolishing the death penalty, and here we have folks who eulogise a person who started an uprising, guised as reform, with the sole weapon being hate. There can be no rationality when the motive is vendetta.

There are enough journals/publications (his very own) to prove the forked tongue of Ramasamy from Erode. Only a biased mind can overlook such glaring evidences against the man.

 

[tks]

In a city of fools, a wise man is considered as an alien; perhaps even as an enemy.

Mass support, or even social causes will not hold up an ideology of hate. The sun does not change its course to be remembered in the pages of history.

It is the age when people debate about abolishing the death penalty, and here we have folks who eulogise a person who started an uprising, guised as reform, with the sole weapon being hate. There can be no rationality when the motive is vendetta.

There are enough journals/publications (his very own) to prove the forked tongue of Ramasamy from Erode. Only a biased mind can overlook such glaring evidences against the man.

Any person who has any form of hate towards anything will have followers who also harbor hate. I have heard though I am no expert that such feelings tend to arise in people who have had issues with their father in their childhood.

Object of hate usually is immaterial in such people - that is why most such people tend to be explicit or latent racists, casteists, sexists etc and can easily switch from one object of hate to another even while coming across as the most liberal minded.

The best response is no response actually

"சூரியனைப் பாத்து “நாய்கள் ” குலைப்பதால் சூரியனுக்கு எதுவும் ஆகிவிடப் போவதில்லை"

I hope this thread does not offer further opportunity to glorify anyone who has messages of hate of any kind.

 

[renuka]

Actually EVR isn't the only being in the world who harboured hatred(note: I am no fan of EVR BTW) most humans only love themselves and what they feel is theirs and brings them benefit.

Anything else which is not to their liking is disliked.

Some show their hatred outwardly and stir up the hornets nest in a mega dose like EVR and some just do not show their hatred.

So I guess no human can say that they do not have at least some form of hatred to anything in this world.

 

[Vaagmi]

Dear Mr. Nara,

Your post #333:
The elementary school drop out went on to change the way people thought about themselves, a kind of "I am a Man" message out of Memphis, TN. His name and achievements are well known all over India and abroad as well. It is no wonder then UNESCO described EVR aka தந்தை பெரியார் as "the prophet of the new age, the Socrates of South East Asia, father of social reform movement and arch enemy of ignorance, superstitions, meaningless customs and base manners".
Proved hypocrites and caste-purity bigots can trash and malign this hugely respected great reformer endlessly, but all that will amount to no more than a reflection of their own childishly parochial caste-centric mindset. There is no intellectual honesty or bravery in criticizing EVR from the safe confines of this forum where such trash talk will only receive applause. This is not entirely unexpected when their minds are infected by such trash as caste-purity, superior Brahmin gunas, etc. EVR will always remain a hypocrite to these hypocrites who are apt to respond வீசை என்ன விலை if asked to show some intellectual honesty.

Come on. Here comes another EVR Bhakta. “The elementary school drop out went on to change the way people thought about themselves”-your words. Yes they, the people, all thought about themselves as belonging to a certain caste. That their caste(thevar, naidus, vanniars etc.,) is superior to the caste of panchamans. That they can kill and maim in order to preserve the purity of their castes. You need proof? Please google(you enjoy googling I know) Vachati and Keelvenmony for just samples. If you have the time and inclination you can go further with Uththapuram, Dharmapuri riots, Ilavarasan etc. and enlighten yourselves with the success of EVR in making people think about themselves and not about the society and their place in the society. “His name is well known all over India and abroad”-your words again. Every notorious element can become well known in the world if he gets kicked up the stairs in politics. That does not mean anything to right thinking people. It just means that notoriety and popularity are two words people use recklessly. தந்தை means father. What a shame. So you are saying he was called Socrates of South East Asia. I have an old book published in Tamil which calls the Late C.N.Annadurai the Socrates of India and goes further to call him தென்னாட்டு பெர்னாட்ஷா, இன்னாட்டு இங்கர்சால் etc., The Unesco and you are going to cause a minor “கோட்டைக்குள் குத்து வெட்டு” by calling EVR the Socrates while there is already a strong claimant to that name.

Your “Hugely respected great reformer” was actually a hypocrite of the first order. I will give just two items as proof. Though this has been discussed in this forum repeatedly, I reproduce so that the lies do not go unchallenged here. 1. EVR opposed tooth and nail the studying of Hindi in Tamilnadu. Even as he was breathing fire in public forums and his captive news paper mouth pieces, he had quietly let out a huge residential property belonging to him in Erode at a very nominal monthly rent to Hindi Prachar Sabha to conduct classes in Hindi for students of Erode. Proof-please read the autobiography of Maraimalai Adigal. 2. He used to talk very eloquently about women’s freedom including the right to women’s sexuality. He at the ripe age of 60+ married a very young girl and justified it by specious arguments. There are many more. Those who are interested can google and find. Are you going to accept that EVR was a hypocrite or are you going to still insist that it is all caste centric nonsense dished out? Where is your intellectual honesty?

“There is no intellectual honesty or bravery in criticizing EVR from the safe confines of this forum where such trash talk will only receive applause”-these are your words. I find no difference between your these words and the “ஏய் வெண்ணை! விளக்கெண்ணை!!. பேரு சொல்லி எழுதுடா மொண்ணை.!!! வர்ரியா ஒத்தைக்கொத்தை ....த்தா தூ” kind of responses that we come across in many EVR forums. I interpret your words as revealing a fanatic intolerance and a secret desire in the depth of your mind to thrash black and blue physically all the members here with an opposite view. That is bad. And that is quite bad for a “professor”. The dividing line between hatred and violence is ever so fine. I mean mental violence here. Please don’t become a hypocrite by trying to reinterpret your words. We have understood you alright. The words “bravery” and “safe confines” are revealing the mind set that is stinking up to heavens. I don’t expect you to delete your post. I would end this with just one sentence. Mr. Nara you have to evolve a lot. Best wishes.

 

[renuka]

. 2. He used to talk very eloquently about women’s freedom including the right to women’s sexuality. He at the ripe age of 60+ married a very young girl and justified it by specious arguments. .

Dear Sir,

This alone I do not understand why everyone gets worked up about...envy I wonder???

Love and marriage is a personal matter so I do not see anything wrong in a 60 year old man marrying a young girl if she consents to it.

May be EVR knew the secret that Hugh Hefner knows!LOL

 

[tks]

Actually EVR isn't the only being in the world who harboured hatred(note: I am no fan of EVR BTW) most humans only love themselves and what they feel is theirs and brings them benefit.

Anything else which is not to their liking is disliked.

Some show their hatred outwardly and stir up the hornets nest in a mega dose like EVR and some just do not show their hatred.

So I guess no human can say that they do not have at least some form of hatred to anything in this world.

Very good point. First step towards self growth is to recognize that hate of any kind at any level is an impediment and that tends to exist in all human beings.

While I have no specific and substantive info of EVR (and I had no interest either when I was growing up or later) I am sure there are many like him from what I have heard that have found ways to unlock hatred in others.

I am sure some Germans living during Hitler's time never knew that they had so much hate in themselves until unlocked by a person in a leadership role like Hitler. One may want to study Hitler for all kinds historical understanding but if someone glorifies his method of political control today you have to question their motive.

Gandhi as a true leader of his times never expressed hatred towards anyone including the Britishers or even towards the Varna system from the best extent I know. My knowledge of Gandhi is limited to what was taught in my school. I have found that true reformers first reform themselves before trying to impact others for a positive change.

Original thread is hijacked fully and I do not want to contribute to hijacking the current sub thread of EVR admiration and fact checking LoL

 

[renuka]

First step towards self growth is to recognize that hate of any kind at any level is an impediment and that tends to exist in all human beings.

Actually those who harbour extreme forms of hatred are secretly obsessed with their "enemy".

By having hatred we let the 'enemy' rule our mind and even by eliminating tactics the enemy still lurks in our thoughts.

So it is of no use hating anyone...if we do not like a situation do not try to fight it with hatred..try to create a new situation or try to change the present scenario.

This is where EVR went wrong...otherwise I feel he did have many qualities of a social reformer.

 

[Vaagmi]

Dear Sir,

This alone I do not understand why everyone gets worked up about...envy I wonder???

Love and marriage is a personal matter so I do not see anything wrong in a 60 year old man marrying a young girl if she consents to it.

May be EVR knew the secret that Hugh Hefner knows!LOL

Dear Renuka Madam,

You don't lecture 365 days to the people about women's rights including the right to her own sexuality. Please carefully mark the word sexuality. And then go and marry a girl far younger than you at the old age of 60+ and deny her the sex that she is entitled to. I call this rank hypocrisy. Yes his love would not have been a subject for public debate if he had kept his views to himself.

 

[prasad1]

Actually those who harbour extreme forms of hatred are secretly obsessed with their "enemy".

By having hatred we let the 'enemy' rule our mind and even by eliminating tactics the enemy still lurks in our thoughts.

So it is of no use hating anyone...if we do not like a situation do not try to fight it with hatred..try to create a new situation or try to change the present scenario.

This is where EVR went wrong...otherwise I feel he did have many qualities of a social reformer.

Renukaji,
Please do not defend that ........... (unspeakable, apology to humans).
It is travesty to call it a love marriage. In India 50 years ago there was no love marriages to speak off. It is like a 60 years old sheik from middle east marrying a 14 year girl (may be the father was given some money) as love marriage. That is child molestation.
There are only two members on this site I know, who keep bringing up that most hated name in this site. One may be enamored by what was written, other is purely mischief, just to poke the majority of members with red hot poker in the eye.
I have wasted valuable space on a .............. I am sorry.

His death did not come soon enough, or he should not have been born. His mother's death should have come earlier so he would not have been born.
This is not hatred, but statement of fact for the Brahmins. If ... he was a reformer, Hitler was a far better.

 

[renuka]

Dear Renuka Madam,

You don't lecture 365 days to the people about women's rights including the right to her own sexuality. Please carefully mark the word sexuality. And then go and marry a girl far younger than you at the old age of 60+ and deny her the sex that she is entitled to. I call this rank hypocrisy. Yes his love would not have been a subject for public debate if he had kept his views to himself.

Dear Vaagmi,

This shows you did not Google Search about Hugh Hefner!LOL

I am reminded of an incident when I was an intern..a young Indian male doctor was examining a 60 year old Indian man for some hydrocele and when the consultant surgeon came he asked the intern if he had asked the patient whether the hydrocele interferes during sexual intercourse.

The young male doctor said "No sir..I did not ask him"

The consultant surgeon aged 65 years got real angry and asked "why do you think man above 60 can't perform? Ask the patient again"

So the young male doctor had to ask the patient again and the patient felt very embarrassed and said " I am a grandfather aged 60..do you think I will be sexually active?"

After the round was over the 65 year old consultant muttered to us that "that patient does not know some men have no pause"

So you see some men have no pause and some men have hit andropause so we can not blindly accuse EVR for denying sexual rights to his young wife..he could have been a Indian Hugh Hefner.

Google Search Hugh Hefner please.

 

[Subramanian Natarajan]

The community was always amongst the most disjoint,disconnected entities with zero political power.There never was internal intertia to change and the total loss of political power and the alienation has resulted in this.

I come from a family of land owning Vadamas in Tirunelveli and whatever one might say the closest relationships we had in our villages was with the OBC Maravars and the Sc Pallars.

There has never been any kind of bad blood/exploitation etc between the castes there except between the Maravars and the SCs with their own problems.

Coming to topic,except my family almost all my extended family moved to Delhi/Mumbai after 1968 and have been doing well ever since,We dont have any inter caste marriage in our family and even the exceptional ones are between culturally closer north Indian and erstwhile upper castes.

I know many girls from my time growing up in west Mambalam and around since the 90s and I can say that most IC/IR happen because of a total disconnect of many Iyer families with their roots in villages and also because of a weak father.

I grew up in full contact with my grandparents and i believe my upbringing and my ethos i received is a full reason for me succeeding independently.I never took a single penny from my dad to do my engineering and MBA and am debt Free now.

Someone said,women have their independence etc but most women still want their parents to be in contact and support them even after their choice,they dont want to be ostracized.

Somehow u ll always notice that such aberrational romantic emotions ll never happen with a guy who is not rich or decently well off,i can completely understand the need for financial security in a woman and nothing wrong with this.

But this is also the reason an Iyer boy always seeks and trust conservatism,he is dead serious in studies since day one as he knows that there is nobody to help him earn a penny in the society,He is independent hard working and makes his own future off his own effort and discpline,thus he earns the right to be arrogant.

Many girls are also the same as guys but they always have an option to marry off with a good chap but Guys dont have that luxury.As someone who had to get things done in a similar environment,my full support for these guys.

I know exactly how other communities support each other and how we dont.

But the same independent guy gets a nice girl,not the headstrong randomly arrogant types but someone with whom he can take his life forward.

Another aspect for these marriages are most non Tb guys marrying these girls are wimps,suckers who think they are fortunate to get this girl a thought which nos elf respecting,world fighting TB Guy ll ever have.

So,in simple good riddance,please dont show ur face again.

PS: And as people say like the Jews,when trouble happens the weak jump and the strong stay and hold.I am grateful that the boarder jumpers increase the concentration of the noble stock and decrease the dilution of pure filth.

 

[Subramanian Natarajan]

Dear Vaagmi,

This shows you did not Google Search about Hugh Hefner!LOL

I am reminded of an incident when I was an intern..a young Indian male doctor was examining a 60 year old Indian man for some hydrocele and when the consultant surgeon came he asked the intern if he had asked the patient whether the hydrocele interferes during sexual intercourse.

The young male doctor said "No sir..I did not ask him"

The consultant surgeon aged 65 years got real angry and asked "why do you think man above 60 can't perform? Ask the patient again"

So the young male doctor had to ask the patient again and the patient felt very embarrassed and said " I am a grandfather aged 60..do you think I will be sexually active?"

After the round was over the 65 year old consultant muttered to us that "that patient does not know some men have no pause"

So you see some men have no pause and some men have hit andropause so we can not blindly accuse EVR for denying sexual rights to his young wife..he could have been a Indian Hugh Hefner.

Google Search Hugh Hefner please.

Ohh It is about EVR,he is grade A fraud,verbose idiot who confused the hell out of the emotional Tamil people and i salute him for giving early warning system for TBs to get out of the shithole called TN.

Social reformer,please.

All he did was empower the middle castes which already enjoyed a lot of economic power and he did nothing for education,Tamils still flock to temples and convert for petty change and miracles.

 

[renuka]

Renukaji,
Please do not defend that ........... (unspeakable, apology to humans).
It is travesty to call it a love marriage. In India 50 years ago there was no love marriages to speak off. It is like a 60 years old sheik from middle east marrying a 14 year girl (may be the father was given some money) as love marriage. That is child molestation.
There are only two members on this site I know, who keep bringing up that most hated name in this site. One may be enamored by what was written, other is purely mischief, just to poke the majority of members with red hot poker in the eye.
I have wasted valuable space on a .............. I am sorry.

His death did not come soon enough, or he should not have been born. His mother's death should have come earlier so he would not have been born.
This is not hatred, but statement of fact for the Brahmins. If ... he was a reformer, Hitler was a far better.

Dear Prasad Ji,

I am sure there is some goodness even the worst of men.

So by hating EVR we only reciprocate the hatred he supposedly sowed.

We have no idea what his last thoughts were.

I used to "hate" him too for what he did to Lord Rama's idol by garlanding it with shoes but later I felt that there is no use hating his actions cos my hatred for his actions only breeds hatred in me.

So I decided to stop hating his actions and tried to look at him as a person and try to look for some goodness in him too.

 

[Subramanian Natarajan]

The elementary school drop out went on to change the way people thought about themselves, a kind of "I am a Man" message out of Memphis, TN. His name and achievements are well known all over India and abroad as well. It is no wonder then UNESCO described EVR aka தந்தை பெரியார் as "the prophet of the new age, the Socrates of South East Asia, father of social reform movement and arch enemy of ignorance, superstitions, meaningless customs and base manners".

Proved hypocrites and caste-purity bigots can trash and malign this hugely respected great reformer endlessly, but all that will amount to no more than a reflection of their own childishly parochial caste-centric mindset. There is no intellectual honesty or bravery in criticizing EVR from the safe confines of this forum where such trash talk will only receive applause. This is not entirely unexpected when their minds are infected by such trash as caste-purity, superior Brahmin gunas, etc. EVR will always remain a hypocrite to these hypocrites who are apt to respond வீசை என்ன விலை if asked to show some intellectual honesty.

He was never an independent person,he and his followers had no integrity,if i am caste centric he is ego centric.

By making people hate brahmins,he just created a molehill out of nothing.

I criticize EVR everywhere,in real life,in trains,amongst his own cadre also.

They make fun of his hypocrasies bigtime,i dont knw why u r sucking upto him but we can evaluate him objectively anyway.

 

[sarang]

Except a few followers sporting a black shirt and ceremonial garlanding of his busts on specific days, evr is is a lost and forgotten man. Despite efforts to delete controversial and abusive passages from the collected works of evr, his image as a perverse and opportunistic remains and is understood by the modern generation. His disciples are clever and know what is good for them. Only those sitting on dravida towers embrace him even though the contact is smelly and absurd. I wonder whether he ever dropped the caste surname naiakkar.

In a city of fools, a wise man is considered as an alien; perhaps even as an enemy.

Mass support, or even social causes will not hold up an ideology of hate. The sun does not change its course to be remembered in the pages of history.

It is the age when people debate about abolishing the death penalty, and here we have folks who eulogise a person who started an uprising, guised as reform, with the sole weapon being hate. There can be no rationality when the motive is vendetta.

There are enough journals/publications (his very own) to prove the forked tongue of Ramasamy from Erode. Only a biased mind can overlook such glaring evidences against the man.

 

[Subramanian Natarajan]

Dear Prasad Ji,

I am sure there is some goodness even the worst of men.

So by hating EVR we only reciprocate the hatred he supposedly sowed.

We have no idea what his last thoughts were.

I used to "hate" him too for what he did to Lord Rama's idol by garlanding it with shoes but later I felt that there is no use hating his actions cos my hatred for his actions only breeds hatred in me.

So I decided to stop hating his actions and tried to look at him as a person and try to look for some goodness in him too.

I see him as a good for nothing Nayakkar,who couldn't take an ego bruise.

His ego needed a massage/boost and the rest is history,

Exactly like Jinnah and History ll never forgives their grave mistakes.

Bigger Villains than Adolf Hitler.